I don't think there is anything more repulsive than parents who use their children as pawns in head games with their ex spouses.
Matt has 2 kids, his son is 9 and his daughter is 13. They are with us this weekend and wanted to play laser tag, which is not cheap, and we just can't swing it, so we told them no. No big deal. His daughter had a baby-sitting job last night, that Matt took her to at 4:00. Their mom called at about 6, to tell us she would bring their daughter back when she was done, about 8:00, and then wanted to talk to her son. Matt put him on the phone and could hear the conversation. The mom asked if we were going to play laser tag and when he told her no, she said that she was sorry things didn't work out the way he'd planned and did he want his "daddy" to come get him and take him? (She is remarried and refers to her husband as their son's daddy.) Matt was pi$$ed, obviously, and said "No way, this is my weekend".
He gave her directions how to get to our house, so she could bring their daughter back when she was through and hung up. About 8:30 his daughter called to say she was at home, and her mom wasn't and she'd be back when her mom got home and brought her. At 10:30 they finally showed up. Matt's punishment for not allowing the laser tag was 2 1/2 hours taken from him with his daughter. This is just one of many examples of the way this bimbo uses her children as a way to punish Matt, and it makes me sick. Anyone who can use their children this way, as game pieces for their own sick and childish agenda does not deserve to be a parent. How do these people look at themselves in the mirror? I can't understand it...even through my parents divorce, which was not pleasant, this was never an issue. When my dad wanted to see us, he saw us, when we wanted to see him, we saw him. There was no bad-mouthing one parent to the other, and it's the same with my son and his dad. When I left, there was NEVER an issue about his dad seeing him. When he wanted to, he did. I can't get my mind around this, how people do this and live with themselves? Now I've got Matt sitting here questioning himself about whether he is just confusing his son, and would he be better off just allowing the "new dad" to take over. I'm absolutely furious right now. :-5
Children as game pieces
Children as game pieces
[FONT=Arial Black]I hope you cherish this sweet way of life, and I hope you know that it comes with a price.
~Darrel Worley~
[/FONT]
Bullet's trial was a farce. Can I get an AMEN?????
We won't be punished for our sins, but BY them.
~Darrel Worley~
[/FONT]
Bullet's trial was a farce. Can I get an AMEN?????
We won't be punished for our sins, but BY them.
Children as game pieces
We have a saying here BR, "Theirs nowt as funny as folk" it seems that Matts ex although re-married is very bitter, maybe she's a little jealous of you.
Its a shame that he's beating himself up over the situation, even more of a shame that this woman wont move on & let the children enjoy life with both parents & respective parteners.
I hope that the problem will be resolved & she will see what a bag she's being to you & Matt xx
Its a shame that he's beating himself up over the situation, even more of a shame that this woman wont move on & let the children enjoy life with both parents & respective parteners.
I hope that the problem will be resolved & she will see what a bag she's being to you & Matt xx
Children as game pieces
I cannot agree more that it is just wrong to use the children to pay the ex back. Seen it happen so many times. His ex is pathetic, plain and simple.
Children as game pieces
parents who do this to each other do irreparable harm to the children they claim to love. UNLESS the other parent is a substance abuser or physically abusive, there is no excuse . a child's view of his/ her self comes from identifying with aspects of both parents. if you convince the child a parent is "no good" then they take that in as THEY are also "no good". children need to have the opportunity to grow up knowing both parents . they will make their own observations and judgements as they grow up. a mature grown-up does not wage war using a child as a tool of revenge. it's an all too common and sad story. and the kids are the losers.
Children as game pieces
Using kids to get back at the ex for a dream gone wrong can and does have a detrimental effect on the child's outlook on life, for life. It is sick, disgusting and one of the most horrid of crimes against children.
The only thing you can do about it is talk about it with the kids. Talking to the other parent is only going to give them more ammunition for the next assault against your sanity. As long as you keep being straight with them eventually they will see the other parent's constant shift of priorities and wind up concluding that they had better listen to you or they'll wind up being like the abusive parent.
Don't give in to giving up because that is exactly what is wanted. They can then strut their superior stuff and continue to malign the other that left the situation. The kids may be amenable to the outcome but when they grow up theyare going to remember that half of them comes from the poisoned fruit. It will be debillitating socially, amongst other things.
The only thing you can do about it is talk about it with the kids. Talking to the other parent is only going to give them more ammunition for the next assault against your sanity. As long as you keep being straight with them eventually they will see the other parent's constant shift of priorities and wind up concluding that they had better listen to you or they'll wind up being like the abusive parent.
Don't give in to giving up because that is exactly what is wanted. They can then strut their superior stuff and continue to malign the other that left the situation. The kids may be amenable to the outcome but when they grow up theyare going to remember that half of them comes from the poisoned fruit. It will be debillitating socially, amongst other things.
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A Karenina
- Posts: 968
- Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2004 8:36 am
Children as game pieces
BabyR, this is one area where you can't afford to lose your temper, protective as you are. (soft grin). Matt cannot give up either - 1) he'd be hurting his kids, and 2) how would he respect himself?
Boy, I make it sound easy, huh? But I know very well that it's not. Screw the ex-wife, she's meaningless. All that matters is the kids. Kids are NOT stupid, and they will recognize the games being played, even if they never voice it. Best approach in my mind is to simply shrug off the games, and tell the kids the truth - the most important thing is how you both feel about them, and the time you get to spend together. Tell them exactly that.
I lost 2 kids because my exH and his family thought they were good pawns. and they were...mostly because I would die before I put them in any danger. I never badmouthed my exH, never even told my younger children that he was abusive to me. But my exH had no compunctions about such things. They made a deathbed promise to him that they would never live with me again. Can you imagine? 13 and 14 years old, seeing their big strong father emaciated, jaundiced, too weak to sit up in bed, and begging them to make this kind of promise. They did. I would've too, had I been them.
People have often asked me why I didn't pursue it after he died. Why didn't I go and kidnap my own kids? This is why. I had to make the choice of playing the same kind of game he did, or allowing them to grow in their own way. I chose their emotional health over my own. This makes me a loving parent, not a saint. Of course, I hope that one day, when they are grown, we can try to re-establish our relationships. Meanwhile, I follow their wishes (they are now 16 and 17).
Matt doesn't have to go that far, and I'm glad!! He just has to hang with it a few more years. Soon the kids will be too old to control. What he does now will have a direct bearing on his future relationship with them. That's really all that matters.
Boy, I make it sound easy, huh? But I know very well that it's not. Screw the ex-wife, she's meaningless. All that matters is the kids. Kids are NOT stupid, and they will recognize the games being played, even if they never voice it. Best approach in my mind is to simply shrug off the games, and tell the kids the truth - the most important thing is how you both feel about them, and the time you get to spend together. Tell them exactly that.
I lost 2 kids because my exH and his family thought they were good pawns. and they were...mostly because I would die before I put them in any danger. I never badmouthed my exH, never even told my younger children that he was abusive to me. But my exH had no compunctions about such things. They made a deathbed promise to him that they would never live with me again. Can you imagine? 13 and 14 years old, seeing their big strong father emaciated, jaundiced, too weak to sit up in bed, and begging them to make this kind of promise. They did. I would've too, had I been them.
People have often asked me why I didn't pursue it after he died. Why didn't I go and kidnap my own kids? This is why. I had to make the choice of playing the same kind of game he did, or allowing them to grow in their own way. I chose their emotional health over my own. This makes me a loving parent, not a saint. Of course, I hope that one day, when they are grown, we can try to re-establish our relationships. Meanwhile, I follow their wishes (they are now 16 and 17).
Matt doesn't have to go that far, and I'm glad!! He just has to hang with it a few more years. Soon the kids will be too old to control. What he does now will have a direct bearing on his future relationship with them. That's really all that matters.
We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act but a habit.
Aristotle
Aristotle
Children as game pieces
You and Matt should just continue to do what you think is good and right for those kids. They will not be children forever and "it will all come out in the wash" so to speak. If their mother continues with her juvenile behavior, the children will eventually see her for who she is.
"A candle loses nothing of its light by lighting another candle." -James Keller
Say what you mean but don't say it mean. :yh_peace
Say what you mean but don't say it mean. :yh_peace
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Erinna1112
- Posts: 413
- Joined: Tue Jan 04, 2005 1:00 pm
Children as game pieces
Gotta agree with the consensus on this one.
Talk with the kids, openly and honestly. I think this needs to come from Matt, by himself; putting you in that mix can only complicate things further, IMO. It can be done without badmouthing their mom, however richly she deserves it. He should just let them know that he loves them, and they come first with him, and that sometimes their mom might try to play these idiotic games but that no matter what she says about him, he loves them. They're old enough to understand that when people get mad at each other, they do stupid things.
Giving the mom too much attention in this situation only gives her power over you. If it gets bad, he can take her back to court to enforce the visitation order.
I'm divorced myself, but one thing my ex and I agreed on at the very beginning of this process was that we were going to make it as easy as possible on our son. He lives with me, and his dad lives almost an hour's drive away, but I go out of my way to make sure they have as much time together as they can. We've never used him as a pawn and never will - there's way too much potential for damage.
Talk with the kids, openly and honestly. I think this needs to come from Matt, by himself; putting you in that mix can only complicate things further, IMO. It can be done without badmouthing their mom, however richly she deserves it. He should just let them know that he loves them, and they come first with him, and that sometimes their mom might try to play these idiotic games but that no matter what she says about him, he loves them. They're old enough to understand that when people get mad at each other, they do stupid things.
Giving the mom too much attention in this situation only gives her power over you. If it gets bad, he can take her back to court to enforce the visitation order.
I'm divorced myself, but one thing my ex and I agreed on at the very beginning of this process was that we were going to make it as easy as possible on our son. He lives with me, and his dad lives almost an hour's drive away, but I go out of my way to make sure they have as much time together as they can. We've never used him as a pawn and never will - there's way too much potential for damage.
Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup.
I swear by my life - and my love of it - that I will never live for the sake of another man, nor ask another man to live for mine. ~Ayn Rand
If you're not outraged, you're not paying attention.
A*M*E*N!
I swear by my life - and my love of it - that I will never live for the sake of another man, nor ask another man to live for mine. ~Ayn Rand
If you're not outraged, you're not paying attention.
A*M*E*N!
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greydeadhead
- Posts: 1045
- Joined: Fri Oct 15, 2004 8:52 am
Children as game pieces
this is really aweful. Using kids as pawns in any divorce negotiations or after is wrong. I have never badmouthed my Ex in front of my daughter period. I cannot lower myself to that kind of standard. But .. what comes around goes around. Children are way more observant than we give them credit for. Rest assured they are seeing what is going on.. and recording it. Eventurally his Ex will reap the benefits of what she is sowwing.
So, hang in there.. you are both following the right course.. have a great day and be well...
So, hang in there.. you are both following the right course.. have a great day and be well...
Feed your spirit by living near it -- Magic Hat Brewery bottle cap
Children as game pieces
Again, you guys are awesome. It never ceases to amaze me the support that comes from being here. No matter how wrong I know the ex is being, there's always the part of me that says "Maybe I'm the one over-reacting because I'm so protective." Hearing from all of you has helped enormously.
I like the part about not being able to change the exes behavior, and you're right. We just have to make sure the kids understand where they stand with us. The ex is a bitter, spiteful, vengeful person and I can't change that. I can only protect the kids as best I can. It's just such a shame that Matt has to be made to feel like this. My protective instincts tell me to go tell the bimbo what an ass she is and then beat the crap out of her to drive the point home. As appealing as that scenario is, I can't do it. LC would have my head on a plate, and the kids seeing their mom with a busted nose probably wouldn't be a good thing, either.
Anyway, I appreciate the words of wisdom from all of you. More to come later, I'm sure.
I like the part about not being able to change the exes behavior, and you're right. We just have to make sure the kids understand where they stand with us. The ex is a bitter, spiteful, vengeful person and I can't change that. I can only protect the kids as best I can. It's just such a shame that Matt has to be made to feel like this. My protective instincts tell me to go tell the bimbo what an ass she is and then beat the crap out of her to drive the point home. As appealing as that scenario is, I can't do it. LC would have my head on a plate, and the kids seeing their mom with a busted nose probably wouldn't be a good thing, either.
Anyway, I appreciate the words of wisdom from all of you. More to come later, I'm sure.
[FONT=Arial Black]I hope you cherish this sweet way of life, and I hope you know that it comes with a price.
~Darrel Worley~
[/FONT]
Bullet's trial was a farce. Can I get an AMEN?????
We won't be punished for our sins, but BY them.
~Darrel Worley~
[/FONT]
Bullet's trial was a farce. Can I get an AMEN?????
We won't be punished for our sins, but BY them.
Children as game pieces
BabyRider wrote: Again, you guys are awesome. It never ceases to amaze me the support that comes from being here. No matter how wrong I know the ex is being, there's always the part of me that says "Maybe I'm the one over-reacting because I'm so protective." Hearing from all of you has helped enormously.
I like the part about not being able to change the exes behavior, and you're right. We just have to make sure the kids understand where they stand with us. The ex is a bitter, spiteful, vengeful person and I can't change that. I can only protect the kids as best I can. It's just such a shame that Matt has to be made to feel like this. My protective instincts tell me to go tell the bimbo what an ass she is and then beat the crap out of her to drive the point home. As appealing as that scenario is, I can't do it. LC would have my head on a plate, and the kids seeing their mom with a busted nose probably wouldn't be a good thing, either.
Anyway, I appreciate the words of wisdom from all of you. More to come later, I'm sure.
Hey girl you are not being over protective your being a good example of a loving person. Children as pawns is criminal. Kids need to know they are loved, they need to know they have natural parents and their love for them is right. Kids also need to know that there is never a substitute for their natural parents but there are "step" parents out there that wish to love and support them as well. Matt has kids of the age where they know and somewhat understand the ex's head games and it won't be long where they will be taking larger steps to show mother that she is in the wrong.
I pity Matt's ex as her bitterness is only going to push her kids away from her in time and she will be the looser in it all. In any divorce kids need tons of love and support. Baby R your doing great!!
I like the part about not being able to change the exes behavior, and you're right. We just have to make sure the kids understand where they stand with us. The ex is a bitter, spiteful, vengeful person and I can't change that. I can only protect the kids as best I can. It's just such a shame that Matt has to be made to feel like this. My protective instincts tell me to go tell the bimbo what an ass she is and then beat the crap out of her to drive the point home. As appealing as that scenario is, I can't do it. LC would have my head on a plate, and the kids seeing their mom with a busted nose probably wouldn't be a good thing, either.
Anyway, I appreciate the words of wisdom from all of you. More to come later, I'm sure.
Hey girl you are not being over protective your being a good example of a loving person. Children as pawns is criminal. Kids need to know they are loved, they need to know they have natural parents and their love for them is right. Kids also need to know that there is never a substitute for their natural parents but there are "step" parents out there that wish to love and support them as well. Matt has kids of the age where they know and somewhat understand the ex's head games and it won't be long where they will be taking larger steps to show mother that she is in the wrong.
I pity Matt's ex as her bitterness is only going to push her kids away from her in time and she will be the looser in it all. In any divorce kids need tons of love and support. Baby R your doing great!!
�You only live once, but if you do it right, once is enough.�
• Mae West
• Mae West