spot;1364628 wrote: Your Great Leader has been offering hundreds of v.useful Scots Police Officers on loan to "our neighbours in the South", saying he was entirely confident in the good sense of his countrymen not to emulate the childish follies of English Yoof. He was grinning like a cat all the way through the interview.
The lack of copy cat behaviour might have something to do with the rain falling rather heavily.
The Tottenham Riot
The Tottenham Riot
The statement in the House today should be interesting, as will the subsequent debate. Prime Minister Cameron has sounded increasingly back-to-the-wall shrill all week which has been an ugly sound. There's a complete lack of introspection, no sign of regret for the damage inflicted over the last thirty years on the unemployable abandoned masses on the estates. In a divided society he spent the week saying They instead of We. He's not fit to govern the country. The Archbishop of Canterbury wouldn't speak in such terms.
The complete lack of any comment by Cameron on the trigger for all these events, the killing of Mark Duggan, is an outrage. The riots are a trivial distraction from the long-term matter of police immunity.
The complete lack of any comment by Cameron on the trigger for all these events, the killing of Mark Duggan, is an outrage. The riots are a trivial distraction from the long-term matter of police immunity.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
-
Oscar Namechange
- Posts: 31840
- Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:26 am
The Tottenham Riot
spot;1364746 wrote: The statement in the House today should be interesting, as will the subsequent debate. Prime Minister Cameron has sounded increasingly back-to-the-wall shrill all week which has been an ugly sound. There's a complete lack of introspection, no sign of regret for the damage inflicted over the last thirty years on the unemployable abandoned masses on the estates. In a divided society he spent the week saying They instead of We. He's not fit to govern the country. The Archbishop of Canterbury wouldn't speak in such terms.
The complete lack of any comment by Cameron on the trigger for all these events, the killing of Mark Duggan, is an outrage. The riots are a trivial distraction from the long-term matter of police immunity.
It will certainly be Intersting and no doubt the subject of any murder Inquiry Into Mark Duggan's death will be carefully avoided. What is the betting that the one thing he will highlight Is the killing of the three Asian men, mown down In the street? That should deflect the cause of the riots nicely for him.
The complete lack of any comment by Cameron on the trigger for all these events, the killing of Mark Duggan, is an outrage. The riots are a trivial distraction from the long-term matter of police immunity.
It will certainly be Intersting and no doubt the subject of any murder Inquiry Into Mark Duggan's death will be carefully avoided. What is the betting that the one thing he will highlight Is the killing of the three Asian men, mown down In the street? That should deflect the cause of the riots nicely for him.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
-
Oscar Namechange
- Posts: 31840
- Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:26 am
The Tottenham Riot
All quiet In Gloucester tonight although the police seemed to be anticipating trouble as we saw many Welsh Police Vans heading Into the town centre.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
The Tottenham Riot
The statement in the House today should be interesting, as will the subsequent debate. Prime Minister Cameron has sounded increasingly back-to-the-wall shrill all week which has been an ugly sound.
He made me think you were going to fight the Nazis again. I just saw him on the BBC, the goons are going to be let loose.
He made me think you were going to fight the Nazis again. I just saw him on the BBC, the goons are going to be let loose.
The Tottenham Riot
Scrat;1364852 wrote: I just saw him on the BBC, the goons are going to be let loose.
I think not. The police have cashed in on the million or so high-resolution CCTV cameras on London's main streets and a stack of face recognition monitoring, they're going out daily with vans arresting everyone at their home addresses and using the photo-evidence in court. On the streets they're standing back rather than clubbing the crowds, effectively egging the rioters to loot themselves into jail.
I think not. The police have cashed in on the million or so high-resolution CCTV cameras on London's main streets and a stack of face recognition monitoring, they're going out daily with vans arresting everyone at their home addresses and using the photo-evidence in court. On the streets they're standing back rather than clubbing the crowds, effectively egging the rioters to loot themselves into jail.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
The Tottenham Riot
What you said in the House yesterday was almost a parody, Mr Cameron. Shall we try that? A parody? Why not...I have said before that there is a major problem in our society with armed police teams not caring about the difference between right and wrong. This is not about enforcing the law, it's about culture. A culture that glorifies violence, shows disrespect to the public, and says everything about rights but nothing about responsibilities. In too many cases, the commanders of these armed police - if they are even consulted - don't care where their teams are or what they are planning. The potential consequences of neglect and indiscipline on this scale have been clear for too long, without enough action being taken.
As I said yesterday, there is no one step that can be taken. But we need a complaints system that works and that is on the side of the public. We need more discipline in our police stations. We need action to deal with the most disruptive police teams. And we need a criminal justice system that scores a clear and heavy line between right and wrong. In short, all the action necessary to help mend our broken police force.
At the heart of all the violence sits the issue of the armed teams. Territorial, hierarchical and incredibly violent, they are mostly composed of volunteer officers attracted to confrontation. They earn money through policing, particularly armed confrontation and are bound together by an imposed loyalty to an authoritarian command structure. They have blighted life on their streets with ambush killings and unprovoked attacks on innocent bystanders. In the last few days they have been behind the planned attack on Mark Duggan in Tottenham and being the trigger for the protests, riots and looting that has followed.
As I said yesterday, there is no one step that can be taken. But we need a complaints system that works and that is on the side of the public. We need more discipline in our police stations. We need action to deal with the most disruptive police teams. And we need a criminal justice system that scores a clear and heavy line between right and wrong. In short, all the action necessary to help mend our broken police force.
At the heart of all the violence sits the issue of the armed teams. Territorial, hierarchical and incredibly violent, they are mostly composed of volunteer officers attracted to confrontation. They earn money through policing, particularly armed confrontation and are bound together by an imposed loyalty to an authoritarian command structure. They have blighted life on their streets with ambush killings and unprovoked attacks on innocent bystanders. In the last few days they have been behind the planned attack on Mark Duggan in Tottenham and being the trigger for the protests, riots and looting that has followed.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
The Tottenham Riot
The police watchdog has appealed for witnesses to the fatal shooting of Mark Duggan by officers in Tottenham, north London.
BBC News - Mark Duggan death: IPCC appeals for witnesses
What's up, chaps? CO19 switched off the permanent police CCTV recorders when they set up the ambush, did they? There's gaps in the files and the backups are empty?
Nothing new there then.
BBC News - Mark Duggan death: IPCC appeals for witnesses
What's up, chaps? CO19 switched off the permanent police CCTV recorders when they set up the ambush, did they? There's gaps in the files and the backups are empty?
Nothing new there then.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
The Tottenham Riot
I'm really glad we have a police force. I know it's not going to get everything right, none of us get everything right but I'm sure riot control is not easy.
Live the questions now. Perhaps you will then gradually, without noticing it, live along some distant day into the answers...Rainer Maria Rilke
The Tottenham Riot
The riot control has been exemplary, theia. The armed ambush squads are a disgrace to the nation and they're immune from prosecution. What's more, they haven't shown their faces since the riots started.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
-
Oscar Namechange
- Posts: 31840
- Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:26 am
The Tottenham Riot
spot;1364871 wrote: The police watchdog has appealed for witnesses to the fatal shooting of Mark Duggan by officers in Tottenham, north London.
BBC News - Mark Duggan death: IPCC appeals for witnesses
What's up, chaps? CO19 switched off the permanent police CCTV recorders when they set up the ambush, did they? There's gaps in the files and the backups are empty?
Nothing new there then.
Correct me should I be wrong but did the Met not turn off the street camera's during the Ian Tomlinson affair and It was In fact, a tourist who filmed the damaging footage ?
BBC News - Mark Duggan death: IPCC appeals for witnesses
What's up, chaps? CO19 switched off the permanent police CCTV recorders when they set up the ambush, did they? There's gaps in the files and the backups are empty?
Nothing new there then.
Correct me should I be wrong but did the Met not turn off the street camera's during the Ian Tomlinson affair and It was In fact, a tourist who filmed the damaging footage ?
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
The Tottenham Riot
oscar;1364915 wrote: Correct me should I be wrong but did the Met not turn off the street camera's during the Ian Tomlinson affair and It was In fact, a tourist who filmed the damaging footage ?
I would not know. I was not there. The ability of normally-recorded video evidence suddenly going walkabout when police prosecutions are discussed ought to come under conspiracy to pervert the course of justice. All we need is an Acting Commissioner of the Metropolitan Police prepared to hold his officers to account instead of maintaining a blanket of immunity over them.
I would not know. I was not there. The ability of normally-recorded video evidence suddenly going walkabout when police prosecutions are discussed ought to come under conspiracy to pervert the course of justice. All we need is an Acting Commissioner of the Metropolitan Police prepared to hold his officers to account instead of maintaining a blanket of immunity over them.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
The Tottenham Riot
Well, it's Friday. Have we still got 16,000 police officers on the streets of London? Because if we don't I suspect the chaps with face-masks will make a fairly defiant point. And if we do actually still have 16,000 police officers on the streets of London, will they be there tomorrow night? It must be a while since some of them saw their own beds.[1]
I note that "The police watchdog has admitted it may have misled journalists into believing police shooting victim Mark Duggan fired at officers before he was killed", according to the BBC News report. How very big of the IPCC to say so. If they know of non-existence of any CCTV imagery relating to the event which would normally have been recorded, or that Mr Duggan wasn't holding a firearm when he was shot, then they're being a damn sight more misleading than they're owning up to so far and it will do their already paltry reputation no good at all when it's finally made public.
[1] That wasn't a sneaky side-reference to the sleaze-rag Daily Mail. This footnote, on the other hand, is.
I note that "The police watchdog has admitted it may have misled journalists into believing police shooting victim Mark Duggan fired at officers before he was killed", according to the BBC News report. How very big of the IPCC to say so. If they know of non-existence of any CCTV imagery relating to the event which would normally have been recorded, or that Mr Duggan wasn't holding a firearm when he was shot, then they're being a damn sight more misleading than they're owning up to so far and it will do their already paltry reputation no good at all when it's finally made public.
[1] That wasn't a sneaky side-reference to the sleaze-rag Daily Mail. This footnote, on the other hand, is.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
The Tottenham Riot
Course don't forget all this has somewhat distracted attention from how far up Rupert Murdoch's backside cameron was. Stael a TV you are a thief, declare war for no good reason bankrupt the country and make millions jobless and homeless and you are a politician or a banker. Trust me I'm the prime minister ---- nope still don't.
Neither do the police it seems.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/cr ... 36535.html
Neither do the police it seems.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/cr ... 36535.html
The Tottenham Riot
who's side on you on?
The police, who most likely had a pretty good reason for going after this guy..
or the thousands of thugs who are out ripping apart your country?
They should round up all of these little feckers, lock them up, and deport the ones who are immigrants.
England needs to toughen up on these little bastatrds
The police, who most likely had a pretty good reason for going after this guy..
or the thousands of thugs who are out ripping apart your country?
They should round up all of these little feckers, lock them up, and deport the ones who are immigrants.
England needs to toughen up on these little bastatrds
The Tottenham Riot
We obviously differ in our priorities Mike. There's no point simply contradicting each other, the best we can do is leave our respective arguments for and against in the thread for whoever reads it to evaluate.
I certainly regard the lethal ambush technique as an abomination and its perpetrators as unprosecuted criminals who have destroyed the good name of the Metropolitan Police over a period of decades.
The riots are utterly unimportant by comparison, they've merely highlighted the value of mass surveillance of densely populated areas of the country which is something I'd like to see extended as far as it can be taken.
I certainly regard the lethal ambush technique as an abomination and its perpetrators as unprosecuted criminals who have destroyed the good name of the Metropolitan Police over a period of decades.
The riots are utterly unimportant by comparison, they've merely highlighted the value of mass surveillance of densely populated areas of the country which is something I'd like to see extended as far as it can be taken.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
-
Oscar Namechange
- Posts: 31840
- Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:26 am
The Tottenham Riot
mikeinie;1364950 wrote: who's side on you on?
The police, who most likely had a pretty good reason for going after this guy..
or the thousands of thugs who are out ripping apart your country?
They should round up all of these little feckers, lock them up, and deport the ones who are immigrants.
England needs to toughen up on these little bastatrds
When we have finished looking at the 'Glory photographs' adorning our tabloids, some should try reading the real stories of real life people caught up In the rioting. I read today of one woman who had to jump from her burning flat as some scroat ran off with a TV from the shop below. She was rightly terrified. Then there were the residents who had a 40 strong gang just arrive In their street and started ransacking Innocent, hard working people's houses brandishing broken bottles while they too were terrified.
Now, In today's papers, there Is the mother whinging about her human rights because she has been served with an eviction notice from her council home due to her little darling going out rioting and looting. Now watch the Lefties come out, make excuses for them and send them on holidays for being 'deprived'.
There Is much to be said about lack of Investment creating this situation but over this past week, one thing has stood out. Why no rioting and looting In Scotland, Ireland or Wales?
Maybe It is because the Scots, The Welsh and the Irish actually have some pride In their country and would not shame their country. Here, the very thugs who terrorised Innocent people are now whinging that plod has battered their door In at 6 am In a dawn raid, dragged them to the floor and got a bit rough with them. Suddenly, now, they want their 'Yuman rites man'.
The police, who most likely had a pretty good reason for going after this guy..
or the thousands of thugs who are out ripping apart your country?
They should round up all of these little feckers, lock them up, and deport the ones who are immigrants.
England needs to toughen up on these little bastatrds
When we have finished looking at the 'Glory photographs' adorning our tabloids, some should try reading the real stories of real life people caught up In the rioting. I read today of one woman who had to jump from her burning flat as some scroat ran off with a TV from the shop below. She was rightly terrified. Then there were the residents who had a 40 strong gang just arrive In their street and started ransacking Innocent, hard working people's houses brandishing broken bottles while they too were terrified.
Now, In today's papers, there Is the mother whinging about her human rights because she has been served with an eviction notice from her council home due to her little darling going out rioting and looting. Now watch the Lefties come out, make excuses for them and send them on holidays for being 'deprived'.
There Is much to be said about lack of Investment creating this situation but over this past week, one thing has stood out. Why no rioting and looting In Scotland, Ireland or Wales?
Maybe It is because the Scots, The Welsh and the Irish actually have some pride In their country and would not shame their country. Here, the very thugs who terrorised Innocent people are now whinging that plod has battered their door In at 6 am In a dawn raid, dragged them to the floor and got a bit rough with them. Suddenly, now, they want their 'Yuman rites man'.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
The Tottenham Riot
oscar;1364970 wrote: When we have finished looking at the 'Glory photographs' adorning our tabloids, some should try reading the real stories of real life people caught up In the rioting. I read today of one woman who had to jump from her burning flat as some scroat ran off with a TV from the shop below. She was rightly terrified. Then there were the residents who had a 40 strong gang just arrive In their street and started ransacking Innocent, hard working people's houses brandishing broken bottles while they too were terrified.
Now, In today's papers, there Is the mother whinging about her human rights because she has been served with an eviction notice from her council home due to her little darling going out rioting and looting. Now watch the Lefties come out, make excuses for them and send them on holidays for being 'deprived'.
There Is much to be said about lack of Investment creating this situation but over this past week, one thing has stood out. Why no rioting and looting In Scotland, Ireland or Wales?
Maybe It is because the Scots, The Welsh and the Irish actually have some pride In their country and would not shame their country. Here, the very thugs who terrorised Innocent people are now whinging that plod has battered their door In at 6 am In a dawn raid, dragged them to the floor and got a bit rough with them. Suddenly, now, they want their 'Yuman rites man'.
There has actually been rioting in Northern Ireland also by people in their teens much to the shock of those who lived through the troubles. As to why there have been no riots in scotland maybe the weather was a factor, who klnows at this point. Rather than bring in someone from the states perhaps Cameron should ask some of the very experienced members of our own police forces for advice. I can't think of anything better guaranteed to antagonise the police force in england that what Cameron is doing - that and not listening to what they are telling him about the effect his cuts will have. What's the bet this american he says the same things the English police are, more police on the streets and getting to know their communities and working with local groups. I've come to the conclusion Cameron is yet another arrogant arsehole
Now, In today's papers, there Is the mother whinging about her human rights because she has been served with an eviction notice from her council home due to her little darling going out rioting and looting. Now watch the Lefties come out, make excuses for them and send them on holidays for being 'deprived'.
There Is much to be said about lack of Investment creating this situation but over this past week, one thing has stood out. Why no rioting and looting In Scotland, Ireland or Wales?
Maybe It is because the Scots, The Welsh and the Irish actually have some pride In their country and would not shame their country. Here, the very thugs who terrorised Innocent people are now whinging that plod has battered their door In at 6 am In a dawn raid, dragged them to the floor and got a bit rough with them. Suddenly, now, they want their 'Yuman rites man'.
There has actually been rioting in Northern Ireland also by people in their teens much to the shock of those who lived through the troubles. As to why there have been no riots in scotland maybe the weather was a factor, who klnows at this point. Rather than bring in someone from the states perhaps Cameron should ask some of the very experienced members of our own police forces for advice. I can't think of anything better guaranteed to antagonise the police force in england that what Cameron is doing - that and not listening to what they are telling him about the effect his cuts will have. What's the bet this american he says the same things the English police are, more police on the streets and getting to know their communities and working with local groups. I've come to the conclusion Cameron is yet another arrogant arsehole
-
Oscar Namechange
- Posts: 31840
- Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:26 am
The Tottenham Riot
gmc;1364985 wrote: There has actually been rioting in Northern Ireland also by people in their teens much to the shock of those who lived through the troubles. As to why there have been no riots in scotland maybe the weather was a factor, who klnows at this point. Rather than bring in someone from the states perhaps Cameron should ask some of the very experienced members of our own police forces for advice. I can't think of anything better guaranteed to antagonise the police force in england that what Cameron is doing - that and not listening to what they are telling him about the effect his cuts will have. What's the bet this american he says the same things the English police are, more police on the streets and getting to know their communities and working with local groups. I've come to the conclusion Cameron is yet another arrogant arsehole
The US geezer Is Bill Bratton. Responsible for bringing gangs under control In NY and LA. I agree with you, he Is only going to tell the arrogant arssehole what we already know.
The Met seems a little peeved with Cama-moron It appears already. Apparently the arrogant arssehole Is swanning around telling all and sundry that the rioting was brought under control by him cutting short his holiday. What a knob !!!
Has It not occurred to him that the Met could actually do as they pleased with the manpower they had available with his say or not.
It had absolutely nothing to do with him cutting short his holiday, In fact, he could have stayed there for all we noticed or cared.
I believe much of this situation was created under the previous government. The kids out rioting and looting were born under the Blair Government. The kids are a product of the ridiculous human rights act where plod may only look at a dusky skinned sole In a slighty queer manner and the said yooof Is claiming compo for police brutality. Labour's legacy Is to reward the reckless, bone Idle, feckless fathers and teenage mothers whilst penalising the hard working couples. Until that balance flips, it will never change.
The US geezer Is Bill Bratton. Responsible for bringing gangs under control In NY and LA. I agree with you, he Is only going to tell the arrogant arssehole what we already know.
The Met seems a little peeved with Cama-moron It appears already. Apparently the arrogant arssehole Is swanning around telling all and sundry that the rioting was brought under control by him cutting short his holiday. What a knob !!!
Has It not occurred to him that the Met could actually do as they pleased with the manpower they had available with his say or not.
It had absolutely nothing to do with him cutting short his holiday, In fact, he could have stayed there for all we noticed or cared.
I believe much of this situation was created under the previous government. The kids out rioting and looting were born under the Blair Government. The kids are a product of the ridiculous human rights act where plod may only look at a dusky skinned sole In a slighty queer manner and the said yooof Is claiming compo for police brutality. Labour's legacy Is to reward the reckless, bone Idle, feckless fathers and teenage mothers whilst penalising the hard working couples. Until that balance flips, it will never change.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
The Tottenham Riot
oscar;1364987 wrote: The kids are a product of the ridiculous human rights act where plod may only look at a dusky skinned sole In a slighty queer manner and the said yooof Is claiming compo for police brutality.The extent of your ignorance is invariably staggering, however many times you display it. I spent a couple of hours today reading the 1857 Instruction Book to the Cornish Police Force, written by their then Chief Constable, and it's far more restrictive on what the police were allowed to do and the way in which they could do it than the rules under which today's officers operate. If I thought you'd reed it I'd put it through the scanner.[1]
[1]: I refer bemused readers to http://www.forumgarden.com/forums/membe ... d-red.html
[1]: I refer bemused readers to http://www.forumgarden.com/forums/membe ... d-red.html
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
The Tottenham Riot
oscar;1364987 wrote: The US geezer Is Bill Bratton. Responsible for bringing gangs under control In NY and LA. I agree with you, he Is only going to tell the arrogant arssehole what we already know.
The Met seems a little peeved with Cama-moron It appears already. Apparently the arrogant arssehole Is swanning around telling all and sundry that the rioting was brought under control by him cutting short his holiday. What a knob !!!
Has It not occurred to him that the Met could actually do as they pleased with the manpower they had available with his say or not.
It had absolutely nothing to do with him cutting short his holiday, In fact, he could have stayed there for all we noticed or cared.
I believe much of this situation was created under the previous government. The kids out rioting and looting were born under the Blair Government. The kids are a product of the ridiculous human rights act where plod may only look at a dusky skinned sole In a slighty queer manner and the said yooof Is claiming compo for police brutality. Labour's legacy Is to reward the reckless, bone Idle, feckless fathers and teenage mothers whilst penalising the hard working couples. Until that balance flips, it will never change.
Remember how tony Blair wanted to centralise control of the police? Now no doubt cameron will try and do the same. I saw some of those pictures with the poklice standing watching, if there are a few of you and hundreds of rioters what exactly are you supposed to do?
The Met seems a little peeved with Cama-moron It appears already. Apparently the arrogant arssehole Is swanning around telling all and sundry that the rioting was brought under control by him cutting short his holiday. What a knob !!!
Has It not occurred to him that the Met could actually do as they pleased with the manpower they had available with his say or not.
It had absolutely nothing to do with him cutting short his holiday, In fact, he could have stayed there for all we noticed or cared.
I believe much of this situation was created under the previous government. The kids out rioting and looting were born under the Blair Government. The kids are a product of the ridiculous human rights act where plod may only look at a dusky skinned sole In a slighty queer manner and the said yooof Is claiming compo for police brutality. Labour's legacy Is to reward the reckless, bone Idle, feckless fathers and teenage mothers whilst penalising the hard working couples. Until that balance flips, it will never change.
Remember how tony Blair wanted to centralise control of the police? Now no doubt cameron will try and do the same. I saw some of those pictures with the poklice standing watching, if there are a few of you and hundreds of rioters what exactly are you supposed to do?
-
fuzzywuzzy
- Posts: 6596
- Joined: Mon Feb 02, 2009 5:35 pm
The Tottenham Riot
stand ...watch...record.
The Tottenham Riot
fuzzywuzzy;1365034 wrote: stand ...watch...record.I'd describe that as a deliberate policy of criminalizing as many of the underclass as possible, giving them as much rope as they could possibly need in the form of windowless consumer goods to walk off with and then refusing to break up the disorder itself.
The Instruction Manual from the Chief Constable of Cornwall in the 19th century, in contrast, ordered his officers to intervene as soon as criminal behaviour began and to break up the gathering, arresting the ringleaders as a matter of priority. That, in my opinion, while arresting fewer people in the long run (and consequently, when targets exist, meeting fewer target figures for arrests and charged suspects), is far more socially useful than criminalizing thousands who wouldn't have committed a crime at all if the "stand ...watch...record" policy weren't in operation.
The Instruction Manual from the Chief Constable of Cornwall in the 19th century, in contrast, ordered his officers to intervene as soon as criminal behaviour began and to break up the gathering, arresting the ringleaders as a matter of priority. That, in my opinion, while arresting fewer people in the long run (and consequently, when targets exist, meeting fewer target figures for arrests and charged suspects), is far more socially useful than criminalizing thousands who wouldn't have committed a crime at all if the "stand ...watch...record" policy weren't in operation.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
The Tottenham Riot
spot;1365044 wrote: I'd describe that as a deliberate policy of criminalizing as many of the underclass as possible, giving them as much rope as they could possibly need in the form of windowless consumer goods to walk off with and then refusing to break up the disorder itself.
The Instruction Manual from the Chief Constable of Cornwall in the 19th century, in contrast, ordered his officers to intervene as soon as criminal behaviour began and to break up the gathering, arresting the ringleaders as a matter of priority. That, in my opinion, while arresting fewer people in the long run (and consequently, when targets exist, meeting fewer target figures for arrests and charged suspects), is far more socially useful than criminalizing thousands who wouldn't have committed a crime at all if the "stand ...watch...record" policy weren't in operation.
I am amazed that anyone watching the events unfold could come to some of the conclusions you come to spot. Initially the police were greatly under represented by sheer weight of numbers, and it doesn't matter if you have the right of law and god on your side when faced with what they were faced with at that time.
To have 'gone in' under such a situation would have been suicide.
The way you put it, it appears that all the innocents were cajoled into looting due to police inaction, where as they could all have passed on by and gone home to safety.
We are policed by consent, that consent was missing during the height of the problems. So far better to use the technology available to safely monitor the events and use that later than steam in and loose the initiative entirely.
Did the Chief Constable of Cornwall have a manual for civil unrest, and would they be applicable today ?
The Instruction Manual from the Chief Constable of Cornwall in the 19th century, in contrast, ordered his officers to intervene as soon as criminal behaviour began and to break up the gathering, arresting the ringleaders as a matter of priority. That, in my opinion, while arresting fewer people in the long run (and consequently, when targets exist, meeting fewer target figures for arrests and charged suspects), is far more socially useful than criminalizing thousands who wouldn't have committed a crime at all if the "stand ...watch...record" policy weren't in operation.
I am amazed that anyone watching the events unfold could come to some of the conclusions you come to spot. Initially the police were greatly under represented by sheer weight of numbers, and it doesn't matter if you have the right of law and god on your side when faced with what they were faced with at that time.
To have 'gone in' under such a situation would have been suicide.
The way you put it, it appears that all the innocents were cajoled into looting due to police inaction, where as they could all have passed on by and gone home to safety.
We are policed by consent, that consent was missing during the height of the problems. So far better to use the technology available to safely monitor the events and use that later than steam in and loose the initiative entirely.
Did the Chief Constable of Cornwall have a manual for civil unrest, and would they be applicable today ?
I thought I knew more than this until I opened my mouth
The Tottenham Riot
There's no doubt in my mind that a large part of the people who participated did so because there was an opportunity to do it. As AC said, laws exist to honest people honest. Take those laws away and the real human comes out. Had the police busted a few heads in the very beginning it would not have been so bad.
What I find sickening at this point is the double standards. As I watched Cammoron make his speech in the big room (parliament) where some of the worst scum that ever floated to the top of the sewer we call government gathered I asked the question of just what have these upstanding individuals looted in their lives, what corruption have they been involved in? How have they broken the law behind the scenes, out of the public eye?
What it comes down to is that if most of the individuals out on the street had MORE OPPORTUNITIES they would not have been there to begin with.
What I find sickening at this point is the double standards. As I watched Cammoron make his speech in the big room (parliament) where some of the worst scum that ever floated to the top of the sewer we call government gathered I asked the question of just what have these upstanding individuals looted in their lives, what corruption have they been involved in? How have they broken the law behind the scenes, out of the public eye?
What it comes down to is that if most of the individuals out on the street had MORE OPPORTUNITIES they would not have been there to begin with.
-
Oscar Namechange
- Posts: 31840
- Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:26 am
The Tottenham Riot
spot;1365012 wrote: The extent of your ignorance is invariably staggering, however many times you display it. I spent a couple of hours today reading the 1857 Instruction Book to the Cornish Police Force, written by their then Chief Constable, and it's far more restrictive on what the police were allowed to do and the way in which they could do it than the rules under which today's officers operate. If I thought you'd reed it I'd put it through the scanner.[1]
[1]: I refer bemused readers to http://www.forumgarden.com/forums/membe ... d-red.html
The extent of your pomposity, conceit and arrogance Is Invariably staggering, however many times you display It.
I spent a couple of hours today reading the paperback version of ' A history of The British Police' by ' Richard John Cowley'. If I thought you'd read It, I'd put It through the scanner.
Posts are opinions Spot. Some are factual whilst others may dally as mere thoughts, suggestions and Idea's based on one's personal experiences of life, political leanings or a rehash of a scripted tabloid journal once perused during a coffee break.
Your self-Imposed superiority should not discount a written post merely because you have formed your own opinion and do not subscribe to that of which you read by others.
[1]: I refer bemused readers to http://www.forumgarden.com/forums/membe ... d-red.html
The extent of your pomposity, conceit and arrogance Is Invariably staggering, however many times you display It.
I spent a couple of hours today reading the paperback version of ' A history of The British Police' by ' Richard John Cowley'. If I thought you'd read It, I'd put It through the scanner.
Posts are opinions Spot. Some are factual whilst others may dally as mere thoughts, suggestions and Idea's based on one's personal experiences of life, political leanings or a rehash of a scripted tabloid journal once perused during a coffee break.
Your self-Imposed superiority should not discount a written post merely because you have formed your own opinion and do not subscribe to that of which you read by others.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
The Tottenham Riot
Bruv;1365054 wrote: The way you put it, it appears that all the innocents were cajoled into looting due to police inaction, where as they could all have passed on by and gone home to safety.That, I think, is an accurate statement of police strategy during the last two weeks. To present as attractive an opportunity for criminal behaviour as those on the streets could possibly wish for, in the knowledge that CCTV is now extensive and clear enough to provide proof to a court in the place of the word of an arresting officer present at the time.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
The Tottenham Riot
oscar;1365079 wrote: I spent a couple of hours today reading the paperback version of ' A history of The British Police' by ' Richard John Cowley'. If I thought you'd read It, I'd put It through the scanner.Your very offer is criminal. Were I not to immediately and explicitly spurn it I might even fall foul of the laws of conspiracy. Besides which, for a hardback only published this month I'm startled that you've found a paperback version.
Go back to what I criticised: "The kids are a product of the ridiculous human rights act where plod may only look at a dusky skinned sole In a slighty queer manner and the said yooof Is claiming compo for police brutality". You may find it amusing - a joke statement. I find it a vulgar piece of meretricious racist abuse. My comment about the laudable procedures of a representative mid-Victorian police force, which I'm prepared to back with a full-text copy of their out-of-copyright Instruction Manual on request since you may find it hard to track down, is an offer of evidence that what passes these days for restraint on the part of the modern constable is in fact comparative provocation. Standards have been corrupted by those who should have been repeating the example of their predecessors.
Your posts may, as you say, reflect your selectively biased opinions. ForumGarden is not, for all that, a spittoon.
Go back to what I criticised: "The kids are a product of the ridiculous human rights act where plod may only look at a dusky skinned sole In a slighty queer manner and the said yooof Is claiming compo for police brutality". You may find it amusing - a joke statement. I find it a vulgar piece of meretricious racist abuse. My comment about the laudable procedures of a representative mid-Victorian police force, which I'm prepared to back with a full-text copy of their out-of-copyright Instruction Manual on request since you may find it hard to track down, is an offer of evidence that what passes these days for restraint on the part of the modern constable is in fact comparative provocation. Standards have been corrupted by those who should have been repeating the example of their predecessors.
Your posts may, as you say, reflect your selectively biased opinions. ForumGarden is not, for all that, a spittoon.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
The Tottenham Riot
spot;1365090 wrote: That, I think...................
You think?
Thats OK then
You think?
Thats OK then
I thought I knew more than this until I opened my mouth
The Tottenham Riot
Bruv;1365092 wrote: You think?
Thats OK then
On the basis that what we've seen in news reports backs up my interpretation. I wouldn't dream of posting speculation (which is all I can post since documentation of police operational strategy isn't published) without reference to the events which support the interpretation I'm offering. I do not write in a vacuum.
Thats OK then
On the basis that what we've seen in news reports backs up my interpretation. I wouldn't dream of posting speculation (which is all I can post since documentation of police operational strategy isn't published) without reference to the events which support the interpretation I'm offering. I do not write in a vacuum.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
The Tottenham Riot
spot;1365093 wrote: On the basis that what we've seen in news reports backs up my interpretation. I wouldn't dream of posting speculation (which is all I can post since documentation of police operational strategy isn't published) without reference to the events which support the interpretation I'm offering. I do not write in a vacuum.
On the basis that the news reports were specific to the area the cameras were rolling, and not to ALL the other locations where the same things were happening unreported or not filmed ?
Unless you were there and could hear running feet, the smashing of shop fronts, smell the smoke and see the whites of the rioters eyes, any judgements about police activity/strategy are conjecture based on one dimension.
The Police 'on the ground' didn't have the luxury of retrospection, as we do.
On the basis that the news reports were specific to the area the cameras were rolling, and not to ALL the other locations where the same things were happening unreported or not filmed ?
Unless you were there and could hear running feet, the smashing of shop fronts, smell the smoke and see the whites of the rioters eyes, any judgements about police activity/strategy are conjecture based on one dimension.
The Police 'on the ground' didn't have the luxury of retrospection, as we do.
I thought I knew more than this until I opened my mouth
-
fuzzywuzzy
- Posts: 6596
- Joined: Mon Feb 02, 2009 5:35 pm
The Tottenham Riot
Dear England, who's full of convicts now?
Yours truly, Australia.
Yours truly, Australia.
-
Oscar Namechange
- Posts: 31840
- Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:26 am
The Tottenham Riot
I refer to my previous post and real life experiences.
Take approx 6 months ago. Police are called to a take-away where a large group of teenagers a little worse the wear for cut price supermarket booze, begin to make racial comments to the owner and staff. Having got some-what bored when their was no response, they moved a few door to the local supermarket where shortly after, police were called by the staff. The entire group were local white lads and the token silly young girl hanging on their every word and giggling but the main offender was a mixed race lad who was even threatening to 'blade' locals. Having heard It all before from this lad, the locals treated him with a mixture of mirth and contempt, however after shouting his mouth off for approx 20 minutes, he suddenly turned Into a meak ( yes that Is meak as I am experimenting with meak, meek and milk ) little lamb the moment plod arrived In two vans. Locals pointed to him a the main offender urging the others on and as soon as:, according to him, every local Including the Polish worker In the take-away was racist along with the police who he told his mother would be suing.
Is this an Isolated Incident? I think not and most people know It is not.
Nor It seems do many sources that police actually fear being labelled racist:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/ ... lamic.html
You could even try watching an episode or two of the several fly on the wall accounts of officers lives on the beat. 'Cops with camera's', 'Traffic cops' 'Road Wars' or a number of others would give you enough coverage to understand that your theory that members of the public do not claim racism when arrested by police, Is merely a theory or opinion on your part,
Instead of just forming a opinion as to what our police go through when they try to arrest some from ethnic backgrounds, and Insisting It doesn't happen because you have appointed yourself as some sort of authority on the subject, then at least research the topic sufficiantly In order to add some weight to your opinion.
The problem with self Imposed superiority Is that one reaches a time In life where their beliefs by the books they read, far outweigh real life. Finding a balance between the two and considering another for the fact they may have witnessed events that you have not, makes life a far more Interesting and sociable experience.
When was the last time you were down In the hood with a gang of feral, disadvantaged youngsters or actually there when plod was trying to reason with them ?
Take approx 6 months ago. Police are called to a take-away where a large group of teenagers a little worse the wear for cut price supermarket booze, begin to make racial comments to the owner and staff. Having got some-what bored when their was no response, they moved a few door to the local supermarket where shortly after, police were called by the staff. The entire group were local white lads and the token silly young girl hanging on their every word and giggling but the main offender was a mixed race lad who was even threatening to 'blade' locals. Having heard It all before from this lad, the locals treated him with a mixture of mirth and contempt, however after shouting his mouth off for approx 20 minutes, he suddenly turned Into a meak ( yes that Is meak as I am experimenting with meak, meek and milk ) little lamb the moment plod arrived In two vans. Locals pointed to him a the main offender urging the others on and as soon as:, according to him, every local Including the Polish worker In the take-away was racist along with the police who he told his mother would be suing.
Is this an Isolated Incident? I think not and most people know It is not.
Nor It seems do many sources that police actually fear being labelled racist:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/ ... lamic.html
You could even try watching an episode or two of the several fly on the wall accounts of officers lives on the beat. 'Cops with camera's', 'Traffic cops' 'Road Wars' or a number of others would give you enough coverage to understand that your theory that members of the public do not claim racism when arrested by police, Is merely a theory or opinion on your part,
Instead of just forming a opinion as to what our police go through when they try to arrest some from ethnic backgrounds, and Insisting It doesn't happen because you have appointed yourself as some sort of authority on the subject, then at least research the topic sufficiantly In order to add some weight to your opinion.
The problem with self Imposed superiority Is that one reaches a time In life where their beliefs by the books they read, far outweigh real life. Finding a balance between the two and considering another for the fact they may have witnessed events that you have not, makes life a far more Interesting and sociable experience.
When was the last time you were down In the hood with a gang of feral, disadvantaged youngsters or actually there when plod was trying to reason with them ?
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
-
Oscar Namechange
- Posts: 31840
- Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:26 am
The Tottenham Riot
Bruv;1365096 wrote: On the basis that the news reports were specific to the area the cameras were rolling, and not to ALL the other locations where the same things were happening unreported or not filmed ?
Unless you were there and could hear running feet, the smashing of shop fronts, smell the smoke and see the whites of the rioters eyes, any judgements about police activity/strategy are conjecture based on one dimension.
The Police 'on the ground' didn't have the luxury of retrospection, as we do. I totally agree with you. I was lucky In that I live just outside Bristol In a quiet village of South Gloucestershire and the only thing that Irked me was the damn police helicopters spooking my Fox population late Into the night, however, I would never be so pompous to think I was the authority based on glorified sensationalist tabloid reporting. I did have a relative In the City Centre however, who did hear the running feet, the smashing of glass etc and the whites of the eyes of fleeing, hooded scroats from her bedroom window.
Unless you were there and could hear running feet, the smashing of shop fronts, smell the smoke and see the whites of the rioters eyes, any judgements about police activity/strategy are conjecture based on one dimension.
The Police 'on the ground' didn't have the luxury of retrospection, as we do. I totally agree with you. I was lucky In that I live just outside Bristol In a quiet village of South Gloucestershire and the only thing that Irked me was the damn police helicopters spooking my Fox population late Into the night, however, I would never be so pompous to think I was the authority based on glorified sensationalist tabloid reporting. I did have a relative In the City Centre however, who did hear the running feet, the smashing of glass etc and the whites of the eyes of fleeing, hooded scroats from her bedroom window.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
The Tottenham Riot
fuzzywuzzy;1365098 wrote: Dear England, who's full of convicts now?
Yours truly, Australia.
I find that really funny, fuzzy :wah:
Yours truly, Australia.
I find that really funny, fuzzy :wah:
Live the questions now. Perhaps you will then gradually, without noticing it, live along some distant day into the answers...Rainer Maria Rilke
The Tottenham Riot
Stories from the frontline: We kept hearing 'officer down' on our radios - Crime, UK - The Independent
The rioter: Name withheld, 19
Took part in the Tottenham rioting
I was involved in the riots and everything that happened. The killing of Mark Duggan was not an isolated incident. There have been killings of more than 340 black people in the past 12 years. No police officer has ever been brought to justice. After Mark's death, no one contacted the family. There were lies, but last week the truth came out: no shots were fired by Mark Duggan. The riots were a statement; to fight against the police, to stand our ground – and to say we're not having any more of this. We've been stopped and searched and harassed and bullied.
Must admit I was unaware of that - if it is true haven't checked yet.
Sadly I don't think David cameron is going to learn anything from this, he's a public schoolboy coming out with public schoolboy responses.
postd by fuzzy wuzzy
Dear England, who's full of convicts now?
Yours truly, Australia.
:yh_rotfl
The rioter: Name withheld, 19
Took part in the Tottenham rioting
I was involved in the riots and everything that happened. The killing of Mark Duggan was not an isolated incident. There have been killings of more than 340 black people in the past 12 years. No police officer has ever been brought to justice. After Mark's death, no one contacted the family. There were lies, but last week the truth came out: no shots were fired by Mark Duggan. The riots were a statement; to fight against the police, to stand our ground – and to say we're not having any more of this. We've been stopped and searched and harassed and bullied.
Must admit I was unaware of that - if it is true haven't checked yet.
Sadly I don't think David cameron is going to learn anything from this, he's a public schoolboy coming out with public schoolboy responses.
postd by fuzzy wuzzy
Dear England, who's full of convicts now?
Yours truly, Australia.
:yh_rotfl
The Tottenham Riot
gmc;1365132 wrote: Stories from the frontline: We kept hearing 'officer down' on our radios - Crime, UK - The Independent
What an interesting article...different perspectives in every story.
What an interesting article...different perspectives in every story.
Live the questions now. Perhaps you will then gradually, without noticing it, live along some distant day into the answers...Rainer Maria Rilke
The Tottenham Riot
fuzzywuzzy;1365098 wrote: Dear England, who's full of convicts now?
Yours truly, Australia.
:yh_rotfl:wah::yh_rotfl
Magnificent
Yours truly, Australia.
:yh_rotfl:wah::yh_rotfl
Magnificent
The Tottenham Riot
fuzzywuzzy;1365098 wrote: Dear England, who's full of convicts now?
Yours truly, Australia.
but Australia is safe?:yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl
More than a quarter of sexual assault victims were aged 10 to 14 years
During 2010 there were 17,757 victims of sexual assault recorded by police, 25% of these victims aged 10 to 14 years, according to figures released today by the Australian Bureau of Statistics (ABS).
The majority of all sexual assault victims were female (85%). Females were also more likely to be victims of kidnapping/abduction than males (58%). Males were more likely to be victims of homicide & related offences than females (62%). This was also the case for robbery (65%) and blackmail/extortion (65%). Female victims of sexual assault aged 15–19 had the highest victimisation rate of any age group, at a rate more than seven times the overall rate for sexual assault.
Of the selected personal offences, weapons were mainly used in the commission of murders, attempted murders, and robberies. A knife was the most commonly used weapon in committing these offences: 33% of murder victims, 28% of attempted murder victims, and 18% of robbery victims were subjected to an offence involving a knife.
Most instances of murder, attempted murder and sexual assault took place in private dwellings (murder 59%; attempted murder 57%; sexual assault 60%). Community locations were the most common venue for kidnapping/abduction (55%) and robbery (59%).
Males aged 15–19 had the highest victimization rate for robbery, more than five times the overall victimization rate for robbery (56 victims per 100,000). Among females the victimization rate for robbery was highest for those aged 15–19 and 20–24.
More information on recorded crimes in Australia, can be found in Recorded Crime - Victims, Australia (cat. no. 4510.0)
Yours truly, Australia.
but Australia is safe?:yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl
More than a quarter of sexual assault victims were aged 10 to 14 years
During 2010 there were 17,757 victims of sexual assault recorded by police, 25% of these victims aged 10 to 14 years, according to figures released today by the Australian Bureau of Statistics (ABS).
The majority of all sexual assault victims were female (85%). Females were also more likely to be victims of kidnapping/abduction than males (58%). Males were more likely to be victims of homicide & related offences than females (62%). This was also the case for robbery (65%) and blackmail/extortion (65%). Female victims of sexual assault aged 15–19 had the highest victimisation rate of any age group, at a rate more than seven times the overall rate for sexual assault.
Of the selected personal offences, weapons were mainly used in the commission of murders, attempted murders, and robberies. A knife was the most commonly used weapon in committing these offences: 33% of murder victims, 28% of attempted murder victims, and 18% of robbery victims were subjected to an offence involving a knife.
Most instances of murder, attempted murder and sexual assault took place in private dwellings (murder 59%; attempted murder 57%; sexual assault 60%). Community locations were the most common venue for kidnapping/abduction (55%) and robbery (59%).
Males aged 15–19 had the highest victimization rate for robbery, more than five times the overall victimization rate for robbery (56 victims per 100,000). Among females the victimization rate for robbery was highest for those aged 15–19 and 20–24.
More information on recorded crimes in Australia, can be found in Recorded Crime - Victims, Australia (cat. no. 4510.0)
Life is just to short for drama.
The Tottenham Riot
Mark Duggan was buried today: BBC News - Mark Duggan: Funeral of man shot by police in Tottenham
"The family of Mr Duggan said on Thursday they had "no faith" in the Independent Police Complaints Commission's investigation into his death".
There's a surprise then. Neither do I. Not a peep out of the buggers since they apologized for implying he'd fired first.
Waiting six months for the next statement isn't adequate. The IPCC must surely be able to state factually answers to at least these questions:
1. Have recordings of the ambush been retrieved from local CCTV cameras.
2. Do they confirm that Mark Duggan had no weapon on his person throughout the ambush.
Because "A non-police issue handgun was recovered close to the scene of his death" sounds like more temporizing weasel-words to me. Close to the scene of his death could as easily be in the glove compartment of the cab as in his pocket, and as easily belong to the cabby as to Mr Duggan even if we discount the logical possibility that it was brought to the scene by a serving officer. Gritting your institutional IPCC teeth and admitting this is yet another unarmed man ambushed and killed out of Leman Street would at least improve your bemired IPCC reputation.
"The family of Mr Duggan said on Thursday they had "no faith" in the Independent Police Complaints Commission's investigation into his death".
There's a surprise then. Neither do I. Not a peep out of the buggers since they apologized for implying he'd fired first.
Waiting six months for the next statement isn't adequate. The IPCC must surely be able to state factually answers to at least these questions:
1. Have recordings of the ambush been retrieved from local CCTV cameras.
2. Do they confirm that Mark Duggan had no weapon on his person throughout the ambush.
Because "A non-police issue handgun was recovered close to the scene of his death" sounds like more temporizing weasel-words to me. Close to the scene of his death could as easily be in the glove compartment of the cab as in his pocket, and as easily belong to the cabby as to Mr Duggan even if we discount the logical possibility that it was brought to the scene by a serving officer. Gritting your institutional IPCC teeth and admitting this is yet another unarmed man ambushed and killed out of Leman Street would at least improve your bemired IPCC reputation.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
The Tottenham Riot
spot;1368920 wrote: 2. Do they confirm that Mark Duggan had no weapon on his person throughout the ambush.
Because "A non-police issue handgun was recovered close to the scene of his death" sounds like more temporizing weasel-words to me. Close to the scene of his death could as easily be in the glove compartment of the cab as in his pocket, and as easily belong to the cabby as to Mr Duggan even if we discount the logical possibility that it was brought to the scene by a serving officer. Gritting your institutional IPCC teeth and admitting this is yet another unarmed man ambushed and killed out of Leman Street would at least improve your bemired IPCC reputation.
That third possibility has raised its profile as regards who took the "non-police issue handgun" to the ambush.Two officers are being probed by the Independent Police Complaints Commission over an investigation they carried out days before the Mark Duggan shooting.
The watchdog said it will be independently examining the officers' response in relation to an alleged assault involving a gun. It has been confirmed that both have been placed on restricted duties pending the outcome of the investigation.
IPCC Examines Duggan Gun Investigation | UK Police News - Police Oracle
I can well believe the implication, though I never thought an officer would ever get prosecuted for doing it either in this instance or any other. Maybe someone from Leman Street will actually be thrown to the wolves for once.
Because "A non-police issue handgun was recovered close to the scene of his death" sounds like more temporizing weasel-words to me. Close to the scene of his death could as easily be in the glove compartment of the cab as in his pocket, and as easily belong to the cabby as to Mr Duggan even if we discount the logical possibility that it was brought to the scene by a serving officer. Gritting your institutional IPCC teeth and admitting this is yet another unarmed man ambushed and killed out of Leman Street would at least improve your bemired IPCC reputation.
That third possibility has raised its profile as regards who took the "non-police issue handgun" to the ambush.Two officers are being probed by the Independent Police Complaints Commission over an investigation they carried out days before the Mark Duggan shooting.
The watchdog said it will be independently examining the officers' response in relation to an alleged assault involving a gun. It has been confirmed that both have been placed on restricted duties pending the outcome of the investigation.
IPCC Examines Duggan Gun Investigation | UK Police News - Police Oracle
I can well believe the implication, though I never thought an officer would ever get prosecuted for doing it either in this instance or any other. Maybe someone from Leman Street will actually be thrown to the wolves for once.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
The Tottenham Riot
I have read that the gun was found over a wall at the scene of the shooting, with the inference that the victim had thrown it away before the shooting, a box was found in the vehicle that had contained the firearm. Also that the gun when found was loaded with one round, and that it had been bought a few days earlier by Duggan.
Can't find the link though.
Can't find the link though.
I thought I knew more than this until I opened my mouth
-
Oscar Namechange
- Posts: 31840
- Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:26 am
The Tottenham Riot
Bruv;1376326 wrote:
Can't find the link though.
I can
Man charged over gun found near Mark Duggan's body - Crime - UK - The Independent
Can't find the link though.
I can
Man charged over gun found near Mark Duggan's body - Crime - UK - The Independent
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
The Tottenham Riot
If the gun was in police... custody, though that's the wrong word... before the ambush it seems unlikely that Mark Duggan had an opportunity to buy it from anyone. A lot of lies get passed to news reporters by the gentlemen in blue. We'll wait and see.
Did I mention what I want happening to the Leman Street station? Bulldozing, with the footprint turning into a permanent memorial garden to all the people ever shot by officers deployed from the site and a damn great list of them in bronze bolted to one wall.
Did I mention what I want happening to the Leman Street station? Bulldozing, with the footprint turning into a permanent memorial garden to all the people ever shot by officers deployed from the site and a damn great list of them in bronze bolted to one wall.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
The Tottenham Riot
spot;1376339 wrote: If the gun was in police... custody, though that's the wrong word... before the ambush it seems unlikely that Mark Duggan had an opportunity to buy it from anyone. A lot of lies get passed to news reporters by the gentlemen in blue. We'll wait and see.
Did I mention what I want happening to the Leman Street station? Bulldozing, with the footprint turning into a permanent memorial garden to all the people ever shot by officers deployed from the site and a damn great list of them in bronze bolted to one wall.
They're having enough trouble bulldozing the other side of the road - they've been at it all year and still not cleared the site.
The interesting one will be when they get to the point of trying to explain how they attended a firearms incident, arrested the guy with the gun and charged him for having the gun in his possession but the gun was then, apparently, sold to Mark Duggan a month later in a sale that the Police were aware of.
If it was a sting type operation (that the Police are not allowed to do) then the ineptitude was unbelievable, if it was not then who was selling the gun and how? Then there is the possibility that the gun was in Police hands after the first incident and was planted by them following the shooting.
Which of the possibilities is worse? None of them can be good.
Did I mention what I want happening to the Leman Street station? Bulldozing, with the footprint turning into a permanent memorial garden to all the people ever shot by officers deployed from the site and a damn great list of them in bronze bolted to one wall.
They're having enough trouble bulldozing the other side of the road - they've been at it all year and still not cleared the site.
The interesting one will be when they get to the point of trying to explain how they attended a firearms incident, arrested the guy with the gun and charged him for having the gun in his possession but the gun was then, apparently, sold to Mark Duggan a month later in a sale that the Police were aware of.
If it was a sting type operation (that the Police are not allowed to do) then the ineptitude was unbelievable, if it was not then who was selling the gun and how? Then there is the possibility that the gun was in Police hands after the first incident and was planted by them following the shooting.
Which of the possibilities is worse? None of them can be good.
The Tottenham Riot
I might be missing something here, where does it say the gun was in the possession of the police at any time, other than when it was found after the shooting ?
Knowing it was the same gun used in earlier incidents doesn't mean that, does it ?
Knowing it was the same gun used in earlier incidents doesn't mean that, does it ?
I thought I knew more than this until I opened my mouth
The Tottenham Riot
It's hard to explain the suspension of the two officers if the gun hadn't gone through police hands.
I note that the IPCC has confirmed that Mark Duggan's fingerprints were absent from the still-boxed "non-police issue handgun" "recovered close to the scene of his death". Any variation of I was in immediate fear for lives when I shot Mark Duggan is going to take a major stretch of credulity. I still want to know what CCTV footage survived the subsequent cull, and how many cameras they now claim were out of commission or looking elsewhere.
I note that the IPCC has confirmed that Mark Duggan's fingerprints were absent from the still-boxed "non-police issue handgun" "recovered close to the scene of his death". Any variation of I was in immediate fear for lives when I shot Mark Duggan is going to take a major stretch of credulity. I still want to know what CCTV footage survived the subsequent cull, and how many cameras they now claim were out of commission or looking elsewhere.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
The Tottenham Riot
A lot of assumptions.
I read that the box had finger prints but not the gun, the box being in the vehicle while the gun was yards away, over a fence.
I would suggest that stopping a man suspected of carrying a loaded gun is tense to say the least, with the potential for loosing your own life.
Not wanting to defend the police's actions that day, it was not the time or the place to do such a thing, but I can understand over reaction resulting in shoots being fired and the confusing reports afterward.
Remember John Wayne was not involved, these are real people with real lives, no re-takes to get it right.
Remember there are nasty people out there.......and some are not policemen.
I read that the box had finger prints but not the gun, the box being in the vehicle while the gun was yards away, over a fence.
I would suggest that stopping a man suspected of carrying a loaded gun is tense to say the least, with the potential for loosing your own life.
Not wanting to defend the police's actions that day, it was not the time or the place to do such a thing, but I can understand over reaction resulting in shoots being fired and the confusing reports afterward.
Remember John Wayne was not involved, these are real people with real lives, no re-takes to get it right.
Remember there are nasty people out there.......and some are not policemen.
I thought I knew more than this until I opened my mouth