Brexit makes us poorer

Clodhopper · Post by **Clodhopper** » Tue May 22, 2018 1:52 pm

According to the Governor of the Bank of England as a result of the brexit vote every household in the UK is NOW £900 worse off as a result of the brexit vote than we would have been had we not been so ****ing stupid. I'd like to thank and congratulate every brexiter on their contribution to our personal financial situations and ask them to get on with paying us back for their cretinous stupidity.

gmc · Post by **gmc** » Thu May 24, 2018 2:33 pm

Growth Commission report sets out independent Scotland cash boost | The National

Growth Commission report sets out independent Scotland cash boost

No vote means whisky should be labelled as British, suggests May | The National

No vote means whisky should be labelled as British, suggests May

Haven't checked but I bet that isn't in the daily mail.

The scotch whisky industry spent a lot of time and effort ensuring whisky made in japan or india or the US can't be sold as scotch whisky. It's the same with scotch meat and fish a lot of time has been spent building up the brandscottish name as being of high quality.

Scotch Whisky Association - Protecting Scotch Whisky worldwide

The Legal Affairs Department (LAD) does not carry out brand protection - that is the responsibility of brand owners.

LAD's responsibility is to stop any mis-representation that states or suggests a whisky is Scotch Whisky, or comes from Scotland, when that isn't the case.

It also protects the industry from general forms of unfair competition to help ensure there is a level playing field between all brands sold as whisky, whatever the origin.

Bruv · Post by **Bruv** » Thu May 24, 2018 2:55 pm

Yes but what about the 350 million a week from leaving ?

It will make that and pay for the NHS funding............so no worries...........fingers crossed of course.

FourPart · Post by **FourPart** » Sat May 26, 2018 2:27 pm

Actually, since the Brexit vote my pay has gone up by about £1,800 & business has never been so good.

gmc · Post by **gmc** » Sun May 27, 2018 4:49 am

posted by fourpart

Actually, since the Brexit vote my pay has gone up by about £1,800 & business has never been so good.

I take it you are paid in euros?

Bruv · Post by **Bruv** » Sun May 27, 2018 5:55 am

gmc;1519392 wrote: posted by fourpart

I take it you are paid in euros?

Nope, changed jobs and/or got promotion ?

FourPart · Post by **FourPart** » Mon May 28, 2018 3:07 pm

Nope. Paid in Sterling, and have been in the same job for almost 2 years now.

I admit I may not be typical. I consider myself extremely fortunate to be working for a company based on Socialist principles. They pay staff more than the Real Living Wage, as well as regular pay rises. Plus they increase your pay scale for each skillset you acquire, as you become more valuable to the company. I started on £17,200 & have since had 2 annual pay rises as well as 2 additional skillsets. Furthermore, they also come up with decent bonuses. Of course, I don't count the bonuses as part of my salary as they are just that. The current one works out at 2.5% of annual salary, and the Xmas one is 1 week's pay, although they occasionally surprise us with additional ones along the way.

Utilita is an entirely UK based company. This means that we're going to be playing on a level playing ground for once. Since I started, shortly after the Referendum, the company is thriving, having almost tripled in size. Brexit has certainly not done any harm to this business.

Clodhopper · Post by **Clodhopper** » Wed May 30, 2018 3:16 am

I trust Utilita will do as well outside the EU when that happens. Your pay rise means you are actually about £900 better off than before the vote - £900 has gone on brexit. Anyone with less than a £900 increase in pay since the vote is actually poorer. Does Utilita do better as people get poorer?

I'd like to hear of any other pay rises. If everyone is like 4part then Brexit is a success in limited economic terms. But so far this is the only one I've heard of.

gmc · Post by **gmc** » Wed May 30, 2018 9:29 am

You find a lot of people especially in the media it seems cannot grasp the concept of "real" wage growth or the real rate of return on savings.

FourPart · Post by **FourPart** » Wed May 30, 2018 4:56 pm

You have to be very careful when using the term 'Real Wage'. The Tories make a point of using their intorduction of the Living Wage as being the 'Real' Living wage which, of course, it is. That is because the REAL Living Wage is only a guideline. It is not mandatory. The NATIONAL Living Wage is just their rebranding of the Minimum Wage, introduced by Labour (opposed by the Tories). Utilita pay above Real Living Wage.

As for £900 having gone on Brexit. So far we are still in the EU. Nothing has changed as far as that is concerned. My salary has increased by £1800pa over the past 2 years. It's as simple as that. I am getting all of that £1800. I do not see anything on my Deductions that says anything about Brexit. Ture, my Tax Code has been lowered so I am paying more tax at the moment, but that was due to an issue with my previous employer screwing up their payroll resulting in my underpaying tax, and that is now being reclaimed.

Brexit, in itself, is not the problem. It's the way the Tories are handling it. May is putting forward unrealistic demands which are never going to be acceded to, whereas Corbyn has put forward viable proposals that the EU Leaders believe would be a fair compromise. The whole negotiations are going to have to be a matter of Give & Take. May's version is "You give us everything or we'll give you nothing".

The UK always thrived as an economy before the EU. There is no reason we cannot do so again. We are a net importer, meaning that we are more valuable to the EU than they are to us. If they impose tariffs, then we do the same. That means we would be better off as they would be paying more tariffs than we would. If you look at all the corporations who have decided to leave, supposedly because of Brexit, you will find that these are companies that pay little or no tax anyway, so are no major loss. There will always be other businesses who do pay their taxes eager to take their place.

There is currently talk of another Snap Election in the Autumn and to be realistic that will be fought mainly on the Brexit issue rather than Party Poicy, but I think everyone will be fully aware of the mess May & her Cronies have been making of things thus far, plus I doubt they will be that enchanted at the way she has bribed the DUP in order to cling to power. It's likely to be a dirty campaign from the Tories but before you take them at their word, take their own advice & "Judge Them On Their Record".

Clodhopper · Post by **Clodhopper** » Thu May 31, 2018 6:24 am

Ok, ignoring the fact that I regard the EU, warts and all, as the best hope for the peace and prosperity of all its members based on the rule of law and the freedom of the individual that has ever existed in European history and will never be reconciled to brexit which is this country at its worst: xenophobic, arrogant and stupid.

Yes, we traded before. Yes, we will again. It's the transition that's worrying. Not to mentioned we were the sick man of Europe before we joined, a basket case. Took a few years to even stop falling.

I have no faith in Corbyn and his bunch of 1970s dinosaurs. I suppose it's a more interesting experiment, to drive all major business out of the country and I'd pick that over the Conservative option because we might at least end up with public ownership of strategic services like water in the long run. I think the pain would last longer and be greater under a Corbyn option but the outcome might at least have a few up sides in 50 or 100 years.

Time will tell. But never forget that brexiters are responsible for what happens. This is a state change of enormous proportions. It changes our whole balance and purpose and situation in the world fundamentally. I don't see Corbyn as any more capable of having his cake and eating it than the tories, because that's what both their plans amount to.

Still, if the Italians leave too, with us gone that might well be enough to kill the whole EU project at which point the whole of Europe will go into economic meltdown. Probably the best hope for brexit. Putin then becomes the most successful Russian leader since Ivan the Terrible and we are back in the dark ages.

I still don't think you have the faintest clue what you have done. None of you. Brexit is, totally and completely, the problem. All of you have different ideas, all are now saying, "If they'd done it OUR way everything would have been fine." Bull****. It's a damned stupid idea to cut ourselves out of a great deal to take a worse one and gain **** all. Let alone the cultural, social, diplomatic and scientific damage which mean nothing to you.

gmc · Post by **gmc** » Fri Jun 01, 2018 12:13 am

A real rate of return is the annual percentage return realised on an investment, which is adjusted for changes in prices due to inflation or other external effects. This method expresses the nominal rate of return in real terms, which keeps the purchasing power of a given level of capital constant over time.

https://www.investopedia.com/terms/r/re ... return.asp

The real rate of return or the real wage increase is the amount above or below the rate of inflation. If inflation is 2% and you get a 1% wage rise then the real wage bcrease is -1%. Last year rpi was 2.2% Typical return on bank savings before tax is 1.5% most people are nopt making any real gains on their savings.

https://www.ons.gov.uk/economy/inflationandpriceindices

I don't know what % of your earnings is but if it's not at least a 5% increase over the last two years then you are actually no better off in real terms. People in the public sector have been getting 1% rises (while MP's gave themselves above inflation pay rises) in real terms their wages have been falling steadily - they are substantially worse off.

As to the effect of brixit with pound falling in value since most of our food is imported prices will rise - as will the cost of fertiulsers etc for farmers. The effect is not immediate something which many brexiteers don't seem to undertstand, supermarkets do not buy foodstuffs for sale the next day they are planning moinths in advance and ordering accordingly usually on fixed price contracts it's only now we are beginning toi see the effect. Diesel is now up at £1.39 transport costs are going up or will do shortly. All thes e couriers zooming around delivering ofr amazon have just seen their profit margins take a kicking.

posted by fourpart

The UK always thrived as an economy before the EU. There is no reason we cannot do so again.

Actually not it wasn't the sick man of europe went bon bended knees to try and get in to the eu. Now they are on bended knees trying to get a deal. What has just imposed tariffs on imported goods from europe imo anyopne who thinks we can do better on our own without being on the wrong end of a deal ith the US is delusional.

In what way has the eu ever stopped british businesses doing business anywhere they like in the world?

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-indi ... SKBN1GM088

France signs deals worth $16 billion in India; to deepen defense, security ties

course all our former colonies will be delighted to do business with us out of gratitiude for us colonizing them. just don't mention the empire windrush scandal.

Clodhopper · Post by **Clodhopper** » Fri Jun 01, 2018 3:06 am

"We are brexiting to do great deals around the world. We can't so these great deals while shackled by EU chains," the brexiters said.

What's the situation now? We can't do any deals at all and meanwhile France has done a big deal (above) and Germany has done a deal on cars with China (should cover any drop in orders from whatever is left of the UK) Ireland has done a deal selling meat to China and the EU is opening negotiations on behalf of all its members with Australia and NZ while we can't.

So this key Brexit claim that we were leaving to do deals because we couldn't do deals as an individual country while in the EU? A LIE. Pure brexit.

gmc · Post by **gmc** » Fri Jun 01, 2018 9:07 am

Arch Brexiteer Lord Lawson applies for French residency | Latest Brexit news and top stories - The New European

Arch Brexiteer Lord Lawson applies for French residency

Bruv · Post by **Bruv** » Fri Jun 01, 2018 12:58 pm

Well well well......what is there to say ?

Clodhopper · Post by **Clodhopper** » Thu Jun 14, 2018 4:24 am

I think what Lawson said was that Brexit should allow any competent government to fly like a bird, or plane, or Superman. Then giggled.

Clodhopper · Post by **Clodhopper** » Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:48 am

The Brexit Secretary and the Foreign Secretary resign. Normally this would be a massive crisis but times are not normal. It's possible in two days we'll have forgotten it completely. But it could be the end of the May Gov't if more resignations follow and it makes a soft Brexit overall less likely. Hard and disorderly Brexit or Remain look more likely, with hard and disorderly ahead because all the brexiters have to do is wreck, and they are very good at wrecking after 40 years practice.

It IS possible that fear of a Corbyn Gov't will cause the Tory brexiters or Remainers to stop short of toppling the current one, nor is there any other candidate who could come as close to uniting the Tory Party as May does. Her very weakness might to turn out to be her strength: she has become irreplaceable to the Tories, at present. That would mean her compromise goes ahead: soft Brexit. And the row will fester on.

For Remainers, it all depends on whether Grieve is right and Parliament CAN still force a vote and still, at the last minute, stop the process. Doubtful.

So all results are still possible but a hard, disorderly Brexit just pushed ahead a bit. Since the exit date is now months away (children conceived now would likely be born post Brexit, I think) this is alarming and gets more alarming the closer the Brexit date gets. It would I think also pretty much guarantee a break up of the UK.

Let's just remember we were promised the easiest negotiations in the history of the world leading to great deals and sunlit uplands by brexiters (literally - that's three promises I've run together). We should note that several papers have now carried the story that Banks and Wigmore saw the Russian ambassador or other officials something like 7 times MORE than the few times they had admitted having a boozy lunch. Big deals were offered by the Russians. We should note the Leave campaign is under investigation for financial cheating and this might go criminal.

When you have a referendum won by a squeaky bum close margin this matters. If this is true and I think it is then the referendum result has no validity because it was decided not by the will of the British people but by the will of Putin and dodgy money which was enough to swing a close result.

gmc · Post by **gmc** » Tue Jul 10, 2018 1:47 pm

Around 72% of those eligible to vote in the referendum 52% of that is nowhere near a majority demonstrating the will of the people except in the delusional world of the brexiteer. The more I hear these arseholes the angrier I find myself getting.

Clodhopper · Post by **Clodhopper** » Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:00 pm

2 more resignations, minor ones, which ups the pressure in theory at least. But the 1922 Committee still hasn't received the necessary number of letters required to trigger a leadership contest and honestly I think May now shrugs at resignations as long as it isn't Hammond. There are only about 60 or 70 hard brexiters and they could all be replaced I think, in theory at least.

Never seen anything like it. Don't know where things are going, don't think it looks good.

I don't know if we can still get a 2nd ref or not, or force a Parliamentary vote to stop it or indeed what the effect on the country would be if Parliament voted to stop it. I have started to see a few brexiters expressing regret which was very rare before the weekend. But it IS possible we are now in an uncontrollable spin heading for a crash.