Is God Real?

Mickiel · Post by **Mickiel** » Wed Nov 18, 2015 10:22 am

FourPart;1489788 wrote: I don't actually 'hang out' in any 'section'. I just do View New Posts & lo & behold I get whatever's new.

My belief is that we go where we are drawn to.

I think any experience with God is a drawing.

FourPart · Post by **FourPart** » Wed Nov 18, 2015 11:09 am

The gravity that pulls a hanging man from the trapdoor is a drawing. You cannot attribute everything you want to 'God' just because it suits you - oh - I forgot - when it doesn't suit you it's the Devil isn't it.

Ted · Post by **Ted** » Wed Nov 18, 2015 1:56 pm

Some folks make a monster out of God as they try to make him in their image. The ancient Hebrews in writing what has become sacred literature were responding to events in their lives. If things went well they gave thanks to God. If things went horribly wrong they thought that God was punishing them for something. God had nothing to do with either.

Ted · Post by **Ted** » Wed Nov 18, 2015 2:00 pm

God is love and he (she) who abides in love abides in God. God is not a monster. Satan is a very human creation to explain why bad things happen to good people.

Mickiel · Post by **Mickiel** » Wed Nov 18, 2015 3:53 pm

FourPart;1489799 wrote: The gravity that pulls a hanging man from the trapdoor is a drawing. You cannot attribute everything you want to 'God' just because it suits you - oh - I forgot - when it doesn't suit you it's the Devil isn't it.

The drawing of God is like gravity, you just can't help the force. And when it does not suit me, I don't worry about it.

Post by **LarsMac** » Wed Nov 18, 2015 3:56 pm

I was watching an interesting film the other day, in which a Nun told one of her students, "God is not in the event that you experienced, but in your response to the experience. "

This is probably true for "the Devil" as well.

Mickiel · Post by **Mickiel** » Wed Nov 18, 2015 3:59 pm

Ted;1489807 wrote: Some folks make a monster out of God as they try to make him in their image. The ancient Hebrews in writing what has become sacred literature were responding to events in their lives. If things went well they gave thanks to God. If things went horribly wrong they thought that God was punishing them for something. God had nothing to do with either.

Man you need to get with it, only 24 of the 66 biblical books are Hebrew.

Hugo · Post by **Hugo** » Thu Nov 19, 2015 9:48 am

I don't think that god is Jesus because the old testament said "God is the creator of this world" which makes no sence. We are not sure how we have been made but for now our planet is the only god we know. And as promised, we are with god when we die (or in hell which is the space).

Ted · Post by **Ted** » Thu Nov 19, 2015 3:00 pm

Hell is a Mesopotamian creation. It is a non-existent place a myth designed to explain evil.

Mickiel · Post by **Mickiel** » Thu Nov 19, 2015 3:24 pm

Ted;1489843 wrote: Hell is a Mesopotamian creation. It is a non-existent place a myth designed to explain evil.

I agree completely.

Mickiel · Post by **Mickiel** » Fri Nov 20, 2015 1:52 pm

God in control

Proverbs 21:1, " The King's heart is in the hand of the Lord, as the rivers of water, he turns it wherever he wants."

God controls the waters, and the hearts of men; he makes them do what he wants them to do.

Truly stunning!

Ted · Post by **Ted** » Fri Nov 20, 2015 4:18 pm

Another example of not knowing how to read and understand the Bible. I take the Bible very seriously but not literally. The writers never intended a literal interpretation..

Mickiel · Post by **Mickiel** » Fri Nov 20, 2015 5:43 pm

Ted;1489883 wrote: Another example of not knowing how to read and understand the Bible. I take the Bible very seriously but not literally. The writers never intended a literal interpretation..

In your view they never intended one, in my view they did. Just not everywhere.

FourPart · Post by **FourPart** » Sat Nov 21, 2015 5:11 am

Mickiel;1489888 wrote: In your view they never intended one, in my view they did. Just not everywhere.
But it's ok for you to cherry pick where it was intended & where it wasn't? Sounds typical of Bible Thumpers.

Mickiel · Post by **Mickiel** » Sat Nov 21, 2015 7:58 am

FourPart;1489893 wrote: But it's ok for you to cherry pick where it was intended & where it wasn't? Sounds typical of Bible Thumpers.

You can't pick cherries if they are not there. If they are there, they are free game.

FourPart · Post by **FourPart** » Sat Nov 21, 2015 5:47 pm

Mickiel;1489897 wrote: You can't pick cherries if they are not there. If they are there, they are free game.

I'm glad to see you admit it.

Mickiel · Post by **Mickiel** » Sun Nov 22, 2015 12:16 am

FourPart;1489921 wrote: I'm glad to see you admit it.

Oh yes, I think cherries are a good thing, not the bad you look to portray. Information found is needed, and adds to, not subtract from.

FourPart · Post by **FourPart** » Sun Nov 22, 2015 4:29 pm

That's the whole thing about Cherry Picking. You use the Cherries to support your case, but turn a blind eye to & try to hide the ones that go against it.

Mickiel · Post by **Mickiel** » Sun Nov 22, 2015 6:26 pm

FourPart;1489946 wrote: That's the whole thing about Cherry Picking. You use the Cherries to support your case, but turn a blind eye to & try to hide the ones that go against it.

If the cherries were not on the tree, I could not pick them.

Ted · Post by **Ted** » Mon Nov 23, 2015 12:39 pm

To get away from the actual fruit cherry picking in a literary sense is done very well by fundamentalists and some evangelicals. They do a lot of creative dancing to make contradictions disappear. For instance how did Judas die. Of course the prior question should be was Judas an actual living human being.

Ted · Post by **Ted** » Mon Nov 23, 2015 12:50 pm

Not sure about Mickiel but I am a Christian just as the first apostles were. I do engage in following the way. It has nothing to do with belief in but with trust (pistis in Greek) Same with the earliest church.

Mickiel · Post by **Mickiel** » Mon Nov 23, 2015 3:46 pm

Ted;1489971 wrote: Not sure about Mickiel but I am a Christian just as the first apostles were. I do engage in following the way. It has nothing to do with belief in but with trust (pistis in Greek) Same with the earliest church.

Good, another closet Atheist trying to appear as a Christian. I am not Christian, by the way.

FourPart · Post by **FourPart** » Mon Nov 23, 2015 6:27 pm

I am anti-Religious, but I believe that I live by a higher standard of morals than most supposed followers of Religions do. As a Socialist, I believe in & live by the rule of "Love Thy Neighbour", but it has nothing to do with Religion. I follow the tenets as mainly laid down in the 10 Commandments, which are merely rules which are common to all societies, regardless of Culture or Religion. They are simply rules that have evolved as being essential to the survival of any society. They weren't laid down by any Deity. They exist purely because society had found that they're the rules that work best.

Mickiel · Post by **Mickiel** » Tue Nov 24, 2015 2:23 pm

FourPart;1489997 wrote: I am anti-Religious, but I believe that I live by a higher standard of morals than most supposed followers of Religions do. As a Socialist, I believe in & live by the rule of "Love Thy Neighbour", but it has nothing to do with Religion. I follow the tenets as mainly laid down in the 10 Commandments, which are merely rules which are common to all societies, regardless of Culture or Religion. They are simply rules that have evolved as being essential to the survival of any society. They weren't laid down by any Deity. They exist purely because society had found that they're the rules that work best.

I am anti-religious, and I believe in God. I believe most of the following of the ten commandments comes from a belief in God. The principles of the bible are real, because the bible itself is real.

FourPart · Post by **FourPart** » Tue Nov 24, 2015 5:09 pm

Mickiel;1490021 wrote: I am anti-religious, and I believe in God. I believe most of the following of the ten commandments comes from a belief in God. The principles of the bible are real, because the bible itself is real.
The principles in SOME of the Bible are real because they are principles which are common to all cultures as being the natural order of society. Even primates tend to live by similar principles, yet I don't see many Gorillas reading the Bible.

Mickiel · Post by **Mickiel** » Tue Nov 24, 2015 5:35 pm

FourPart;1490027 wrote: The principles in SOME of the Bible are real because they are principles which are common to all cultures as being the natural order of society. Even primates tend to live by similar principles, yet I don't see many Gorillas reading the Bible.

Well I could truthfully say, in a sense, Gorillas are Atheist.

Mickiel · Post by **Mickiel** » Sun Dec 13, 2015 10:46 am

Is God real? Is our future real? God is our future, it just does not now seem like it. I would like to know God's pathology in keeping us in the dark, but I just don't completely understand it. In his mind, darkness has to come before the light for humans; we have to swim in the birth womb, before we are brought out and born. And that womb is dark; surrounded by a serious womb wall which is making us wait for this birth.

FourPart · Post by **FourPart** » Sun Dec 13, 2015 5:16 pm

Birth is a physical reality. It can be observed & recorded & has been observed for centuries. It is understood how & why it happens. It is known how to interact & modify the event. There is no such evidence as to the existence of a God, other than a book of hearsay, folklore & legend.

Mickiel · Post by **Mickiel** » Sun Dec 13, 2015 5:21 pm

Birth is the future of all humanity; to be born again into the spirit world of God. Human birth symbolizes this through and through.

FourPart · Post by **FourPart** » Sun Dec 13, 2015 5:23 pm

Mickiel;1490461 wrote: Birth is the future of all humanity; to be born again into the spirit world of God. Human birth symbolizes this through and through.

It's not being born again (unless you're a believer in reincarnation). It's about being born - just the once. Plain & simple. It's like becoming a virgin again.

Mickiel · Post by **Mickiel** » Mon Dec 14, 2015 1:34 pm

Is God real? Consider this;

Eric Metaxas: Science Increasingly Makes the Case for God - WSJ

FourPart · Post by **FourPart** » Mon Dec 14, 2015 5:14 pm

Mickiel;1490494 wrote: Is God real? Consider this;

Eric Metaxas: Science Increasingly Makes the Case for God - WSJ
I don't intend to subscribe in order to read any further than the first paragraph, but the very nature of science requires hard evidence in order to prove anything. Without evidence it accepts anything to be possible, but unproven. It used to be thought that there could be no life on other planets, due to the fact that there were no other planets with liquid water, which is essential for all forms of life, as we know it (it is acknowledged that there may be life forms yet to be discovered that do not require water) , but now that liquid water has been found on Mars, that previously held belief is out of the window. More & more evidence is being found every day to increase the likelihood of extra terrestrial life, yet despite the $millions being invested into astronomical research, there has been absolutely no evidence to support the existence of a God.

Mickiel · Post by **Mickiel** » Mon Dec 14, 2015 8:29 pm

FourPart;1490495 wrote: I don't intend to subscribe in order to read any further than the first paragraph, but the very nature of science requires hard evidence in order to prove anything. Without evidence it accepts anything to be possible, but unproven. It used to be thought that there could be no life on other planets, due to the fact that there were no other planets with liquid water, which is essential for all forms of life, as we know it (it is acknowledged that there may be life forms yet to be discovered that do not require water) , but now that liquid water has been found on Mars, that previously held belief is out of the window. More & more evidence is being found every day to increase the likelihood of extra terrestrial life, yet despite the $millions being invested into astronomical research, there has been absolutely no evidence to support the existence of a God.

God is worth being aware of, and anything worth being aware of, is worth developing your thoughts around it.

FourPart · Post by **FourPart** » Fri Dec 18, 2015 8:09 pm

I don't see that being aware of something that doesn't exist as worthy of being aware of in the first place.

Fuzzy · Post by **Fuzzy** » Sat Dec 19, 2015 12:48 am

Mickiel;1490494 wrote: Is God real? Consider this;

Eric Metaxas: Science Increasingly Makes the Case for God - WSJ

Of course god is real.....in your mind, Micki. In my mind.....no.

I'm wondering about all the other gods ever invented. Are they still real or have we dropped most of them?

Mickiel · Post by **Mickiel** » Sat Dec 19, 2015 10:20 am

Fuzzy;1490635 wrote: Of course god is real.....in your mind, Micki. In my mind.....no.

I'm wondering about all the other gods ever invented. Are they still real or have we dropped most of them?

The mind is the best place to be conscious of God; we can only be conscious of, those things we are conscious of. You are not conscious of God, because you are not now supposed to be; its not yet your conscious time.

There are no other gods, you are using myth to dispute fact; a favorite tactic of Atheist. There can only be one. And that one is a bad dude!

Mickiel · Post by **Mickiel** » Sat Dec 19, 2015 10:24 am

FourPart;1490632 wrote: I don't see that being aware of something that doesn't exist as worthy of being aware of in the first place.

God does not exist in your consciousness, because he is not supposed to. You are not supposed to believe in God, God has you in opposition, because that is where he wanted you during this time. Its where he wanted you to put your effect. Your consciousness has been purposely turned off to God; you are thinking like your supposed to think.

FourPart · Post by **FourPart** » Sat Dec 19, 2015 7:20 pm

I actually find that offensive because you, as someone who has been brainwashed into believing in an imaginary entity, are directly stating that I don't have a mind of my own.

Mickiel · Post by **Mickiel** » Sat Dec 19, 2015 7:56 pm

FourPart;1490685 wrote: I actually find that offensive because you, as someone who has been brainwashed into believing in an imaginary entity, are directly stating that I don't have a mind of my own.

I have stated no such thing, your offense is misdirected and wasteful. We have minds of our own, I just believe there are powers that highly influence us; many of those powers are far greater than us. And you are right, I have been brainwashed; my mind has been washed of much of the nonsense that exist in this world.

Fuzzy · Post by **Fuzzy** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 4:15 am

Mickiel;1490687 wrote: I have stated no such thing, your offense is misdirected and wasteful. We have minds of our own, I just believe there are powers that highly influence us; many of those powers are far greater than us. And you are right, I have been brainwashed; my mind has been washed of much of the nonsense that exist in this world.

Is Mickiel real? Or is he just one of god's sons sent to earth to brainwash us into believing the unbelievable?

FourPart · Post by **FourPart** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 4:25 am

It might help if you understood what Brainwashing is. It's actually a bit of a misnomer. It doesn't 'wash' the brain of anything. It just floods it with all sorts of other crap so that the rationale can no longer be found as the directed intent has been drummed in so much as to overpower it. The rationale is the needle. Brainwashing is the haystack. The needle is still there. The bigger the haystack gets, the more difficult it becomes to find the needle - so much to the point that no-one remembers there even is a needle in there at all.

Fuzzy · Post by **Fuzzy** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 4:48 am

FourPart;1490711 wrote: It might help if you understood what Brainwashing is. It's actually a bit of a misnomer. It doesn't 'wash' the brain of anything. It just floods it with all sorts of other crap so that the rationale can no longer be found as the directed intent has been drummed in so much as to overpower it. The rationale is the needle. Brainwashing is the haystack. The needle is still there. The bigger the haystack gets, the more difficult it becomes to find the needle - so much to the point that no-one remembers there even is a needle in there at all.

Oh yeah, I know what brainwashing is, and I haven't had any problems resisting it so far. Fingers crossed.

FourPart · Post by **FourPart** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 8:21 am

Fuzzy;1490714 wrote: Oh yeah, I know what brainwashing is, and I haven't had any problems resisting it so far. Fingers crossed.
The comment was actually directed at Mickiel & his snippet:

And you are right, I have been brainwashed; my mind has been washed of much of the nonsense that exist in this world.

Mickiel · Post by **Mickiel** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 10:01 am

Fuzzy;1490709 wrote: Is Mickiel real? Or is he just one of god's sons sent to earth to brainwash us into believing the unbelievable?

How can something be unbelievable when more than half of human history has believed it? The vast minority voice does not believe it; that is not enough weight to brainwash humans against God. Its quite weak in fact; the brainwashing goes both ways; unbelief is brainwashing. Many, if not most forms of belief is brainwashing, forms of belief I definitely disagree with. But that is brainwashing as it is, part of human reality.

FourPart · Post by **FourPart** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 5:52 pm

Mickiel;1490731 wrote: How can something be unbelievable when more than half of human history has believed it? The vast minority voice does not believe it; that is not enough weight to brainwash humans against God. Its quite weak in fact; the brainwashing goes both ways; unbelief is brainwashing. Many, if not most forms of belief is brainwashing, forms of belief I definitely disagree with. But that is brainwashing as it is, part of human reality.

'Has' believed - past tense. More than half the people in human history once believed that the earth was the centre of the universe & that the sun went around the earth, and that the stars were holes in the sky.

Fuzzy · Post by **Fuzzy** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 8:25 pm

If millions of people believe in a fairy tale, it's still a fairy tale.

Mickiel · Post by **Mickiel** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 9:06 pm

I think percentages can tell us things. In example, in 1991 4.4% of the worlds population were Atheist, by 2006 that number shrunk to 2 %. The percentages show a significant shrinkage.

Atheist Population - Conservapedia

FourPart · Post by **FourPart** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 8:40 am

Censuses that take account of people's Religious beliefs rarely get an accurate response, as so many people categorise their Religion with the Culture. For example, there are still a vast number of people in the UK who will put their Religion down as C of E (Church of England) in the belief it means White British. A lot of the time without even know what C of E stands for, let alone believing in any Religion at all. Also, on Ethnic Diversity reviews now, more & more of them are including multiple options, such as Atheist, Agnostic & No Religion. This immediately splits the individual percentages. If you had just 2 options as with Religious or Not Religious, I think you'd get an entirely different result.

Mickiel · Post by **Mickiel** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 10:19 am

FourPart;1490788 wrote: Censuses that take account of people's Religious beliefs rarely get an accurate response, as so many people categorise their Religion with the Culture. For example, there are still a vast number of people in the UK who will put their Religion down as C of E (Church of England) in the belief it means White British. A lot of the time without even know what C of E stands for, let alone believing in any Religion at all. Also, on Ethnic Diversity reviews now, more & more of them are including multiple options, such as Atheist, Agnostic & No Religion. This immediately splits the individual percentages. If you had just 2 options as with Religious or Not Religious, I think you'd get an entirely different result.

Census is not an exact science, no. But I find it hyppicritcal that many Atheist like claiming that religion is shrinking, when their ranks are shrinking as well.

Ted · Post by **Ted** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 2:55 pm

It seems to me we are heading towards a religionless Christianity. Christianity like Judaism was meant to be a way of life and not a belief system.