Christians Are Most Persecuted Religious Group in the World

Hope6 · Post by **Hope6** » Fri Feb 28, 2014 4:38 pm

World's Largest Religion Also Most Persecuted - World - CBN News - Christian News 24-7 - CBN.com

Týr · Post by **Týr** » Fri Feb 28, 2014 4:46 pm

Not before time, either. I can think of few religious ideologies more deserving of persecution. Or, even more destructively, ridicule.

Bruv · Post by **Bruv** » Fri Feb 28, 2014 5:23 pm

Týr;1449194 wrote: Not before time, either. I can think of few religious ideologies more deserving of persecution. Or, even more destructively, ridicule.

Would you like to rephrase that remark?

Hope6 · Post by **Hope6** » Fri Feb 28, 2014 6:31 pm

As a Christian I take offence at the statement that I deserve to be persecuted, I've never done anything to anybody!

Wandrin · Post by **Wandrin** » Fri Feb 28, 2014 6:51 pm

When was the last time a Christian was persecuted in the US for being a Christian?

Mickiel · Post by **Mickiel** » Fri Feb 28, 2014 7:13 pm

Hope6;1449204 wrote: As a Christian I take offence at the statement that I deserve to be persecuted, I've never done anything to anybody!

Your religion teaches the worst persecution possible to do to humans with its horrible eternal hell punishing doctrine. To torture a person alive for eternity is the most barbaric crazy thing I have ever read. I take offense to such a terrible teaching being pinned on the God I believe in.

gmc · Post by **gmc** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 1:40 am

The irony is they are being prosecuted by the godly who share the belief there is only one god - just they believe their one is the right one.

posted by tyr

Not before time, either. I can think of few religious ideologies more deserving of persecution. Or, even more destructively, ridicule.

persecution lowers yourself to their level. Education and reason are the best weapons against religion. If people can read the religious texts for themselves they are less likely to follow blindly the words of a priest. That last bit identifies me as a heretic so far as the largest christian sect is concerned, at least they can't burn me at the stake any more.

Týr · Post by **Týr** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 2:25 am

Hope6;1449204 wrote: As a Christian I take offence at the statement that I deserve to be persecuted, I've never done anything to anybody!

You live in a country which just ten years ago went on Crusade in the Middle East and unjustly killed even more Muslims than Richard the Lionheart and his paid killers managed to the last time it was tried on such a massive scale. Do you not remember being told what you-all "must" do - "you" being "the American people"? Here is is...This is a new kind of - a new kind of evil. And we understand. And the American people are beginning to understand. This crusade, this war on terrorism is going to take a while. And the American people must be patient.

George Bush, President.

"I want to tell you something, we've got no better friends than Canada. They stand with us in this incredibly important crusade to defend freedom, this campaign to do what is right for our children and our grandchildren."

George Bush, President.

Tenth Crusade - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

And last I looked in the papers, you-all were still at it. Or is the US Crusade over?

Hope6 · Post by **Hope6** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 6:39 am

When you are a Christian you are supposed to pattern your actions after Jesus, act as he would act. So many who claim to be Christian have got it wrong but we all get the blame for it.

How to Act Like a Christian in Any Circumstance: 10 Steps

It was my assumption that the actions of my government were an effort to protect us from terrorists not a crusade.

Týr · Post by **Týr** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 6:46 am

Hope6;1449227 wrote: It was my assumption that the actions of my government were an effort to protect us from terrorists not a crusade.Your Commander-in-Chief should have been more circumspect in his choice of words then. "Crusade" isn't my description of America's Big Day Out, it was his. My description is more along the lines of Crime Against Humanity.

Are you seriously suggesting that most of the Muslim dead resulting from George Bush's Middle East deployment were terrorists? If not, why are they dead?

Hope6 · Post by **Hope6** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 6:47 am

Wandrin we are constantly under attack here, people are wanting to take this away or stop you from doing that. I just heard where some atheists were after a hotel chain to make them take all the Bibles out of their hotel rooms. That's the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard in my life! If you don't want to read it then just don't read it! but don't stop others from having the right to read it if they want to.

Hope6 · Post by **Hope6** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 6:56 am

No I am not suggesting they are all terrorists, that unfortunately is what happens with war, many innocent are killed.......that why I don't believe in war, I know people say sometimes that we have no choice. I guess we had no choice back with the Nazis. But as someone once said, in war there are no winners, only survivors.

Týr · Post by **Týr** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 6:56 am

Hope6;1449229 wrote: Wandrin we are constantly under attack here, people are wanting to take this away or stop you from doing that. I just heard where some atheists were after a hotel chain to make them take all the Bibles out of their hotel rooms. That's the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard in my life! If you don't want to read it then just don't read it! but don't stop others from having the right to read it if they want to.

They're an odd outfit, the Gideons. For one thing membership is restricted to men only - if their wives want to join in there's the Gideons Auxiliary for them but as far as I can tell there's no way for a woman to join either group unless they marry a Gideon member first.

Perhaps you find that normal in a Christian setting.

Týr · Post by **Týr** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 7:01 am

Hope6;1449230 wrote: No I am not suggesting they are all terrorists, that unfortunately is what happens with war, many innocent are killed.......that why I don't believe in war, I know people say sometimes that we have no choice. I guess we had no choice back with the Nazis. But as someone once said, in war there are no winners, only survivors.

I asked whether you thought most of the Muslim dead resulting from George Bush's Middle East deployment were terrorists. I think you think most were unarmed bystanders, the same as I think. Anyone who tells you that's normal in the history of mechanized war is lying. And how you can possibly think you're winning hearts and minds to the American way of life totally baffles me.

Hope6 · Post by **Hope6** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 7:03 am

No! I guess I have a little feminist in me because I don't agree with anything that leaves women out! A lot of churches don't want women in leading roles but as one friend said to me and I found this very interesting. He said that the most he had learned about his religion he had learned from women......Sunday School teachers and all. He also said if you think about it, when Jesus arose from his tomb on the third day he didn't choose one of his disciples or any other man to go and tell the news of his resurrection.....he appeared to a woman....Mary Magdalene...and told her to go and tell everyone else.

Hope6 · Post by **Hope6** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 7:06 am

Actually I don't think we are winning any hearts and minds to the American way of life. lots of people hate Americans. the sad part of that is most of them don't actually know us as people, they just know all this political and military stuff.

theia · Post by **theia** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 7:12 am

Hope6;1449234 wrote: Actually I don't think we are winning any hearts and minds to the American way of life. lots of people hate Americans. the sad part of that is most of them don't actually know us as people, they just know all this political and military stuff.

It is sad, Hope. I think it's how prejudice works...judging a whole group instead of seeing each individual.

Hope6 · Post by **Hope6** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 7:27 am

Hi theia! I hope you are doing well?

Yes it is sad but I think it is a big problem........judging a whole group instead of taking each individual as their own person. I see it on a daily basis with some people around here. People judge other people so much by their background or what they look like, instead of getting to know the person.

Týr · Post by **Týr** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 7:44 am

theia;1449235 wrote: It is sad, Hope. I think it's how prejudice works...judging a whole group instead of seeing each individual.

I'm wondering to what extent the soldiers deployed by the US saw those they killed as individuals. Or whether, perhaps, they'd become prejudiced as a result of their training.

I'm not sure one could organize a Crusade against individuals but it's bloody simple if they happen to all share a different religion.

Snooz · Post by **Snooz** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 7:50 am

Hope6;1449193 wrote: World's Largest Religion Also Most Persecuted - World - CBN News - Christian News 24-7 - CBN.com

First of all, I don't put much faith in obviously biased news sources. Second, is Christianity in fact the world's largest religion?

Post by **LarsMac** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 8:05 am

Snooz;1449241 wrote: First of all, I don't put much faith in obviously biased news sources. Second, is Christianity in fact the world's largest religion?

Depends on who you ask.

According to many sects of Protestant Christianity, they are the only "True Christians"

I have had pastors say that Catholics are not Christians, and heard Catholics make the same claim regarding many Protestant sects.

And most Christians dismiss the Gnostics, and Copts.

If you gather up all of the religious groups that are based upon Jesus, then, yes, this is the largest religious group in the world.

Getting them to agree on anything else is the challenge.

theia · Post by **theia** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 9:06 am

Týr;1449240 wrote: I'm wondering to what extent the soldiers deployed by the US saw those they killed as individuals. Or whether, perhaps, they'd become prejudiced as a result of their training.

I'm not sure one could organize a Crusade against individuals but it's bloody simple if they happen to all share a different religion.

You'll have to keep wondering unless you decide to ask the individuals in that group as to whether they saw those they killed as individuals.

theia · Post by **theia** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 9:07 am

Hope6;1449237 wrote: Hi theia! I hope you are doing well?

Yes it is sad but I think it is a big problem........judging a whole group instead of taking each individual as their own person. I see it on a daily basis with some people around here. People judge other people so much by their background or what they look like, instead of getting to know the person.

I'm fine thank you, Hope :-6

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 9:27 am

A claim of persecution is absolutely absurd with no evidence of real facts. Pat Robertson, who felt 9/11 was punishment over acceptance of homosexuals, is just stirring up trouble. Most Americans are Christian, no one is taking away Christmas; if a Christian needs to read a bible anywhere, bring your own.

The claim is silly with no justification.

Týr · Post by **Týr** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 10:40 am

LarsMac;1449242 wrote: If you gather up all of the religious groups that are based upon Jesus, then, yes, this is the largest religious group in the world.
I've a horrid suspicion you just included the Mormons.

Snowfire · Post by **Snowfire** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 10:44 am

AnneBoleyn;1449251 wrote: A claim of persecution is absolutely absurd with no evidence of real facts. Pat Robertson, who felt 9/11 was punishment over acceptance of homosexuals, is just stirring up trouble. Most Americans are Christian, no one is taking away Christmas; if a Christian needs to read a bible anywhere, bring your own.

The claim is silly with no justification.

Absolutely correct.

Týr · Post by **Týr** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 10:56 am

theia;1449246 wrote: You'll have to keep wondering unless you decide to ask the individuals in that group as to whether they saw those they killed as individuals.

It distresses me that you can even write that, presumably in good faith.

is this sufficiently well founded for you?Since World War II, a new era has quietly dawned in modern warfare: an era of psychological warfare, conducted not upon the enemy, but upon one’s own troops. The triad of methods used to enable men to overcome their innate resistance to killing includes desensitization, classical and operant conditioning, and denial defense mechanisms.

Authors such as Gwynne Dyer and Richard Holmes have traced the development of bootcamp glorification of killing. They’ve found it was almost unheard of in World War I, rare in World War II, increasingly present in Korea, and thoroughly institutionalized in Vietnam. “The language used in [marine training camp] Parris Island to describe the joys of killing people, writes Dyer, helps “desensitize [marines] to the suffering of an ‘enemy,’ and at the same time they are being indoctrinated in the most explicit fashion (as previous generations were not) with the notion that their purpose is not just to be brave or to fight well; it is to kill people.

[...] By the time a soldier does kill in combat, he has rehearsed the process so many times that he is able to, at one level, deny to himself that he is actually killing another human being. One British veteran of the Falklands, trained in the modern method, told Holmes that he “thought of the enemy as nothing more or less than Figure II [man-shaped] targets.

There is “a natural disinclination to pull the trigger¦ when your weapon is pointed at a human, says Bill Jordan, a career U.S. Border Patrol officer and veteran of many gunfights. “To aid in overcoming this resistance it is helpful if you can will yourself to think of your opponent as a mere target and not as a human being. In this connection you should go further and pick a spot on your target. This will allow better concentration and further remove the human element from your thinking.

Jordan calls this process “manufactured contempt.

Hope on the Battlefield | Greater Good

Do, by all means, read the article. How can you think soldiers aren't deliberately desensitized to killing by discounting any personal value in "the enemy"?

Bruv · Post by **Bruv** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 11:05 am

Christian persecution.....

Open Doors

Reuters

It is undeniable.

theia · Post by **theia** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 11:45 am

TÃ½r;1449269 wrote: It distresses me that you can even write that, presumably in good faith.

is this sufficiently well founded for you?Since World War II, a new era has quietly dawned in modern warfare: an era of psychological warfare, conducted not upon the enemy, but upon one’s own troops. The triad of methods used to enable men to overcome their innate resistance to killing includes desensitization, classical and operant conditioning, and denial defense mechanisms.

Authors such as Gwynne Dyer and Richard Holmes have traced the development of bootcamp glorification of killing. They’ve found it was almost unheard of in World War I, rare in World War II, increasingly present in Korea, and thoroughly institutionalized in Vietnam. “The language used in [marine training camp] Parris Island to describe the joys of killing people, writes Dyer, helps “desensitize [marines] to the suffering of an ‘enemy,’ and at the same time they are being indoctrinated in the most explicit fashion (as previous generations were not) with the notion that their purpose is not just to be brave or to fight well; it is to kill people.

[...] By the time a soldier does kill in combat, he has rehearsed the process so many times that he is able to, at one level, deny to himself that he is actually killing another human being. One British veteran of the Falklands, trained in the modern method, told Holmes that he “thought of the enemy as nothing more or less than Figure II [man-shaped] targets.

There is “a natural disinclination to pull the trigger¦ when your weapon is pointed at a human, says Bill Jordan, a career U.S. Border Patrol officer and veteran of many gunfights. “To aid in overcoming this resistance it is helpful if you can will yourself to think of your opponent as a mere target and not as a human being. In this connection you should go further and pick a spot on your target. This will allow better concentration and further remove the human element from your thinking.

Jordan calls this process “manufactured contempt.

Hope on the Battlefield | Greater Good

Do, by all means, read the article. How can you think soldiers aren't deliberately desensitized to killing by discounting any personal value in "the enemy"?

Why would I dispute the conditioning of soldiers when I can see that we are all conditioned in numerous ways from birth? But that doesn't detract from the argument that prejudice arises from grouping individuals together and making a judgment. We're not privy to what goes on in a battle zone, unless its seen as "beneficial" for us to know, or unless there's a leak. So we don't actually know if all the members of a fighting team blindly follow their conditioning and hence we cannot realistically make a sound judgment about the team as a whole.

Týr · Post by **Týr** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 11:55 am

That's why there are authoritative academic studies to show what actually happens, theia.

As for grouping, there are two exclusive categories of adult American. There are those who think patriotism is a debilitating societal malaise, and there are the guilty.

theia · Post by **theia** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 12:09 pm

Týr;1449274 wrote: That's why there are authoritative academic studies to show what actually happens, theia.

As for grouping, there are two exclusive categories of adult American. There are those who think patriotism is a debilitating societal malaise, and there are the guilty.

I have a problem with "authoritative academic studies. "Academic perspectives" would sit more easily with me.

Týr · Post by **Týr** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 12:33 pm

theia;1449275 wrote: I have a problem with "authoritative academic studies. "Academic perspectives" would sit more easily with me.

The thing they have that mere people don't is raw data from actually going out and discovering. I think that puts them at an advantage.

Hope6 · Post by **Hope6** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 12:58 pm

Lars you're right about the different types of Christians I'm sad to say. Being a Southern Baptist I know some folks you don't think much of Catholics' ways of doing things. But as one of our preachers wives used to say, as long as it's got Jesus in it the rest of the little differences don't matter.

theia · Post by **theia** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 1:06 pm

Týr;1449277 wrote: The thing they have that mere people don't is raw data from actually going out and discovering. I think that puts them at an advantage.

And what do they do with the raw data?

Post by **LarsMac** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 1:15 pm

Týr;1449267 wrote: I've a horrid suspicion you just included the Mormons.

Up until around April or May of 2012, there were any number of "Christian" pastors and preachers telling us that Mormons were NOT Christians, but then when it it began looking like Romney would win the Republican nomination, suddenly, all of those voices began to fade away, and several of the high profile individuals publicly changed their tune.

So, I reckon that Mormons are now Christians.

Hope6 · Post by **Hope6** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 1:42 pm

I remember some years ago The Southern Baptist Convention, which is held in a different city each year, and members go out into the community and witness to people they consider in need of it. That year it was held in Utah right in the middle of the Mormon territory. They seemed to think there was a great need there.

gmc · Post by **gmc** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 3:10 pm

Hope6;1449281 wrote: Lars you're right about the different types of Christians I'm sad to say. Being a Southern Baptist I know some folks you don't think much of Catholics' ways of doing things. But as one of our preachers wives used to say, as long as it's got Jesus in it the rest of the little differences don't matter.

Sadly many millions have died over those little differences. Given the persecution meted out by christians in the name of their religion both in the past and present times it's hard to sympathise when you know given half a chance they are always ready to persecute those that don't share their beliefs.

Hope6 · Post by **Hope6** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 3:18 pm

I wouldn't persecute anybody, even if I had the chance to.

Týr · Post by **Týr** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 3:19 pm

LarsMac;1449286 wrote: Up until around April or May of 2012, there were any number of "Christian" pastors and preachers telling us that Mormons were NOT Christians, but then when it it began looking like Romney would win the Republican nomination, suddenly, all of those voices began to fade away, and several of the high profile individuals publicly changed their tune.

So, I reckon that Mormons are now Christians.

The one thing Mormons can be applauded for is the consistent strength of their willful self-delusion, on a scale paralleled only by Scientologists and those hard-core smokers who think cigarettes are good for the throat (an advertising claim often made for Craven "A", though not recently).

Týr · Post by **Týr** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 3:22 pm

theia;1449284 wrote: And what do they do with the raw data?

Test their interpretations of reality against accurate information and adjust accordingly. It's far better than composing a self-consistent theory out of thin air just because it sounds nice.

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Sat Mar 01, 2014 4:12 pm

Hope6;1449281 wrote: Lars you're right about the different types of Christians I'm sad to say. Being a Southern Baptist I know some folks you don't think much of Catholics' ways of doing things. But as one of our preachers wives used to say, as long as it's got Jesus in it the rest of the little differences don't matter.

What about Lars' statement makes you sad?

Hope6 · Post by **Hope6** » Sun Mar 02, 2014 5:23 am

It's sad that Christians hold on to those petty differences between the different denominations. It should be like I said in my other post. If Jesus is in it, the other little differences shouldn't matter.

Post by **Bryn Mawr** » Sun Mar 02, 2014 5:32 am

Bruv;1449270 wrote: Christian persecution.....

Open Doors

Reuters

It is undeniable.

That there is persecution of Christians is undeniable - that there is persecution on the scale being claimed is, at the least, unproven.

Post by **jones jones** » Sun Mar 02, 2014 7:27 am

While the storm clouds gather far across the sea,

Let us swear allegiance to a land that's free.

Let us all be grateful for a land so fair,

As we raise our voices in a solemn prayer:

God bless america, land that I love,

Stand beside her and guide her

Through the night with a light from above.

From the mountains, to the prairies,

To the oceans white with foam,

God bless america,

My home sweet home.

-- irving berlin

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Sun Mar 02, 2014 8:11 am

Irving Berlin didn't have Jesus in him.

Post by **LarsMac** » Sun Mar 02, 2014 9:33 am

Bryn Mawr;1449365 wrote: That there is persecution of Christians is undeniable - that there is persecution on the scale being claimed is, at the least, unproven.

It seems to be more like 2 thousand than 100 thousand.

Of course compare that to the million or so Shi'a and Sunni deaths in Iraq, or the Buddhists in Tibet and Muslims in Uighur, I don't think we Christians can claim persecution status, just yet.

Týr · Post by **Týr** » Sun Mar 02, 2014 9:36 am

AnneBoleyn;1449395 wrote: Irving Berlin didn't have Jesus in him.

Though he may have become a Mormon since he died.

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Sun Mar 02, 2014 9:44 am

Týr;1449404 wrote: Though he may have become a Mormon since he died.

I'm so disgusted by that made up religion. No better than scientology. That practice of baptizing Jews after death is on the one hand persecution, on the other hand simply meaningless. There are many who say those 2 named practices are no more made up than any other. At least the others have some basis of historical accuracy.

theia · Post by **theia** » Sun Mar 02, 2014 10:19 am

Týr;1449311 wrote: Test their interpretations of reality against accurate information and adjust accordingly. It's far better than composing a self-consistent theory out of thin air just because it sounds nice.

And hence the raw data is no more.

I don't deny that research can be informative but objective/authoritative it is not, which is why I prefer the term "academic perspective."

Any hypothesis can be interesting, whether created out of thin air or thoroughly researched...it can spark the imagination and give rise to an infinite range of questions, most of which are unanswerable. Now, that is truly exciting.

Snowfire · Post by **Snowfire** » Sun Mar 02, 2014 11:55 am

Hope6;1449363 wrote: It's sad that Christians hold on to those petty differences between the different denominations. It should be like I said in my other post. If Jesus is in it, the other little differences shouldn't matter.

Why restrict it to Jesus ?

Muslims, Jews and Christians all worship the same God.

If God is in it, the other little differences shouldn't matter