Kenya on the brink?
Kenya on the brink?
I fear events in Kenya may be slipping out of control, not that important a story for us, but given what happened in Rwanda and Burundi in the mid 1990s I hope that the international community doesn't allow what was once an african country with a relatively bright future descend into anarchy and ethnic cleansing.
"We are never so happy, never so unhappy, as we imagine"
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Kenya on the brink?
Good post, too often these situations are not discussed until too late.
It is very unfortunate as Kenya is not a country that would normally be known for violence and this kind of madness. It is a country that has a strong tourist market and being a very friendly place.
It is a shame to see it be dragged into this kind of madness, and only adds to the reputation that as a continent, Africa just can’t get its act together.
It is very unfortunate as Kenya is not a country that would normally be known for violence and this kind of madness. It is a country that has a strong tourist market and being a very friendly place.
It is a shame to see it be dragged into this kind of madness, and only adds to the reputation that as a continent, Africa just can’t get its act together.
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lemon_and_mint
- Posts: 928
- Joined: Tue Nov 20, 2007 2:04 pm
Kenya on the brink?
Galbally;752267 wrote: I fear events in Kenya may be slipping out of control, not that important a story for us, but given what happened in Rwanda and Burundi in the mid 1990s I hope that the international community doesn't allow what was once an african country with a relatively bright future descend into anarchy and ethnic cleansing.
Hi Galbally, i think you are right, but i also think it needs to be looked at in conjunction with pakistan, this could be more serious than you may think.
Hi Galbally, i think you are right, but i also think it needs to be looked at in conjunction with pakistan, this could be more serious than you may think.
Kenya on the brink?
I am not sure what the direct association with the Pakistan situation is other than both of these countries are facing a breakdown in politics, and potential anarchy. I would say that the immeadiate danger is in Kenya, while in Pakistan its the longer term picture that really looks bad. Of course geopolitically Pakistan being a Nuclear power, and a major Islamic country would appear to have more serious repercussions. What do you think are the parrallels or links L&M? I would be interested to hear your opinion.
The sad thing about Kenya is that like Milkennie said, it is (or was) one of the more stable countries in East Africa, which as a region is a bit of a basket case, and its sad to see the country unravelling in the way it is, perhaps the situation will improve and the sides involved will pull back from all out civil and ethnic conflict, though at present that doesn't seem like its going to happen, but I don't know enough about what the country is like internally to have much of an informed opinion. I do know that the EU is putting forces into the region because of the already difficult situations in Sudan and Chad, so I am wondering what the plan is should things completely deteriorate in Kenya.
The sad thing about Kenya is that like Milkennie said, it is (or was) one of the more stable countries in East Africa, which as a region is a bit of a basket case, and its sad to see the country unravelling in the way it is, perhaps the situation will improve and the sides involved will pull back from all out civil and ethnic conflict, though at present that doesn't seem like its going to happen, but I don't know enough about what the country is like internally to have much of an informed opinion. I do know that the EU is putting forces into the region because of the already difficult situations in Sudan and Chad, so I am wondering what the plan is should things completely deteriorate in Kenya.
"We are never so happy, never so unhappy, as we imagine"
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
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lemon_and_mint
- Posts: 928
- Joined: Tue Nov 20, 2007 2:04 pm
Kenya on the brink?
Hi Galbally,
It is possible you will think that i am making a link where there not one, but i will try to explain.
It has been known that for years there have been extreme islamists in Kenya, America started to focus on them ten years or so ago when they doscovered it was this faction of alqueada who made the attacks on the us embassy in Nairobi.
If those extremeists were strong enough then to acheive that, i wonder how strong they are now given that they have not been eradicated, and now in Pakistan we can see that civil war is a possibility.
It only takes them joining forces, as I see it.
It is possible you will think that i am making a link where there not one, but i will try to explain.
It has been known that for years there have been extreme islamists in Kenya, America started to focus on them ten years or so ago when they doscovered it was this faction of alqueada who made the attacks on the us embassy in Nairobi.
If those extremeists were strong enough then to acheive that, i wonder how strong they are now given that they have not been eradicated, and now in Pakistan we can see that civil war is a possibility.
It only takes them joining forces, as I see it.
Kenya on the brink?
lemon_and_mint;752275 wrote: Hi Galbally,
It is possible you will think that i am making a link where there not one, but i will try to explain.
It has been known that for years there have been extreme islamists in Kenya, America started to focus on them ten years or so ago when they doscovered it was this faction of alqueada who made the attacks on the us embassy in Nairobi.
If those extremeists were strong enough then to acheive that, i wonder how strong they are now given that they have not been eradicated, and now in Pakistan we can see that civil war is a possibility.
It only takes them joining forces, as I see it.
Thats depressing, I know that there are islamicist factions in Kenya, but the country does not have a majority muslim population. I know that Al Queda see the horn of Africa region as a potential powerbase, but its not working out as well as they had hoped. Still they are persistent if nothing else, and Sudan is certainly a stronghold for them now, oh well, the world goes on, full of conflict as usual. I suspect that if Islamicists try their hand in Kenya they will probably only succeed in uniting the population against them, but who knows.
It is possible you will think that i am making a link where there not one, but i will try to explain.
It has been known that for years there have been extreme islamists in Kenya, America started to focus on them ten years or so ago when they doscovered it was this faction of alqueada who made the attacks on the us embassy in Nairobi.
If those extremeists were strong enough then to acheive that, i wonder how strong they are now given that they have not been eradicated, and now in Pakistan we can see that civil war is a possibility.
It only takes them joining forces, as I see it.
Thats depressing, I know that there are islamicist factions in Kenya, but the country does not have a majority muslim population. I know that Al Queda see the horn of Africa region as a potential powerbase, but its not working out as well as they had hoped. Still they are persistent if nothing else, and Sudan is certainly a stronghold for them now, oh well, the world goes on, full of conflict as usual. I suspect that if Islamicists try their hand in Kenya they will probably only succeed in uniting the population against them, but who knows.
"We are never so happy, never so unhappy, as we imagine"
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
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lemon_and_mint
- Posts: 928
- Joined: Tue Nov 20, 2007 2:04 pm
Kenya on the brink?
Galbally;752277 wrote: Thats depressing, I know that there are islamicist factions in Kenya, but the country does not have a majority muslim population. I know that Al Queda see the horn of Africa region as a potential powerbase, but its not working out as well as they had hoped. Still they are persistent if nothing else, and Sudan is certainly a stronghold for them now, oh well, the world goes on, full of conflict as usual. I suspect that if Islamicists try their hand in Kenya they will probably only succeed in uniting the population against them, but who knows.
yes, in times of peace the population may unite against them, but in a civil war, they may well give allegiance to any side which pledges to keep them safe, and there's the problem as i see it at themoment, given that that terrorism can surmount country boundaries.
yes, in times of peace the population may unite against them, but in a civil war, they may well give allegiance to any side which pledges to keep them safe, and there's the problem as i see it at themoment, given that that terrorism can surmount country boundaries.
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lemon_and_mint
- Posts: 928
- Joined: Tue Nov 20, 2007 2:04 pm
Kenya on the brink?
Musharraf has just asked British police to investigate Bhuttos death.
That;s another step I don't like and if it goes ahead, links pakistan Britain and Kenya even more closely.
That;s another step I don't like and if it goes ahead, links pakistan Britain and Kenya even more closely.
Kenya on the brink?
But then, look at what they are rioting about!
Their president was elected in 1992 on the promises of reform and further development of democracy and elimination of corruption in government. Now, the same president is not only very corrupt, but has held a rigged election to make sure he stays in power.
Democracy does not just happen. People need to fight for their rights, and in all of our Western Countries there has been some kind of conflict to attain democracy. Heck, July 4 is a celebration in the states of their ‘revolution’ for independence and it is seen as a positive in American history.
When is a revolution a good thing? If by this Kenya removes a corrupt government and replaces it with an honest one and implements constitutional reform, would that not be good?
When does a terrorist become a revolutionary?
When does rioting become a revolution?
How do you achieve freedom without a fight?
Their president was elected in 1992 on the promises of reform and further development of democracy and elimination of corruption in government. Now, the same president is not only very corrupt, but has held a rigged election to make sure he stays in power.
Democracy does not just happen. People need to fight for their rights, and in all of our Western Countries there has been some kind of conflict to attain democracy. Heck, July 4 is a celebration in the states of their ‘revolution’ for independence and it is seen as a positive in American history.
When is a revolution a good thing? If by this Kenya removes a corrupt government and replaces it with an honest one and implements constitutional reform, would that not be good?
When does a terrorist become a revolutionary?
When does rioting become a revolution?
How do you achieve freedom without a fight?
Kenya on the brink?
mikeinie;752316 wrote: But then, look at what they are rioting about!
Their president was elected in 1992 on the promises of reform and further development of democracy and elimination of corruption in government. Now, the same president is not only very corrupt, but has held a rigged election to make sure he stays in power.
Democracy does not just happen. People need to fight for their rights, and in all of our Western Countries there has been some kind of conflict to attain democracy. Heck, July 4 is a celebration in the states of their ‘revolution’ for independence and it is seen as a positive in American history.
When is a revolution a good thing? If by this Kenya removes a corrupt government and replaces it with an honest one and implements constitutional reform, would that not be good?
When does a terrorist become a revolutionary?
When does rioting become a revolution?
How do you achieve freedom without a fight?
Oh I am not criticizing people because they are upset with the election or their government thats their own business and I am sure that they have every right to feel angry. I just hope that the country doesn't totally unravel, as that would be tragic for all involved. I tell ya if Irish people got a bit more angry sometimes perhaps our politicans wouldn't act like such a bunch of clowns. Not that I am advocating rioting over the tribunals, the health service, or the totally corrupt way the country has been planned, then again.
Their president was elected in 1992 on the promises of reform and further development of democracy and elimination of corruption in government. Now, the same president is not only very corrupt, but has held a rigged election to make sure he stays in power.
Democracy does not just happen. People need to fight for their rights, and in all of our Western Countries there has been some kind of conflict to attain democracy. Heck, July 4 is a celebration in the states of their ‘revolution’ for independence and it is seen as a positive in American history.
When is a revolution a good thing? If by this Kenya removes a corrupt government and replaces it with an honest one and implements constitutional reform, would that not be good?
When does a terrorist become a revolutionary?
When does rioting become a revolution?
How do you achieve freedom without a fight?
Oh I am not criticizing people because they are upset with the election or their government thats their own business and I am sure that they have every right to feel angry. I just hope that the country doesn't totally unravel, as that would be tragic for all involved. I tell ya if Irish people got a bit more angry sometimes perhaps our politicans wouldn't act like such a bunch of clowns. Not that I am advocating rioting over the tribunals, the health service, or the totally corrupt way the country has been planned, then again.
"We are never so happy, never so unhappy, as we imagine"
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Kenya on the brink?
lemon_and_mint;752315 wrote: Musharraf has just asked British police to investigate Bhuttos death.
That;s another step I don't like and if it goes ahead, links pakistan Britain and Kenya even more closely.
I think thats a very good point, I don't think the British Government should touch the Bhutto assassination with a ten-foot pole, its a pandora's box, and they have enough problems already.
That;s another step I don't like and if it goes ahead, links pakistan Britain and Kenya even more closely.
I think thats a very good point, I don't think the British Government should touch the Bhutto assassination with a ten-foot pole, its a pandora's box, and they have enough problems already.
"We are never so happy, never so unhappy, as we imagine"
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Kenya on the brink?
Galbally;752464 wrote: Oh I am not criticizing people because they are upset with the election or their government thats their own business and I am sure that they have every right to feel angry. I just hope that the country doesn't totally unravel, as that would be tragic for all involved. I tell ya if Irish people got a bit more angry sometimes perhaps our politicans wouldn't act like such a bunch of clowns. Not that I am advocating rioting over the tribunals, the health service, or the totally corrupt way the country has been planned, then again.
I agree
I agree