Mormon Women Demand to Share Husbands

RedGlitter · Post by **RedGlitter** » Sun Dec 31, 2006 10:49 pm

The TimesDecember 30, 2006

Mormon teenagers demonstrate in Sal Lake City for their right to choose plural marriage

Out of the shadows, the Big Love women who want the right to share a husband

Catherine Philp in Salt Lake City, Utah

Mormon wives are coming forward for the first time to defend their plural marriages and help to root out the abuse of young girls

Dressed in her sharp pinstripe suit, her dark brown hair elegantly coiffed, Vicky looks every inch the archetypal young working woman after a day at the office. But there are things she does not talk about at work.

Things such as the house she grew up in with her 39 brothers and sisters. Things such as the 21 children, six of them her own, who run around the house she lives in now. Things such as the two other “sisterwives, one of them her blood sister, with whom she she shares her husband, taking turns to spend the night with him in strict rotation. “It’s not a thing we generally publicise, she says shyly.

NI_MPU('middle');Now, however, Vicky is going public, although she declines to use her last name. As high-profile cases of child sex abuse among secretive cults unsettle and anger the larger polygamist community, women like Vicky are stepping forward to lobby in defence of a woman’s right to be a plural wife without fear of prosecution. “We live good and decent lives, she said.

Going public on polygamy has long been a risky business in Utah, where an estimated 40,000 polygamists live below the legal radar. For the past 50 years Utah has had a strict “don’t ask, don’t tell policy towards the practice, a felony punishable by up to five years in jail. The policy was prompted by a raid in 1953 on a polygamist community that ended with hundreds of children taken into care and parents jailed, causing a public relations disaster.

Some groups retreated into compounds. Those living among the wider community kept their mouths shut and their heads down. Parents avoided taking their children to the dentist or doctor, fearing the discovery of their secret. Children were warned not to bring friends home from school – if they were allowed to go.

Murmurs persisted of dark acts among some of the many splinter groups of Mormon fundamentalists, the umbrella term for those who broke away from the main Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints over the practice 100 years ago.

Then in 2003, in a direct challenge to prosecutors, Tom Green, a polygamist, began appearing on television shows to argue his right to his five wives.

“I’d never really thought about prosecuting polygamy, said Mark Shurtleff, a mainstream Mormon who had been elected Utah attorney general the year before. “But it’s a felony and he’s out there flaunting it. Investigators discovered worse: Mr Green’s youngest bride was only 13 and had borne him a child – proof of a sexual relationship. Mr Green was charged with child rape and polygamy.

The case opened up a Pandora’s box for Mr Shurtleff. Emboldened, escapees from the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, the closed cult led by Warren Jeffs, came to tell their stories. “The stories were horrendous, he said. Carolyn Jessop, who escaped with her eight children, told him of forced child marriages, the abuse of young boys and girls and threats to slit their throats if they left.

“Here’s what I had to decide, Mr Shurtleff explains. “We had to do something. How are we supposed to prosecute all the polygamists, 20,000 people? It can’t be done. So we decided ‘We’ll go after child rape, child sexual assault. We’ll make it about that, not religion’.

A warrant was issued for Mr Jeffs’s arrest on charges of aiding child rape instead of polygamy. He went on the run but was recaptured in August. The shocking testimony of a former child bride at a hearing earlier this month convinced a judge to send Mr Jeffs to trial. The hearing is set to begin in April. The stories of Mr Jeffs’s church horrified many other polygamists who regarded his actions as an abuse of God’s law. To them polygamy is a religious duty that they must undertake to reach the highest level of heaven.

Anne Wilde, the widow of a high-profile polygamist, decided it was time to save the reputation of the community as a whole. She began collecting the oral histories of plural wives to publish in a book and created a website for her organisation, Principle Voices. She launched a pro-polygamy magazine, Mormon Focus, and recruited Vicky to pose with her two sisterwives and their babies for the inaugural cover, taking lessons from same-sex marriage advocates to argue their right to an “alternative lifestyle. “It was also easier for me because I was no longer a plural wife, Ms Wilde explains. “For those others, it was a brave thing to do.

BTS · Post by **BTS** » Sun Dec 31, 2006 11:10 pm

Why not?.........

If gay marriage then why not plural?

But I ask ...2-3 wives???

Not me..... never.

Oh yah it is Mormon not Mormom:)

Marie5656 · Post by **Marie5656** » Mon Jan 01, 2007 12:13 am

Not sure I could deal with or even want another husband hanging around.

RedGlitter · Post by **RedGlitter** » Mon Jan 01, 2007 3:08 am

I find it really repulsive but I don't really care what they do. I don't have to do it. I don't feel they should be considered criminals. I do have a problem with the fact that many get state aid to help provide for all their kids. That's plain wrong. In my opinion, for Mormons or anybody else- if you can't afford them, stop having all those kids. I also don't agree with taking girl children as brides.Thirteen may be "old enough" if you're talking marrying her off to a 16 year old boy but to a 40 or 50 year old man? Please. Not all Mormons are polygamists though. Far from it.

BTS · Post by **BTS** » Wed Jan 03, 2007 6:36 pm

RedGlitter;501902 wrote: I find it really repulsive but I don't really care what they do. I don't have to do it. I don't feel they should be considered criminals. I do have a problem with the fact that many get state aid to help provide for all their kids. That's plain wrong. In my opinion, for Mormons or anybody else- if you can't afford them, stop having all those kids. I also don't agree with taking girl children as brides.Thirteen may be "old enough" if you're talking marrying her off to a 16 year old boy but to a 40 or 50 year old man? Please. Not all Mormons are polygamists though. Far from it.

FYI the Mormon church does not condone plural marriage.

On a lighter note...... NV and I like this show on HBO.....

http://www.hbo.com/biglove/

Think having three wives is a dream come true? Meet Bill Henrickson (Bill Paxton), a modern-day Utah polygamist who lives in suburban Salt Lake City with his three wives, seven children, and a mounting avalanche of debt and demands. The owner of a growing chain of home improvement stores, Bill struggles to balance the financial and emotional needs of Barb, Nicki and Margene (Jeanne Tripplehorn, ChloÃ« Sevigny and Ginnifer Goodwin), who live in separate, adjacent houses and take turns sharing their husband each night. While managing the household finances together and routinely sharing "family home nights," they try to keep simmering jealousies in check and their arrangement a secret — polygamy is illegal in Utah and banned by the mainstream Mormon Church. Adding to Bill's woes are a series of crises affecting his parents (Bruce Dern and Grace Zabriskie), who live on a fundamentalist compound in rural Utah, and his ruthless father-in-law, Roman (Harry Dean Stanton), the powerful head of the polygamist commune where his parents live. Bold, funny and wholly original, Big Love explores the evolving institution of marriage through a typical atypical family.

The executive producers of BIG LOVE are Playtone's Tom Hanks and Gary Goetzman and series creators Mark V. Olsen & Will Scheffer (writer of HBO's "In the Gloaming"), who produced the independent feature film "Easter."

Big Love stars Bill Paxton ("Twister," "A Simple Plan"), Jeanne Tripplehorn ("The Firm"), ChloÃ« Sevigny (Oscar®-nominated for "Boys Don't Cry," "Dogville"), Ginnifer Goodwin ("Walk the Line," "Win a Date with Tad Hamilton!"), Harry Dean Stanton ("The Green Mile," "Anger Management"), Bruce Dern ("Monster") and Grace Zabriskie ("Twin Peaks"). Other regulars include Amanda Seyfried ("Mean Girls"), Shawn Doyle ("Don't Say a Word") Daveigh Chase ("Lilo & Stitch"), Joel McKinnon Miller ("After the Sunset"), Douglas Smith ("Sleepover"), Melora Walters ("Cold Mountain") and Jolean Wejbe ("Gilmore Girls"). Also featured: Mary Kay Place ("Sweet Home Alabama"), Matt Ross ("Good Night, and Good Luck") and Tina Majorino ("Napoleon Dynamite").

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- According to a joint report issued by the Utah and Arizona Attorney General's Offices, July 2005, "[a]pproximately 20,000 to 40,000 or more people currently practice polygamy in the United States." The Mormon Church officially banned the practice of polygamy in 1890.

RedGlitter · Post by **RedGlitter** » Wed Jan 03, 2007 7:36 pm

Thanks BTS, I know the Church does not condone polygamy. Some of my family are Mormon. I do know that looked down upon or not, polygamy exists. I also know that it is common for polygamists to use state aid (ie: Colorado City) to support all their kids. I find this unacceptable. Maybe I'll check out that show. Thanks.

Rain · Post by **Rain** » Wed Jan 03, 2007 7:47 pm

You have no idea how right you are Magenta. I could go on for hours about these fanatical LDS. I lived in southern Utah for 10 years and you wouldn't believe the hell these boys and girls have to live through, as well as the women. I've seen some of these children you're alluding to. And these were the ones they thought would be ok to go out in to public. VERY messed up little humans. Almost alien looking. So sad

As for these ppl in RG's thread...... I'm speechless.

BTS · Post by **BTS** » Wed Jan 03, 2007 8:00 pm

RedGlitter;505019 wrote: Thanks BTS, I know the Church does not condone polygamy. Some of my family are Mormon. I do know that looked down upon or not, polygammy exists. I also know that it is common for polygamists to use state aid (ie: Colorado City) to support all their kids. I find this unacceptable. Maybe I'll check out that show. Thanks.

I agree polygamy exists and is terrible in fundamentalist compounds which are not exclusive to UT,CO or AZ.

They are all over and I wanted to put a few stories here from women that were subject this crap:

Links only so I don't load up post:

http://www.rickross.com/reference/polyg ... my385.html

Ex-polygamist wife talks about her experiences

http://www.utahstatesman.com/media/stor ... tesman.com

Utah has turned a blind eye to those who practice polygamy,

http://deseretnews.com/dn/view/0,1249,645196473,00.html

New film by ex-wife takes aim at FLDS

Yes these SOB's that are supposed leaders should be run out of town on a rail!!!!

Saffron · Post by **Saffron** » Wed Jan 03, 2007 8:45 pm

My thoughts on polygamy or polygyny is that it is put in place by men, so that maybe they can spread their Mormonism and have more offspring.

Muslims do this also. But it's legal for them, as long as it's in their own country.

But here in the U.S. I cannot understand how women can accept it. I don't like to share. I think it's disgusting to say the least.

Saffron · Post by **Saffron** » Wed Jan 03, 2007 8:47 pm

Marie5656;501882 wrote: Not sure I could deal with or even want another husband hanging around.

No I don't think that there are several husbands, there are several wives. It's not polyandry, it's polygyny. A form of polygamy. And it's illegal. I think these women must be brainwashed.

Saffron · Post by **Saffron** » Wed Jan 03, 2007 8:50 pm

Ewww, that man isn't even attractive. Sorta looks like some white trash all dressed up. Or maybe he's just a sex addict.

nvalleyvee · Post by **nvalleyvee** » Wed Jan 03, 2007 8:54 pm

I just reminds me of how difficult it is for one man and one woman.................this jack ass doesn't care take any of them very well. My attitude is NEVER SHARE and NEVER WANT TO BE SHARED!!!:wah:

BTS · Post by **BTS** » Wed Jan 03, 2007 8:55 pm

Saffron;505130 wrote: My thoughts on polygamy or polygyny is that it is put in place by men, so that maybe they can spread their Mormonism and have more offspring.

Muslims do this also. But it's legal for them, as long as it's in their own country.

But here in the U.S. I cannot understand how women can accept it. I don't like to share. I think it's disgusting to say the least.

Saffron.....

Before I attack................ Please define and support your statement, and I quote (emphasis MINE):

"My thoughts on polygamy or polygyny is that it is put in place by men, so that maybe they can spread their Mormonism and have more offspring."

RedGlitter · Post by **RedGlitter** » Wed Jan 03, 2007 9:02 pm

Those were good links, BTS.

I have seen the brainwashing done to my Mormon cousin who has a traditional marriage so I can only imagine what this religion and way of life are capable of doing to someone if unchecked.

My problem with this aside from my own personal distaste is that religion is used to dupe women. And children. And impressionable teenagers.

Saffron · Post by **Saffron** » Wed Jan 03, 2007 9:05 pm

BTS;505148 wrote: Saffron.....

Before I attack................ Please define and support your statement, and I quote (emphasis MINE):

"My thoughts on polygamy or polygyny is that it is put in place by men, so that maybe they can spread their Mormonism and have more offspring."

What?! are you expecting me to go and dig up articles online? And what are you a college professor trying to correct my paper?

I don't have to "define and support" anything. But I can write my own thought, opinions and experiences here.

It's obvious that this sick culture is purely an oppressive practice where the men control and manipulate the women, in the name of "religion". They are born into it and the only way out of these horrible circumstances is for the women to literally escape. But then they have to leave their children behind. It's very sad, and just one more way that some men abuse and use women for their own sickness.

And I am sure that these men do not even love their wives. But that is all that these poor women expect out of life, because this is how they've been conditioned since childhood.

:(

Saffron · Post by **Saffron** » Wed Jan 03, 2007 9:07 pm

RedGlitter;505159 wrote:

My problem with this aside from my own personal distaste is that religion is used to dupe women. And children. And impressionable teenagers.

I also have the same opinion about religion. Even the "christian" religion can take advantage of women. I've seen and experienced this first hand.

BTS · Post by **BTS** » Wed Jan 03, 2007 10:05 pm

Saffron;505161 wrote: What?! are you expecting me to go and dig up articles online? And what are you a college professor trying to correct my paper?

I don't have to "define and support" anything. But I can write my own thought, opinions and experiences here.

It's obvious that this sick culture is purely an oppressive practice where the men control and manipulate the women, in the name of "religion". They are born into it and the only way out of these horrible circumstances is for the women to literally escape. But then they have to leave their children behind. It's very sad, and just one more way that some men abuse and use women for their own sickness.

And I am sure that these men do not even love their wives. But that is all that these poor women expect out of life, because this is how they've been conditioned since childhood.

:(

Saffron............. Take a deep breath

My point was how do you tie momonism into this such as your statetement:

Originally Posted by BTS

Saffron.....

Before I attack................ Please define and support your statement, and I quote (emphasis MINE):

"My thoughts on polygamy or polygyny is that it is put in place by men, so that maybe they can spread their Mormonism and have more offspring."

The fester in my craw is this............

"that maybe they can spread their Mormonism and have more offspring."

SOOOOOOO Mormonism is what in your mind?

A way to take many wifes? then have MORE offspring?

Think you are off base if that is your stand.

RedGlitter · Post by **RedGlitter** » Wed Jan 03, 2007 10:34 pm

I know this is between you and Saffy but for the sake of (pleasant) argument, why would she be off base with that comment? The Mormon church is the same as the Catholic church in that propagating many children is desired.

What am I not seeing here?

buttercup · Post by **buttercup** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 1:27 am

Well this is a first for me, i'd heard of polygamy & mormons but had no idea mormons were polygamists. Thats just not the picture they paint when they come calling at doors in Scotland. There's a church about 20 miles from here & we get a door to door visit once every 10 years or so, i'll enjoy the next one :wah:

RedGlitter · Post by **RedGlitter** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 1:33 am

Not all Mormons are polygamists. There are groups of them who are but they are not recognized by the LDS Church as Mormon. The LDS do not support polygamy. The ones who come to your door are probably not polygamists.

buttercup · Post by **buttercup** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 1:36 am

Well that just spoils the fun, i'll have to pretend im not in now as usual :p

RedGlitter · Post by **RedGlitter** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 1:41 am

:wah:

Accountable · Post by **Accountable** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 4:54 am

As I understand it (I lived in Utah for awhile & asked lots of questions) Joseph Smith, founder of the Mormon Church, decreed that polygamy was not only legal, but desirable, for myriad reasons. When they basically took over the territory now known as Utah (they also founded Las Vegas btw) to avoid religious persecution (sound familiar?) they practiced plural marriage freely. When the US gov't said that Utah would have to give up polygamy to join the union, the Mormon Church decided to deny a basic tenent of their belief system for political gain, much like the Christian Church did by adjusting Holy Days to fit then-current pagan holidays. Ain't it grand how some people's moral foundations are so adaptable ... like shifting sand.

I can't vouch for the originators (absalom) but here's a wealth of mormon information.

http://www.absalom.com/mormon/polygamy/faq.htm

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

On polygamy in general:

I don't get it. So long as we're talking about consenting adults, what possible difference could it make if 2, 4, or 50 want to marry each other? Governmental recognition of an act of its citizenry neither makes that act moral or immoral. Abuse of legal government policy (child welfare) is not a basis make any given marital practice illegal.

How is polygamy immoral?

Saffron · Post by **Saffron** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 6:19 pm

BTS;505210 wrote: Saffron............. Take a deep breath

My point was how do you tie momonism into this such as your statetement:

Originally Posted by BTS

The fester in my craw is this............

"that maybe they can spread their Mormonism and have more offspring."

SOOOOOOO Mormonism is what in your mind?

A way to take many wifes? then have MORE offspring?

Think you are off base if that is your stand.
Yes that is what I believe. And also maybe a way for these horny men to have their way legally. It's sick.

Accountable · Post by **Accountable** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 6:21 pm

Saffron;505885 wrote: Yes that is what I believe. And also maybe a way for these horny men to have their way legally. It's sick.
It's consentual. You wouldn't want the government to put restrictions on who you love, would you?

Saffron · Post by **Saffron** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 6:26 pm

Accountable;505891 wrote: It's consentual. You wouldn't want the government to put restrictions on who you love, would you?
The fact that it's conscentual doesn't make it legal or morally right. There is a reason that certain things are illegal. And it's obvious why it's wrong. I think these women don't know any other way of life. And it's very sad.

Accountable · Post by **Accountable** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 6:32 pm

Saffron;505897 wrote: The fact that it's conscentual doesn't make it legal or morally right. There is a reason that certain things are illegal. And it's obvious why it's wrong. I think these women don't know any other way of life. And it's very sad.
It's not obvious why it's wrong, any more than it's obvious why homosexuality is wrong. It was once illegal too, remember, and not very long ago. I won't even address how condescending your statement about "these women" was.

You say there is a reason that certain things are illegal. Why, in your view, is polygamy illegal?

Saffron · Post by **Saffron** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 6:41 pm

Accountable;505903 wrote: It's not obvious why it's wrong, any more than it's obvious why homosexuality is wrong. It was once illegal too, remember, and not very long ago. I won't even address how condescending your statement about "these women" was.

You say there is a reason that certain things are illegal. Why, in your view, is polygamy illegal?
Comparing homosexuals and polygamy is not a good comparison. I guess I could say that it's a fallacy.

These woman are conditioned to accept this lifestyle. They have no choice in the matter. And I also believe that Mormonism is a cult. When I write "these women" I am referring to the women who are in a polygamists marriage.

I don't have to make the rules, the government makes the laws. The government made polygamy illegal. And I myself believe it's immoral and unethical.

guppy · Post by **guppy** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 7:00 pm

i think this is sooooo wrong on so many levels.....

Amie · Post by **Amie** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 7:01 pm

guppy;505915 wrote: i think this is sooooo wrong on so many levels.....

I agree. I mean, I didn't read the story at all, but from the thread title, one husband is more than enough.

guppy · Post by **guppy** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 7:18 pm

i have a hard time with the whole mormon following since it's conception.....

i just can;t believe that any rational adult man would believe he is a priest on earth...that he can pray his wife to heaven with him, that the wife can only get to heaven by her husband....that they will inherit another planet when they die......it's the whole god complex run amuk to me.....and this is my opinion and how i feel bout this......you dont like it....too bad, so sad, lump it my friend.......

Accountable · Post by **Accountable** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 7:29 pm

guppy;505923 wrote: i have a hard time with the whole mormon following since it's conception.....

i just can;t believe that any rational adult man would believe he is a priest on earth...that he can pray his wife to heaven with him, that the wife can only get to heaven by her husband....that they will inherit another planet when they die......it's the whole god complex run amuk to me.....and this is my opinion and how i feel bout this......you dont like it....too bad, so sad, lump it my friend.......
I don't get mormonism either. I'm just wondering if it's right for us to call something like polygamy (separate from mormonism) illegal/immoral simply because we don't want to participate.

Tigerlily · Post by **Tigerlily** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 7:37 pm

While bigamy is a crime in the UK, in order to placate the Muslims, there are tax credits for 'multiple spouses'. So you can get tax relief for committing a crime. Look up the FAQ section on the Inland Revenue website.

Any polygamist culture demeans women. It reduces them to nothing more than sexual outlets for incontinent and self-indulgent men. There is no equality. The women aren't allowed the opportunity to have multiple husbands.

guppy · Post by **guppy** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 7:39 pm

Accountable;505928 wrote: I don't get mormonism either. I'm just wondering if it's right for us to call something like polygamy (separate from mormonism) illegal/immoral simply because we don't want to participate.

one of the driving forces behind this whole polygamy thing is the fact that mormon men believe they are really brothers of jesus on earth. that they are the only true followers and their beliefs are the only true and correct way to get to heaven......This is one of those times when religion is used to abuse women in general...how much more god da88 arrogant can you get than to think you have the power to get your wife in heaven with you or leave her where? who knows.........prgatory, hell, the grave?...i am not sure on this...i just know when i had a friend really start telling me his beliefs on this, it was all i could do , not to rupture his balls for him......

did you know there are more suicides committed by women in utah than any other state in the us?

that there are more antidepressents dispensed in utah that any other state in the us?

i wonder why?........:-2

Saffron · Post by **Saffron** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 7:41 pm

Tigerlily;505933 wrote: While bigamy is a crime in the UK, in order to placate the Muslims, there are tax credits for 'multiple spouses'. So you can get tax relief for committing a crime. Look up the FAQ section on the Inland Revenue website.

Any polygamist culture demeans women. It reduces them to nothing more than sexual outlets for incontinent and self-indulgent men. There is no equality. The women aren't allowed the opportunity to have multiple husbands.

Yeah, what she said. These men are probably sex addicts also. I'd be so turned off on so many levels. These male pigs cannot possibly be in love with their "wives".

Saffron · Post by **Saffron** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 7:47 pm

guppy wrote: ......This is one of those times when religion is used to abuse women in general...how much more god da88 arrogant can you get...Not much more, except maybe in Saudi Arabia.

guppy wrote: ....did you know there are more suicides committed by women in utah than any other state in the us?
Wow, I didn't know this. But it makes sense.

guppy wrote: ......that there are more antidepressents dispensed in utah that any other state in the us?

i wonder why?........:-2
Duh. It's sad. I think that it would be very difficult to escape from that culture. So there would be a thinking that they have no other way out. :-5

Tigerlily · Post by **Tigerlily** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 7:52 pm

Those statistics about Utah are fascinating. They might be putting a brave face on their situation, but it's obviously all show.

RedGlitter · Post by **RedGlitter** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 8:00 pm

Accountable;505928 wrote: I don't get mormonism either. I'm just wondering if it's right for us to call something like polygamy (separate from mormonism) illegal/immoral simply because we don't want to participate.

I'm calling it wrong because although there may be a few odders who free and clear like the lifestyle, an adult woman is capable of being brainwashed just as a child is, if the material is presented right, if she is beaten down emotionally or physically and if she is susceptible to it. Why should looking at child porno be wrong? Aside from the ick factor, we need to protect kids from preying adults. Well, I think polygamy is wrong because it preys on women as a whole and these women need to be protected.

That's my take on it. If they were just doing it the way other people take multiple lovers I wouldn't have a care but when religion is used, I have a big concern about that.

Accountable · Post by **Accountable** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 8:03 pm

Saffron;505907 wrote: Comparing homosexuals and polygamy is not a good comparison. I guess I could say that it's a fallacy. Why? They both involve consenting adults who want to participate in unconventional relationships.

Saffron wrote: These woman are conditioned to accept this lifestyle.Just as you were conditioned to reject it.

Saffron wrote: They have no choice in the matter.Of course they do!

Saffron wrote: And I also believe that Mormonism is a cult.'kay

Saffron wrote: When I write "these women" I am referring to the women who are in a polygamists marriage.I know, and it is condescending to imply your "way of life" is better than theirs.

Saffron · Post by **Saffron** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 8:08 pm

RedGlitter;505949 wrote: I'm calling it wrong because although there may be a few odders who free and clear like the lifestyle, an adult woman is capable of being brainwashed just as a child is, if the material is presented right, if she is beaten down emotionally or physically and if she is susceptible to it. Why should looking at child porno be wrong? Aside from the ick factor, we need to protect kids from preying adults. Well, I think polygamy is wrong because it preys on women as a whole and these women need to be protected.

That's my take on it. If they were just doing it the way other people take multiple lovers I wouldn't have a care but when religion is used, I have a big concern about that.

Know what? I'm beginning to believe that all religions are just wrong.

There was a girl who was staying where I was living and she had been married to a Mormon and was involved in that group. She was beaten by her husband and she left him and went to the "christian" shelter to get away from him. So he divorced her and she was having to pay child support to him, as he had taken their daughter. The Mormons were looking for her also. They are a cult and they didn't like that she had left their church.

She was really really annoying and self centered. But I don't think that had anything to do with the religion.

And what is the name of that man who they were all supposed to be devout to? It was David something.

Saffron · Post by **Saffron** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 8:13 pm

Accountable;505951 wrote: Why? They both involve consenting adults who want to participate in unconventional relationships.

Just as you were conditioned to reject it.

Of course they do!

'kay

I know, and it is condescending to imply your "way of life" is better than theirs.

Okay well, now I can see that I was communicating with an idiot.:rolleyes:

Accountable · Post by **Accountable** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 8:16 pm

I think it's sad that so many women in FG have so little confidence in their fellow women.

guppy · Post by **guppy** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 8:17 pm

Acc- i am a woman, i have a problem with any religion , policy, or culture that puts women beneath men in general...like in all other things i am speaking my mind, how i feel about this....

I really dont care if they do it all day long.....or with who,,,i am not ever going to accept it, or condone it, or be a part of it...period.....:-6

Saffron · Post by **Saffron** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 8:19 pm

Accountable;505960 wrote: I think it's sad that so many women in FG have so little confidence in their fellow women.

Not anything to do with having confidence. It's more about what they are doing to themselves. There is still a lot of oppression of women, even in this day and age and in this country. So why allow yourself to be so obviously oppressed, in the name of religion?

RedGlitter · Post by **RedGlitter** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 8:19 pm

I think it's sad that we cannot have our own opinions and ideas in a discussion without having to make sure everyone else feels they're validated.

Why can't we just discuss something without having to change each others' minds all the time??

guppy · Post by **guppy** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 8:22 pm

Accountable;505960 wrote: I think it's sad that so many women in FG have so little confidence in their fellow women.

what you dont realize is these little mormon girls are born and raised in closed societies and go to school with mostly mormons , are taught to be friends with only mormon children, and are encouraged to marry only within the mormon following.....they are taught from birth that they are to be humble, obedient and submissive, that the men are priests, and they anwer to them....that they must marry a priest in order ot get to go to heaven and then be lucky enough to get to inherit under their husbands their very own planet one day.....if he wants her there with him...his choice btw.....

Saffron · Post by **Saffron** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 8:25 pm

Some men are only Neanderthals.

guppy · Post by **guppy** » Thu Jan 04, 2007 8:29 pm

i applaud the women on fg that have the right and the guts to say what they think....we are not asking for permission ......