Is london under attack

Jives · Post by **Jives** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 12:57 pm

LOL. It's true you are seriously deluded. You actually think that its acceptable to butcher women and children. That puts you in the same league as Adolf Hitler, Micah. No civilized human being would EVER avocate war on civilians and innocents. You'll notice that our forces in Iraq do not kill civilians, but only fight against armed insurgents.

You see, our people are soldiers. They put on a uniform to be recognized, because they have nothing to hide. They follow the rules of engagement. They kill only arms carrying enemy soldiers.

The terrorists you are loving and protecting, do not use uniforms because they need to hide their identities like the criminals they are. They annihilate innocent civilians and noncombatants which makes them murderers. They recognize no rules at all and no limits to their behavior, that makes them psychopaths.

And you stick up for them, Micah? You are not a real man in my book. Real men have honor and integrity, you have none. You are something much less than a man.

And that goes for TW2005. and Spot, and anyone else that thinks cold-blooded murder is justifible.

MicahLorain · Post by **MicahLorain** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 1:12 pm

flopstock wrote: Hate to disagree with you on anything jives, but i just want to grab him and bitch slap him at the moment.

This is one of those things that is just WRONG. No reasoning, justification or other excuses.

It's just wrong and anyone that has trouble with stating that obvious fact, just because it may be totally opposite of their views on any other matter..needs to be knocked upside the head until they wake up.
Women & children are being killed in Iraq & Afghanistan every single day and our bombs and weapons have taken far more than those lost today in London. My point is if you invade another country and forcefully occupy it you will make enemies. People that have nothing and nothing to lose. There is no standing army to fight the invaders, just whatever you can do to weaken your foe. Of course I do not endorse bloodbaths like today in London. But I wonder how many were killed in Iraq and Afghanistan? Certainly some were killed by rebels, but many also by coalition troops and bombs. The invasion has turned both countries into war zones no one expected. To think the richest occupiers would have no repercussions at all at this stage is incredibly naive. My POINT again: Our war on terror has created and strengthened terror. To think our populations can just continue to consume and carry on normally is dreadfully wrong and will likely be proven so over the next couple decades. War on Terror = Peace & Security!! Interesting :yh_eyerol

Jives · Post by **Jives** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 1:13 pm

TW2005 wrote: I'm sure something will happen in the US again, maybe soon, maybe in the distant future.

You sound like you'd like that to happen. Excuse me for a minute....I have to forward your reply to the FBI.

We are aggressors in the War on Terror, anyone who is could be possibly be attacked at anytime.

Are you serious? One of the dead today in Britain is a 5 year old!!! In what possible way could a 5 year old EVER be considered an 'aggressor"?!!

MicahLorain · Post by **MicahLorain** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 1:17 pm

Jives wrote: You sound like you'd like that to happen. Excuse me for a minute....I have to forward your reply to the FBI.

Are you serious? One of the dead today in Britain is a 5 year old!!! In what possible way could a 5 year old EVER be considered an 'aggressor"?!!

Of the many children killed by coaltion forces, which Jives do YOU classify as aggressors?? Include Palestinian kids here too. It's the great patriotic war on terror! You expected no reprisals for living in a financier country??

Jives · Post by **Jives** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 1:28 pm

MicahLorain wrote: Women & children are being killed in Iraq & Afghanistan every single day

Not by us. We don't target women and children, the insurgents do. You know, those bloody murderers you are supporting.

and our bombs and weapons have taken far more than those lost today in London.

They sure do, and those we take out are enemy combatants, not civilians. Don't you get the basic difference between and fighter and an innocent civilian? Or do you just not care to make that distinction?

My point is if you invade another country and forcefully occupy it you will make enemies.

I don't have a problem with that. If soldiers had been killed, that is the cost of war. But these insane psycho-killers murdered innocent civilians. That's not a part of war by any standard. Unless you are an evil person.

just whatever you can do to weaken your foe.

There...you said it. You just said right out that you feel that murder of children is acceptable to "weaken your foe."

Of course I do not endorse bloodbaths like today in London.

Yes you do. You just did. Now I can call you a hypocrite to your face.

But I wonder how many were killed in Iraq and Afghanistan?

Are you feeling sorry for the terrorists now? It's agood thing they are dead, or they would be planning more carnage like today's. The funny thing about you, Micah, (and Spot and TW as well) is that you sing this "Up with the Freedom Fighter" revolutionary Anti-American garbage, yet if someone you love had been killed in this murder spree, you be singing an entirely different tune.

The invasion has turned both countries into war zones no one expected.

Thank you for pointing ot the "war" part. Killing innocent civilians is considered a war crime. Or didn't you know that? Your friends are criminals.

My POINT again: Our war on terror has created and strengthened terror. To think our populations can just continue to consume and carry on normally is dreadfully wrong and will likely be proven so over the next couple decades.

So since we are fighting terrorism and killing their combatants that means that it's OK for them to blow up grandmothers, little children, and old people. Nice logic, Micah. You are still refusing to admit that acts such as these cross the boundries of human behavior.

There is no justification for this Micah. By your logic, it would have been ok for us to slaughter the entire population of Germany, ...men, women, and children..., during World War II.

We do not kill civilians, Micah. That makes us the good guys and them the bad guys.

Whatever you believe about the "poor downtrodden terrorists fighting against the evil superpowers", killing innocents means that their cause no longer deserves your respect or sympathy.

But you are too stubborn, or too programmed, or too ignorant to admit it.

Lizzie Love · Post by **Lizzie Love** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 1:31 pm

Anyone who is maimed or killed is a casualty of human aggression and while I agree that people need to be defended, there is a code of ethics which determines that a soldier dressed as a soldier behaves as one.

The insidious way in which these and ANY other terrorists behave, in the US, Madrid, Palestine, the UK, Bali is the cancer which is growing on our planet.

I do not condone war and I do not believe that it is the answer, but I truly belive that as someone said, "for evil to continue it is only neccessary that good men do nothing". The Islamic fundamentalists and any other extremist group that wishes to TERRORIZE ordinary people, like Hitlers nazis and SS are EVIL.

For God's sake why is this a problem for some people, are you too demented yourself to see the truth. Are you defending these acts?

This violence is killing us all. but we cannot stand by and allow evil to continue and Al Queada is a force of evil in the world.

Lizzie Love :-5

MicahLorain · Post by **MicahLorain** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 1:34 pm

Far Rider wrote: God do people think this thing is over? We're not even at the beginning of the WOT, we've barely scratched the surface, with everyone of them we kill we are weakening their ability to attack peace loving countries... some folks here just dont get it. its a process, and drunig that process we will be attacked again and again. its called 'war'

Thinking the coalition forces went into Iraq and purposely targeted civilians is absolutley wrong. Did some civilians loose their lives, yes, and it's awful.

But like in London these terrorists take innocent life all the time it IS THEIR FOCUS... their method, and its evil.

If we stop attacking them do you think it will get better? Heck no! It will progressively get worse and they will continue to try to control us!

And thats the point of stopping them. because even if we pull out and leave the middle east alone and Isolate ourselves from them they will continue to make war against our way of life!
I sincerely wish you were correct FR! I do. But with every terrorist that is killed many, many more are lined up behind him. Exterminating ALL moslems is the only way to stop this round of terror. Are you willing to foot the bill? Send your kids? Open ourselves up to certain future attacks? Iraq had no weapon of mass destruction. Our reasons for being there are false. But we've simply poured honey on the beehive by invading anyway and drawing thousands of rebels from all over the globe. War doesn't equal peace. The WW2 days are over. This new foe is far more dangerous than the USSR ever was. Now the enemy is among us all. It's time to exit Iraq, focus on Afghanistan and Pakistan and restructure our approach to this 'war.'

abbey · Post by **abbey** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 1:35 pm

How very sad i feel today reading these posts, i never for one minute thought i would see an American in support of terrorism.

SHAME ON YOU

Jives · Post by **Jives** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 1:35 pm

YAY! Thank you Lizzie!

(Jives gets up on his desk and gives Lizzie a standing ovation!)

:yh_clap :yh_clap :yh_clap

Lizzie Love · Post by **Lizzie Love** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 1:36 pm

And that was meant to be in agreement with Jives not the Mica one.

Lizzie Love

Jives · Post by **Jives** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 1:36 pm

abbey wrote: an American in support of terrorism.

SHAME ON YOU

Good for you, Abbey! Shame, shame, we know your name...MICAH!:D

Jives · Post by **Jives** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 1:44 pm

MicahLorain wrote: Exterminating ALL moslems is the only way to stop this round of terror.

Man, that is the single most ridiculous statement I've hear in the Garden. There are lots of moderate, civilized Islamic people. You are as extremist as those terrorists you want to protect and justify.

Are you willing to foot the bill? Send your kids?

Damn straight. I am a First Lieutenant in the Air Force and my son serves to. So I get to have an opinion about the war. You, who does nothing but sit in the dark and support the enemy, are a coward and a traitor. If you love the terrorists so much, why not move to Iraq and join them. Oh, I forgot. Those people, whom you condone, would shoot you on sight.

Iraq had no weapon of mass destruction.

Really? Tell that to the Kurds. Oh, that's right, you can't... since they are all DEAD from chemical weapons of mass destruction.

The WW2 days are over. This new foe is far more dangerous than the USSR ever was. Now the enemy is among us all. It's time to exit Iraq, focus on Afghanistan and Pakistan and restructure our approach to this 'war.'

Go ahead. I'm listening. What is this "approach" you speak of? Giving them all cookies and mik?

:p

MicahLorain · Post by **MicahLorain** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 1:44 pm

Jives wrote: Good for you, Abbey! Shame, shame, we know your name...MICAH!:D

I won't take the bait but thanx for recognizing my name!! Exciting! Nothing I have said so far has sunken in so I'll boil it down: Terrorism is the result of something. Get to the result, then build a strategy to stop the cause. Invading countries on false pretenses is a catalyst for a future problem. The suggestion I'm 'glad' the London attacks happened is stupidity that won't get a reaction. I pictured MY FAMILY on the double decker bus. It's a hideous crime. By thinking we will get rid of these attacks by continuing our war and policies I've been labeled and threatened. So be it. This war will continue to bring tragedy to the coalition countries. It's the wrong path.

Jives · Post by **Jives** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 1:49 pm

TW2005 wrote: Obviously you missed my first post on this thread. I said "I do not condone the terrorists attacks"

And you are being as hypocritical as Micah. You do condone terrorist attacks, let me show you where....

All I am saying is that, anyone involved in the War will most likely be attacked.

There, you said it right there. You assume that it is a simple reaction that innocent civilians were killed. We invade their country so that means that some of our civilians will get slaughtered on busses and subways.

Let's get this straight. Those innocent communters weren't involved in the war. They have not taken up arms, they are not in the combat zone. It is illegal and immoral to target them.

Yet you seem to think it's a taken-for-granted act. You condone terrorism.

MicahLorain · Post by **MicahLorain** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 1:49 pm

Jives wrote: Man, that is the single most ridiculous statement I've hear in the Garden. There are lots of moderate, civilized Islamic people. You are as extremist as those terrorists you want to protect and justify.

Damn straight. I am a First Lieutenant in the Air Force and my son serves to. So I get to have an opinion about the war. You, who does nothing but sit in the dark and support the enemy, are a coward and a traitor. If you love the terrorists so much, why not move to Iraq and join them. Oh, I forgot. Those people, whom you condone, would shoot you on sight.

Really? Tell that to the Kurds. Oh, that's right, you can't... since they are all DEAD from chemical weapons of mass destruction.

Go ahead. I'm listening. What is this "approach" you speak of? Giving them all cookies and mik?

:p
The 1980's chemical attack on the Kurds is the reason we invaded Iraq Sarge? :wah: PLEASE suit up and go to the fight. And save some Kurds!!!!! BTW the Saddam regime was funded by the US of Fvckin A so try not to dream about the terrorism YOU wrought on the region.

MicahLorain · Post by **MicahLorain** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 1:50 pm

Jives wrote: And you are being as hypocritical as Micah. You do condone terrorist attacks, let me show you where....

There, you said it right there. You assume that it is a simple reaction that innocent civilians were killed. We invade their country so that means that some of our civilians will get slaughtered on busses and subways.

Let's get this straight. Those innocent communters weren't involved in the war. They have not taken up arms, they are not in the combat zone. It is illegal and immoral to target them.

Yet you seem to think it's a taken-for-granted act. You condone terroism.

You misspelled buses. And you're a teacher! :-3

Jives · Post by **Jives** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 2:00 pm

MicahLorain wrote: You misspelled buses. And you're a teacher! :-3

I have Rheumatoid Arthritus which makes verbal fencing on a typewriter a study in pain.

But my points are honorable, and vaild. And I use my real name, unlike you.....DAVID813.

Jives · Post by **Jives** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 2:02 pm

Well...it's been fun. Now I am going out to the sunshine to swim and forget about people who love evil and hate goodness.

See ya! :wah:

MicahLorain · Post by **MicahLorain** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 2:02 pm

TW2005 wrote: Anyone who thinks that it wont happen again, is an idiot. I never said I wanted it to happen. Go ahead and forward this message to the FBI. I'm sure they are aware that something will happen again. You will be wasting their time. Nice threat.

Again, an unfortunate event. I'm very sad for the family. But this is not a suprise to me. Sorry I can realize the threat is there and see that things like this will happen.
Odd how the biggest most shrill voices for war and occupation for whatever reason they could come up with are the bleeding hearts when a whiff of that war hits home.

MicahLorain · Post by **MicahLorain** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 2:03 pm

Jives wrote: Well...it's been fun. Now I am going out to the sunshine to swim and forget about people who love evil and hate goodness.

See ya! :wah:
Bring a life jacket!! You may drown in your stinky arrogance!

MicahLorain · Post by **MicahLorain** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 2:05 pm

Jives wrote: I have Rheumatoid Arthritus which makes verbal fencing on a typewriter a study in pain.

But my points are honorable, and vaild. And I use my real name, unlike you.....DAVID813.
I have a brother named David!!! You're full of BS too Jivetalker. Let's get some proof. Was he a lover?

Lizzie Love · Post by **Lizzie Love** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 2:28 pm

Ergo ego

where "I" go

he go.

It is unfortunate that so many people spend their whole lives fast asleep. Deluded as they are by the many facets the egoic mind., which thrives on seperatism, comparison and greed (just to name a few).

If we are to have a world then we need to wake up. And do it now.

namaste

lizzie Love :-6

Jives · Post by **Jives** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 3:01 pm

There is no justification for terrorism.

abbey · Post by **abbey** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 3:02 pm

Far Rider wrote: That was low of you Micah.A leopard may very well change his name Far, but he certainly can't change his spots!!;)

nvalleyvee · Post by **nvalleyvee** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 3:24 pm

I thought this was a post about the London bombings. OK I only read the last 10 posts - I hope there are no more to come. Those darned terrorists are attacking our allies now. Let them attack a few more and maybe we will get to the nitty-gritty and put them in their place. I can only hope no more people suffer.

nvalleyvee · Post by **nvalleyvee** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 3:43 pm

Far Rider wrote: Yeah well it started like that then morphed into a few telling us that the Brits deserved it for attacking Iraq and being agressive.

I thought the US was resposible for the attack on Iraq. We are the master infidels (sp) of the world. What about the other 20 or so countries who have sent troups? Does anyone think terrorism might be a global problem that stems from a minority group bent on martyrdom? I'd really like to read their Koran, Bible - whatever document they get their proof that killing in the name of their religion is OK.

nvalleyvee · Post by **nvalleyvee** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 4:09 pm

Far Rider wrote: Wow you're gonna stir it right back up there! You go girl!

You said it killing in the name of religion, not God. At least not under his direct orders today.

Killing in the name of their religion - I doubt God has sanctioned anything. If I were God looking down I would be twisted right now to think my teachings were soooooooo misconstrued.

So back to London - sorry you got hit - I mean that - it brought back my feelings on 9/11 in the US. My heart and soul are with all of the victims and their families.

Lizzie Love · Post by **Lizzie Love** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 4:32 pm

Thankyou Nvyvalleyvee I am a brit living in the US and while none of my close family are directly affected there are friends I don't know about yet.

It was the same for me when Madrid train was bombed and the 9/11 horrors, I am fortunate to have friends and family all over the globe. including Iraq and afghanistan. your thoughts and kind words are much appreciated.

namaste

Lizzie Love :-4

nvalleyvee · Post by **nvalleyvee** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 4:38 pm

Namaste Lizzie - I don't many people who know that meaning.

turbonium · Post by **turbonium** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 4:48 pm

My prayers and best wishes go out to all of you UK members, family & friends that you are all OK!

Accountable · Post by **Accountable** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 5:56 pm

MicahLorain wrote: The people in the subway are paying for the invasion and sending their kids to fight. Again, CONSEQUENCES!!!
Pretty easy spouting that tripe from the comfort of your chair, isn't it?

BabyRider · Post by **BabyRider** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 6:48 pm

MicahLorain wrote: You misspelled buses. And you're a teacher! :-3Completely off topic, so I'll be quick.

Micah, we generally don't point out people's spelling errors here, it's rude, and makes one sound like a snob. Not to mention the fact, that on the rare occassions we do point them out, they are actually real misspellings. Busses is spelled with 2 s's. You can check it out at www.dictionary.com

So now, not only did you succeed in making yourself look rude, you made yourself look foolish to boot!

That's the end of my little aside...enjoy your thread.