Offensive art work

[hoppy]

Teacher Deems American Flag 'Offensive' | The FOX Nation

[Ferret_annica]

So Hoppy, tell me; do you find burning old Glory to be an offensive thing to do?

[hoppy]

Ferret_annica;1309177 wrote: So Hoppy, tell me; do you find burning old Glory to be an offensive thing to do?


Sorry, but I see nothing about flag burning in the article.

[yaaarrrgg]

I don't see why people feel the need to tell God what to bless. They treat the invisible guy like an moron that has to be directed around, literally by a kid. I don't think it's offensive *to me*, just insulting to the idea of God.

[hoppy]

yaaarrrgg;1309202 wrote: I don't see why people feel the need to tell God what to bless. They treat the invisible guy like an moron that has to be directed around, literally by a kid. I don't think it's offensive *to me*, just insulting to the idea of God.


In that case, God knew she was ASKING, not TELLING.

[beowulf]

Ferret_annica;1309177 wrote: So Hoppy, tell me; do you find burning old Glory to be an offensive thing to do?


in most countries, including america, it is illegal to deface or burn your national flag

[yaaarrrgg]

Still, it seems weird for a kid to ask an omnipotent, omniscient being to do something. Like this being wouldn't have already considered the action and weighed the pros and cons.

How does the kid know they aren't asking God to empower an empire that will do evil? From what I hear from many Christians, the U.S. government is a skip away from being the next Nazi Germany. And God is supposed to bless that and make it even more powerful"?

Worse, this blessing comes at the expense of others. They aren't asking for all people of Earth to be blessed. Just themselves really. The typical Christian prayer: "me me me, amen"

[hoppy]

yaaarrrgg;1309214 wrote: Still, it seems weird for a kid to ask an omnipotent, omniscient being to do something. Like this being wouldn't have already considered the action and weighed the pros and cons.

How does the kid know they aren't asking God to empower an empire that will do evil? From what I hear from many Christians, the U.S. government is a skip away from being the next Nazi Germany. And God is supposed to bless that and make it even more powerful"?

Worse, this blessing comes at the expense of others. They aren't asking for all people of Earth to be blessed. Just themselves really. The typical Christian prayer: "me me me, amen"


You're more twisted than a double corkscrew.:yh_rotfl

[Saint_]

Yeah. FOXNEWS. Now THERE'S and unbiased source!

FOXNEWS is about as accurate as a Parkinson's victim with a spray can.

Attached files

[K.Snyder]

Ferret_annica;1309177 wrote: So Hoppy, tell me; do you find burning old Glory to be an offensive thing to do? Don't try and wrap your intros around trying to establish a sense of other peoples' formative logic because they don't participate at all. Not because they hate you but because they don't get it. My personal observations and thought I'd just give you some advice Ms. annica

[yaaarrrgg]

hoppy;1309260 wrote: You're more twisted than a double corkscrew.:yh_rotfl


I take it, you've never given much thought to the the nationalistic-religious propaganda you've been programmed with?

The War Prayer, by Mark Twain

[K.Snyder]

yaaarrrgg;1309308 wrote: I take it, you've never given much thought to the the nationalistic-religious propaganda you've been programmed with?

The War Prayer, by Mark Twain


Brainwashing never entails questions, only "answers"

[Ferret_annica]

hoppy;1309182 wrote:

Sorry, but I see nothing about flag burning in the article.


Gee, you're no fun. Don't be a party pooper sweetie. Was just setting up an observation that burning is the normal protocol for flag disposal.

I am a veteran, I give pointed feedback to people who do not follow flag protocol.

I would never disrespect the organic representation of the U.S.A. Relax.

[Ferret_annica]

beowulf;1309210 wrote: in most countries, including america, it is illegal to deface or burn your national flag


Actually, burning the flag in protest is protected under the aupices of the First Amendment of the U.S. Constitution.

Of course, to do so in the wrong setting can be bad for one's health.



Fred Phelps and family are always walking on flags or dragging them on the ground when they protest.

[spot]

I suggest the teacher's been misquoted. Instead of saying of the flag and commentary 'You can’t draw that – that’s offensive’ she may well have actually said 'You can’t draw! That – that’s offensive!’, in which case she was definitely defending Old Glory and not attacking it.

[mikeinie]

spot;1309324 wrote: I suggest the teacher's been misquoted. Instead of saying of the flag and commentary 'You can’t draw that – that’s offensive’ she may well have actually said 'You can’t draw! That – that’s offensive!’, in which case she was definitely defending Old Glory and not attacking it.


Good point...

[spot]

mikeinie;1309337 wrote: Good point...


I'm still wondering how anyone can teach an art class if a critical word to a student is a sackable offence. If the picture in question lacked artistic merit and required improvement in order to satisfy the teacher then, back in my day, that'd have been an end to the matter. I might well have had my ear clipped in the process too.

[G#Gill]

It seems the matter has been sorted now to mutual satisfaction. I suspect the teacher was originally referring to the fact that words were written on the picture of the flag - defacing the nation's flag. That is offensive. Similarly in England when people brandish the St. George's flag with 'England' emblazoned across the middle of it - that is in fact defacing the flag. I always thought it strange that 'England' should be written on our country's flag, like it has to be advertised that the flag of St. George is in fact the flag of England!!!!! I'm just waiting for the 'Union' flag to have England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland written on it ! I don't think there will be enough room for all those letters :wah:

[beowulf]

G#Gill;1309342 wrote: I'm just waiting for the 'Union' flag to have England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland written on it ! I don't think there will be enough room for all those letters :wah:


especially since wales isnt represented on the uinion flag :D:D

its made up from the crosses of st george, andrew and patrick

[mikeinie]

I think that the media and people have nothing better to do than worry about such trivial shyte while the rest of the world is falling apart around them.

[yaaarrrgg]

mikeinie;1309367 wrote: I think that the media and people have nothing better to do than worry about such trivial shyte while the rest of the world is falling apart around them.


I agree. Though this does have some practical significance IMO. If the fascists in the U.S. can't brainwash kids with nationalistic-religious propaganda, then who will fight in our next war? Certainly not the older folks voting for the next fascist. They need these kids to mindlessly accept having their heads blown off for the sake of the state. That's not going to happen as easily, if the kids aren't encouraged to draw completely unoriginal political propaganda, and pass that off as "art."

[spot]

yaaarrrgg;1309371 wrote: They need these kids to mindlessly accept having their heads blown off for the sake of the state.Surely that's the purpose of scheduling a flag salute during the school day and the group recital of the Pledge of Allegiance. I'm not entirely sure whether the sole ground for refusal to participate is religious objection - can any other reason be given without penalty?

If it happened in any other country but not the USA then Americans would regard it as deeply doctrinaire. Being something that's done in the USA makes it, on the contrary, perfectly acceptable. Rather like voting machines with no hard copy proof. As President Putin said, if that were a Russian voting process Americans would be derisive.

People should question their own assumptions on a regular basis.

[BTS]

Originally Posted by yaaarrrgg

Still, it seems weird for a kid to ask an omnipotent, omniscient being to do something. Like this being wouldn't have already considered the action and weighed the pros and cons.

How does the kid know they aren't asking God to empower an empire that will do evil? From what I hear from many Christians, the U.S. government is a skip away from being the next Nazi Germany. And God is supposed to bless that and make it even more powerful"?

Worse, this blessing comes at the expense of others. They aren't asking for all people of Earth to be blessed. Just themselves really. The typical Christian prayer: "me me me, amen"



hoppy;1309260 wrote: You're more twisted than a double corkscrew.:yh_rotfl


No he/she is not twisted Hoppy, just confused.

It is all part of his/her/their agenda of tearing down ALL things America.

Just look at his/her post of the past. ALL anti American, anti christian but pro marxisism.

[Saint_]

Actually... as a teacher, I can tell you that the art teacher is guilty.

Guilty of not knowing how to be politically correct, pick your battles, and be PR and media sensitive and savvy in today's social battleground, the schools.

1. Don't have an opinion of your own in the classroom. Put forth both sides, but without stating which one you are on, ever.

2. Understand that everything you do and say will be recorded, relayed, and analyzed ad infinitum, ad nauseum.

3. Realize that public relations is your actual job, not education. Without keeping the parents happy, you will have no job.

Brutal, ridiculous, out of synch, anti-logical, anti-productive...but true.

[Saint_]

Saint_;1309378 wrote: Actually... as a teacher, I can tell you that the art teacher is guilty.

Guilty of not knowing how to be politically correct, pick your battles, and be PR and media sensitive and savvy in today's social battleground, the schools.

1. Don't have an opinion of your own in the classroom. Put forth both sides, but without stating which one you are on, ever.

2. Understand that everything you do and say will be recorded, relayed, and analyzed ad infinitum, ad nauseum.

3. Realize that public relations is your actual job, not education. Without keeping the parents happy, you will have no job.

Brutal, ridiculous, out of synch, anti-logical, anti-productive...but true.


GOODNESS! I'm pretty cynical this morning!

[BTS]

yaaarrrgg;1309308 wrote: I take it, you've never given much thought to the the nationalistic-religious propaganda you've been programmed with?

The War Prayer, by Mark Twain


Twain on the American Indian:

His heart is a cesspool of falsehood, of treachery, and of low and devilish instincts. With him, gratitude is an unknown emotion; and when one does him a kindness, it is safest to keep the face toward him, lest the reward be an arrow in the back. To accept of a favor from him is to assume a debt which you can never repay to his satisfaction, though you bankrupt yourself trying. The scum of the earth!:rolleyes:

[yaaarrrgg]

BTS;1309376 wrote:

No he/she is not twisted Hoppy, just confused.

It is all part of his/her/their agenda of tearing down ALL things America.

Just look at his/her post of the past. ALL anti American, anti christian but pro marxisism.


You're the un-American, with your Joe McCarthy, flag waiving, anti-democracy, fascist platform.

[yaaarrrgg]

spot;1309374 wrote: Surely that's the purpose of scheduling a flag salute during the school day and the group recital of the Pledge of Allegiance. I'm not entirely sure whether the sole ground for refusal to participate is religious objection - can any other reason be given without penalty?

If it happened in any other country but not the USA then Americans would regard it as deeply doctrinaire. Being something that's done in the USA makes it, on the contrary, perfectly acceptable. Rather like voting machines with no hard copy proof. As President Putin said, if that were a Russian voting process Americans would be derisive.

People should question their own assumptions on a regular basis.


It is brainwashing. Back when I was in public school, I wasn't even aware there was an option to not participate. My impression was if a kid tried to do so they'd be sent to the principal's office. Either that, or beaten up on the playground by miniature brown shirts.

[BTS]

:yh_flagyaaarrrgg;1309385 wrote: You're the un-American, with your Joe McCarthy, flag waiving, anti-democracy, fascist platform.:yh_flag

Your previous post through tyme prove my point about your anti America agenda.

Can I/we get just facts instead of more slander............?

PLEASE, just once?:yh_flag:yh_flag:yh_flag

[yaaarrrgg]

BTS;1309388 wrote: :yh_flag:yh_flag

Your previous post through tyme prove my point about your anti America agenda.

Can I/we get just facts instead of more slander............?

PLEASE, just once?:yh_flag:yh_flag:yh_flag


Waive the flag all you want. You are the one who's sh!tting on it.

[BTS]

:yh_flag:yh_flag:yh_worshp:yh_party:yh_glasse:yh_flag:yh_ttth:yh_flagyaaarrrgg;1309390 wrote: Waive the flag all you want. You are the one who's sh!tting on it.

[Saint_]

yaaarrrgg;1309371 wrote: I agree. Though this does have some practical significance IMO. If the fascists in the U.S. can't brainwash kids with nationalistic-religious propaganda, then who will fight in our next war?


Or maybe they just want to build up the kid's self-esteem by showing them that they are a part of a great Union? That's a good thing for kids, believe me, I do that for a living.



Certainly not the older folks voting for the next fascist.


Well, thank you for acknowledging that we all vote around here. How can that be Fascist?

They need these kids to mindlessly accept having their heads blown off for the sake of the state.


Last I heard, our military was all volunteer! Moreover, we do not take anyone who is not old enough to make coherent decisions about their own future.

That's not going to happen as easily, if the kids aren't encouraged to draw completely unoriginal political propaganda, and pass that off as "art."


What you are railing at are what my family used to call "values." A belief in God and a greater purpose to life. Pride in who we are as a country and what we stand for. That is exactly what the child drew.... a flag with the words "God Bless America."

Those things you seem to hate, that you think are negative, were good things. They brought us together as a family and helped us to get through times of adversity. They made us believe in ourselves and try our best. They gave us a moral compass and made us decent and civil, compassionate and caring. They helped us to be successful and we passed those values on to our children.

People like you that might try to make them into negative things are an anathema to goodness and right. Paranoia, which you display towards the flag, and fear, which you spout concerning our place in history ....

are bad things.

[Raven]

hoppy;1309157 wrote: Teacher Deems American Flag 'Offensive' | The FOX Nation


I noticed the article did not identify the teacher. It just implied religious and political persuasion. People are too easily lead by sensational journalism.

[yaaarrrgg]

Saint_;1309426 wrote: What you are railing at are what my family used to call "values." A belief in God and a greater purpose to life. Pride in who we are as a country and what we stand for. That is exactly what the child drew.... a flag with the words "God Bless America."

Those things you seem to hate, that you think are negative, were good things. They brought us together as a family and helped us to get through times of adversity. They made us believe in ourselves and try our best. They gave us a moral compass and made us decent and civil, compassionate and caring. They helped us to be successful and we passed those values on to our children.

People like you that might try to make them into negative things are an anathema to goodness and right. Paranoia, which you display towards the flag, and fear, which you spout concerning our place in history ....

are bad things.


Over the last several years, I've watched as more than 4,000 Americans have gotten their heads blown off in Iraq. Keep it up, and that kid will be one of them.

[Saint_]

So, because you don't agree with one war, you condemn an entire country and our entire history.

What about all the good America has done over the centuries?

Let Gordon Sinclair say if for me:

Americans: The Good Neighbors

"This Canadian thinks it is time to speak up for the Americans as the most

generous and possibly the least appreciated people on all the earth.

Germany, Japan and, to a lesser extent, Britain and Italy were lifted out

of the debris of war by the Americans who poured in billions of dollars and

forgave other billions in debts. None of these countries is today paying

even the interest on its remaining debts to the United States.

When the franc was in danger of collapsing in 1956, it was the Americans who

propped it up, and their reward was to be insulted and swindled on the

streets of Paris. I was there. I saw it.

When earthquakes hit distant cities, it is the United States that hurries in

to help. This spring, 59 American communities were flattened by tornadoes.

Nobody helped.

The Marshall Plan and the Truman Policy pumped billions of dollars into

discouraged countries. Now newspapers in those countries are writing about

the decadent, warmongering Americans. I'd like to see just one of those

countries that is gloating over the erosion of the United States dollar

build its own airplane. Does any other country in the world have a plane to

equal the Boeing Jumbo Jet, the Lockheed Tri-Star, or the Douglas 10? If

so, why don't they fly them? Why do all the International lines except

Russia fly American Planes?

Why does no other land on earth even consider putting a man or woman on the

moon? You talk about Japanese technocracy, and you get radios. You talk

about German technocracy, and you get automobiles. You talk about American

technocracy, and you find men on the moon - not once, but several times and

safely home again.

You talk about scandals, and the Americans put theirs right in the store

window for everybody to look at . Even their draft-dodgers are not pursued

and hounded. They are here on our streets, and most of them, unless they

are breaking Canadian laws, are getting American dollars from ma and pa at

home to spend here.

When the railways of France, Germany and India were breaking down through

age, it was the Americans who rebuilt them. When the Pennsylvania Railroad

and the New York Central went broke, nobody loaned them an old caboose. Both

are still broke.

I can name you 5000 times when the Americans raced to the help of other

people in trouble. Can you name me even one time when someone else raced to

the Americans in trouble? I don't think there was outside help even during

the San Francisco earthquake. Our neighbors have faced it alone, and I'm

one Canadian who is damned tired of hearing them get kicked around. They

will come out of this thing with their flag high. And when they do, they

are entitled to thumb their nose at the lands that are gloating over their

present troubles. I hope Canada is not one of those."

Stand proud, Americans!

[Raven]

Saint_;1309455 wrote: So, because you don't agree with one war, you condemn an entire country and our entire history.



What about all the good America has done over the centuries?



Let Gordon Sinclair say if for me:



Americans: The Good Neighbors



"This Canadian thinks it is time to speak up for the Americans as the most

generous and possibly the least appreciated people on all the earth.

Germany, Japan and, to a lesser extent, Britain and Italy were lifted out

of the debris of war by the Americans who poured in billions of dollars and

forgave other billions in debts. None of these countries is today paying

even the interest on its remaining debts to the United States.



When the franc was in danger of collapsing in 1956, it was the Americans who

propped it up, and their reward was to be insulted and swindled on the

streets of Paris. I was there. I saw it.



When earthquakes hit distant cities, it is the United States that hurries in

to help. This spring, 59 American communities were flattened by tornadoes.

Nobody helped.



The Marshall Plan and the Truman Policy pumped billions of dollars into

discouraged countries. Now newspapers in those countries are writing about

the decadent, warmongering Americans. I'd like to see just one of those

countries that is gloating over the erosion of the United States dollar

build its own airplane. Does any other country in the world have a plane to

equal the Boeing Jumbo Jet, the Lockheed Tri-Star, or the Douglas 10? If

so, why don't they fly them? Why do all the International lines except

Russia fly American Planes?



Why does no other land on earth even consider putting a man or woman on the

moon? You talk about Japanese technocracy, and you get radios. You talk

about German technocracy, and you get automobiles. You talk about American

technocracy, and you find men on the moon - not once, but several times and

safely home again.



You talk about scandals, and the Americans put theirs right in the store

window for everybody to look at . Even their draft-dodgers are not pursued

and hounded. They are here on our streets, and most of them, unless they

are breaking Canadian laws, are getting American dollars from ma and pa at

home to spend here.



When the railways of France, Germany and India were breaking down through

age, it was the Americans who rebuilt them. When the Pennsylvania Railroad

and the New York Central went broke, nobody loaned them an old caboose. Both

are still broke.



I can name you 5000 times when the Americans raced to the help of other

people in trouble. Can you name me even one time when someone else raced to

the Americans in trouble? I don't think there was outside help even during

the San Francisco earthquake. Our neighbors have faced it alone, and I'm

one Canadian who is damned tired of hearing them get kicked around. They

will come out of this thing with their flag high. And when they do, they

are entitled to thumb their nose at the lands that are gloating over their

present troubles. I hope Canada is not one of those."



Stand proud, Americans!
But that is precisley what makes us Americans! Who needs thanks for doing good deeds and showing compassion? Not me, mate! I answer to a higher authority. Most Americans do.

[Saint_]

Raven;1309462 wrote: But that is precisley what makes us Americans! Who needs thanks for doing good deeds and showing compassion? Not me, mate! I answer to a higher authority. Most Americans do.


That's the way I feel too! But it is nice to hear others say it once in a while!:D

[yaaarrrgg]

Saint_;1309455 wrote: So, because you don't agree with one war, you condemn an entire country and our entire history.

What about all the good America has done over the centuries?




It's not just one war, but the general trending of the military-industrial-complex that Eisenhower warned about. We've averaged one war per GOP administration as of late.

[Raven]

Saint_;1309482 wrote: That's the way I feel too! But it is nice to hear others say it once in a while!:D
I am quite proud of being an American. While acknowledging our hands are bloody too, we have also done some incredible good as well. We are capable of so much, yet we often stumble. We are at our best when facing impossible odds.

[Saint_]

yaaarrrgg;1309485 wrote: We've averaged one war per GOP administration as of late.


Damn. You got me that time....

[Saint_]

Raven;1309493 wrote: I am quite proud of being an American. While acknowledging our hands are bloody too, we have also done some incredible good as well. We are capable of so much, yet we often stumble. We are at our best when facing impossible odds.


One of my friends told me, "The thing that is great about America is that, like other countries we make mistakes, but unlike other countries, we drag ours out into the light and work on them."

(See: Clinton Impeachment.)

[Bryn Mawr]

Saint_;1309503 wrote: One of my friends told me, "The thing that is great about America is that, like other countries we make mistakes, but unlike other countries, we drag ours out into the light and work on them."

(See: Clinton Impeachment.)


Sometimes.

Sometimes not :-

BBC News - Red Cross confirms 'second jail' at Bagram, Afghanistan

Unless caught, that is.

In response to these allegations, Vice Adm Robert Harward, in charge of US detentions in Afghanistan, denied the existence of such a facility or abuses.

[Saint_]

Actually, Bryn, you prove my point. Abu Graib was a secret jail, but when it came out, there were all kinds of investigations, trials, punishments, and press.

Same thing here. When we screw up, even when it's secret and gets found out suddenly, we deal with it openly. It's only a matter of time until this particular situation is dealt with.

[Bryn Mawr]

Saint_;1309510 wrote: Actually, Bryn, you prove my point. Abu Graib was a secret jail, but when it came out, there were all kinds of investigations, trials, punishments, and press.

Same thing here. When we screw up, even when it's secret and gets found out suddenly, we deal with it openly. It's only a matter of time until this particular situation is dealt with.


Better not to have the squalid secrets in the first place

[Saint_]

Bryn Mawr;1309511 wrote: Better not to have the squalid secrets in the first place


How absolutely true, but no modern government has been able to do something like that. (It may not even be possible for mankind to HAVE a government that doesn't try to keep secrets, possibly for the population's well-being)

So at least we have a society that will admit to wrongdoing when caught and try to fix things.

[K.Snyder]

spot;1309324 wrote: I suggest the teacher's been misquoted. Instead of saying of the flag and commentary 'You can’t draw that – that’s offensive’ she may well have actually said 'You can’t draw! That – that’s offensive!’, in which case she was definitely defending Old Glory and not attacking it.


She'd have done so at the expense of scarring that child for quite some time and the sad part is that would be a "better alternative" in the minds of some I've witnessed

[K.Snyder]

G#Gill;1309342 wrote: It seems the matter has been sorted now to mutual satisfaction. I suspect the teacher was originally referring to the fact that words were written on the picture of the flag - defacing the nation's flag. That is offensive. Similarly in England when people brandish the St. George's flag with 'England' emblazoned across the middle of it - that is in fact defacing the flag. I always thought it strange that 'England' should be written on our country's flag, like it has to be advertised that the flag of St. George is in fact the flag of England!!!!! I'm just waiting for the 'Union' flag to have England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland written on it ! I don't think there will be enough room for all those letters :wah:


People are so used to drooling over their own flag they confuse England's flag with the Red Cross albeit one of ill proportion in reference to "cross" in the context of "Red Cross"