Mohamed cartoons provoke bomb threats

Sheryl · Post by **Sheryl** » Sat Feb 11, 2006 4:39 pm

Far Rider wrote: Id very much welcome some of thier own leaders standing up and going against them, I don't see that happening either. I do know some peaceful muslums, but even they have told me that their own book can be easily misconstrude and open to multiple interpretations.

Thanks for answering.

Yes and we both know the bible can be misconstude too. David Koresh, the wierdo's out of Kansas doing all these protests. I think the fact that most of these are in areas where poverty is a real issue. And I bet that plays into them being so radical.

Saffron · Post by **Saffron** » Sat Feb 11, 2006 4:43 pm

I received these links from my Egyptian friend in Cairo, Adoula. He is a Copt Christian.

http://www.answering-islam.org/Women/

I am not an "ignorant" woman. For all of the idiots on this string calling me names......I think that you are the only ignorant ones here. I can bet I know more about Islam than most of you. I am just not going to get baited into a discussion about it. :yh_silent

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Fletch · Post by **Fletch** » Sat Feb 11, 2006 4:44 pm

Far Rider wrote: Feel free to rip all ya want...

Are you denying that Radical Islamic Fundamentalists are trying to kill americans?

Nice try Marconi, but that's not what you said.

Now about Jesus being God, run that one by me again...

Sheryl · Post by **Sheryl** » Sat Feb 11, 2006 4:45 pm

Saffron wrote: I received these links from my Egyptian friend in Cairo, Adoula. He is a Copt Christian.

http://www.answering-islam.org/Women/

I am not an "ignorant" woman. For all of the idiots on this string calling me names......I think that you are the only ignorant ones here. I can bet I know more about Islam than most of you. I am just not going to get baited into a discussion about it. :yh_silent

Then why are you posting in this thread??

Sheryl · Post by **Sheryl** » Sat Feb 11, 2006 4:47 pm

Far Rider wrote: Yes, true, but those factions and cults are not mainline christianity, But Islamic Fundametalism is, or at least it has many many "sheeple" following the radicals!

How many folks were under David Koresh? 50? Thats a far cry from the numbers fighing Jihad.

Because there is no seperation between church and state??

Answer Fletch's question so I can right down the verses for myself.

Fletch · Post by **Fletch** » Sat Feb 11, 2006 4:54 pm

Saffron wrote: I know a bit about Islam,

Saffron wrote: From what I know about Islam, it sounds as if it is a cult,

Saffron wrote: I can bet I know more about Islam than most of you.

I'll bet you don't!

Kinda confused, no?

You know what?

If this was all being said about Jews, you'd be branded a racist.

As you come out with all kinds of crap about Muslims, and this goes for you too Far, I'd say you're both racists.

You don't really care to research anything and don't read anything presented to you.

Why?

Because it takes time to read a page?

Or because you have an inherent racist attitude towards Muslims?

You see them as the enemy.

And as long as you have that mindset, they always will be.

These have got to be some of the stupidest, most baseless arguments or assumptions I have had the misfortune to have read and what makes it worse, is that you are adults.

I'd expect this level of "My gangs better than yours" from a child.

Welcome to the 21st century.

Bez · Post by **Bez** » Sat Feb 11, 2006 4:56 pm

Saffron wrote: I received these links from my Egyptian friend in Cairo, Adoula. He is a Copt Christian.

http://www.answering-islam.org/Women/

I am not an "ignorant" woman. For all of the idiots on this string calling me names......I think that you are the only ignorant ones here. I can bet I know more about Islam than most of you. I am just not going to get baited into a discussion about it. :yh_silent

It's late here but i will definitely read this tomorrow...have saved to my 'favourites' so that i can find it easily. What is a 'COPT CHRISTIAN' by the way ?

Fletch · Post by **Fletch** » Sat Feb 11, 2006 4:59 pm

Far Rider wrote: Jesus and God are one and the same. ever heard of the trinity? Father, Son and Holy Spirit?

Jesus is God.

Paradox.

Dichotomy.

Call it what you will, but riddle me this oh Rider from Afar, but God the omnipotent, the benevolent creator who has been here from time itself, gave unto Mary (Maryam in the Quran) a child...and that child was...himself?

It's like that scene in Terminator where Kyle Reece is...no, nevermind...

Would you been intrepreting the Trinity in your own way?

Would all of the people who said Jesus was God's son be wrong?

The Muslims believe in Jesus and have the utmost respect for Mary, in fact a good deal is dedicated to Mary.

They just don't believe he was the son of God.

They believe he was a messenger.

Ignorance is bliss they say, it couldn't be much clearer.

Sheryl · Post by **Sheryl** » Sat Feb 11, 2006 5:00 pm

Far Rider wrote: ahahah ok I'll lok for the verses in a second.

Thasta good point, yes I'd agree to part of the reson being the seperation of church and state, but I look at it morelike this.

Well over half I'd say and its more like 75% of americans dont attend a church service on a given weekend, Just look at the number of folks that stay home on a sunday morning. If a nation is judged by what its citizens do, then few really follow chritianity in the US. We should not be judged a christian nation if the majority of us dont follow christianity in whatever form its can be loosly discribed as in the US.

It's not nesiccarly (sp) Christians they are against. It's more like the west's ideas. What we call our freedoms, they are against. Like the big deal over the cartoon. We say big deal freedom of speech. They yell no you broke our rule of not making an illustration of Mohammed.

Sheryl · Post by **Sheryl** » Sat Feb 11, 2006 5:02 pm

Fletch wrote: Jesus is God.

Paradox.

Dichotomy.

Call it what you will, but riddle me this oh Rider from Afar, but God the omnipotent, the benevolent creator who has been here from time itself, gave unto Mary (Maryam in the Quran) a child...and that child was...himself?

It's like that scene in Terminator where Kyle Reece is...no, nevermind...

Would you been intrepreting the Trinity in your own way?

Would all of the people who said Jesus was God's son be wrong?

The Muslims believe in Jesus and have the utmost respect for Mary, in fact a good deal is dedicated to Mary.

They just don't believe he was the son of God.

They believe he was a messenger.

Ignorance is bliss they say, it couldn't be much clearer.

It's in the bible Fletch, Far's supposed to post the verses. I pm'd him with same question. Be patient.....

Fletch · Post by **Fletch** » Sat Feb 11, 2006 5:05 pm

Interpretation?

In the meantime, have some of this.

http://www.christiananswers.net/q-eden/edn-t005.html

Fletch · Post by **Fletch** » Sat Feb 11, 2006 5:07 pm

....and this one.

Well worth a read of your time.

http://www.godandscience.org/apologetics/trinity.html

Saffron · Post by **Saffron** » Sat Feb 11, 2006 5:12 pm

Far Rider wrote: Fletch, I'll try to tae you seriously.... sheeze if I can.

Listen son, I dont know how old you are or where you hailed from, but a faction of radical Islmaic fundamentalist screaming Jihad have been attacking the US and its allies form nearly 20 years. I chased these idoit from one end of africa to the next, across four contenents and in more climates than you have holes in your head... Ive seen them slime though viallges and sodomize evry man and boy and woman in the place... before they cut off their heads and sent them to allah.

You tell me we dont have an enemy and I''lll tell you your so full of **** its not funny.

I already agreed that there is peaceful Islamic people, I dont deny that. but the radical Islamicst is our enemy.

And since that religion has many others beliveing in it, that appear peaceful I choose to be weary of them. You want to call that racist.. youre the stupid ingnorant one.

Have I said kill them all? Have I advocated killing any one that is not in a direct attack mode on us?

You better go read up on me before you paint me a racist.

Stupid people like to say "racism" to those who have a right to dissent. Stupid people also like to call those who have the nerve to speak up about what is wrong in the world "racist". The word "racist" is abused in our society more than any other word, except the "F" word. When anybody calls me "racist", before even knowing me as the person who I am, I know that they are only trying to shut me up.

Call me racist all you like, it ain't gonna shut me up.

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Sheryl · Post by **Sheryl** » Sat Feb 11, 2006 5:14 pm

Fletch wrote: Interpretation?

In the meantime, have some of this.

http://www.christiananswers.net/q-eden/edn-t005.html

Arghh Fletch anyone can take a passage out of the bible and twist it to thier concern.

Paul was talking to Christians in a time when they were persecuted. He's telling them to have faith because there is more than what they have on earth.

Fletch · Post by **Fletch** » Sat Feb 11, 2006 5:17 pm

OK Far, time for me to take you seriously.

I have studied.

Rather a lot.

I studied History as well as Politics, Religion & Psychology.

Along my road, I have read much and spoken to many.

I would suggest you wonder why so many countries dislike the politics of the US.

Unless you read and educate yourself on why they are this way, then you'll forever repeat Capital Hill's soundbites.

A Chinese Warrior and Philosopher named Sun Tzu, wrote the most famous war manual.

It's called, quite simply, The Art of War.

Know thy enemy, is to know thyself.

I wish to God, you would bloody read and educate yourself and not make half baked assumptions.

The muslims as a whole have been shafted by the west for as long as I can remember.

Be it the Pakistani Muslims during the '47 partition war to the Afghans who were SUPPORTED by the US to Gadaffi who was funded by the US to Bin Laden whose family are friends with the US to Hussain who was funded by the US during the Iran crises.

All of the above are facts that have enough documentation to prove their validity.

Doesn't that make you question your own governent?

I'm all for patriotism, but if my government doesn't give a **** about me, then I wont give a **** straight back.

I love my country and if it was invaded by hostile forces, I would put my life on the line.

I love this place, but I am disgusted by the vile warmongering sycophants that tell us what we should believe.

This incident with the cartoons started in September.

The Muslim council asked for something to be done but were ignored time and time again?

Could it be that an example had to be made?

Christians say, "We wouldn't do that" then maybe they should.

Maybe they should stand up for their deities etc being lampooned.

They did a perfect job killing hundreds of thousands in two crusades so why stop now?

Bez · Post by **Bez** » Sat Feb 11, 2006 5:18 pm

Far Rider wrote: Saffron im taking your side on this one.

.

Saffron....it appears that Far is with you on this. i think you are mistaken with what you posted.

Fletch · Post by **Fletch** » Sat Feb 11, 2006 5:20 pm

Saffron wrote:

Call me racist all you like, it ain't gonna shut me up.

Now that you have unblocked me, would you kindly stop sending me requests to be a buddy.

Oh and by the way, just as a test, repeat your comments but this time replace Muslim for Jew and see how many people jump down your throat and call you anti-semetic?

You don't like being called racist?

OK, well seeing as Arabic & Hebrew are both semitic languages, I'll settle for calling you...yep, you guess it...anti-semitic.

Have a coke and a smile.

Now I hear you all screaming "NO IT ISN'T!!!"

Well because I love you all, here's a link.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semitic_languages

The Semitic languages are a family of languages spoken by more than 370 million people across much of the Middle East, where they probably originated, and North and East Africa. They constitute the northeastern subfamily of the Afro-Asiatic languages, and the only branch of this group spoken in Asia.

The most widely spoken Semitic language today is Arabic (206 million speakers), followed by Amharic (26 million speakers), Tigrinya (6.75 million speakers), and Hebrew (6 million speakers).

Arabs 206 million

Hebrew 6 million.

So Saffie, you are, anti-semitic.

Far, so are you pal.

Shocking huh?

Sheryl · Post by **Sheryl** » Sat Feb 11, 2006 5:22 pm

Ok I've decided it's all because of the Illuminati. We are all just pawns on thier chessboard.

this is meant to bring some humour to the thread.

Saffron · Post by **Saffron** » Sat Feb 11, 2006 5:28 pm

This is now getting ridiculous, as usual. I don't care whose side anyone is on here, I am not going back to read all of the disssertations here about who is on who's side. I am not in agreement with Islam. And I never will be. This is the last post I'll make on this subject.

As for the people who are calling me names.....you are on my ignore list. thank God i don't have to see what you wrote. As i do not care.

good-bye

P.S. to BEZ: Try to see and read what is there, not what you want to be there.

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Fletch · Post by **Fletch** » Sat Feb 11, 2006 5:39 pm

Far Rider wrote: Fletch, Im not here to give you a bible lesson, you have already stated you do not believe in any religion at all.

Whoa there Marconi, you don't get out of it that easy.

If you make a claim, back it up.

Far Rider wrote: you have already stated you do not believe in any religion at all.

And?

Is that a reason to NOT understand?

Do you see me insulting any religion?

I don't believe in any, but at least I have educated myself in as many religions as I can, to try and understand why **** happens.

Heck, I think I've patient enough with some of you guys.

I've given you link after link from basic ideology to UN sanctions to the true meaning of anti-semitic which is a hijacked phrase that offends a good number of Muslims.

I haven't disrespected a single religion or faith and my conscience of racial bigotry is clean.

As for you Saffron, your comments are anti-semitic and as such, you disgust me.

Seems strange to think of Muslims as semitic huh?

Fletch · Post by **Fletch** » Sat Feb 11, 2006 5:44 pm

Far Rider wrote: You dont get it. I said "I believe" on here,

And?

So?

You also came out with a lot of anti-semitic crap.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semitic_languages to prove the meaning of anti-semitic.

Far Rider wrote: And what right do they have to expect a reply,

The same as any other man, woman or child who has been wronged.

If you choose to offend and ignore, then reap the consequences without whining.

Far Rider wrote: My God does not need me to fight his battles

You want me to teach you about the crusades?

Gimme a break.

Fletch · Post by **Fletch** » Sat Feb 11, 2006 5:52 pm

Far Rider wrote: not everything done in Gods name is really done in Gods name.

AT LAST YOU GET IT!!!

I knew I'd get there sooner or later.

Sleep well people.

Peace

Fletch

Fletch · Post by **Fletch** » Sat Feb 11, 2006 6:17 pm

Nice try Far, but you have misquoted yourself.

This is actually what you said.

And what right do they have to expect a reply

and this is what I said:

The same as any other man, woman or child who has been wronged

Now then, where did I claimthey had a right to respond with great violence to a cartoon that they found offensive to their god, to say that God is not behind them?

Where have I said I hate Christians?

Where have I even offended a single religion?

Where have I said Islam is the best thing ever?

Where did I say they had a right to respond with violence?

BS.

You have the nerve to call me stupid?

Don't ever try to tell me I hate Christianity when I haven't said a single negative thing about it.

That's a disgusting way to try and drum affirmation for your lost cause.

Trying to get people to just pick on your one line of complete BS and try to hound me for it?

When I didn't even say it?

That kind of bully boy tactic goes straight to an admin as far as I'm concerned.

It's so hard for you to admit you're wrong, isn't it.

Go and educate yourself on these matters before you make yourself sound any stupider

CARLA · Post by **CARLA** » Sat Feb 11, 2006 6:32 pm

OK Carla turns slowly and runs back into the ARCADE ...!! where I feel safe..:-3 Be nice guys.. !! :rolleyes:

Fletch · Post by **Fletch** » Sat Feb 11, 2006 6:53 pm

You still pissed off about my fluff comment?

Actually I didn't say it like that as you well know.

Snooze was pissed off because someone else mentioned it in a different way.

Like I said, go say the same crap about Jews and see if you have any skin left on you.

Not racist my arse.

You have displayed ignorance, prejudiced and racist attitudes through a number of threads.

I've highlighted again and again discrepancies in your words and attitude, given you link after unbiased link that you have chosen to ignore.

And now sir, I shall give you something I had the pleasure of writing in my Book of Hilarious Comebacks thanks to your kind natured self. You wrote it back on page 11 of this very thread would you believe.

It went something like this;

Talk...to...the...hand.

Yeah that's right.

Far Rider wrote: yeah-yeah... talk to the hand.

And you wanted to debate?

Bless!

Have the last word and turn the light off on your way out.

Saffron · Post by **Saffron** » Sat Feb 11, 2006 9:07 pm

Far Rider wrote: Geeze I suspect he went to college debate class *said in my best Texas drawl*

Nice twist!

Not anyone on this board would deny technically you are right, but go stand in the center of Telaviv and and claim the same thing, I suspect you might get a reaction!

hahahahahaha.

Just how long have you hated Christians?
Here's for that Fletch person........

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venus · Post by **venus** » Sun Feb 12, 2006 5:19 am

Saffron wrote: Here's for that Fletch person........

Very mature Saffron and you expect people to be able to take you seriously.:wah:

NOT

so am l on the ignore list now...come on we are getting a little club together...

Acc is chair, fletch the second, Br is the lady with the quick retort and me well lm willing to sit back and enjoy the debate show...

There have been numerous posts that have given factual points and things that can be misconstued, this l feel is one of themain points.

ny writings of religion can be misconstrued, and as to the comments calssed as racist or hate filled. sorrry thats how they read.

You are constantly clumping peaceful true muslims with the radicals, well couldnt we do that with all the religions etc. caling them all crazy, you cannot lump them all together.

How about the americans during the vietnam war and the terrible things they have one which is documented, do l think all soldiers were like that, hell no.

Do l have a distrust of all the irish, nope.

I have met some people from other counties with very hate filled views, do l think all their country men are of the same mind set....NO

I have learnt alot from hte past few days on here, and some of which l wish l had'nt... l do know though that l will make sure l am certain in what l am writing ie research research......so that if lm trying to make a point l feel confident in backing it up and l won't be making sweeping generalisations.

This is never gonna settle so lm backing off a bit for now!

Adam Zapple · Post by **Adam Zapple** » Sun Feb 12, 2006 6:05 am

Definition of anti-semitism from Merriam-Webster:

"hostility toward or discrimination against Jews as a religious, ethnic, or racial group"

Fletch · Post by **Fletch** » Sun Feb 12, 2006 10:06 am

Definition of semitism from various Reference:

"The Semitic languages are a family of languages spoken by more than 370 million people across much of the Middle East, where they probably originated, and North and East Africa. They constitute the northeastern subfamily of the Afro-Asiatic languages, and the only branch of this group spoken in Asia.

The most widely spoken Semitic language today is Arabic (206 million speakers), followed by Amharic (26 million speakers), Tigrinya (6.75 million speakers), and Hebrew (6 million speakers)."

Definition 1) A language group in the Afro-Asiatic language family that includes Hebrew and Arabic. 2) description of Middle East peoples that trace their origin from the biblical Noah and his son Shem; these include Jews and Arabs.

Semitic doesn't only cover Jews.

Every link will tell you Arabic is the most widely spoken semitic language.

It's a language/dialect, not a religious base.

A huge body of cultures would come under the banner of anti-semitic if discriminated against.

Feel free to check the following links.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semitic_languages

http://www.bartleby.com/61/10.html

http://fp.ccls.columbia.edu/~semwksp-acl05/

http://phoenicia.org/semlang.html

http://www.arab.de/arabinfo/larabic.htm

http://www.britannica.com/eb/article-9008157

So to be 'anti-semitic' you must be against Semites

After looking through the above, if you still think to be 'anti-semitic' is just a Jewish thing, then I will say it is a complete hijacking of a word, as have plenty of scholars in the past.

Peace

Fletch

Saffron · Post by **Saffron** » Sun Feb 12, 2006 10:30 am

Wow everyone has really gone off the deep-end over here, all because of a few "IGNORE" buttons and smileys. And I am even being called a "Jew hater" and "anti-semitist". I'm not even gonna go back and try to figure that out. I'll just leave you all to your name-calling thread, as that is really what is has turned into.:wah: I need to go take a bath now and pay attention to my real life. Bye bye!

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Fletch · Post by **Fletch** » Sun Feb 12, 2006 11:04 am

Saffron wrote: And I am even being called a "Jew hater"

Ladies & Gentlemen, this is what happens when you block people and only get to read highlighted quotes.

Pity as nobody has said she hates Jews and as she has decided to block, she will never get to know that 'semitic' doesn't mean Jewish.

Jives · Post by **Jives** » Sun Feb 12, 2006 11:10 am

Saffron wrote: Wow everyone has really gone off the deep-end over here, all because of a few "IGNORE" buttons and smileys. And I am even being called a "Jew hater" and "anti-semitist". I'm not even gonna go back and try to figure that out. I'll just leave you all to your name-calling thread, as that is really what is has turned into.:wah: I need to go take a bath now and pay attention to my real life. Bye bye!

Don't worry, Saffron! I like you lots! don't worry, not all of us are like that!:o