Joy To The World
Joy To The World
Thank you - nice post. I think we will begin to see the pendulum swinging back away from forced secularism - at least in the U.S.
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Joy To The World
Tombstone wrote: Thank you - nice post. I think we will begin to see the pendulum swinging back away from forced secularism - at least in the U.S.
In the name of christianity I sure hope so Tomb. And yes wasn't that an interesting message.
In the name of christianity I sure hope so Tomb. And yes wasn't that an interesting message.
�You only live once, but if you do it right, once is enough.�
• Mae West
• Mae West
Joy To The World
As an agnostic, I find the Christ-phobia totally bewildering. Methinks it's more about bullying by habitual malcontents, then about spiritual belief's.
Old age and treachery, is an acceptable response to overwelming youth and skill 
Joy To The World
tmbsgrl wrote: I feel like they are slowly trying to take Christmas away just because some came here and got offended. Is it just me?
Fpr those who hold Christmas close to their hearts in a spiritual way.. it will always remain so. It shouldnt be so shocking or surprising that the meaning is under fire to be eliminated. Our society began erasing religious connotations to it over the past 20 years, as it slowly turned into a shopping extravaganza. Not every one who gets up Christmas morning files off to church. Many just rip opened packages, and celebrate acquiri ng new STUFF.
Fpr those who hold Christmas close to their hearts in a spiritual way.. it will always remain so. It shouldnt be so shocking or surprising that the meaning is under fire to be eliminated. Our society began erasing religious connotations to it over the past 20 years, as it slowly turned into a shopping extravaganza. Not every one who gets up Christmas morning files off to church. Many just rip opened packages, and celebrate acquiri ng new STUFF.
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Joy To The World
posted by der wulf
As an agnostic, I find the Christ-phobia totally bewildering.
I would agree with that, we have a similar situation here (UK) with merry christmas being taken of council christmas cards and the like in case it offends non christians, most of whom are not in the least bothered by it. The sheer stupidity of such actions does not go unremarked. I object to having religon forced down my throat that doesn't mean that I consider it acceptable the other way either.
For most in the UK it is really a non issue, if you want to go to church go, if you want to shop then shop. do your own thing. The usual reaction when church leaders lament our love of xmas sales and our increasingly secular society is to have it pointed out to them that no one is suggesting they don't go to church if that's what they want to do it's a free country celebrate christmas as you will just don't tell everybody else what to do.
Question from an outsider, do you think the rampant christian fundamentalism that seems to feature in America is antagonising those of a non-religious disposition?
I' not trying to offend anyone just curious. I couldn't think how to phrase that innocuously.
posted by kit
According to Webster's New Dictionary, Third College Edition, secular is derived from the Late Latin (LL) word "saecularis" meaning "worldly, profane, heathen."
Needless to say, the modern-day secularists have dusted this definition off a bit for use in the newest definition of secularism, "A system of doctrines and practices that disregards or rejects any form of religious faith and worship," which would seem to bring secularists more into line with atheists.
From the Oxford english dictionary
secular // adj. & n.
adj.
1 concerned with the affairs of this world; not spiritual or sacred.
2 (of education etc.) not concerned with religion or religious belief.
3 a not ecclesiastical or monastic. b (of clergy) not bound by a religious rule.
4 occurring once in an age or century.
5 a lasting for or occurring over an indefinitely long time. b Astron. of or designating slow changes in the motion of the sun or planets.
n. a secular priest.
secularism n.
secularist n.
secularity // n.
secularize v.tr. (also -ise).
secularization // n.
secularly adv.
[Middle English (in senses 1–3 via Old French seculer) from Latin saecularis, from saeculum ‘generation, age’, in ecclesiastical Latin = the world (as opposed to the Church)]
Interesting, no mention of heathen. I think that is a play on words to appeal to fundamentalists.
As an agnostic, I find the Christ-phobia totally bewildering.
I would agree with that, we have a similar situation here (UK) with merry christmas being taken of council christmas cards and the like in case it offends non christians, most of whom are not in the least bothered by it. The sheer stupidity of such actions does not go unremarked. I object to having religon forced down my throat that doesn't mean that I consider it acceptable the other way either.
For most in the UK it is really a non issue, if you want to go to church go, if you want to shop then shop. do your own thing. The usual reaction when church leaders lament our love of xmas sales and our increasingly secular society is to have it pointed out to them that no one is suggesting they don't go to church if that's what they want to do it's a free country celebrate christmas as you will just don't tell everybody else what to do.
Question from an outsider, do you think the rampant christian fundamentalism that seems to feature in America is antagonising those of a non-religious disposition?
I' not trying to offend anyone just curious. I couldn't think how to phrase that innocuously.
posted by kit
According to Webster's New Dictionary, Third College Edition, secular is derived from the Late Latin (LL) word "saecularis" meaning "worldly, profane, heathen."
Needless to say, the modern-day secularists have dusted this definition off a bit for use in the newest definition of secularism, "A system of doctrines and practices that disregards or rejects any form of religious faith and worship," which would seem to bring secularists more into line with atheists.
From the Oxford english dictionary
secular // adj. & n.
adj.
1 concerned with the affairs of this world; not spiritual or sacred.
2 (of education etc.) not concerned with religion or religious belief.
3 a not ecclesiastical or monastic. b (of clergy) not bound by a religious rule.
4 occurring once in an age or century.
5 a lasting for or occurring over an indefinitely long time. b Astron. of or designating slow changes in the motion of the sun or planets.
n. a secular priest.
secularism n.
secularist n.
secularity // n.
secularize v.tr. (also -ise).
secularization // n.
secularly adv.
[Middle English (in senses 1–3 via Old French seculer) from Latin saecularis, from saeculum ‘generation, age’, in ecclesiastical Latin = the world (as opposed to the Church)]
Interesting, no mention of heathen. I think that is a play on words to appeal to fundamentalists.
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A Karenina
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Joy To The World
Random thoughts...
My Christmas cards said "Have yourself a merry little Christmas..."
If thousands of Christians got together and sang carols, I'd go. I'd bring candles - what an awesome sight that would be.
My stance is that religion is private, personal. It should not be rammed down the throat of others, nor should it be denied to those who believe.
The seemingly non-stop "us" against "them" attitudes are heartbreaking. Some days I don't think it will ever stop. But today is Christmas Eve and I believe in human potential to do better than we are today.
My Christmas cards said "Have yourself a merry little Christmas..."
If thousands of Christians got together and sang carols, I'd go. I'd bring candles - what an awesome sight that would be.
My stance is that religion is private, personal. It should not be rammed down the throat of others, nor should it be denied to those who believe.
The seemingly non-stop "us" against "them" attitudes are heartbreaking. Some days I don't think it will ever stop. But today is Christmas Eve and I believe in human potential to do better than we are today.
We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act but a habit.
Aristotle
Aristotle
Joy To The World
gmc wrote: posted by der wulf
Question from an outsider, do you think the rampant christian fundamentalism that seems to feature in America is antagonising those of a non-religious disposition?
I' not trying to offend anyone just curious. I couldn't think how to phrase that innocuously.
.rampant christian fundamentalism????????????????
C'mon gmc, if you seriously want intellegent discussion, ya gotta knock off the incendiary phrases, and eurospeak. :rolleyes:
IMHO, "those of a non-religious disposition " are in fact a small but loud group of malcontents that have little to do with religion, and a lot to do with bullying, and personal aggrandizement.
You have the equation backwards, the "great silent majority" has finally had enough of this motley band of dissadents and are now fighting back. To characterize the GSM as "christian fundamentalists" is ridiculous on it's face.
The attack's are primarily against traditional American culture as commonly practiced in small towns and rural areas. This is an extremely tolerant culture evolved over 200 years by utalizing culture's brought by immagrants from the international community, and blended in the great American melting pot.
That it has taken so long for the GSM to strike back is proof of it's tolerance, and inclusionary nature. Frankly, most of us are proud of the fact that we don't have the burden of a long history of prejudice against new ideas, we came to this country specifically rejecting the insularity of the
"old world".
I' not trying to offend anyone, just couldn't think how to phrase that innocuously.
sincerely wish you a Merry Christmas, and Happy new year.
Question from an outsider, do you think the rampant christian fundamentalism that seems to feature in America is antagonising those of a non-religious disposition?
I' not trying to offend anyone just curious. I couldn't think how to phrase that innocuously.
.rampant christian fundamentalism????????????????
C'mon gmc, if you seriously want intellegent discussion, ya gotta knock off the incendiary phrases, and eurospeak. :rolleyes:
IMHO, "those of a non-religious disposition " are in fact a small but loud group of malcontents that have little to do with religion, and a lot to do with bullying, and personal aggrandizement.
You have the equation backwards, the "great silent majority" has finally had enough of this motley band of dissadents and are now fighting back. To characterize the GSM as "christian fundamentalists" is ridiculous on it's face.
The attack's are primarily against traditional American culture as commonly practiced in small towns and rural areas. This is an extremely tolerant culture evolved over 200 years by utalizing culture's brought by immagrants from the international community, and blended in the great American melting pot.
That it has taken so long for the GSM to strike back is proof of it's tolerance, and inclusionary nature. Frankly, most of us are proud of the fact that we don't have the burden of a long history of prejudice against new ideas, we came to this country specifically rejecting the insularity of the
"old world".
I' not trying to offend anyone, just couldn't think how to phrase that innocuously.
sincerely wish you a Merry Christmas, and Happy new year.
Old age and treachery, is an acceptable response to overwelming youth and skill
Joy To The World
I just have a couple quick things to say: On another board, someone posted
that she asked her 5 year old son why they celebrated Christmas, and he
answered "Because it's Jesus' birthday". She thought she must be doing
something right.
And for many years on my morning walks I have seen this homeless man;
yes, I used to "profile" and not talk to him and then one day I realized
that my extremely protective German Shepherd never "alerted" on him,
and she sure would have if she thought she needed to. We started
exchanging chit-chat and comments about the weather. The first time
he saw me walking without her (she had surgery and couldn't go any
more) he was so sweet and concerned... really touching. Well, this
morning I saw him out there, and this man who had NOTHING to give,
gave me the cheeriest MERRY CHRISTMAS you ever heard. No need to
ask if I celebrated Christmas or if it was the right thing to do or say. And
this from a man who hoped he and his girlfriend could get a motel room
tonight. I tell ya, it really makes you stop and think.
So Merry Christmas, all.
that she asked her 5 year old son why they celebrated Christmas, and he
answered "Because it's Jesus' birthday". She thought she must be doing
something right.
And for many years on my morning walks I have seen this homeless man;
yes, I used to "profile" and not talk to him and then one day I realized
that my extremely protective German Shepherd never "alerted" on him,
and she sure would have if she thought she needed to. We started
exchanging chit-chat and comments about the weather. The first time
he saw me walking without her (she had surgery and couldn't go any
more) he was so sweet and concerned... really touching. Well, this
morning I saw him out there, and this man who had NOTHING to give,
gave me the cheeriest MERRY CHRISTMAS you ever heard. No need to
ask if I celebrated Christmas or if it was the right thing to do or say. And
this from a man who hoped he and his girlfriend could get a motel room
tonight. I tell ya, it really makes you stop and think.
So Merry Christmas, all.