What's happening to FG?

farmer giles · Post by **farmer giles** » Sun May 31, 2009 8:21 am

Nomad;1197254 wrote: I have to be me.

its great that you are you

:)

i dont really know how to get on with people all i can do is be me ,a laugh a joke a very occasional spout about something i probably should probably avoid and thats it

Swimming maggie · Post by **Swimming maggie** » Sun May 31, 2009 11:40 am

It could be that most of us Brits are out in the garden enjoying the sunshine whilst its here, because in this country you never know when you might see it again, so we make the most of it whilst we can:wah:

AussiePam · Post by **AussiePam** » Sun May 31, 2009 8:44 pm

You ask a very good question, my friend Kathy - and a serious one which deserves a serious answer. I think something has very definitely changed over the last few years - and that this is not just a reflection of the normal internet ebb and flow, or of the seasons of the year. People have given you a range of answers. This is my take, and I hope readers of your thread will consider the input, and not just attack the person expressing the view.

I think FG has been dumbed down.

Where's the spark, the vitality, the meaty issues to explore, the though provoking snippets to take away and chew on, the witty verbal sword play, the intelligent conversation??

I think we have lost most of the colourful but risky posters who made the place vibrant and alive. We have become a forum of inconsequential feel good fluff threads, word games, mindless chatter. Fine in themselves, but ....

We have been over-sanitised and over-feminised.

Current events are now quoted gossip snippets from the tabloid press. Politics and religion tend now to be personal explanations from one-issue obsessives. We don't discuss things let alone debate them. People give opinions, get attacked or ignored, readers have emotional not logical responses or wander off into their own often unrelated agendas, and in the end, to harmonise our interactions, someone always comes in and swamps the inevitable brawls and hurt feelings with flowers and smiley emoticons.

I'm not having a go at any individual fellow Gardeners, and willingly include my own timidity in the face of online slings and arrows in the culpability pool.

I think our current state has come about for a number of reasons and the American/UK polarisation a while back didn't help. Our squabbles now seem to be girly ones behind the scenes over possible slights - not robust differences of opinion valiantly defended up front. Are we over-moderated, too, for the sake of marshmallow peace?

We've somehow reduced ourselves to the lowest common denominator.

This is a big Forum - yet we seem to be drowning in the posts of a few predictable mega-posters. Our diversity has been overwhelmed.

Maybe none of this matters. Maybe the demographics the advertising part of the site is interested in are exactly what's here now? This may also explain Lon's question about keeping politics etc off the Today's Posts list - which is what many of us first go to when we open FG. And anyway, there are a whole lot of really nice and fine people in ForumGarden.

So all's right with the world....

Isn't it????

Lon · Post by **Lon** » Sun May 31, 2009 9:14 pm

AussiePam;1197645 wrote:

I think FG has been dumbed down.

That's an understatement.

Nomad · Post by **Nomad** » Sun May 31, 2009 9:34 pm

Lon;1197652 wrote:

I think FG has been dumbed down.

That's an understatement.

Im not being sarcastic Lon, Im really not but am I to assume when you post threads like whats your favorite small appliance its out of contempt, are you smirking that people actually reply or what ?

Im confused.

Nomad · Post by **Nomad** » Sun May 31, 2009 9:39 pm

Sunshine;1194879 wrote: Nomad, didn't your mother ever teach you that if you can't say something nice, don't say anything at all?

Sunshine Im sure your a nice person and all but you also sound like a prude.

Relax Im not out to hurt anyone. If you dont care for me thats fine by me but your beginning to annoy me with your holier than though comments. Its a forum that ranges from super squeaky clean to Nomad on the other end of the spectrum and everything in between. Tolerance is essential, if Im that offensive block me out and spare yourself the aggravation.

Lon · Post by **Lon** » Sun May 31, 2009 9:42 pm

Nomad;1197655 wrote:

Im not being sarcastic Lon, Im really not but am I to assume when you post threads like whats your favorite small appliance its out of contempt, are you smirking that people actually reply or what ?

Im confused.

No. I'm attempting to appeal to the intellectual capabilities of some posters in the hope of upgrading the threads. I guess what we have all had for dinner is more to the general appeal. So be it.

Nomad · Post by **Nomad** » Sun May 31, 2009 9:51 pm

Lon;1197659 wrote:

No. I'm attempting to appeal to the intellectual capabilities of some posters in the hope of upgrading the threads. I guess what we have all had for dinner is more to the general appeal. So be it.

Then why the disparity between asking for intellectual challenges and posting about appliances ?

Seriously Lon Im not getting on you or making judgements, I like you immensely but Im trying to understand if its all or nothing. Surely theres room for silliness as well as serious debate isnt there ?

Lon · Post by **Lon** » Sun May 31, 2009 10:01 pm

Nomad;1197660 wrote:

Then why the disparity between asking for intellectual challenges and posting about appliances ?

Seriously Lon Im not getting on you or making judgements, I like you immensely but Im trying to understand if its all or nothing. Surely theres room for silliness as well as serious debate isnt there ?

There certainly is room for silliness and I have been a party to some of it, however there has been in my view a over abundance of crap postings, particularly stupid or silly responses to someones serious post or just changing the subject of the thread entirely.

Odie · Post by **Odie** » Sun May 31, 2009 10:14 pm

Lon;1197659 wrote:

No. I'm attempting to appeal to the intellectual capabilities of some posters in the hope of upgrading the threads. I guess what we have all had for dinner is more to the general appeal. So be it.

some of us have a blast on that thread, and that's what it's all about.....having fun...

it also eases tensions away that everyone has in real life.

what about your thread, what is your favorite small appliance?

We all have our favorites threads.....but lately some are continually being harassed, including snide remarks on their own threads...

.....when you just want to share your day....bang....its totally ruined and trashed........and completely off topic!

Nomad · Post by **Nomad** » Sun May 31, 2009 10:21 pm

Lon;1197664 wrote:

There certainly is room for silliness and I have been a party to some of it, however there has been in my view a over abundance of crap postings, particularly stupid or silly responses to someones serious post or just changing the subject of the thread entirely.

Ok I understand but whats crap to you may not be to another. I come to unwind and goof. I am seriously guilty of popping in threads and throwing them off track though. I can change that. No problem, consider it done.

Odie · Post by **Odie** » Sun May 31, 2009 10:35 pm

Nomad;1197668 wrote:

Ok I understand but whats crap to you may not be to another. I come to unwind and goof. I am seriously guilty of popping in threads and throwing them off track though. I can change that. No problem, consider it done.

but when you take threads off topic, its funny and that's the way it should be.

and you never mean any harm....

everyone will always go off topic here and there....its just normal, we all do it, myself included.

my god, I love your sense of humor.......when I understand it!:yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl

Carolly · Post by **Carolly** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 1:49 am

valentine;1197714 wrote:

Well, you pretty much described me. Cool.

For the record Valentine I know for a fact that Pam believes your a very nice person and no she wasn't descibing you for one minute and please dont think she was.Pams one lovely lady behind that screen and knows another one even with just typed words believe me like many of us can;)

Post by **Betty Boop** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 2:06 am

This has been a constant question since I joined in 2004. The only difference being is that the people asking the question change.

It's almost like people want to apportion blame to individuals for FG not being the way they want it to be.

Everyone here posting is responsible for whats going on in here. If you don't like certain topics or threads create your own, or dig up some old ones you'd like to re-hash.

If you can't stand the heat then stay out of the religious and political threads.

If you want fluff then stay in the fluff and above all will everyone quit being so hyper sensitive and reading things into posts that are not there.

People get offended and assume posts are about them personally, rise above it and walk away, feel sorry for the one trying to provoke a reaction, they obviously have nothing better to do!

Carolly · Post by **Carolly** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 2:22 am

valentine;1197721 wrote: I'm sure she is Carol. For better or worse, most of what she wrote is me and why I joined.

Doesn't matter. Thank you Carol. :)Now remember why you told me you became a supporting member and dont let things get to you ok;)You have lots to offer and I wish you wouldnt knock yourself as we all get knocked and yes sometimes it hurts if your not hard skinned like some but we all are different and thank goodness we are.BB is right of course about only going on Threads where we feel we are not going to get upset....its hard as I have come to learn at times but is the only way to make your time on here enjoyable.You have alot to offer Valentine as I said;)

farmer giles · Post by **farmer giles** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 3:04 am

what happened to FG i can sum it up in one word .....OSCAR :yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl

remember the good old days pinky ,hammy ,yzgi had the odd joke that you had only heard about a dozen times :yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl

it used to be a funny place where not even the off topic thread stayed off topic

thats the trouble if people dont talk about what you want to talk you end up in threads where really you are on a hiding to nothing if you enter them you annoy the hell outa folks if you dont then you have no one to talk to :sneaky: or you can take them off topic :yh_rotfl

i stay here coz you guys have been here with me through thick and thin :-4 there will be a day when some funny people join or yzgi gets a new joke and on that great day ole jimbo will laugh again

:D

Swimming maggie · Post by **Swimming maggie** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 3:09 am

Betty Boop;1197719 wrote: This has been a constant question since I joined in 2004. The only difference being is that the people asking the question change.

It's almost like people want to apportion blame to individuals for FG not being the way they want it to be.

Everyone here posting is responsible for whats going on in here. If you don't like certain topics or threads create your own, or dig up some old ones you'd like to re-hash.

If you can't stand the heat then stay out of the religious and political threads.

If you want fluff then stay in the fluff and above all will everyone quit being so hyper sensitive and reading things into posts that are not there.

People get offended and assume posts are about them personally, rise above it and walk away, feel sorry for the one trying to provoke a reaction, they obviously have nothing better to do!

Well said Betty:)

farmer giles · Post by **farmer giles** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 3:11 am

Betty Boop;1197719 wrote: This has been a constant question since I joined in 2004. The only difference being is that the people asking the question change.

It's almost like people want to apportion blame to individuals for FG not being the way they want it to be.

Everyone here posting is responsible for whats going on in here. If you don't like certain topics or threads create your own, or dig up some old ones you'd like to re-hash.

If you can't stand the heat then stay out of the religious and political threads.

If you want fluff then stay in the fluff and above all will everyone quit being so hyper sensitive and reading things into posts that are not there.

People get offended and assume posts are about them personally, rise above it and walk away, feel sorry for the one trying to provoke a reaction, they obviously have nothing better to do!

you are talking about me there i just know it

Bill Sikes · Post by **Bill Sikes** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 5:43 am

buttercup;1194920 wrote: I dont know if its the same as what i believe but i'm willing to stick my neck out and say - Its dull

Needs an injection of contriversial stuff for a good ole bitch. If its fluffy fluffy it will die out. Probably nobody wants to believe that either but the proof is in the ratings of the bitchy threads, more posts and views than any other.

It's impossible to say anything provocative, or even mildly insulting. If you do, you will be censured. In the "old" days, this would only happen for continual and extreme anti-social behaviour - I can only remember three or so people being slung out, and I disagreed with the slinging of one of these.

Not so much controvertial stuff, because it's impossible to get fired up about it, for fear of being reported/got at.

Too much "fluffy fluffy stuff". Yerch.

The old "Private Messaging". I try to avoid using it. Sneaky whispers behing people's backs.

Too many "Word Games". How I *wish* I could "filter by forum".

All this leads to somewhat stodgy conversation, and lack of repartee - IMO.

kazalala · Post by **kazalala** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 7:02 am

Betty Boop;1197719 wrote: This has been a constant question since I joined in 2004. The only difference being is that the people asking the question change.

It's almost like people want to apportion blame to individuals for FG not being the way they want it to be.

Everyone here posting is responsible for whats going on in here. If you don't like certain topics or threads create your own, or dig up some old ones you'd like to re-hash.

If you can't stand the heat then stay out of the religious and political threads.

If you want fluff then stay in the fluff and above all will everyone quit being so hyper sensitive and reading things into posts that are not there.

People get offended and assume posts are about them personally, rise above it and walk away, feel sorry for the one trying to provoke a reaction, they obviously have nothing better to do!

Yes! i agree with that,, and also ,, the people here not posting sometimes too:sneaky::)

Bill Sikes;1197788 wrote: It's impossible to say anything provocative, or even mildly insulting. If you do, you will be censured. In the "old" days, this would only happen for continual and extreme anti-social behaviour - I can only remember three or so people being slung out, and I disagreed with the slinging of one of these.

Not so much controvertial stuff, because it's impossible to get fired up about it, for fear of being reported/got at.

Too much "fluffy fluffy stuff". Yerch.

The old "Private Messaging". I try to avoid using it. Sneaky whispers behing people's backs.

Too many "Word Games". How I *wish* I could "filter by forum".

All this leads to somewhat stodgy conversation, and lack of repartee - IMO.
why would you want ot be insulting? theres no need even in a strong debate:-3

Nomad;1197668 wrote: Ok I understand but whats crap to you may not be to another. I come to unwind and goof. I am seriously guilty of popping in threads and throwing them off track though. I can change that. No problem, consider it done.
Dont you dare!

-1

Odie · Post by **Odie** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 7:07 am

when snide remarks are directed at you in threads, and yes we do know when it is for us ......its just not that easy or simple just to walk away........

your feelings get hurt.:-1

then the angry at just the 'thought of those posts?'......you then have to just get off fg.....for awhile.:-5:-5

Lon · Post by **Lon** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 7:48 am

[quote=Odie;1197666]some of us have a blast on that thread, and that's what it's all about.....having fun...

it also eases tensions away that everyone has in real life.

what about your thread, what is your favorite small appliance?

This is part of the problem Odie----people are having so much fun they don't really bother to read the posts throughly. When I started the post I said what my favorite small appliance is.

Bill Sikes · Post by **Bill Sikes** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 8:15 am

kazalala;1197810 wrote: why would you want ot be insulting? theres B]no need even in a strong debate : -3

It's part of normal life and conversation. If normal life and conversation is reduced to "a debate", it gets very, very boring and colourless, so people drop out of FG. I don't actually *want* to be "insulting" (note, I in fact used the word "mildly" in my post). However, a degree of latitude is *absolutely essential* in any normality. FG these days certainly lacks spark.

kazalala · Post by **kazalala** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 8:25 am

Bill Sikes;1197846 wrote: It's part of normal life and conversation. If normal life and conversation is reduced to "a debate", it gets very, very boring and colourless, so people drop out of FG. I don't actually *want* to be "insulting" (note, I in fact used the word "mildly" in my post). However, a degree of latitude is *absolutely essential* in any normality. FG these days certainly lacks spark.

Im not sure i understand exactly what you mean Bill

do you mean its part of normal life to be insulting? albeit mildy?

I dont think it is,, but then again thats my opinion. I happen to think it is completely unneccassary to be insulting to anyone however mildly. I have been very interested in some debates on here ,, and even managed to join in a few, and i find the bits where it gets too heated and personal insults and offensiveness start to come in to it uncomfortable and dissapointing to be honest.

I understand that some people may find it boring without the rows... as thats what they find interesting, but it cant be true of all people, and there are plenty of different people from all walks of life on this forum.

kazalala · Post by **kazalala** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 8:27 am

Surely people can have an interesting discussion without it having to result in rows and insults?

Odie · Post by **Odie** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 8:56 am

Lon;1197834 wrote: [quote=Odie;1197666]some of us have a blast on that thread, and that's what it's all about.....having fun...

it also eases tensions away that everyone has in real life.

what about your thread, what is your favorite small appliance?

This is part of the problem Odie----people are having so much fun they don't really bother to read the posts throughly. When I started the post I said what my favorite small appliance is.

Oh I do know that Lon, as I did read it.

then some read posts.....but only the first line.....and jump in with things that don't even belong there, and are on a totally different subject of their own....what he heck is that? -----They seem to just wanna post, get it over with and go on to the next thread....and do the same there and its done over and over and over.

Odie · Post by **Odie** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 8:58 am

kazalala;1197850 wrote: Surely people can have an interesting discussion without it having to result in rows and insults?

one would think.

but not anymore.

flopstock · Post by **flopstock** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 9:03 am

Bill Sikes;1197788 wrote: It's impossible to say anything provocative, or even mildly insulting. If you do, you will be censured. In the "old" days, this would only happen for continual and extreme anti-social behaviour - I can only remember three or so people being slung out, and I disagreed with the slinging of one of these.

Not so much controvertial stuff, because it's impossible to get fired up about it, for fear of being reported/got at.

Too much "fluffy fluffy stuff". Yerch.

The old "Private Messaging". I try to avoid using it. Sneaky whispers behing people's backs.

Too many "Word Games". How I *wish* I could "filter by forum".

All this leads to somewhat stodgy conversation, and lack of repartee - IMO.

I've always enjoy reading you and yet I seldom agree with much you say.

As for folks being slung out, aside from spammers, you have to be really really annoying to get the boot, even for a short period of time. Quite often you'll find that folks who have crossed the line repeatedly, get their hand slapped and take a break to regroup. There is the mistaken impression that they are shown the door. As a moderator, I don't care if they stay or go, so long as I quit being pulled in to moderate their crap de jour..

I agree on the fluff, with the noted exception of my 'Jon and Kate' thread last week...:p

I only annoy folks when I go into games, because I generally don't bother to read the rules and always think I have a clue regardless..

But I agree they don't need to be front and center.. gives the impression that is all there is here somedays..

I don't PM. When folks see a PM from me they generally assume bad news is to follow... perhaps you and I could start our own little gossip tree?:sneaky:

Lon · Post by **Lon** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 9:12 am

Part of the problem is cultural. Not all, but many Americans are confrontational, like to argue, raise their voices, get in your face. If you have traveled as much as I have you notice the difference right off.

Just look at the differences between UK, Australian and New Zealand News Presenters. You very seldom hear them getting excited, raising their voices, confronting etc. It's just not British. People have posted things to me on FG that would upset many. Believe me, it slides right off my back and I could care less. I have been needled, insulted, criticized and pilloried by some of the best.

Post by **Betty Boop** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 9:14 am

Lon;1197872 wrote: Part of the problem is cultural. Not all, but many Americans are confrontational, like to argue, raise their voices, get in your face. If you have traveled as much as I have you notice the difference right off.

Just look at the differences between UK, Australian and New Zealand News Presenters. You very seldom hear them getting excited, raising their voices, confronting etc. It's just not British. People have posted things to me on FG that would upset many. Believe me, it slides right off my back and I could care less. I have been needled, insulted, criticized and pilloried by some of the best.

You have, and I admire the way you walk on by :-6

kazalala · Post by **kazalala** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 9:19 am

Part of the problem is cultural. Not all, but many Americans are confrontational, like to argue, raise their voices, get in your face. If you have traveled as much as I have you notice the difference right off.

Just look at the differences between UK, Australian and New Zealand News Presenters. You very seldom hear them getting excited, raising their voices, confronting etc. It's just not British. People have posted things to me on FG that would upset many. Believe me, it slides right off my back and I could care less. I have been needled, insulted, criticized and pilloried by some of the best.

well i agree that sometimes differnt cultures are of course different in the way they see things, handle things,, etc etc ,, but also sometimes its just a case of people,,, no matter where you live people are different,, not all british are the same and talk the same or behave the same,, not all Americans are the same and talk the same , behave the same ,, not all Australians,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, you get the gist:wah: i think its sort of pigeon holing people to just lump them together as a country

I havent exactly travelled all over the world,, but living at S.H.A.P.E in Belguim for 3 years meant i got to live among a few differnt nationalities,,, British and American being two of them:D

flopstock · Post by **flopstock** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 9:20 am

Nomad;1197668 wrote: Ok I understand but whats crap to you may not be to another. I come to unwind and goof. I am seriously guilty of popping in threads and throwing them off track though. I can change that. No problem, consider it done.

Here's what I was going to post before I decided you might be serious..aint saying where..

Was it pink? Did it stand and stare off into the distance for what seemed like days on end? Was it able to balance on one leg, seemingly effortlessly? Did you notice it seemed to have lots of family living in the yards of the old folks in the neighborhood? Yep, definitely a peacock...

Then I thought better of it..

Post by **Bryn Mawr** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 12:18 pm

Bill Sikes;1197846 wrote: It's part of normal life and conversation. If normal life and conversation is reduced to "a debate", it gets very, very boring and colourless, so people drop out of FG. I don't actually *want* to be "insulting" (note, I in fact used the word "mildly" in my post). However, a degree of latitude is *absolutely essential* in any normality. FG these days certainly lacks spark.

As I recall, the last bout of members dropping out of FG was blamed on people trying to debate the state of the world and the retirees feeling insulted - that appeared to be the start of this quiet phase.

BTW - go into the Forums page and double click on the balloon to the left of the forums you dislike to mark it as read. For sub-forums like Word Games double click on the small square to the left of the name.

Mutley · Post by **Mutley** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 12:30 pm

AussiePam;1197645 wrote:

I think FG has been dumbed down.

Where's the spark, the vitality, the meaty issues to explore, the though provoking snippets to take away and chew on, the witty verbal sword play, the intelligent conversation??

I think we have lost most of the colourful but risky posters who made the place vibrant and alive. We have become a forum of inconsequential feel good fluff threads, word games, mindless chatter. Fine in themselves, but ....

I miss the colourful but risky posters (won't name any of them for the sake of peace - PINKY - ahem sorry about that)

Sometimes a bit or colour and risk is fun although I admit it can also cause a lot of hassle at times or should that be it can cause a riot of posting and opinions?

People come and people go. Look at me for example! I have been snooping here for months and months and only recently started posting again. Maybe I feel that the hoohah over my leaving has died down or maybe I just missed everybody!

FG is safe. It won't be going anywhere because of the people who are members here. Too much love has gone into this forum for it ever to shut down. :-4

YZGI · Post by **YZGI** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 1:22 pm

[quote=farmer giles;1197738]what happened to FG i can sum it up in one word .....OSCAR :yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl

remember the good old days pinky ,hammy ,yzgi had the odd joke that you had only heard about a dozen times :yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl

it used to be a funny place where not even the off topic thread stayed off topic

thats the trouble if people dont talk about what you want to talk you end up in threads where really you are on a hiding to nothing if you enter them you annoy the hell outa folks if you dont then you have no one to talk to :sneaky: or you can take them off topic :yh_rotfl

i stay here coz you guys have been here with me through thick and thin :-4 there will be a day when some funny people join or yzgi gets a new joke and on that great day ole jimbo will laugh again

:D[/quote]

No new jokes yet jimbo, I have just come back from a 10 day vacation 7 of which were on a boat in the middle of the Caribbean sea. I could have done some Jamaican jokes after being there but then they probably aren't PC enough and you know how it goes around here anymore when the one offended person thinks someone is being racist or bigoted.

flopstock · Post by **flopstock** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 1:52 pm

YZGI;1198030 wrote:

No new jokes yet jimbo, I have just come back from a 10 day vacation 7 of which were on a boat in the middle of the Caribbean sea. I could have done some Jamaican jokes after being there but then they probably aren't PC enough and you know how it goes around here anymore when the one offended person thinks someone is being racist or bigoted.
For all that everyone complains about racist or bigoted remarks, have you ever noticed that on the rare occasions that we actually get some wad in here spouting off, everyone tends to defend our turf, in mass.

I've only ever felt like smacking someone for daring to judge a man on his heritage once in here and it took me a bit to even get that there was anyone dumb enough to still use that kind of thing as the measure of a man.

The folks I like and care about may be idiots, but I like to think they work hard at it and haven't had it handed to them through their dads jeans...

YZGI · Post by **YZGI** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 2:07 pm

flopstock;1198043 wrote: For all that everyone complains about racist or bigoted remarks, have you ever noticed that on the rare occasions that we actually get some wad in here spouting off, everyone tends to defend our turf, in mass.

I've only ever felt like smacking someone for daring to judge a man on his heritage once in here and it took me a bit to even get that there was anyone dumb enough to still use that kind of thing as the measure of a man.

The folks I like and care about may be idiots, but I like to think they work hard at it and haven't had it handed to them through their dads jeans...

It's a tough life for the last great white male chavinist pig left..

Might be back later after I get the dishes washed and the toilets clean.

Odie · Post by **Odie** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 3:04 pm

YZGI;1198050 wrote: It's a tough life for the last great white male chavinist pig left..

Might be back later after I get the dishes washed and the toilets clean.

whoopee!

welcome home!:guitarist:guitarist

Bill Sikes · Post by **Bill Sikes** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 3:45 pm

kazalala;1197850 wrote: Surely people can have an interesting discussion without it having to result in rows and insults? thinking:

As FG is, or should be IMO, a microcosm of Real Life.... no. Rows and insults are not, of course, the norm - but they are part and parcel of the whole. In RL, if I say to someone "You stupid person, that's rubbish", or something minor like that, they'll argue the toss - here in FG, it's possible (for anyone, not just the "offended" party) to turn around and "report" someone, resulting in their censure, and there's nothing the "offender" can do about it. This is an artificial twisting of reality, which is not conducive to the wellbeing of the Garden (yes, I know that a wild excess of manure isn't, either - but this wasn't often seen, even in the "old days").

I must admit, I report "spammers" if it appears that they have not already been reported, and have once reported someone I think of as devious and underhand. That's all, AFAIR.

Odie · Post by **Odie** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 4:00 pm

Bill Sikes;1198116 wrote: As FG is, or should be IMO, a microcosm of Real Life.... no. Rows and insults are not, of course, the norm - but they are part and parcel of the whole. In RL, if I say to someone "You stupid person, that's rubbish", or something minor like that, they'll argue the toss - here in FG, it's possible (for anyone, not just the "offended" party) to turn around and "report" someone, resulting in their censure, and there's nothing the "offender" can do about it. This is an artificial twisting of reality, which is not conducive to the wellbeing of the Garden (yes, I know that a wild excess of manure isn't, either - but this wasn't often seen, even in the "old days").

I must admit, I report "spammers" if it appears that they have not already been reported, and have once reported someone I think of as devious and underhand. That's all, AFAIR.

I have never called anyone stupid in RL!

yup, devious and cruel spammers need to be reported.

ZAP · Post by **ZAP** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 7:14 pm

[QUOTE=AussiePam;1197645]You ask a very good question, my friend Kathy - and a serious one which deserves a serious answer. I think something has very definitely changed over the last few years - and that this is not just a reflection of the normal internet ebb and flow, or of the seasons of the year. People have given you a range of answers. This is my take, and I hope readers of your thread will consider the input, and not just attack the person expressing the view.

I think FG has been dumbed down.

Where's the spark, the vitality, the meaty issues to explore, the though provoking snippets to take away and chew on, the witty verbal sword play, the intelligent conversation??

I think we have lost most of the colourful but risky posters who made the place vibrant and alive. We have become a forum of inconsequential feel good fluff threads, word games, mindless chatter. Fine in themselves, but ...."

--Some of the brightest and best are no longer here.--

"I'm not having a go at any individual fellow Gardeners, and willingly include my own timidity in the face of online slings and arrows in the culpability pool. "

--Certainly one of the reasons I stayed away. It's safe in the "Games" You can't make too many enemies there.--

"This is a big Forum - yet we seem to be drowning in the posts of a few predictable mega-posters. Our diversity has been overwhelmed. "

-- But it's a great place to ask questions and get some really good info. I'm still overwhelmed by the size & content of FG.--

"So all's right with the world...."[/QUOTE

--Your posts make it a better world, Pam.--

AussiePam · Post by **AussiePam** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 8:39 pm

Interesting responses - and only to a small part of what I wrote - but a bit disappointing too. And illustrative of the issues to which I was trying to draw attention. My criticism was intended to be constructive, and was aimed at all of us collectively, not at any individual.

Vibrant does not equal insulting, racist, bullying or confrontational. It doesn't even equal impolite. And I don't in any way regret the absence of the one or two past members whose memberships were terminated by the management.

Personally, I very much enjoy lighthearted threads, and also chatting with friends - but balanced with sparky threads of substance.

I guess that the majority of current posters see no problem, are happy with things just as they are, and that Kathy's opening post was only a blue moment at a time of unusual forum inactivity.

I appreciate the opportunity to have my say. Thank you!!!

:-6

Post by **Sunshine** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 9:33 pm

Nomad;1197658 wrote: Sunshine Im sure your a nice person and all but you also sound like a prude.

Relax Im not out to hurt anyone. If you dont care for me thats fine by me but your beginning to annoy me with your holier than though comments. Its a forum that ranges from super squeaky clean to Nomad on the other end of the spectrum and everything in between. Tolerance is essential, if Im that offensive block me out and spare yourself the aggravation.
Nomad, I am far from a prude. I have read things that others have written that are far more insultive than I have ever written. I guess my sense of humor is different than yours and for that I'm not sure what can be done. I enjoy your comments and am sorry if I offended you. That was not my intention.

Truce?:yh_peace

Victoria · Post by **Victoria** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 11:18 pm

I like the cut and thrust of FG yes there are fluffy threads and some good serious ones where views from across the world and very diverse opinions can be aired.

It does get heated sometimes but thats to be expected on some of the more personal or emotional subjects.

So long as it doesnt slide into personal in fighting and insults beyond the realm of the thread its fine.

Odie · Post by **Odie** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 12:13 am

Victoria;1198234 wrote: I like the cut and thrust of FG yes there are fluffy threads and some good serious ones where views from across the world and very diverse opinions can be aired.

It does get heated sometimes but thats to be expected on some of the more personal or emotional subjects.

So long as it doesnt slide into personal in fighting and insults beyond the realm of the thread its fine.

I love the thrust of a good serious thread.:guitarist

I adore some funny ones, as they can keep you laughing all day as they just don't stop with humour.:yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl

I hate political threads as many take each others heads off.:-5:-5

and some are just a joke, meaning an actual joke...........and it just hysterical!:wah::wah:

but lately some do slide into personal and vindictive insults on threads, purposely, and right off topic .

kazalala · Post by **kazalala** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 1:54 am

Bill Sikes;1198116 wrote: As FG is, or should be IMO, a microcosm of Real Life.... no. Rows and insults are not, of course, the norm - but they are part and parcel of the whole. In RL, if I say to someone "You stupid person, that's rubbish", or something minor like that, they'll argue the toss - here in FG, it's possible (for anyone, not just the "offended" party) to turn around and "report" someone, resulting in their censure, and there's nothing the "offender" can do about it. This is an artificial twisting of reality, which is not conducive to the wellbeing of the Garden (yes, I know that a wild excess of manure isn't, either - but this wasn't often seen, even in the "old days").

I must admit, I report "spammers" if it appears that they have not already been reported, and have once reported someone I think of as devious and underhand. That's all, AFAIR.
Yes i agree in real life there are rows and insults etc,,, i am probably too idealistic to think we can discuss without it

Myself i try very hard not to do it just because i disagree,, even strongly disagree,, even when i am thinking omg you stupid person!:wah: but i wouldnt say to that person you are stupid.. to me thats not neccessary or constructive,, it does'nt achieve anything other than hurt a persons feelings (maybe

).

As for reporting, so far i havent reported anyone,, i have felt like it sometimes but funnily not for anything directed towards myself. If i feel someone is being rude or offensive to me i usually try to tell them that myself, but still i try not to call them names,, i keep saying try because im not a saint of course and have probably failed at times:wah: But i do think we need the mods and the report button, as, the same as in real life, some people would only get worse the more they are allowed to get away with:sneaky: also it may be an artificial twisting of reality,,, but surely then so is a debating contest,,, where there are rules set out ,,, the teams or members would have to debate in a polite and civil manner,,, there are always rules to follow wherever you go for the most part,, you know the rules on FG so keep them in mind when posting.. its simple. you obviously know you can get into trouble for name calling etc,, so dont do it! Im sure you can still make your point regardless:)

AussiePam;1198207 wrote: Interesting responses - and only to a small part of what I wrote - but a bit disappointing too. And illustrative of the issues to which I was trying to draw attention. My criticism was intended to be constructive, and was aimed at all of us collectively, not at any individual.

Vibrant does not equal insulting, racist, bullying or confrontational. It doesn't even equal impolite. And I don't in any way regret the absence of the one or two past members whose memberships were terminated by the management.

Personally, I very much enjoy lighthearted threads, and also chatting with friends - but balanced with sparky threads of substance.

I guess that the majority of current posters see no problem, are happy with things just as they are, and that Kathy's opening post was only a blue moment at a time of unusual forum inactivity.

I appreciate the opportunity to have my say. Thank you!!!

:-6
me too Pam:D i do like the silly or chatty threads mainly,,, but i often venture in to a more "grown up" conversation ,, and some i do thouroughly enjoy as long as we stay civil.. i do like to find out about people and what their views are ,, and why? yes im the nosiest person on the planet:yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl

minks · Post by **minks** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 11:06 am

Hmmm well I think so much contributes to the FG feel of late.

We have lost some key members who brought spark to the garden sadly.

We have been put under the thumb of mods in their attempt to make the garden PC and amicable (I think I have that word right... friendly and polite)

There is no controversy and let's face it controversy sells, but because feelings got hurt, and toes stepped upon, controversy has been removed from FG.

Mods I am not blaming you I see where you are going with this... you are doing what you all believe is best for everybody and your efforts have always been for the greater good of the garden.

And I think us members have led the parade to make FG this way because when things get "sticky" many run to the mods.

It appears we are not always going to be happy with the mood of FG.

We can't please everybody sadly.

Just my opinion and I mean no offense but think of the members who have left or post less frequent and check the mood and check why they left or post less often.... they got tired of being micromanaged by everybody and the loss of that freedom made many change or leave.

Again Mods you do a fine job and it's gotta be tough determining what this lot wants.

Please again understand I mean no offence.

Post by **Betty Boop** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 11:53 am

minks;1198421 wrote: Hmmm well I think so much contributes to the FG feel of late.

We have lost some key members who brought spark to the garden sadly.

We have been put under the thumb of mods in their attempt to make the garden PC and amicable (I think I have that word right... friendly and polite)

There is no controversy and let's face it controversy sells, but because feelings got hurt, and toes stepped upon, controversy has been removed from FG.

Mods I am not blaming you I see where you are going with this... you are doing what you all believe is best for everybody and your efforts have always been for the greater good of the garden.

And I think us members have led the parade to make FG this way because when things get "sticky" many run to the mods.

It appears we are not always going to be happy with the mood of FG.

We can't please everybody sadly.

Just my opinion and I mean no offense but think of the members who have left or post less frequent and check the mood and check why they left or post less often.... they got tired of being micromanaged by everybody and the loss of that freedom made many change or leave.

Again Mods you do a fine job and it's gotta be tough determining what this lot wants.

Please again understand I mean no offence.

None taken and as a mod I would like to say that I volunteered to be a mod to keep FG lightly moderated, I'd far rather people moderated themselves! :-6

flopstock · Post by **flopstock** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 12:33 pm

Betty Boop;1198474 wrote: None taken and as a mod I would like to say that I volunteered to be a mod to keep FG lightly moderated, I'd far rather people moderated themselves! :-6

I agree. When folks bicker in threads about the thread topic, I enjoy it. I'm watching one at this very moment with more interest then I have experienced in a while here. and I haven't posted a word into it..

of course, I haven't wandered back for about an hour, so probably all hell has broken loose... one can only hope..:sneaky::D

Post by **Betty Boop** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 12:35 pm

flopstock;1198512 wrote: I agree. When folks bicker in threads about the thread topic, I enjoy it. I'm watching one at this very moment with more interest then I have experienced in a while here. and I haven't posted a word into it..

of course, I haven't wandered back for about an hour, so probably all hell has broken loose... one can only hope..:sneaky::D

Shall we both take a look and then throw water bombs to cool it, sharp, short sudden tactics are the only thing that seems to work around here, then I can get back to more important things!