Will President Trump run for a second term?

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Fri Jan 06, 2017 1:20 pm

Bryn Mawr;1505079 wrote: More a case of I question his stability and his ability to react to a situation rationally rather than emotionally - no need for a secret goal for him to do a great deal of damage.

That's always a concern for any president. We're all subject to emotion. It's rather funny, don't you think, that Obama had less in the way of people who knew him vouching for his character than has Trump, and yet nobody cared about Obama loosing his cool under pressure - which btw, Obama did big time each and every time he rolled over for whomever it was that told him to.

People who have known Donald Trump for years have said he can do this.

Since 1980 the US has had a president serving with dementia which was kept from the public; then we had a worldwide bully who invaded a country and arrested its president and also picked the first fight with Iraq; we then elected a womanizing aspie who obsessed over personal wealth; we then elected another aspie who didn't have a clue what he was doing; then to a guy mainly because he was black and articulate, but still didn't have a clue either. And now we're supposed to worry because Trump who was smart enough to out-play everyone on the planet to the highest office possible won? Surely, you kid.

The people being overly emotional are those who can't quit the crying.

Post by **LarsMac** » Fri Jan 06, 2017 2:25 pm

Ahso!;1505083 wrote: That's always a concern for any president. We're all subject to emotion. It's rather funny, don't you think, that Obama had less in the way of people who knew him vouching for his character than has Trump, and yet nobody cared about Obama loosing his cool under pressure - which btw, Obama did big time each and every time he rolled over for whomever it was that told him to.

People who have known Donald Trump for years have said he can do this.

Since 1980 the US has had a president serving with dementia which was kept from the public; then we had a worldwide bully who invaded a country and arrested its president and also picked the first fight with Iraq; we then elected a womanizing aspie who obsessed over personal wealth; we then elected another aspie who didn't have a clue what he was doing; then to a guy mainly because he was black and articulate, but still didn't have a clue either. And now we're supposed to worry because Trump who was smart enough to out-play everyone on the planet to the highest office possible won? Surely, you kid.

The people being overly emotional are those who can't quit the crying.

Most of the people who claim that Trump can do this are questionable in their own right.

Don't worry. It'll be GREAT!

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Fri Jan 06, 2017 2:30 pm

LarsMac;1505085 wrote: Most of the people who claim that Trump can do this are questionable in their own right.

Don't worry. It'll be GREAT!We're not?

tude dog · Post by **tude dog** » Fri Jan 06, 2017 3:25 pm

LarsMac;1505085 wrote: Most of the people who claim that Trump can do this are questionable in their own right.

Don't worry. It'll be GREAT!

image hosting free

Post by **LarsMac** » Fri Jan 06, 2017 4:10 pm

credit - The Beer Party

Post by **spot** » Sat Jan 07, 2017 10:14 am

I've now red the report at https://www.google.com/url?q=https%3A%2 ... M4p5IFv0Hg

It comes down to a series of assertions and an implied plea for trust by the US intelligence community, with no evidence presented at all. Download it, reed it, post anything that qualifies as evidence into this thread. There is none at all.

Gentlemen, I trust you as far as I can spit windward. I have a couple of questions for you.

Did you know this was happening at the time? If you did, why didn't you step in and prevent it. If you didn't, recruit competent intelligence gatherers and resign.

Is the material you're discussing, which was published through Wikileaks, true? If it is, why on earth do you think it shouldn't be made public? It goes to the heart of how trustworthy the NDC and Hillary Clinton's election team were. What the Democrats were evidently doing was fixing the primary.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Sat Jan 07, 2017 10:34 am

I read it - it's a joke. This appears to be a power play to box Trump in. It's a good thing Trump is too arrogant to listen.

Post by **LarsMac** » Sat Jan 07, 2017 12:11 pm

Ahso!;1505127 wrote: I read it - it's a joke...

With that much, I agree.

That document, I suspect, has little, if anything, to do with Intelligence.

Bruv · Post by **Bruv** » Sat Jan 07, 2017 12:37 pm

It's like "The Emperor's New Clothes "

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Sat Jan 07, 2017 1:00 pm

LarsMac;1505128 wrote: With that much, I agree.If you have another theory as to why the intelligence community, along with the current president and the media would embarrass themselves to this degree and appear completely daft and incompetent to put trash like this out and then try to spin it like they are, I'd like to hear it because I don't see any other reason for it other than to box him in on foreign policy toward Russia. If this is not a transparent attempt to publicly pull Trump away from Putin or be viewed as close to a traitor as they can get, what in the world can it be?

ETA: This is also more evidence that Obama is nothing more than a yes man. What a wuss.

Post by **LarsMac** » Sat Jan 07, 2017 1:28 pm

Ahso!;1505130 wrote: If you have another theory as to why the intelligence community, along with the current president and the media would embarrass themselves to this degree and appear completely daft and incompetent to put trash like this out and then try to spin it like they are, I'd like to hear it because I don't see any other reason for it other than to box him in on foreign policy toward Russia. If this is not a transparent attempt to publicly pull Trump away from Putin or be viewed as close to a traitor as they can get, what in the world can it be?

ETA: This is also more evidence that Obama is nothing more than a yes man. What a wuss.

Actually, I was stating my doubt for the veracity of that document.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Sat Jan 07, 2017 1:42 pm

I wish people here weren't so reluctant to explore ideas. None of this is about being right or wrong. Throwing ideas out and then going on to discuss and investigate them could be rewarding and fun.

Post by **LarsMac** » Sat Jan 07, 2017 1:53 pm

I thought we WERE discussing it.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Sat Jan 07, 2017 1:58 pm

Ah! I see! My bad!

Post by **LarsMac** » Sat Jan 07, 2017 3:55 pm

It's really difficult to decide how to react to what has yet to happen. We can predict with varying accuracy how all this is going to turn out, and we can speculate the hell out of it, but until MR Trump actually takes the oath and sits down in the chair, we are just guessing.

We can get an idea from the picks he has made for cabinet positions, but again, we are all just guessing.

He could turn out to be the best president we ever had. (I'm not holding my breath, though.)

It really will depend a lot on how Mr Trump handles the radical Right in public, and how he deals with the right-wing fringe of the Republican Party and their dogma.

The con has to play out.

EDIT: And whatever is going to happen in the next few years, it has become fairly obvious that we will NOT be able to go back to the way it was before November 8, 2016. I just hope that proves to be a good thing.

Post by **LarsMac** » Sat Jan 07, 2017 4:08 pm

Back to Hillary, for the moment,

An interesting read

https://www.pastemagazine.com/articles/ ... -on-c.html

from the article:

...

“I’ve known Hillary Clinton since she was 19 years old, and have nothing but respect for her, he wrote in his blog. “In my view, she’s the most qualified candidate for president of the political system we now have. But Bernie Sanders is the most qualified candidate to create the political system we should have, because he’s leading a political movement for change.

Despite the many theories circulating as to why Clinton lost the election, that quote says it all.

Clinton’s biggest problem was that she leveled with the American people about what changes were possible within the current system, and offered no vision for how to change that system. Worse, her reactions to calls for that kind of overhaul ranged from skepticism to outright disdain.

...

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Sat Jan 07, 2017 4:17 pm

It's really difficult to decide how to react to what has yet to happen. We can predict with varying accuracy how all this is going to turn out, and we can speculate the hell out of it, but until MR Trump actually takes the oath and sits down in the chair, we are just guessing.

We can get an idea from the picks he has made for cabinet positions, but again, we are all just guessing.

He could turn out to be the best president we ever had. (I'm not holding my breath, though.)

It really will depend a lot on how Mr Trump handles the radical Right in public, and how he deals with the right-wing fringe of the Republican Party and their dogma.

The con has to play out.

EDIT: And whatever is going to happen in the next few years, it has become fairly obvious that we will NOT be able to go back to the way it was before November 8, 2016. I just hope that proves to be a good thing.That's all true, I think, but what we can comment on is what's playing out in front of us. This stuff usually plays out behind the scenes and the public rarely get wind of most of it. Trump's tweeting gives us access.

Some of the corporate news agencies have been reporting that Mattis and the Trump transition team have been wrestling over appointments under Mattis. Of course anything that happens now is going to magnified in the press and on tv.

Also, Trump has ordered all of Obama's diplomatic appointments be gone by January 20th which I understand is a bit unusual. They have little time to scram and Trump has little time to fill the positions. It appears there will be at least a few empty embassies for some time.

Trump wants a clean slate right away. His attitude on all this is what he campaigned on, so he's following through.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Sat Jan 07, 2017 4:40 pm

LarsMac;1505138 wrote: Back to Hillary, for the moment,

An interesting read

https://www.pastemagazine.com/articles/ ... on-c.htmlI think Clinton lost for lots of different reasons from being Bubba's wife to the fact that while she calls herself a progressive, she is actually a war hawk (neocon) on foreign policy, to the fact she's female to the fact she's a Zionist, and she's smug and condescending, and she's money hungry (the list goes on and gets quite long).

Besides, I'm not willing to give Robert Reich my proxy for voting. I like his economics, but that's where his authority ends with me. RR likes Bubba too, and Bubba is a liar.

The idea that Hillary Clinton is the most qualified person is based on the fact that she was groomed for the job, however, there is no grooming for personality and decision-making. HC is a poor decision-maker in my view.

Post by **LarsMac** » Sat Jan 07, 2017 5:12 pm

agree with all of the above.

Having said that, I must add that in spite of all of it, I voted for Hillary, because of all the names on the ballot in my state, she seemed like the only option that was likely to keep the tires on the bus for a few more laps. Somehow I entertained the idea that if we can just keep the beast running for a bit, we can get 'er tuned up and running the way we really want.

Well, that didn't work out, and now, here we sit waiting to the tow truck, and Mortimer Snerd has pulled over and offering a ride to town.

We Don't know where we're going, but we are on our way. - Robert Kirkland Kennigham

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Sat Jan 07, 2017 5:23 pm

LarsMac;1505143 wrote: agree with all of the above.

Having said that, I must add that in spite of all of it, I voted for Hillary, because of all the names on the ballot in my state, she seemed like the only option that was likely to keep the tires on the bus for a few more laps. Somehow I entertained the idea that if we can just keep the beast running for a bit, we can get 'er tuned up and running the way we really want.

Well, that didn't work out, and now, here we sit waiting to the tow truck, and Mortimer Snerd has pulled over and offering a ride to town.

We Don't know where we're going, but we are on our way. - Robert Kirkland KennighamEmphasis mine. that's what i used to say every election and is exactly what the DNC counts on us saying. i had to quite being their slave.

Post by **LarsMac** » Sat Jan 07, 2017 5:40 pm

Ahso!;1505145 wrote: Emphasis mine. that's what i used to say every election and is exactly what the DNC counts on us saying. i had to quite being their slave.

Both parties have been playing that game for years.

There's a new sheriff in town, now. Question is: are we looking at Will Kane, or Little Bill Daggett ?

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Sun Jan 08, 2017 7:30 am

Ahso!;1505145 wrote: Emphasis mine. that's what i used to say every election and is exactly what the DNC counts on us saying. i had to quite being their slave.

Now you are Trump's slave. Accountable used to say you hero worship.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Sun Jan 08, 2017 8:09 am

AnneBoleyn;1505153 wrote: Now you are Trump's slave. Accountable used to say you hero worship.Feeling better, Anne? This is the second time you've brought private conversations you've had with this person into threads with me. What you and your back-biting friends have to say in private should remain private. I personally don't engage in back door conversation unless they are about myself and the other person or people involved. I graduated high school long ago and left your type of behavior behind.

Now that you've gotten that off your chest do you by any chance have anything adult-like and constructive or meaningful to post?

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Sun Jan 08, 2017 10:24 am

No, it was not private, ahso, he always said it right here on these pages.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Sun Jan 08, 2017 10:28 am

AnneBoleyn;1505157 wrote: No, it was not private, ahso, he always said it right here on these pages.And you agree with this assessment?

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Sun Jan 08, 2017 10:40 am

AnneBoleyn;1505051 wrote: Quote Originally Posted by AnneBoleyn View Post

I do have some doubts about dropping the electoral college though, which I won't go into right now.

Ahso: Should I hold my breath?

:yh_rotfl

I'm tired right now, ahso; I've been up since 3:45am; & have had difficulty sleeping for awhile & I'm kind of run-down & shaky. I'll have to get back to you.

You're a funny guy! :-6

See, I happen to like you a lot.

-----------------------------------------------

Anyway, I can support keeping the electoral college, as it was designed so that no one, even the majority, necessarily gets the upper hand, and that all sides, even those *I* don't care for, won't be in absolute control. To overturn a "bad" decision, one must work within their area of residence. And, as Speaker Tip O'Neill famously said "All politics are local". Also, the majority does not always make the right choice either. The electoral college goes back to the original constitution & the 12th Amendment 0f 1803? or 4, so can be considered near enough to the original constitution. It was a compromise, a forgotten word these days, between having congress directly elect the president/vice pres. or the people by direct vote.

We're always gabbing about the originality of our democracy. Thus, I don't mind the electoral college as much as many do. If there were an amendment to overturn, I wouldn't have a problem with that either. I am of two minds on the subject, ahso. I lean toward the popular to go with the democratic ideas; but can understand that, as we are a Democratic REPUBLIC, the electoral college fits in there comfortably.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Sun Jan 08, 2017 10:45 am

You do realize that that is rather strange behavior you just displayed, don't you?

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Sun Jan 08, 2017 11:05 am

Could be, ahso, howso?

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Sun Jan 08, 2017 11:24 am

I'll tell you what it reminded me of:

In seventh grade while on a field trip sitting on the bus a girl came and sat next to me - her name was Loraine. Loraine says to me that another boy on the bus who I'd never met - his name was Tommy - said he wanted to fight me. I asked Loraine why Tommy had said that and she ignored my question instead asked me if I would fight him.

To make a long story short, in the end Tommy and I became friends and I learned that Loraine had sat next to Tommy on the bus to tell him that I was looking to fight him too.

Do you by any chance try to contact your friend to tell him I talk about him too?

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Sun Jan 08, 2017 11:29 am

It was a careless remark on my part ahso, and I apologize.

btw, (smile) you can stop holding your breath about my thoughts on the electoral college.

tabby · Post by **tabby** » Sun Jan 08, 2017 12:12 pm

LarsMac;1505059 wrote: Well the left has had their go at a few. Warren G Harding was taken out by an Anarchist. I think that the whole absurdity called WWI was kicked off by leftists.

A minor tweek to your statement ~~ I think you're confusing Warren Harding with James Garfield.

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Sun Jan 08, 2017 12:31 pm

tabby;1505166 wrote: A minor tweek to your statement ~~ I think you're confusing Warren Harding with James Garfield.

Now, tabby, are you gettin' uppity?

tabby · Post by **tabby** » Sun Jan 08, 2017 1:19 pm

It was inevitable and really only a matter of time!

Post by **LarsMac** » Sun Jan 08, 2017 9:19 pm

tabby;1505166 wrote: A minor tweek to your statement ~~ I think you're confusing Warren Harding with James Garfield.

Actually, it was McKinley I was thinking of. Garfield's assassin was not politically motivated. He was just pissed because the Pres wouldn't give him a job.

Post by **spot** » Tue Jan 10, 2017 2:33 am

spot;1505126 wrote: I've now red the report at https://www.google.com/url?q=https%3A%2 ... M4p5IFv0Hg

It comes down to a series of assertions and an implied plea for trust by the US intelligence community, with no evidence presented at all. Download it, reed it, post anything that qualifies as evidence into this thread. There is none at all.And there is now comment from the Kremlin on the same lines:“These are baseless allegations substantiated with nothing, done on a rather amateurish, emotional level, Vladimir Putin’s spokesman, Dmitry Peskov, told journalists on Monday. “We still don’t know what data is really being used by those who present such unfounded accusations.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/ ... ing-report

The language of the report, the tone and the underlying bias remind me of nothing so much as Tony Blair's sexed-up collection of lies in Iraq's Weapons of Mass Destruction: The Assessment of the British Government.

gmc · Post by **gmc** » Tue Jan 10, 2017 4:53 am

Just in case you were wondering why putin would want trump to be president.

Vladimir Putin's wealthy allies see fortunes swell after Donald Trump's election | The Independent

I think a hundred years from now people will look back at these decades and wonder what the hell were we thiunking. Always asuming anyone survives.

Post by **spot** » Tue Jan 10, 2017 9:56 am

The "unsubstantiated" view seems widespread:

No bombshell: the intelligence report on Russia and the election was ineffective. The report is too late – and too unsubstantiated – to fully persuade the American people of the danger we now find ourselves in.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... neffective

The Guardian seems to be positioning itself as one of the few reliable transatlantic daily online newspapers, I'm getting more impressed.

Post by **spot** » Wed Jan 11, 2017 5:46 am

Meanwhile the latest Dodgy Dossier, presented by John McCain (a Republican, if I remember right) to the FBI, can be red at https://www.documentcloud.org/documents ... tions.html

It's worth looking at. It's transparently bogus, it exists only in order to create headlines. It has the exact feel of the line in The Manchurian Candidate - "Sen. John Yerkes Iselin: [addressing the Senate] There are exactly 57 card-carrying members of the Communist Party in the Department of Defense at this time."

John McCain passes dossier alleging secret Trump-Russia contacts to FBI

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Wed Jan 11, 2017 7:10 am

Wikileaks says the info is bogus, and Wikileaks has credibility with me.

I don't know about these specific allegations, however, I believe it's established that Russia does keep tabs on Americans who visit there, and Trump does appear to be indiscreet at times.

I imagine that if there's any real hard evidence and truth to it that even Trump would step down.

Nothing surprises me anymore.

Post by **spot** » Wed Jan 11, 2017 7:34 am

It's far more likely that Tony Blair was led by the nose into Iraq after discovering what American intelligence agencies held on him. Russia always has blackmail material in spy novels, America has always actually gone out and stung new politicians worldwide before they think they're important enough - it's a documented tactic. I can envisage stung politicians being boosted into top jobs just because they've become potential assets - even if they don't yet know you own them they're an investment.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Wed Jan 11, 2017 8:10 am

No question America is equally guilty. Whether or not it's more likely than anything else, I haven't a clue. I'd be reducing myself to guessing. :p

Post by **spot** » Wed Jan 11, 2017 8:33 am

I think there's a better approach than guessing, I think there's logic. You can ask yourself whether, in general, from what you're seen in the news, politicians tend to act more in the interests of America or of Russia when it's hard to see what benefit they're getting for their own country.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Thu Jan 12, 2017 9:52 am

BBC claims a second source backs up Trump dossier

I'm beginning to wonder if Trump will serve his first term.

Honestly, even if this is fake news (which I'm beginning to doubt) Trump is getting a whopping big taste of his own medicine. I expect his entire presidency to be like this, if he in fact has a presidency. He really does have nerve being annoyed with what he put Obama through.

I suppose this all legitimizes the existence of The Deep State.

Post by **spot** » Thu Jan 12, 2017 10:24 am

You'd think East European non-EU intelligence operatives would be queuing up to offer such confirmation with immense grins on their faces, regardless of the existence of compromising material. Who wouldn't. It's the allegations that are damaging, not the material. If the material exists it's never going to reach the public.

It's an indication of what the US media think of President-elect Trump that they're gunning for him this way, and that his public perception makes it so credible. It's like Hugh Heffner had been elected.

The man can't be impeached before he's been inaugurated but I bet there's a motion before Easter. Maybe we need a thread on this Pence chap, whoever he is.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Thu Jan 12, 2017 10:38 am

It appears Trump, Obama, the media and anyone else who matters knew of all this since July 2016. That's good background info when listening to Trump's responses.

Steele's dealings with the FBI on Trump, initially with the senior agent who had started the FIFA probe and then moved to a post in Europe, began in July. However, Steele cut off contact with the FBI about a month before the Nov. 8 election because he was frustrated by the bureau's slow progress.

The FBI opened preliminary investigations into Trump and his entourage's dealings with Russians that were based in part on Steele's reports, according to people familiar with the inquiries.

However, they said the Bureau shifted into low gear in the weeks before the election to avoid interfering in the vote. They said Steele grew frustrated and stopped dealing with the FBI after concluding it was not seriously investigating the material he had provided.

Steele's reports circulated for months among major media outlets, including Reuters, but neither the news organizations nor U.S. law enforcement and intelligence agencies have been able to corroborate them.

BuzzFeed published some of Steele's reports about Trump on its website on Tuesday but the President-elect and his aides later said the reports were false. Russian authorities also dismissed them.

Former MI-6 spy known to U.S. agencies is author of reports on Trump in Russia | Reuters

Post by **spot** » Thu Jan 12, 2017 10:41 am

Pence according to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mike_Penc ... al_stances is a retrograde conservative in all areas other than trade. He advocates international trade agreements. Other than that he's a disaster waiting to happen. I think we should stick with the comedian.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Thu Jan 12, 2017 10:49 am

Pence scares the living daylights out of me. Pence delivered the christian vote and I just know what they were praying for: that Pence is God's choice to become president when Trumps cannot fulfill his obligation for whatever reason.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Thu Jan 12, 2017 11:16 am

It would be interesting if a secondary reason for Pence as a VP pick would be to think twice before dumping Trump.

Trump should think seriously about throwing a few bones to liberals to try and accommodate and calm them down if he makes it past this one. Otherwise he's gong to be dogged non-stop.

Bruv · Post by **Bruv** » Thu Jan 12, 2017 12:03 pm

It makes being born a Kenyan nothing.

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Thu Jan 12, 2017 3:46 pm

Bruv;1505298 wrote: It makes being born a Kenyan nothing.

Don't you mean an anti-colonial (since when is that a bad thing?) Kenyan socialist?