Does a specific religion really matter?

koan · Post by **koan** » Tue Jan 11, 2005 10:18 pm

It is a good question. Somehow it does seem to matter. Mostly because a lot of religions say that you will go to hell (or some form of it) unless you worship in a specific way. Not wanting to associate with losers, followers tend to judge and reprimand the so called errant. Or, let's give them a nobler cause, they truly want to save others from hell and feel the need to convert them.

If you see someone climbing the railing of a bridge you would probably be concerned and attempt to talk them into coming down. It is as simple a matter as this. That the bridge may only be two feet off the ground and there are some delicious fruit growing from bushes you are trying to reach is not always evident to the would be rescuer. Perception is focused and limited. We generally see what we expect to see.

polycarp · Post by **polycarp** » Wed Jan 12, 2005 8:58 am

It wouldn't have matter if everyone would practise his or her faith in his or her closeth. The most unfortunate thing about religion is when a particular faith looks down on non-members or sees them as infidels or poeple who do not deserve to to be alive. If we can learn to respect each others beliefs, I see us moving forward as a people. For preaching, I support it but only when the intended person is willing to listen or is not capable of getting provoked or violent.

BabyRider · Post by **BabyRider** » Wed Jan 12, 2005 3:06 pm

Religion should not and, in my opinion, DOES not matter. There will always be the heated debates about who is right, who is wrong, who will be saved, and who will go to "hell", or each religion's respective idea of the place. The one thing most people, (those who are most religious especially) seem to forget, is that religion is a MAN-MADE institution, therefore inherently flawed. There are so many interpretations to the bible, who is right? Who is to say ANYONE is right? Another poster here said it very well: "A man's walk with God is strictly a personal one." No man, no religion should dictate to anyone how they should or shouldn't worship. It's a personal belief, and a personal choice. I know of many people who subscribe to a religion who should probably be behind bars. One of them is a teacher in a private school I attended who took it upon himself to put his hands on me. These people find justification in worship. They delude themselves with the idea that they are "church-goers" and therefore will seek (and, in their minds receive) forgiveness for any act. So why not sin? Heck, all you have to do is go to church and confess or whatever absolution they seek, and they are forgiven! The idea of religion is, to me an utter fallacy.

I was brought up in a religion that turned it's back on me and protected a man known to have an unhealthy interest in his students. So religion? :yh_tongue

Like you said, all that should matter is how you live your life and being the best you can be. For yourself, and to other people. It sounds cliche? Oh well. I like cliches.

capt_buzzard · Post by **capt_buzzard** » Wed Jan 12, 2005 3:33 pm

BabyRider wrote: Religion should not and, in my opinion, DOES not matter. There will always be the heated debates about who is right, who is wrong, who will be saved, and who will go to "hell", or each religion's respective idea of the place. The one thing most people, (those who are most religious especially) seem to forget, is that religion is a MAN-MADE institution, therefore inherently flawed. There are so many interpretations to the bible, who is right? Who is to say ANYONE is right? Another poster here said it very well: "A man's walk with God is strictly a personal one." No man, no religion should dictate to anyone how they should or shouldn't worship. It's a personal belief, and a personal choice. I know of many people who subscribe to a religion who should probably be behind bars. One of them is a teacher in a private school I attended who took it upon himself to put his hands on me. These people find justification in worship. They delude themselves with the idea that they are "church-goers" and therefore will seek (and, in their minds receive) forgiveness for any act. So why not sin? Heck, all you have to do is go to church and confess or whatever absolution they seek, and they are forgiven! The idea of religion is, to me an utter fallacy.

I was brought up in a religion that turned it's back on me and protected a man known to have an unhealthy interest in his students. So religion? :yh_tongue

Like you said, all that should matter is how you live your life and being the best you can be. For yourself, and to other people. It sounds cliche? Oh well. I like cliches. Excellent :-6

BabyRider · Post by **BabyRider** » Wed Jan 12, 2005 4:10 pm

capt_buzzard wrote: Excellent :-6
Awww shucks...Thanks Capt! :yh_blush

Ted · Post by **Ted** » Wed Jan 12, 2005 5:14 pm

As a Christian Pluralist let me add a few (I hope) words to the question.

Personally, and supported by many in my church including clergy and theologians, it does not matter or at least should not matter. What counts is how we live our lives in realation to our fellow man.

Biblical and Jesus scholar Marcus Borg has clearly said in his writings that it is not about belief or doctrine or dogma but about living in a transforming realtionship with God. According Hans Kung, RC theologian God's cause is the betterment of man. As a Christian I will refer to Jesus message but the message is inclusive and universal..

We are to fight the evil domination systems of the world, work for social and economic justice, feed the hungry, cloth the naked, assist the downtrodden. Jesus very clearly says in Matt. 25 that when we are doing this to the least of these his children we are doing it to Him.

Anyone in this world can change their focus from self satisfying to serving others in need. It does ot matter what faith you are. It is about living in a transforming relationship with God (Allah, the creator etc)

That was Jesus message about establishing the kingdom of God here on earth and it is totally inclusive.

Shalom

Ted :-6

BabyRider · Post by **BabyRider** » Wed Jan 12, 2005 5:23 pm

Here's a big Standing Ovation for Ted... :yh_clap

Excellent.

weeder · Post by **weeder** » Wed Jan 12, 2005 6:56 pm

Religion supplies the need to belong to a group. Braver men are able to stand alone. We all will have to die alone, someday. that is one of the greatest arenas of denial that many humans live in everyday.

Ted · Post by **Ted** » Wed Jan 12, 2005 7:03 pm

Actually religion supplies answers to the questions that science doesn't. These questions relate to meaning and purpose. No doubt they do give comfort during a time of need such as death of illness.

Quantum theory is now investigating that the spiritual needs of man may be innate right from the biginning of man: that man knows there is more to life.

Its also rather qurious that many of these strong people call upon God near the end of their lives, Nietzche being one such person.

Shalom

Ted :-6

Paula · Post by **Paula** » Wed Jan 12, 2005 7:08 pm

I had Religious instruction until i was 16, seeya..I live in a house now that was a religious famiy...i have a Shadow box with many religious items that is beautiful--to show my respect to those who once lived here....times are different, religion is now used to get money from people, it not like its used to be sorry!

Ted · Post by **Ted** » Wed Jan 12, 2005 7:17 pm

Paula :-6

I must seriously disagree. Churches raise money weekly, yes. Part of that money is to look after the corporate needs of the immediate church. Government regualtions require that the remainder of the money be disbursed to charitable organization and churches must supply proof on a yearly basis that that has been done or they loose their charitable status.

Perhaps you should do a little research on what several churches do with their charitable money. I think you would be pleasantly surprised.

I do not speak for TV evangelists as I know nothing about the laws under which they operate.

What I do find amazing is that many people want no use of the church. They couldn't care less. But where do they run when times get rough: birth, baptism, marriage, illness and death. They then expect the church to be their to help them even though they have made no effort to ensure its continued existence. And typical of the Message of Jesus none are turned away even in that time of trial.

Shalom

Ted :-6

Paula · Post by **Paula** » Wed Jan 12, 2005 8:03 pm

Ted, i understaND YOU....i am talking about other scams...my family is gone, so i have no more affiliation with religion, i speak off the sleeve, excuse me...I RESPECT all beliefs, and give often...

Ted · Post by **Ted** » Thu Jan 13, 2005 2:24 pm

Paula :-6

And there are lots of scammers out there willing to take any money they can get "in the name of God." I totally agree.

Shalom

Ted :-6

polycarp · Post by **polycarp** » Sun Jan 16, 2005 9:27 am

I like your input Susie, it makes a lot of sense.

telaquapacky · Post by **telaquapacky** » Sat Feb 05, 2005 3:14 am

weeder wrote: Religion supplies the need to belong to a group. Braver men are able to stand alone. I agree with Weeder- you have to stand alone. I strongly believe this is because truth is in the minority.

But there is an aspect to being part of a movement that is far more than emotional need for belonging or identity. Some movements don't exist to oppose or condemn, but to reform. Some of the greatest reform movements in history have arisen to persuade and work ethically against the kind of abuses and corruption that BabyRider talked about. The Bible talks about the whole world being lighted up with the truth of God. This isn't going to be accomplished by one lone guy on a street corner with sign, or one fellow posting opinions on a forum. It takes a worldwide organization of people who agree on a set of beliefs and publish and practice them for the benefit of the whole world. A person may join, for example, a particular Christian denomination because they feel led that way by God, and because they see a world-wide effort that they believe is worthwhile and full of truth.

There are some very good (and some very bad) organizations out there. And yes, even the most inspired movement is merely a human organization. The Bible says we have the treasure of the truth of God in jars of clay. Though we try to serve God, we're not perfect, and He's working on us as individuals too. But to lump them all together and say "Religion is bad" just because one has encountered one bad religious organization or one obnoxious member of one is to make an uninformed generalization.

Yes, a specific religion does matter- to what influence you are trying to have in the world. But if you mean, "you have to belong to my church, or you're lost," That's totally wrong, untrue, and unbiblical. I regret to say those churches are in the majority. But not all churches say or believe that they have a monopoly on God's grace.

capt_buzzard · Post by **capt_buzzard** » Sat Feb 05, 2005 3:44 am

The Catholic Church and Co in Ireland collected 60m for the tsunami disaster,and is still collected more money. How much of it will actually go to that area remains to be seen.

polycarp · Post by **polycarp** » Sat Feb 05, 2005 4:23 am

Hello Captain, I must commend your sincere scepticism about religion and religious outfits. However, men are not gods hence are bound to err in discharging their religious obligations. But let me tell you that if not for the offering given by someone somewhere I wouldn't have been interacting with you on the internet now. I am a direct beneficiary of missionary effort and church funded scholarship program. Today I am a univcersity graduate and working for my government, thanks to the money collected by the church from cheerful givers. While some church money does go down the wrong channel, a great deal of it is used to put a smile on somebody else's face or make him something from nothing. I'll long to hear a day that you will give a handsome donation to a church Captain, because some one somewhere desperately needs it.

Dakotawoman · Post by **Dakotawoman** » Wed Oct 26, 2005 3:40 pm

absolutely not, whatever trips your trigger...no one person should dictate what anyone else should believe in.....:yh_pray the sky's the limit........:yh_star believe in whatever makes you fulfilled.

G-man · Post by **G-man** » Wed Oct 26, 2005 8:33 pm

Religion doesn't really matter so match... my beliefs do, though... most importantly I respect others particular beliefs... I have friends and family who practise a number of religions other than my own... Muslim, Hindi, Judaism... I do see the many similarities in a number of religions too...

Lon · Post by **Lon** » Thu Oct 27, 2005 8:07 am

hairygarden1 wrote: Why does it matter what religion you are? I can't stand this controversy over different religions! Your religion should not matter, all that should matter is what you do and how you treat people in this lifetime

There really shouldn't be any controversy. They are all full of crap.

Bez · Post by **Bez** » Thu Oct 27, 2005 10:41 am

G-man wrote: Religion doesn't really matter so match... my beliefs do, though... most importantly I respect others particular beliefs... I have friends and family who practise a number of religions other than my own... Muslim, Hindi, Judaism... I do see the many similarities in a number of religions too...

I was bought up a Christian....I have recently started to practise Buddhism. I have not encountered any antagonism towards me ....happily...in fact most people are interested and ask questions which is good.

Most religions / beliefs follow the same set of rules...BE NICE TO PEOPLE..don't steal, don't hurt people etc etc.

Unfortunately I know several people who have been ostracised by friends and family for becoming Buddhists...they have been heartbroken.

The PERSON matters and how they lead their lives....honesty, integrity, kindness, respect....taking responsibilty for yourself, your fellow human beings and the planet.....these are the things that count. (In my opinion anyway)

minks · Post by **minks** » Thu Oct 27, 2005 11:02 am

Bez wrote: I was bought up a Christian....I have recently started to practise Buddhism. I have not encountered any antagonism towards me ....happily...in fact most people are interested and ask questions which is good.

Most religions / beliefs follow the same set of rules...BE NICE TO PEOPLE..don't steal, don't hurt people etc etc.

Unfortunately I know several people who have been ostracised by friends and family for becoming Buddhists...they have been heartbroken.

The PERSON matters and how they lead their lives....honesty, integrity, kindness, respect....taking responsibilty for yourself, your fellow human beings and the planet.....these are the things that count. (In my opinion anyway)

You have that Right Bez, seems the golden rule applies to all religious beliefs

Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.

Bez · Post by **Bez** » Thu Oct 27, 2005 11:04 am

minks wrote: seems the golden rule applies to all religious beliefs

Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.

EXACTLY Minks :-6

minks · Post by **minks** » Thu Oct 27, 2005 11:11 am

Bez wrote: EXACTLY Minks :-6

Not much simpler of a concept really and I think religious fanatics have taken and gone so beyond that they can't see the basics.

Ted · Post by **Ted** » Mon Oct 31, 2005 3:46 pm

Minks:-6

Exactly, it is time for all those of faith to get back to the basis of all the great faiths of the world. There, one will find God by whatever name.

Shalom

Ted:-6