Virus Warning - Virus Sent By E-mail

G#Gill · Post by **G#Gill** » Sat Jan 05, 2008 6:58 am

This seems to be through MSN users' e-mail addresses.

It seems to be a recurring problem. Somebody manages to gain access to your list of contacts in MSN and uses those contacts to send a message bogusly from YOU.

Unaware contacts will think it is from you and open the message thus innocently receiving this virus !

In order to help prevent yourself becoming a victim of this CHANGE YOUR PASSWORDS REGULARLY.

What happens :-

You will receive an e-mail from a friend on your contacts list

Subject :- "Find out who has blocked or deleted you in MSN MESSENGER"

This is a hoax, tempting the naturally curious into opening this email - DO NOT OPEN.

DELETE IT IMMEDIATELY , then inform the sender what you have done and why, so they are in the picture.

This is the second time this has happened to me. The first time I was caught out, and the virus had to be manually removed, as my security could not remove it. The second time - today, I am now aware of it so I have deleted without opening, and I now pass on this information to all on Forum Garden.

Carolly · Post by **Carolly** » Sat Jan 05, 2008 7:08 am

G#Gill;753668 wrote: This seems to be through MSN users' e-mail addresses.

It seems to be a recurring problem. Somebody manages to gain access to your list of contacts in MSN and uses those contacts to send a message bogusly from YOU.

Unaware contacts will think it is from you and open the message thus innocently receiving this virus !

In order to help prevent yourself becoming a victim of this CHANGE YOUR PASSWORDS REGULARLY.

What happens :-

You will receive an e-mail from a friend on your contacts list

Subject :- "Find out who has blocked or deleted you in MSN MESSENGER"

This is a hoax, tempting the naturally curious into opening this email - DO NOT OPEN.

DELETE IT IMMEDIATELY , then inform the sender what you have done and why, so they are in the picture.

This is the second time this has happened to me. The first time I was caught out, and the virus had to be manually removed, as my security could not remove it. The second time - today, I am now aware of it so I have deleted without opening, and I now pass on this information to all on Forum Garden.I got one yesterday from Janloue Gill......I did open it but I didnt click on the email to show me more as I sussed it out it was a con.I also think (as Im not at home) that I have some more like that.Havent these pratts got anything else to do with their time than hurt innocent people........some where the pc is their lifeline.God some people are sick in the head.

G#Gill · Post by **G#Gill** » Sat Jan 05, 2008 7:12 am

Hi Carol, I would check back in all the emails on any PC you have and just delete those that look like this one. Also change your passwords matey, regularly.

See you later maybe ! Elsewhere

G#Gill · Post by **G#Gill** » Sat Jan 05, 2008 7:27 am

I have always wondered why these idiots don't put their obvious talents to better and more sociable use. :-5 :-5

Nomad · Post by **Nomad** » Sun Jan 06, 2008 12:31 am

Okaaaay, Ill stop.

kazalala · Post by **kazalala** » Sun Jan 06, 2008 5:19 am

Nomad;754243 wrote: Okaaaay, Ill stop.

:wah::wah::wah:

G#Gill · Post by **G#Gill** » Sun Jan 06, 2008 6:00 am

Nomie you are a wally :wah::wah::wah::wah:

Mia · Post by **Mia** » Sun Jan 06, 2008 6:10 am

Thanks for the warning,I have not had one yet. I think it is mainly kids with a warped sence of humour that do this type of thing,I have no idea what they get out of it.How an earth do they get your contacts? They must be able to hack your hotmail account!!! This is scarey.

Chezzie · Post by **Chezzie** » Tue Jan 08, 2008 11:12 am

thats cos your a mucky girl and surf porn

:wah:

Chezzie · Post by **Chezzie** » Tue Jan 08, 2008 11:13 am

that was meant for kinks but her post disappeared lol...sorry if I just revealed your secret pastime Mia lol:wah::wah::wah:

Post by **spot** » Tue Jan 08, 2008 1:50 pm

Are you saying that you have a virus checker installed and operational but that opening the email still infected your system?

Ritz · Post by **Ritz** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 1:09 am

Hiiii guys..

As you may know that I have had two of my forums Hacked,now I cannot get into my msn no matter how I try as that been hacked also if so how???:mad:

Carolly · Post by **Carolly** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 4:42 am

Ritz;781063 wrote: Hiiii guys..

As you may know that I have had two of my forums Hacked,now I cannot get into my msn no matter how I try as that been hacked also if so how???:mad:Ritz I had that problem...no way could I get into my MSN but I can into my hotmail there.I had to open a new MSN account with a different name.I was told its prob been hacked and yes I agree how, why and who ....whats the point fgs.

Post by **spot** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 5:13 am

What does hacked mean?

That is an absolutely genuine 100% question, I haven't a clue what either of you mean by the word and I feel I would have a far better grasp of the reality if someone explained it to me. It's like listening to a couple of alchemists discussing the best moon phase for a successful triple distillation of mercurial spirits.

Carolly · Post by **Carolly** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 5:24 am

spot;781100 wrote: What does hacked mean?

That is an absolutely genuine 100% question, I haven't a clue what either of you mean by the word and I feel I would have a far better grasp of the reality if someone explained it to me. It's like listening to a couple of alchemists discussing the best moon phase for a successful triple distillation of mercurial spirits.If I could understand what you mean Spot Id answer you:rolleyes:;)

kazalala · Post by **kazalala** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 5:27 am

its when someone accesses your computer, or an account on your computer. is'nt it?:-3

Post by **spot** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 5:36 am

Carolly;781106 wrote: If I could understand what you mean Spot Id answer you:rolleyes:;)

How can anyone not understand what "What does hacked mean?" means?

It's so simple a question...

What does hacked mean?

Carolly · Post by **Carolly** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 5:41 am

spot;781112 wrote: How can anyone not understand what "What does hacked mean?" means?

It's so simple a question...

What does hacked mean?Spot please dont be sarcy as all im doing is asking a question and I hilighted the bit I dont understand .

.

kazalala · Post by **kazalala** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 5:43 am

spot;781112 wrote: How can anyone not understand what "What does hacked mean?" means?

It's so simple a question...

What does hacked mean?

I told you spot^^^^up there look:Doooer hope i aint gone invisible again:wah:

Post by **spot** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 5:59 am

Carolly;781118 wrote: Spot please dont be sarcy as all im doing is asking a question and I hilighted the bit I dont understand .

.

Carolly, I can't see highlighting on this computer. Words are so much simpler to understand than diagrams. All I can see are words. No colours, no font size changes, none of it. I can see bold and italic. This is a very simple small computer with practically no frills at all.

I am, I promise, not being sarky. I plain don't know what this thread means by "hacked" and I would love to be told.

If kaz is right and "its when someone accesses your computer, or an account on your computer. is'nt it?" then "hacked" means "someone knows your password and uses it" - is that it? Hacked means someone's using your password? Or is there anything else to it as well, or have I misunderstood?

It's not sarcasm Carolly, it's that "hack" means something very different to me and I guarantee that what I mean by it isn't what it means to you at all. I'm making an honest attempt to find out what you're talking about.

Peg · Post by **Peg** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 6:04 am

From Wikipedia

a modification of a program or device to give the user access to features that were otherwise unavailable to them.

Post by **spot** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 6:12 am

That's helpful Peg, that fits into what I've always understood by "hack". To hack is to understand something down to its roots, it's to become an authority on a small[1] area of knowledge to such an extent that people come to you just to watch it happen. "Do you hack that" could mean "do you understand not just what you can see there, but what's causing it, what it implies, where it could lead, how it could be improved, where its strong and weak points lie, why it is what it is, do you see the beauty of those three lines and why it's just those three lines that turn this whole thing into an artwork". Here are two crucial sentences to help understand hacking: "He hacks that" is possible, "I'm a hacker" is unlikely. In Peg's example there are new additional features in a device because someone hacked it.

[1] "small" is meaningless in this paragraph.

Peg · Post by **Peg** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 6:17 am

When someone "hacks" your computer, they can get into your computer from another location, look around at your files and folders, and change things.

Carolly · Post by **Carolly** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 6:20 am

Peg;781131 wrote: When someone "hacks" your computer, they can get into your computer from another location, look around at your files and folders, and change things.Thankyou Peg for that simple explanation.

kazalala · Post by **kazalala** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 6:31 am

right, now, so how do you fix it then

:wah::wah:

Post by **spot** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 6:34 am

Peg;781131 wrote: When someone "hacks" your computer, they can get into your computer from another location, look around at your files and folders, and change things.

Bullshit. That's not what they mean in the slightest.

Bear with me, the reason for my explaining what I understand by hack is that it's relevant to what's in this thread. Once upon a time someone must have made a joke that went along the lines of:

My computer's been invaded, my passwords have been accessed, my documents have been read, my settings have been altered, my desktop has a Mona Lisa background in place of my sister"

"Man, someone really hacked your security!".

That doesn't allow "My computer's been hacked" in this thread. Nobody has come and looked delicately at your configuration and teased apart layer after layer of protection before working their evil will on the contents. What's happened is far less personal, it's not involved anyone hacking anything. If you take your computer out onto the internet and engage in unsafe practices then your machine will end up a total wreck.

I'm here in this thread because for all I can tell so far the ForumGarden server is causing these problems. I don't yet believe it, I doubt if it's happened but I'm trying very hard to find out if it's true because the answer matters a lot to me.

Post by **spot** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 6:57 am

Carolly;781118 wrote: Spot please dont be sarcy as all im doing is asking a question and I hilighted the bit I dont understand .It's like listening to a couple of alchemists discussing the best moon phase for a successful triple distillation of mercurial spirits.

Ah... I pressed Quote and it told me where the colour change was.

Alchemy is a subject about which I know almost nothing.

Mercurial spirits is a powder which contains mercury. Heat breaks it down and allows the mercury to escape as a vapour. Distillation allows the mercury to be captured as a liquid again. Re-dissolving it in spirits lets the alchemist re-distill the mercury a second and then a third time. The alchemist is trying, as best I understand it, not to chemically purify the mercury but to work its essential immaterial aspect - those are words I don't understand other than that the alchemist uses the physical manipulation of chemicals as a metaphor for the corresponding mental process he works at simultaneously, and that both processes act on the spiritual plane where he's trying to achieve an effect.

The phase of the moon may or may not have an influence on the result in the mind of the alchemist on the spiritual outcome of the distillations.

My listening to a couple of alchemists discussing this is as meaningless as my listening to you lot talk about hacking because in both cases I have a limited grasp of the vocabulary, I'm ignorant of the ground of the belief system in what's being discussed and nobody's ever bothered to explain to my why the moon's phase is relevant.

Chezzie · Post by **Chezzie** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 10:02 am

Spot, my msn account was hacked.......JUST my msn account, not my pc, which is what mia also said, except hers was hotmail. These people somehow gain entry to your msn,hotmail and change the password and secret question/answer so you cant use no more. My friends could see me online but it wasnt me..

I have no idea what so ever who did it.

Post by **spot** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 10:16 am

Chezzie;781334 wrote: These people somehow gain entry to your msn,hotmail and change the password and secret question/answer so you cant use no more. My friends could see me online but it wasnt me..

I have no idea what so ever who did it.

That's password theft, identity theft, it might even be as good as password cracking though I'd doubt it. None of it has anything to do with hacking. You're taking a useful word and using it to confuse yourself about what was done to you. You simply can't just have one word for all the ills of online computer use, you need to discriminate to be able to even discuss what happens and how to protect yourself. You're in the position here of saying "I got magic used on me" except you call it hack instead of magic. It's not a useful model for what happens, it's too vague. It's like having a language with only one word.

Underlying all of this is that you have a program - MSN or Yahoo Messenger - capable of letting malign code onto your computer, and at some point you get asked "can I do this" and you say yes instead of no, or you've changed your defaults to allow the intrusion to happen automatically. That's the user mistake. From then on all your base are belong to us - you handed your keys to a stranger. You get absolutely the same consequence if you don't stay up to date with all the Microsoft security patches too. What you see is "my friends could see me online but it wasnt me" but it wasn't necessarily a conscious real person either, it's far more likely to have been an automated process trying to spread the malign code to further users by pretending to be you, using your good name to validate their request for access. It's not a person, it's usually called a Bot.

Post by **spot** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 1:36 pm

Peg;781131 wrote: When someone "hacks" your computer, they can get into your computer from another location, look around at your files and folders, and change things.

I apologize Peg, I said Bullshit earlier on and I was perhaps unclear as to why. I agree with what you've written here except I'd word it slightly differently - if someone hacks computer security then they could get into your computer &c &c. What I meant was that I completely guarantee that this is not what has ever happened to anyone in this thread ever, under any circumstances.

The people who write the Bots that invade people's home computers and prejudice personal information don't go anywhere near your computer themselves, and they don't crack your home computer passwords either. They rely entirely on social engineering. They write Bots that say "click this and X will happen" and the Bots quite often validate their friendliness by knowing one of your friends and pretending to be him or her saying "hey, have a look at this". Your own computer security depends on you saying No to such invitations. Once you say yes to it, it then automatically steals your online accounts and pretends to be you to all your own friends and relations. This isn't a guy breaking into your system, this is an automated process. It's not a kiddy with too much time on his hands, it's commercial theft. The end result of all these invasions is a quarter of a million dollar credit card list for sale once a week, or an orchestrated denial of service attack that gets bought off by a bank transfer.

So, yes, there are people who hack computer security but you've none of you ever had any contact with one of them. What you're plagued by are automated Bots and you ought to know by now how to stay safe from them. Staying safe from them is entirely your own responsibility. Most people don't manage to.

Is there anything I can possibly say in this thread that will be useful to anyone? I'm sat here being totally accurate and informative and all I can sense is mutant hostility from people who don't want to listen.

Look, I'll be really good, I'll put the question to Gill that I put a month ago and got no response to - are you saying that you have a virus checker installed and operational but that opening the email still infected your system? Because if the answer to that is Yes then I think there's a mistake some place in the opening post and I'd be interested in finding out what it is. If the answer's No then hey, what else can you expect.

kazalala · Post by **kazalala** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 1:58 pm

Spot, you probably could be of good help to a lot of people. BUT....... and im only speaking for myself here. The way you talk (or type) sometimes comes across as sarcastic, arrogant well just plain unpolite really. its as if you get annoyed when people dont understand what you mean, or if they wont agree. Please understand im not saying you are doing it on purpose, but like its been said many times on here the written word can come across wrong, You put a lot of effort in to your posts most of the time, maybe you could try putting more of an effort in to being a bit more civil or understanding of others. Saying that i havent really got across exactly what i mean here

Anyway i hope you are not offended by my honest opinion spot, as i wont be of yours:D

Post by **spot** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 2:32 pm

People quite often don't want to hear reality, I expect. It hurts. Not a word I've posted in this thread is unhelpful and it's all going to be ignored simply because they think they know what they're talking about and consequently I'm wrong. It's not exactly a sensible choice on their part.

kazalala · Post by **kazalala** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 2:37 pm

:-2:rolleyes::-5

Chezzie · Post by **Chezzie** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 2:45 pm

I enjoy reading your comments Spot, alot I dont understand but thats my ignorance and your high intelligence lol

Your replies are curt and blunt and not frilly which often make them seem very harsh. I am sure thats not the real case and as you only use a real basic pc with no smileys etc, I think thats why you get misinterpreted.

I totally understand what your saying Spot but most of us arent that pc savvy and if someone attempts to do anything to our pc we call it hacking...Its how every I know explains it, rightly or wrongly.

Post by **spot** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 2:59 pm

Chezzie;781484 wrote: and if someone attempts to do anything to our pc we call it hacking...Let me try to explain why I think vocabulary is so important here.

We have people saying "I've been hacked", right? Active external aggression is implied. Oh I am a victim of events beyond my control. Someone with a huge brain and a voracious appetite for antisocial behaviour came along and picked deliberately on me and wham, my computer had no choice, it was thrown to the floor and forcibly ravished before my very eyes.

That's not what happened.

Let's do the checklist. Are the security patches up to date? No? You left your computer open to an automated attack, lose two goes and forfeit a holiday in Majorca.

Do you have an up to date installed active resident virus checker? No? Same result, same penalty.

If it were me I'd insist on the same question with a two-way firewall like the free Zone Alarm, because I don't feel confident enough of my fly-by-wire instincts to know that nobody has popped one over on me. I want a second opinion from my automated friend which watches every single Internet access and warns me if material's leaving my machine that I haven't actively consented to.

So, has your two-way firewall ever asked you for permission to allow material to go off-site and you've said Yes when you really didn't know why you were saying it? Yes? Return to the Old Kent Road and pay a forfeit.

Has your Operating System ever asked whether you really do mean to allow something to be installed and you've said Yes because you didn't understand the question? Bong!

If your computer is running slow or your messengers are locked out or your browser keeps showing you advertising you didn't expect to see then somewhere in that list you've screwed up, and none of it involved anyone hacking your computer. What it involved is that you have allowed - active, not passive - you have allowed your computer to be taken over by a malign Bot that means to steal from you and that's busy offering itself to a hundred other people, dangling its cherries and uttering seductive mumbles as it goes and, to add insult to injury, probably pretending to be you.

And none of it involved anyone hacking your computer. Did I mention that bit?

Chezzie · Post by **Chezzie** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 3:01 pm

I get it Spot.....np dont get hacked off hun:sneaky::D

Post by **spot** » Sat Feb 23, 2008 1:05 am

Chezzie;781492 wrote: I get it Spot.....np dont get hacked off hun:sneaky::D

Let me try by way of a fable, in the manner of Aesop.A visitor once asked a lad to account for his missing leg. You are, I can't help but notice, missing your left leg below the knee, how did that come about, he asked.

Sir, replied the lad, it is a curious feature of my village that practically all the lads are missing at least one leg. It stems from our use of a short-cut through the minefield when going to and from school. Every now and then somebody blows our leg off when we're part-way through.

Surely, the man asked, there must be another route that could avoid this shocking consequence?

Indeed there is, sir, replied the youth, but that way passes close by the village hospital. We lads hate going near that place on account of the howls of pain we might overhear by being near it.I do hope that helps.

Post by **spot** » Mon Feb 25, 2008 5:32 am

Nobody mentioned Richard Stallman in this thread. He's the man. His tale is a story of total bloody-mindedness in the face of impossible pressures and nobody can say he didn't win.