Born Again OR Saved?

Runner4thePrize · Post by **Runner4thePrize** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 12:25 pm

There are several opinions even among friends concerning what the steps to true Salvation are.

How do we know when, like exactly what day in our life we become "in Christ Jesus?"

Are we obligated to follow Jesus` instructions on being Born Again in John 3:1 thru 6?

Tombstone · Post by **Tombstone** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 3:09 pm

Personally, I think there is way too much hand-wringing by the Evangelicals about this topic.

Here's something short and sweet - and it is acknowledged in almost all major Protestant Catechisms as a key to salvation:

Omnis qui negat Filium nec Patrem habet qui confitetur Filium et Patrem habet.

or...

No one who denies the Son has the Father, but whoever confesses the Son has the Father as well.

1 John 2:23

Runner4thePrize · Post by **Runner4thePrize** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 4:42 pm

True statement that you shared and vital if Jesus is our Head.

The question remains, at what time in our life do we obey Jesus and the Apostles by being born again?

John 3:3 thru 5 seems infleible as far as what must be accomplished in one's life in order to see into, and enter the Kingdom of God.

Ted · Post by **Ted** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 8:35 pm

Runner:-6

Within the scriptures there are several quotations that would seem to be in opposition. Micah 6 says that all God requires of us is to "do justice, love kindleness and walk humbly with your God". Then we can go to Matthew 22 and we find that the two top commandments are to "Love God and your fellow man". In Acts 10 we learn that whomever loves God and does what is right is acceptable to him. In Matt. 25 we see that Jesus welcomes into his kingdom anyone who has fed the hungry, clothed the naked, visited the sick etc. The Beatitudes in Matt 5 also indicate that others too will be welcomed into the kingdom.

These above quotes cannot be reconciled with the quotes, mostly from John, unless we add the proviso that one specifically accept Jesus as their saviour. However, all quotes can be reconciled if we realize that in John Jesus is the "way" and way has been used throughout the OT and the NT to mean path or road. Jesus has shown us the road and it is a road of love, compassion and justice.

The real answer is not to be found in dogma or doctrine but in living in a developing, transforming, relationship with the Risen Lord if one is a member of the "Christian" society and in a developing, tranforming, relationship with God if otherwise encultured. The fundamentalist/literalists don't like this idea but if God is the one and only then S/He is universal and speaks to all people in the way that they can best understand.

I would agree with tombstone evangelicals make far to much out of this and ought to get on with walking in the masters footsteps rather then quoting dogma and doctrine.

A Christian Pluralist

Shalom

Ted:-6

Ted · Post by **Ted** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 8:37 pm

Runner:-6

The words in John attributed to Jesus do not go back to the historical Jesus but in fact are the words of John placed in the mouth of Jesus. This is not wrong or an attempt to deceive. It was an ancient style of writing that was well accepted at that time. What all of the evangelists were doing in their writing of the gospels were presenting what the Church had come to believe about Yeshua of Nazareth at the time of writing.

Shalom

Ted:-6

Runner4thePrize · Post by **Runner4thePrize** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 8:40 pm

This is my Beloved Son; Hear ye HIM!

- God

He does not encourage us to form an opinion and decide what we choose to believe, He says to "Hear ye Him."

Ted · Post by **Ted** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 8:52 pm

Runner:-6

???

Shalom

Ted:-6

Accountable · Post by **Accountable** » Fri Jan 13, 2006 11:10 am

Ted wrote: Runner:-6

The words in John attributed to Jesus do not go back to the historical Jesus but in fact are the words of John placed in the mouth of Jesus. This is not wrong or an attempt to deceive. It was an ancient style of writing that was well accepted at that time. What all of the evangelists were doing in their writing of the gospels were presenting what the Church had come to believe about Yeshua of Nazareth at the time of writing.

Shalom

Ted:-6I'm always curious why you point stuff like this out if is "not wrong or an attempt to deceive" and "was an ancient style of writing that was well accepted at that time." Is it simply to show how much you know? How does it help the discussion?

(sorry to sidetrack but I'm really curious)

Runner4thePrize · Post by **Runner4thePrize** » Fri Jan 13, 2006 11:26 am

How would you go about proving this factually and scripturally rather than opinion? You could use this argument to discredit anything and everything contained in scripture. If that is possible to do, why even bother with this?

>

You have stated as fact that the words are not attributable to Jesus. Could it possibly be opinion?

Ted · Post by **Ted** » Fri Jan 13, 2006 9:59 pm

Accountable:-6

It has absolutely nothing to do with what I know or don't know. It has to do with the truth both historical as well as metaphysical. Generally I thought we were all interested in the truth.

That being sai I will remind ou that there are some 22 000 Christian denominations around the world each with its own interpretation on many issues. Many of these, though not all claim to have the sole hold on the truth. So whose interpretation is correct.?

It does seem to me that these things are most important in the search for ultimate truth. I am not one of those who says "I've made up my mind so don't bore me with the facts." If you are content with what you believe is the truth then go for it. I am not and my constant prayer is for knowledge, understanding and wisdom. God has never failed me yet.

Shalom

Ted:-6

Ted · Post by **Ted** » Fri Jan 13, 2006 10:17 pm

Runner:-6

Are you interested in the truth or only what you have already made your mind up to?

Personally as a follower of my Risen Lord I am interested in the truth as I have noted in the previous post to Accountable.

I will draw to your attention the fact that there are some 22 000 Christian denominations around the world. Each in some way or another has its own interpretation. Whose is correct? Yours? Mine? or the little old lady next door.

There are also thousands of ancient manuscripts of the New Testament and in those manuscripts there are over 400 000 variations of the scriptures. Which variant is the correct one. The KJB was based on very inferions manuscripts. "Misquoting Jesus" Bart D. Ehrman. So which manuscript should we follow?

In history in a very large way all is opinion. Clergy have their own opinions on which Bible is best. Denominations have their opinions on which is the correct path. You and I have our own opinions. However scholars like Crossan, Borg, Kung, Vermes and a host of others using the intelligence that God gave them are working on it and are peicing together slowly the truth.

Even the manuscripts are copies of copies of copies. We do not have accepss to the originals and the original words of the authors. Changes have been made over the millenia as is evidenced by the great number of manuscripts and the variations within them.

I am a searcher for the truth and the Holy Spirit has been my guide for some 50+ years.

I also live in a developing, transforming relationship with the Risen Lord and have for all those years.

Shalom

Ted:-6

BabyRider · Post by **BabyRider** » Sat Jan 14, 2006 2:41 am

Threads like this bug me. I generally stay away from them. But even the title of this one got to me. "Born again or saved?" WTF does it matter? What's the difference? With all the arguing amongst the 6 trillion religions and 3x that many opinions, we now have to determine if the two are separate, mutually exclusive, identical, similar...or WHAT?

A person's walk with God is personal. Live a good life, follow the golden rule, do what you can to leave a good mark. The rest is just smoke and mirrors and a soap box for one person or another to stand on and puff out his/her chest. I've about had it with religions, (not that I've ever had much tolerance for organized religion as it is) but this is just goofy. Damn, but sh!t like this just irks me.

I probably shouldn't even have interjected anything here, since I have nothing to add to the discussion, except, just be a decent human being. They are few and far between enough as it is.

Accountable · Post by **Accountable** » Sat Jan 14, 2006 8:10 am

Ted wrote: Accountable:-6

It has absolutely nothing to do with what I know or don't know. It has to do with the truth both historical as well as metaphysical. Generally I thought we were all interested in the truth.

That being sai I will remind ou that there are some 22 000 Christian denominations around the world each with its own interpretation on many issues. Many of these, though not all claim to have the sole hold on the truth. So whose interpretation is correct.?

It does seem to me that these things are most important in the search for ultimate truth. I am not one of those who says "I've made up my mind so don't bore me with the facts." If you are content with what you believe is the truth then go for it. I am not and my constant prayer is for knowledge, understanding and wisdom. God has never failed me yet.

Shalom

Ted:-6
You gave information that you defined as "not wrong or an attempt to deceive" and "was an ancient style of writing that was well accepted at that time." That defines it as trivia. It doesn't help the discussion progress, so I was curious why you brought it up.

Ted · Post by **Ted** » Sat Jan 14, 2006 3:33 pm

FarRider:-6

In answer to your question it is called "Experience". I have experienced the Risen Lord. I think the word transforming is important here though. Some call it "born again" but personally I hate that term because the fundamentalists have used it adnausium.

Shalom

Ted:-6

Ted · Post by **Ted** » Sat Jan 14, 2006 3:38 pm

Accountable:-6

Very clearly you do not understand what I have said. You may call it trivia but I refuse to lable the Bible as trivia.

Why did I add in that "it was not wrong nor an attempt to deceive but a traditional writing style"? Because if one does not understand how the Bible came about and the style of writing then one would find it almost impossible to understand the message the author(s) were trying to present.

So it is rather simple. One must understand what the authors intended if one is to interpret the Bible. It has to do with language, culture, fund of knowledge at that time, writing style, conceptualization ability and a host of others.

Shalom

Ted:-6

Accountable · Post by **Accountable** » Sat Jan 14, 2006 3:49 pm

Ted wrote: Accountable:-6

Very clearly you do not understand what I have said. You may call it trivia but I refuse to lable the Bible as trivia.

Why did I add in that "it was not wrong nor an attempt to deceive but a traditional writing style"? Because if one does not understand how the Bible came about and the style of writing then one would find it almost impossible to understand the message the author(s) were trying to present.

So it is rather simple. One must understand what the authors intended if one is to interpret the Bible. It has to do with language, culture, fund of knowledge at that time, writing style, conceptualization ability and a host of others.

Shalom

Ted:-6
You win Ted. You waaay smart. This Christian thing is too complicated for my simple mind. I'll just wait for my bus to hell.

Ted · Post by **Ted** » Sat Jan 14, 2006 4:01 pm

Accountable:-6

I am not here to win or lose. I'm here to share information and to discuss it. I have no objections to people challenging what I say that is how we discuss and learn. If folks don't agree with me that is immaterial. We are sharing and learning. That apparently, is one way we can keep alzheimers at bay as we grow older; use the brain. I do hope they're correct on that.

"You way smart". No, I am just a humble servant of my Risen Lord.

As far a judging where you are headed ultimatly that is not my role nor yours but belongs to God alone.

All I ask is that others realize and understand the fact that there are many different and valid interpretations of the Bible. I personally find the history of the church and its sacred writings totally fascinating. It presents many challenges that are interesting. That is one of the reasons I studied Biblical History, Hebrew and Greek, translation and interpretation. Ultimately what matters is our relationship with the Risen Christ if you adhere to the Christian faith.

May the Peace of Christ be with you

Shalom

Ted:-6

Accountable · Post by **Accountable** » Sun Jan 15, 2006 9:12 am

Something came to me while I was taking a shower. That's when I get my best epiphanies, because I think best when I'm naked and slippery.

You have no faith, Ted. You question everything, and believe nothing unless it's backed up by scholars - human scholars.

As I understand it, you've said:

* The old testament is fiction, full of fairy tales and bedtime stories that can't be taken literally.

* Most, if not all, miracles can be explained away scientifically

* Jesus was not born of a virgin. Joseph was really the father; it just sounds more dramatic.

* Jesus didn't really say everything attributed to him in the Bible, only those things the scholars say he said.

* Jesus is the one way to salvation, unless you don't believe it, in which case the one way is that way that you believe, because God would never be so restrictive.

I'm sure there's more, but I get tired of you're academic malarky. How can you believe Jesus Christ is God when you apparently hold His Word in such contempt? How can you possibly believe that Jesus Rose from the dead and is the Messiah, when you glibly denounce anything your beloved scholars discount?

My answer: You can't. What you espouse is anti-faith, anti-Christ.

Maybe I'm completely off-base, or maybe it takes a backsliding heathen like me to recognize it.

If you truly believe yourself to be a man of faith, maybe what you really should investigate is within.

Ted · Post by **Ted** » Sun Jan 15, 2006 4:20 pm

Accountable/Far Rider:-6

You have absolutely no idea concerning the depth of my faith, none whatsoever. The Bible tells us to study to show ourselves approved. I have done that and continue to do that.

That you have judged me is your business and to your own peril as we are clearly told not to judge others ior we to shall be judged with the same judgemnt. I believe in an will accept the judgement of God and it is in Him I trust.

Your problem is clearly that you have never accepted the fact that there are many Christians around the world who do not think as you do and if they don't they are not Christian. Now I am not surprised at that having been raised in a very fundamentalist church. In fact nothing has changed. There is clearly a groups of Christians who think they have the direct line to God and that everyone else has it wrong.

Rather then address the issues which I present I get judged. There are only a few reasons that I can think of that would be the cause of this; I've made up my mind so don't confuse me with the facts; laziness, fear of both the truth and reality.

My faith is in Jesus Christ and none other. I have learned that one does not have to fear God but to love Him and my fellow man and to follow in His footsteps as He so leads.

Shalom

Ted:-6

Ted · Post by **Ted** » Sun Jan 15, 2006 4:23 pm

Far Rider:-6

I've given you a very clear answer to your question. Either you have a reading problem, which I doubt very much or you simply don't like the answer. My faith is founded on Jesus Christ the Risen Lord. If yours is not, perhaps it is you that has a problem???

Shalom

Ted:-6

Ted · Post by **Ted** » Sun Jan 15, 2006 4:25 pm

Gentlemen:-6

Have a nice day.

Shalom

Ted:-6

Ted · Post by **Ted** » Sun Jan 15, 2006 5:02 pm

Snooze:-6

Thanks. The basic problem is that I have different understandings and interpretations of the Christian Faith. For whatever reason, because they don't or won't try to understand what I am saying they simply dismiss my faith.

However neither do they challenge the facts that I have come upon through study, which by the way is approved in the Bible. For example I presented them with the fact that there are at least 400 000 variations in the ancient manuscripts of the New Testament and that this has caused and still causes problem s in getting as accurate a translation as is possible.

They then decry study and scholarship and in one case the use of the councils and yet without them we would not have the Bible we have today, as imperfect as it is. If faith does not fit the reality around you then it is blind faith and no substance to back it up.

At any rate I was raised in such a church and it was pathetic to say the least. That is why I decided to make formal studies of translation and Biblical history as well as interpretation as part of my studies.

Anyway I'm used to this attitude and really could't care less about the attacks. I am comfortable with my faith in Jesus Christ and so is my church and the clergy that serve it.

Once again, thanks.

May the Peace of Christ be with you.

Shalom

Ted:-6

Ted · Post by **Ted** » Sun Jan 15, 2006 5:04 pm

Far Rider:-6

Sigh! Again--My experiences of and belief in the Risen Christ as my Lord. I'm really not sure how much planer I cn put it. I'm certainly not writing in Swahili. I live in a developing, transforming realtionship with my Risen Lord.

Shalom

Ted:-6

Ted · Post by **Ted** » Sun Jan 15, 2006 5:49 pm

Far Rider:-6

I'm sorry but that is what I have been saying for several posts.

"I am living in a developing (ever increasing understanding and growing faith) transforming (some folks call it "born again") relationship (I have a relationship with my Lord in which I follow in His footsteps as directed by the Holy Spirit)

Perhaps it is partly my problem but I use the language that I know and understand. It relates to the emerging paradigm of the Christian faith wherein we try to understand the Christian faith in terms of our great fund of knowledge, our increasing conceptualization ability, our better understading of history and the culture of the day as well as the writing style of the ancient Jewish scribes called "Midrash" If we don't understand these things then how can we understand what the Bible is saying.

Accountable takes exception to my description of the Bible as containing, myth, legend, folk tale, poety, short story, fiction and even a little history. If one does not understand what those words mean and imply and how those concepts were used by the ancient scribes as they presented the Great truths of the Divine then one takes the Bible as literal history which cannot be supported by the research. The Bible is a human document, albeit inspired by God in which great use was made of midrash, metaphor, short story etc. to convey to man as best they could the great truths about God and His Son (Metaphor) Jesus Christ as they then understood the Divine to be with their limited fund of knowledge, their conceptualization ability, their history, the language and their culture etc. God does not chang but our understandings do. When I was a child I understood as a child. When I become an adult I put away childish things. Now that I am an adult in the 21st Cent I understand as that adult.

I have elsewhere indicated to you, which I rarely do the things that both I and my wife do as part of our Faith in Jesus Christ and through the guidance of the HolySpirit The implecation conveyed to me was "salvation by works". Not at all but according to Paul ,faith without works is dead.

The Bible is not a history book or a science book. It was and is primarily and Religious Book. Crossan, Borg, Spong, Laythrop, Kung, Gordon, Wagner, Meek and dozens of others.

Now you speak of not seeing my depth of faith. I do not wear my faith on my shirt sleves. I do not have to broadcast to all and sundry that I am a Christian. Words are cheap. I live my faith daily. On several occasions diring my carreer I was told that I ran a Christian School. My response was that I never said that. The paretns respons was we know but you do. That sir is my faith. I don't believe in wearing cheap words or speaking cheap words which I saw and heard in the fundamentalist church in which I was raised.

On one occassion at a lodge the loge owner said to myself a several others; You people are different. What makes that difference? Why? Then words are not cheap because they follow obvious activity. Now you may question the depth of my faith or lack thereof but you neither know me nor have seen me in action and when it comes down to it my depth of faith is a personal thing between myself and my Lord and His judgement I will accept.

Shalom

Ted:-6

Ted · Post by **Ted** » Sun Jan 15, 2006 5:55 pm

Arnold:-6

Thanks. I appreciate that observation.

Shalom

Ted:-6 :-6

nvalleyvee · Post by **nvalleyvee** » Sun Jan 15, 2006 6:26 pm

My mother and father already gave me life. It is my choice to believe in any kind of ever after.

Accountable · Post by **Accountable** » Mon Jan 16, 2006 10:25 am

SnoozeControl wrote: I bet Arnold meant me when he said "certain other members." ;)Fishin' for compliments. Well you'll get none from me ... unless you have more pics like that uniform one.

downag · Post by **downag** » Sat Feb 18, 2006 6:25 am

Gen 6:5 And Jehovah saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.

Gen 27:41 And Esau hated Jacob because of the blessing wherewith his father blessed him. And Esau said in his heart, The days of mourning for my father are at hand. Then will I slay my brother Jacob.

Lev 26:41 I also walked contrary unto them, and brought them into the land of their enemies: if then their uncircumcised heart be humbled, and they then accept of the punishment of their iniquity;

Isa 29:13 And the Lord said, Forasmuch as this people draw nigh unto me, and with their mouth and with their lips to honor me, but have removed their heart far from me, and their fear of me is a commandment of men which hath been taught them;

Jer 3:17 At that time they shall call Jerusalem the throne of Jehovah; and all the nations shall be gathered unto it, to the name of Jehovah, to Jerusalem: neither shall they walk any more after the stubbornness of their evil heart.

Jer 4:4 Circumcise yourselves to Jehovah, and take away the foreskins of your heart, ye men of Judah and inhabitants of Jerusalem; lest my wrath go forth like fire, and burn so that none can quench it, because of the evil of your doings.

Jer 9:26 Egypt, and Judah, and Edom, and the children of Ammon, and Moab, and all that have the corners of their hair cut off, that dwell in the wilderness; for all the nations are uncircumcised, and all the house of Israel are uncircumcised in heart.

Eze 11:19 And I will give them one heart, and I will put a new spirit within you; and I will take the stony heart out of their flesh, and will give them a heart of flesh;

Eze 36:26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you; and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you a heart of flesh.

Joe 2:12 Yet even now, saith Jehovah, turn ye unto me with all your heart, and with fasting, and with weeping, and with mourning:

Joe 2:13 and rend your heart, and not your garments, and turn unto Jehovah your God; for he is gracious and merciful, slow to anger, and abundant in lovingkindness, and repenteth him of the evil.

Isa 55:3 Incline your ear, and come unto me; hear, and your soul shall live: and I will make an everlasting covenant with you, even the sure mercies of David.

Isa 55:6 Seek ye Jehovah while he may be found; call ye upon him while he is near:

Psa 34:18 Jehovah is nigh unto them that are of a broken heart, And saveth such as are of a contrite spirit.

Psa 51:17 The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit: A broken and contrite heart, O God, thou wilt not despise.

Mat 18:2 And he called to him a little child, and set him in the midst of them,

Mat 18:3 and said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye turn, and become as little children, ye shall in no wise enter into the kingdom of heaven.

Mat 18:4 Whosoever therefore shall humble himself as this little child, the same is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven.

Mar 10:15 Verily I say unto you, Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a little child, he shall in no wise enter therein.

Jam 2:17 In the same way, faith by itself, if it does not have any works, is dead.

(Here is an example of a "faith work")

Luk 18:13 But the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote his breast, saying, God, be thou merciful to me a sinner.

Luk 18:14 I say unto you, This man went down to his house justified rather than the other: for every one that exalteth himself shall be humbled; but he that humbleth himself shall be exalted.

(But you say, I believe what the Bible says. BUT, do you do what the Bible says?)

Jam 2:19 You believe that there is one God. That's fine! Even the demons believe that and tremble with fear.

Joh 3:1 Now there was a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews:

Joh 3:2 the same came unto him by night, and said to him, Rabbi, we know that thou art a teacher come from God; for no one can do these signs that thou doest, except God be with him.

Joh 3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except one be born anew, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

Joh 3:4 Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter a second time into his mother's womb, and be born?

Joh 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except one be born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God!

Joh 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

Joh 3:7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born anew.

In the Greek manuscripts, the thought being conveyed is that we must be born anew, from above.

(We humans are born our first time through water, as in when a mother's water breaks and a baby is born.)

Eph 2:1 And you did he make alive, when ye were dead through your trespasses and sins,

Luk 11:13 If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children, how much more shall your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him?

Joh 14:13 And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son.

Joh 14:14 If ye shall ask anything in my name, that will I do.

Joh 15:16 Ye did not choose me, but I chose you, and appointed you, that ye should go and bear fruit, and that your fruit should abide: that whatsoever ye shall ask of the Father in my name, he may give it you.

Rev 3:20 Behold, I stand at the door and knock: if any man hear my voice and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.

The door to your inner being, your heart. It seems that there is a spiritual connection to be made in the location of that blood pump! Do we not "feel" "emotion" in that location?

1Jo 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

Confess to him, not a priest or any other person. Where the scripture says to confess our sin to one another, it means to agree that we are all still sinners publically. You don't have to bare all to other people.

Mat 6:5 And when ye pray, ye shall not be as the hypocrites: for they love to stand and pray in the synagogues (gathering places for worship) and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have received their reward.

Mat 6:6 But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thine inner chamber, and having shut thy door, pray to thy Father who is in secret, and thy Father who seeth in secret shall recompense thee.

Mat 6:7 And in praying use not vain repetitions, as the Gentiles do: for they think that they shall be heard for their much speaking.

Mat 6:8 Be not therefore like unto them: for your Father knoweth what things ye have need of, before ye ask him.

Rom 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

Rom 10:10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

Do these help you understand?:-5

Agape

downag

Runner4thePrize · Post by **Runner4thePrize** » Sat Feb 18, 2006 10:45 am

For some reason, I have not been able to sign in for a couple of weeks. It appears to be fixed now. Just making an observation here..... People like pit-bulls because they clamp down and hang on, they don't care where they grab, just as long as its something.

Ted, when you look in the mirror do you see pit-bull looking back?

LOL

BabyRider · Post by **BabyRider** » Sun Feb 19, 2006 1:59 am

ArnoldLayne wrote: Not at all Snooze, not at all
It was me, wasn't it? :yh_bigsmi

weeder · Post by **weeder** » Sun Feb 19, 2006 11:13 am

If you want to know the answer to the big question.Born Again or Saved? Id encourage more living and less searching through scriptures for the answer.

In 1972, I graduated a class called Power for Abundant Living. Absorbing enough scripture, and believing enabled the " Graduates to stand up on graduation night and speak in tongues. Which meant, you were manifesting Holy Spirit, and therefore "Saved" It was a hoax.

In 1967, after surviving a car wreck that nearly ended my young life... I closed my eyes.. thanked God......and I was BORN AGAIN!!

In 1980, and again in 1984 when I gave birth to my perfect and beautiful sons,

I closed my eyes.. thanked God.. and I was SAVED!!

In 1999 I fell 40 feet into a river, on a horse... In the emergency room.. I closed my eyes.. thanked God.. and I was, again SAVED!!

This past August, upon receiving pathology reports stating that my malignant

melanoma had not travelled into my blood stream.... I thanked God over and over and over again. And I was truly..... BORN AGAIN.

There arent any directions..... anywhere. Just words to consider. The map cannott

be the same for everyone. The route is different for everyone. And the final destination has yet to be discovered.

BabyRider · Post by **BabyRider** » Sun Feb 19, 2006 11:24 am

weeder wrote: If you want to know the answer to the big question.Born Again or Saved? Id encourage more living and less searching through scriptures for the answer.

In 1972, I graduated a class called Power for Abundant Living. Absorbing enough scripture, and believing enabled the " Graduates to stand up on graduation night and speak in tongues. Which meant, you were manifesting Holy Spirit, and therefore "Saved" It was a hoax.

In 1967, after surviving a car wreck that nearly ended my young life... I closed my eyes.. thanked God......and I was BORN AGAIN!!

In 1980, and again in 1984 when I gave birth to my perfect and beautiful sons,

I closed my eyes.. thanked God.. and I was SAVED!!

In 1999 I fell 40 feet into a river, on a horse... In the emergency room.. I closed my eyes.. thanked God.. and I was, again SAVED!!

This past August, upon receiving pathology reports stating that my malignant

melanoma had not travelled into my blood stream.... I thanked God over and over and over again. And I was truly..... BORN AGAIN.

There arent any directions..... anywhere. Just words to consider. The map cannott

be the same for everyone. The route is different for everyone. And the final destination has yet to be discovered.
You are so damn good. I'm not much for public sucking up (to swipe a phrase I heard recently) but damn, weeder. I wish you would post 10 times as much as you do.