Something just doesn't quite add up here.

[Oscar Namechange]

Or Is It just me ?

I'd be very Interested to hear from our US members on this.

AWOL Traitor Traded for Taliban Terrorists: “In the name of Allah, the most gracious, the most merciful,’’ AWOL soldier's dad said in Arabic | Pamela Geller, Atlas Shrugs

The author of the article Is a little controversial but last night I saw the Father make his speech with Obama and was surprised when he said after just 5 years In captivity, his son had difficulty speaking English.

Now these tweets In the article ???

[Snowfire]

Oscar Farage;1456107 wrote: Or Is It just me ?

I'd be very Interested to hear from our US members on this.

AWOL Traitor Traded for Taliban Terrorists: “In the name of Allah, the most gracious, the most merciful,’’ AWOL soldier's dad said in Arabic | Pamela Geller, Atlas Shrugs

The author of the article Is a little controversial but last night I saw the Father make his speech with Obama and was surprised when he said after just 5 years In captivity, his son had difficulty speaking English.

Now these tweets In the article ???


I doubt he has had the opportunity to speak English at all for 5 years. The only language that would have been responded to would have been Arabic. Can't begin to imagine what his life has been like all that time.

[LarsMac]

Firstly, I would consider the source.

Seems that site is one that loves to bad-mouth President Obama, and loves to hate Muslims.

Much of what they offer is hearsay.

And the good Ms Geller was very outspoken, bad-mouthing Obama over his inability to gain Bergdahl's release just a year ago.

But as Snowfire says, the guy has been POW for 5 years

And, unlike POWs in most "wars" he has been alone. No other POWs around to relate to.

Probably suffers a bit from the Stockholm Syndrome. He bears watching closely, and should get some serious counseling.

[Oscar Namechange]

LarsMac;1456112 wrote: Firstly, I would consider the source.

Seems that site is one that loves to bad-mouth President Obama, and loves to hate Muslims.

Much of what they offer is hearsay.

And the good Ms Geller was very outspoken, bad-mouthing Obama over his inability to gain Bergdahl's release just a year ago.

But as Snowfire says, the guy has been POW for 5 years

And, unlike POWs in most "wars" he has been alone. No other POWs around to relate to.

Probably suffers a bit from the Stockholm Syndrome. He bears watching closely, and should get some serious counseling. Yes, I did say she was controversial,

Thanks Lars. I'm trying to understand this more and see all angles.

[LarsMac]

Oscar Farage;1456115 wrote: Yes, I did say she was controversial,

Thanks Lars. I'm trying to understand this more and see all angles.


Were I a member of the Bergdahl family, I would have already contacted an attorney to consider a libel suit against Geller.

[Oscar Namechange]

LarsMac;1456119 wrote: Were I a member of the Bergdahl family, I would have already contacted an attorney to consider a libel suit against Geller.


That's why I was asking for US opinions. To be honest, this subject was one I knew little about until he was released. I posted Geller's views to see what the US thought and If there was any truth In It.

One thing I do agree with, Is, what happened to Obama saying he didn't do deals with terrorists ?

[jones jones]

The euphemism controversial is often used in place of the truth.

The first time I saw an image of Bergdahl's father I went: "Unusual to see a Muslim's son fighting for Uncle Sam."

Personally if its true that this earthling taught his captor's something they didn't already know about bomb making, then I would have preferred that a more deserving US Marine was brought home instead of Bergdahl.

I don't believe that President Obama won himself many new friends by this action on his part.

Time will tell.

[Oscar Namechange]

jones jones;1456123 wrote: The euphemism controversial is often used in place of the truth.

The first time I saw an image of Bergdahl's father I went: "Unusual to see a Muslim's son fighting for Uncle Sam."

Personally if its true that this earthling taught his captor's something they didn't already know about bomb making, then I would have preferred that a more deserving US Marine was brought home instead of Bergdahl.

I don't believe that President Obama won himself many new friends by this action on his part.

Time will tell. That's an Interesting view JJ, Thank you.

From what I've seen, there Is a great deal of discord over this along with the jubilation. That's what Interests me, the opposing views.

May I prod you further to ask what would be a more deserving Marine? As I understand It, he was the only one In a captive situation.

[jones jones]

Oscar Farage;1456126 wrote: That's an Interesting view JJ, Thank you.

From what I've seen, there Is a great deal of discord over this along with the jubilation. That's what Interests me, the opposing views.

May I prod you further to ask what would be a more deserving Marine? As I understand It, he was the only one In a captive situation.


Always assuming there is another US Marine in captivity some where.

[Oscar Namechange]

jones jones;1456127 wrote: Always assuming there is another US Marine in captivity some where. Ahh right.

I'm not a fan of the Obama administration but It's not a personal view on my part. I distinctly remember the pre-election gumph of closing Guam Bay and never dealing with terrorists. Now It appears he has back-tracked on both. That's why I can understand some views that there's more to this than we know.

[LarsMac]

There is a Marine that apparently wandered into Mexico when he got lost on the expressway in San Diego.

He had guns, and it seems the Mexican Federales locked him up.

Marine held in Mexican prison on weapons charge; mom calls for release - CNN.com



As for Bergdahl:

http://www.snopes.com/politics/military/bergdahl.asp

and

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/is-sgt-bowe ... -deserter/

[jones jones]

LarsMac;1456130 wrote: There is a Marine that apparently wandered into Mexico when he got lost on the expressway in San Diego.

He had guns, and it seems the Mexican Federales locked him up.

Marine held in Mexican prison on weapons charge; mom calls for release - CNN.com


There you go then!

[Snowfire]

So apart from some unsubstantiated emails, why has it been suggested that he deserted or at least went AWOL ?

The fact he has parents who are Arabic and he was supposedly unhappy with the US's stance in the middle east ?

Stinks to me !

[LarsMac]

Snowfire;1456134 wrote: So apart from some unsubstantiated emails, why has it been suggested that he deserted or at least went AWOL ?

The fact he has parents who are Arabic and he was supposedly unhappy with the US's stance in the middle east ?

Stinks to me !


I have seen nothing of any credibility to suggest his parents are/were Muslim.

Though there are reports of emails from Sgt Bergdahl that suggest he was disillusioned with the Army, I remember a lot of similar comments from military personnel back in the middle of the Vietnam era. Doesn't make them traitors.

One news release quoted some taliban radio conversations about catching him in a latrine.

That would be worse than being called a traitor, being "caught with your pants down."

All in all, I will reserve my judgment until he gets home, and the army can work out all the details.

[Oscar Namechange]

Snowfire;1456134 wrote: So apart from some unsubstantiated emails, why has it been suggested that he deserted or at least went AWOL ?

The fact he has parents who are Arabic and he was supposedly unhappy with the US's stance in the middle east ?

Stinks to me ! I can't make that bit out.

If he was Muslim ( his Father spoke fluent Arabic last night), why would he be a US Marine In Afghan ?

Then there's the Info from his captors that they had real problems keeping him safe and moved him around so much. If he was a Muslim why was he In Afghan for the US and why would other Taliban factions be wanting to kill him If he was an asset to them as alleged?

None of It adds up.

[Snowfire]

Oscar Farage;1456146 wrote: I can't make that bit out.

If he was Muslim ( his Father spoke fluent Arabic last night), why would he be a US Marine In Afghan ?

Then there's the Info from his captors that they had real problems keeping him safe and moved him around so much. If he was a Muslim why was he In Afghan for the US and why would other Taliban factions be wanting to kill him If he was an asset to them as alleged?

None of It adds up.


Well, there are plenty of Muslims in the US Forces and many have served in Iraq/Afghanistan one way or another

Secondly, he isn't necessarily Muslim just because he is of Arab extraction.

I might be wrong but I think the desertion assertion is from the right wingers trying to stir things up. There's no evidence of it that I can see and I would imagine a majority of troops showing dissatisfaction with government foreign policy regarding the middle east.

[Oscar Namechange]

Snowfire;1456148 wrote: Well, there are plenty of Muslims in the US Forces and many have served in Iraq/Afghanistan one way or another

Secondly, he isn't necessarily Muslim just because he is of Arab extraction.

I might be wrong but I think the desertion assertion is from the right wingers trying to stir things up. There's no evidence of it that I can see and I would imagine a majority of troops showing dissatisfaction with government foreign policy regarding the middle east. It would be good If our US members have any links to his original capture five years ago. I'll look when I've had my supper.

[Oscar Namechange]

It will be Interesting to see If these alleged E mails get leaked,

Bowe Bergdahl, U.S. soldier held by Taliban, was "ashamed to be American," emails show - CBS News

[Wandrin]

What does it matter whether he was captured by the Taliban because he walked off base because of ptsd, disillusionment, naiveté, or some other reason? He was active duty military in a war zone at the time. He became a POW. They managed to secure his release.

Yes, I understand that large groups of politicians will grandstand in front of the cameras complaining about anything that Obama does. They will do that anyhow, as they have done since 2008 and will continue to do until after 2016.

[LarsMac]

Oscar Farage;1456146 wrote: I can't make that bit out.

If he was Muslim ( his Father spoke fluent Arabic last night), why would he be a US Marine In Afghan ?

Then there's the Info from his captors that they had real problems keeping him safe and moved him around so much. If he was a Muslim why was he In Afghan for the US and why would other Taliban factions be wanting to kill him If he was an asset to them as alleged?

None of It adds up.


Snowfire;1456148 wrote: Well, there are plenty of Muslims in the US Forces and many have served in Iraq/Afghanistan one way or another

Secondly, he isn't necessarily Muslim just because he is of Arab extraction.

I might be wrong but I think the desertion assertion is from the right wingers trying to stir things up. There's no evidence of it that I can see and I would imagine a majority of troops showing dissatisfaction with government foreign policy regarding the middle east.


Where did the arab thing come from, anyway?

His father hardly looks arab, to me, and neither does Bowe.

I would guess that the Bergdahl name comes from somewhere closer to High Threshold's neck of the world, than from anywhere in the middle east.

If there is any arab in there, I would guess it is from the mother.

And even speaking Arabic, does not make you an Arab, or a Muslim.

The right wing sites that are jumping on this are the same ones who were criticizing Obama because he had not worked hard enough to bring Bergdahl home. They just want to do anything that discredits Obama.

[Oscar Namechange]

LarsMac;1456173 wrote: Where did the arab thing come from, anyway?

His father hardly looks arab, to me, and neither does Bowe.

I would guess that the Bergdahl name comes from somewhere closer to High Threshold's neck of the world, than from anywhere in the middle east.

If there is any arab in there, I would guess it is from the mother.

And even speaking Arabic, does not make you an Arab, or a Muslim.

The right wing sites that are jumping on this are the same ones who were criticizing Obama because he had not worked hard enough to bring Bergdahl home. They just want to do anything that discredits Obama.#

I'm Interested because there Is so much on the net, Including the Navy site saying he was a traitor and so much to defend him. It's one of those cases where something perfectly normal can be used for political gain.

As more emerges, I have just read that apparently his Father learned to speak Arabic to help corespond with his captors...that clears that one up.

Why now ?Five years Is a long time to secure his release.

[LarsMac]

Oscar Farage;1456175 wrote: #

I'm Interested because there Is so much on the net, Including the Navy site saying he was a traitor and so much to defend him. It's one of those cases where something perfectly normal can be used for political gain.

As more emerges, I have just read that apparently his Father learned to speak Arabic to help corespond with his captors...that clears that one up.

Why now ?Five years Is a long time to secure his release.


The original demands from the people that held him were fairly unrealistic, and of course, the gummint is not in the habit of negotiating with such people.

Whether the guy was a traitor, or a deserter, or whatever should be decided by the army in a Courts Marshall, after he is returned.

[AnneBoleyn]

Ronald Reagan Gave Iran 1,500 Missiles for Hostages. Obama Trades Five Guys? GOP Heads Explode.

"In 1985, while Iran and Iraq were at war, Iran made a secret request to buy weapons from the United States. McFarlane sought President Reagan's approval, in spite of the embargo against selling arms to Iran. McFarlane explained that the sale of arms would not only improve U.S. relations with Iran, but might in turn lead to improved relations with Lebanon, increasing U.S. influence in the troubled Middle East. Reagan was driven by a different obsession. He had become frustrated at his inability to secure the release of the seven American hostages being held by Iranian terrorists in Lebanon. As president, Reagan felt that "he had the duty to bring those Americans home."

Ronald Reagan Gave Iran 1,500 Missiles for Hostages. Obama Trades Five Guys? GOP Heads Explode.

I also want to remind American Conservatives that Israel, who they claim to worship (but really don't) gives up masses of proven Arab murderers, etc. for a few Israelis every few years. This is not to debate Israel, but just to note the flaming hypocrisy of the Rethuglican Party.

[LarsMac]

AnneBoleyn;1456236 wrote: Ronald Reagan Gave Iran 1,500 Missiles for Hostages. Obama Trades Five Guys? GOP Heads Explode.

"In 1985, while Iran and Iraq were at war, Iran made a secret request to buy weapons from the United States. McFarlane sought President Reagan's approval, in spite of the embargo against selling arms to Iran. McFarlane explained that the sale of arms would not only improve U.S. relations with Iran, but might in turn lead to improved relations with Lebanon, increasing U.S. influence in the troubled Middle East. Reagan was driven by a different obsession. He had become frustrated at his inability to secure the release of the seven American hostages being held by Iranian terrorists in Lebanon. As president, Reagan felt that "he had the duty to bring those Americans home."

Ronald Reagan Gave Iran 1,500 Missiles for Hostages. Obama Trades Five Guys? GOP Heads Explode.

I also want to remind American Conservatives that Israel, who they claim to worship (but really don't) gives up masses of proven Arab murderers, etc. for a few Israelis every few years. This is not to debate Israel, but just to note the flaming hypocrisy of the Rethuglican Party.


The west has been nothing if not consistently hypocritical in their collective dealings with the Persian Gulf nations.

[AnneBoleyn]

Re: Pamela Geller. As a New Yorker I know her antics quite well. Here is one of the worst:

Meet the Organization Behind These Anti-Islamic Bus Ads

"The American Freedom Defense Initiative, headed by Pamela Gellar, has caught a lot of heat recently for putting up anti-Islamic ads on DC metro buses. The ads tell of intrinsic Islamic hate of Israel, showing Hitler sitting with Haj Amin al Husseini, who was once the grand mufti of Jerusalem."

Read more: Meet the Organization Behind These Anti-Islamic Bus Ads | Care2 Causes

I have seen these signs sometimes on the NYC subway. They are divisive & downright rude to Muslims sharing the ride. I have heard her blabbing her big mouth on Fox News, I have heard her hate speech regarding the mosque & cultural center near Ground Zero. She is a xenophobe.

She's a Jew I'm sorry is in the "tribe". She's the political Kim Kardashian, always looking to be noticed.

eta--The Hebrew Sarah Palin.

[LarsMac]

well, now Glen Beck, O'Reilly, and Coulter, among others, have all hopped onto her bandwagon.

Working the Anti-Obama crowd into a frenzy over the thing.

[AnneBoleyn]

LarsMac;1456244 wrote: well, now Glen Beck, O'Reilly, and Coulter, among others, have all hopped onto her bandwagon.

Working the Anti-Obama crowd into a frenzy over the thing.


Proof enough, I'd say. Like they all jumped on the Cliven Bundy wagon until Bundy began his musings on "the Negro."

[Oscar Namechange]

What on earth has an 1985 hostage situation In Iran got to with a POW 20 years later In another country? That's like saying Thatcher's war In The Falklands Is similar.

[AnneBoleyn]

Oscar Farage;1456247 wrote: What on earth has an 1985 hostage situation In Iran got to with a POW 20 years later In another country? That's like saying Thatcher's war In The Falklands Is similar.


It's the hypocrisy of the Republicans. Anything a Republican president does is swell, every single thing Obama does is wrong. &, re: Israel, the rethugs are always praising them no matter what, including mass prison exchanges, sometimes for a few Israelis, sometimes to show Israel wants peace. Can't have it only one way. If it's good enough for their idol Israel, about whom they NEVER criticize, only heap praise..............some of those prisoners let out of Israeli jails could kill Americans, too.

Also, Guantanamo is a blight on the planet & it's not Obama's fault it hasn't closed. Let them out, or, I have a good idea==Don't take prisoners if you intend to never give them a trial, Kill Them on the Spot.

[AnneBoleyn]

PS--Thatcher's war comparison has nothing to do with this at all.

[Oscar Namechange]

AnneBoleyn;1456251 wrote: PS--Thatcher's war comparison has nothing to do with this at all.


Ahhh I see your comparison now and understand.

Thatcher's war still has the same hypocrisy Anne. She goes to war with Argentina, good call for the Tories. Blair goes to war with Iraq, good call for Labour... same old same old.

[Oscar Namechange]

Got a feeling this Is going to turn Into one huge hot potato

Taliban prisoner swap was ILLEGAL and could lead to Obama's IMPEACHMENT | Mail Online

[LarsMac]

Oscar Farage;1456269 wrote: Got a feeling this Is going to turn Into one huge hot potato

Taliban prisoner swap was ILLEGAL and could lead to Obama's IMPEACHMENT | Mail Online


More squawking from red hens.

[Oscar Namechange]

LarsMac;1456272 wrote: More squawking from red hens. Yep but they are making a meal of It.

It'll all come out In the wash no doubt.

[AnneBoleyn]

Oscar Farage;1456268 wrote: Ahhh I see your comparison now and understand.

Thatcher's war still has the same hypocrisy Anne. She goes to war with Argentina, good call for the Tories. Blair goes to war with Iraq, good call for Labour... same old same old.


No it isn't. Were you willing to let the Falklands go?

[Oscar Namechange]

AnneBoleyn;1456295 wrote: No it isn't. Were you willing to let the Falklands go? Of course not. We have a duty to keep what we have Invaded and stolen.

[LarsMac]

Oscar Farage;1456305 wrote: Of course not. We have a duty to keep what we have Invaded and stolen.


THAT's the spirit.

[jones jones]

Five Taliban terrorist leaders were swopped for a deserter who left his brothers in arms in the lurch while he walked over to the enemy. He had to stay five years to make it look good. I'm surprised President Obama fell for it ... pressure had to come from somewhere I think.

[Oscar Namechange]

LarsMac;1456308 wrote: THAT's the spirit. :wah:

That's ENGLISH spirit :wah:

[Oscar Namechange]

jones jones;1456315 wrote: Five Taliban terrorist leaders were swopped for a deserter who left his brothers in arms in the lurch while he walked over to the enemy. He had to stay five years to make it look good. I'm surprised President Obama fell for it ... pressure had to come from somewhere I think. I just hope to god, these 5 do not return to the Taliban and go on to kill Allied forces. Wouldn't that be a tragic Irony ?

[jones jones]

Oscar Farage;1456319 wrote: I just hope to god, these 5 do not return to the Taliban and go on to kill Allied forces. Wouldn't that be a tragic Irony ?


You can put money on that happening ... No doubt about it.

[Oscar Namechange]

jones jones;1456321 wrote: You can put money on that happening ... No doubt about it. I'm no visionary but If a bookie laid me a price, I'd take It.

[flopstock]

Bowe Bergdahl to face desertion charges | MSNBC