Muslim Demographics
Muslim Demographics
YouTube - Muslim Demographics
Muslim Demographics
I found the video was heavily loaded with terms to alarm the viewer. Are there any comparative figures for Christians and Jews? These would be useful to get a fuller picture of the situation.
Muslim Demographics
OpenMind;1182986 wrote: I found the video was heavily loaded with terms to alarm the viewer. Are there any comparative figures for Christians and Jews? These would be useful to get a fuller picture of the situation.
I was not alarmed, just found it interesting and curious about how others felt about it. I guess one could do a bit of research to determine if the stats as presented on the U Tube video are valid.
I was not alarmed, just found it interesting and curious about how others felt about it. I guess one could do a bit of research to determine if the stats as presented on the U Tube video are valid.
Muslim Demographics
Birth control by one demographic group has successfully made room for the growth of another.:rolleyes:
Schooling results in matriculation. Education is a process that changes the learner.
-
Swimming maggie
- Posts: 174
- Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2009 6:08 am
Muslim Demographics
Clint;1183071 wrote: Birth control by one demographic group has successfully made room for the growth of another.:rolleyes:
If the figures are correct then it is very disturbing:(
If the figures are correct then it is very disturbing:(
Muslim Demographics
Swimming maggie;1183085 wrote: If the figures are correct then it is very disturbing:(
Why?
Why?
-
Swimming maggie
- Posts: 174
- Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2009 6:08 am
Muslim Demographics
Lon;1183088 wrote: Why?
because people want to be able to practice their own religion and culture in their own country.
because people want to be able to practice their own religion and culture in their own country.
-
Oscar Namechange
- Posts: 31842
- Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:26 am
Muslim Demographics
Swimming maggie;1183085 wrote: If the figures are correct then it is very disturbing:(
What i find disturbing is that England has the highest teenage pregnancy figures in Europe. When you think that everyone of these teenagers will claim benifit and free housing until their child is 18 yrs old, that's providing they don't have more children and don't ever get a job, then this country will reach a point where it can not sustain the amounts of benifit we hand out. The old school workers and tax payers that sustain are getting older and retiring. There will come a day where we will need these teenage mothers to go out to work and pay their way....... i doubt very much that they will. Too many see benifit as a safety net but see it as a lifestyle. They think the country owes them a living and need do nothing in return for that giro.
What i find disturbing is that England has the highest teenage pregnancy figures in Europe. When you think that everyone of these teenagers will claim benifit and free housing until their child is 18 yrs old, that's providing they don't have more children and don't ever get a job, then this country will reach a point where it can not sustain the amounts of benifit we hand out. The old school workers and tax payers that sustain are getting older and retiring. There will come a day where we will need these teenage mothers to go out to work and pay their way....... i doubt very much that they will. Too many see benifit as a safety net but see it as a lifestyle. They think the country owes them a living and need do nothing in return for that giro.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Muslim Demographics
I would imagine that Jews are a lot more widespread around the globe than we think. They just don't particularly stand out from the crowd except on their religious celebrations.
I'm not sure about Christianity. It is very splintered into many factions now but that could just as easily mean there are a lot of Christians. Again, they mostly blend with people in general.
Who knows what to think but, in my mind, the video in the OP was designed to alert people against the spread of the Muslims. I agree, Lon, that I wasn't alarmed by it, but it's presentation appeared to be designed to alarm the viewer. In some countries, a Muslim can have up to four wives. That ups the ante a tad.
I'm not sure about Christianity. It is very splintered into many factions now but that could just as easily mean there are a lot of Christians. Again, they mostly blend with people in general.
Who knows what to think but, in my mind, the video in the OP was designed to alert people against the spread of the Muslims. I agree, Lon, that I wasn't alarmed by it, but it's presentation appeared to be designed to alarm the viewer. In some countries, a Muslim can have up to four wives. That ups the ante a tad.
-
Oscar Namechange
- Posts: 31842
- Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:26 am
Muslim Demographics
OpenMind;1183094 wrote: I would imagine that Jews are a lot more widespread around the globe than we think. They just don't particularly stand out from the crowd except on their religious celebrations.
I'm not sure about Christianity. It is very splintered into many factions now but that could just as easily mean there are a lot of Christians. Again, they mostly blend with people in general.
Who knows what to think but, in my mind, the video in the OP was designed to alert people against the spread of the Muslims. I agree, Lon, that I wasn't alarmed by it, but it's presentation appeared to be designed to alarm the viewer. In some countries, a Muslim can have up to four wives. That ups the ante a tad.
In the 60's. Enoch Powell predicted that by today, one tenth of England would be Muslim....... how right he was.
I'm not sure about Christianity. It is very splintered into many factions now but that could just as easily mean there are a lot of Christians. Again, they mostly blend with people in general.
Who knows what to think but, in my mind, the video in the OP was designed to alert people against the spread of the Muslims. I agree, Lon, that I wasn't alarmed by it, but it's presentation appeared to be designed to alarm the viewer. In some countries, a Muslim can have up to four wives. That ups the ante a tad.
In the 60's. Enoch Powell predicted that by today, one tenth of England would be Muslim....... how right he was.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Muslim Demographics
oscar;1183096 wrote: In the 60's. Enoch Powell predicted that by today, one tenth of England would be Muslim....... how right he was.
I honestly don't know how many Muslims there are in the UK. 10% seems to be an underestimate to me.
A couple of months ago there was a rally in Leeds town centre that started outside the Henry Moore museum. The first banner I read was Leeds for Freedom. As the participants slowly gathered though, it soon became clear that it was a Muslim rally. That rather gave me the impression that the Muslims here think they dominate Leeds and they could well be right. Harehills is predominantly Muslim from what I see of it.
I honestly don't know how many Muslims there are in the UK. 10% seems to be an underestimate to me.
A couple of months ago there was a rally in Leeds town centre that started outside the Henry Moore museum. The first banner I read was Leeds for Freedom. As the participants slowly gathered though, it soon became clear that it was a Muslim rally. That rather gave me the impression that the Muslims here think they dominate Leeds and they could well be right. Harehills is predominantly Muslim from what I see of it.
-
Swimming maggie
- Posts: 174
- Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2009 6:08 am
Muslim Demographics
OpenMind;1183101 wrote: I honestly don't know how many Muslims there are in the UK. 10% seems to be an underestimate to me.
A couple of months ago there was a rally in Leeds town centre that started outside the Henry Moore museum. The first banner I read was Leeds for Freedom. As the participants slowly gathered though, it soon became clear that it was a Muslim rally. That rather gave me the impression that the Muslims here think they dominate Leeds and they could well be right. Harehills is predominantly Muslim from what I see of it.
I think 10% is an understatement too, I used to teach people to drive in Batley and Dewsbury and most of those areas had a higher Muslim population, in some areas you found it hard to find a non muslim person.
A couple of months ago there was a rally in Leeds town centre that started outside the Henry Moore museum. The first banner I read was Leeds for Freedom. As the participants slowly gathered though, it soon became clear that it was a Muslim rally. That rather gave me the impression that the Muslims here think they dominate Leeds and they could well be right. Harehills is predominantly Muslim from what I see of it.
I think 10% is an understatement too, I used to teach people to drive in Batley and Dewsbury and most of those areas had a higher Muslim population, in some areas you found it hard to find a non muslim person.
Muslim Demographics
Swimming maggie;1183090 wrote: because people want to be able to practice their own religion and culture in their own country.
Are you saying that if people are a minority they would not be able to practice their own religion and culture?
Are you saying that if people are a minority they would not be able to practice their own religion and culture?
-
Swimming maggie
- Posts: 174
- Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2009 6:08 am
Muslim Demographics
Lon;1183103 wrote: Are you saying that if people are a minority they would not be able to practice their own religion and culture?
no not necessarily, but our religion would be the minority religion inthis country and it should be the majority religion in England.
no not necessarily, but our religion would be the minority religion inthis country and it should be the majority religion in England.
Muslim Demographics
Swimming maggie;1183106 wrote: no not necessarily, but our religion would be the minority religion inthis country and it should be the majority religion in England.
Would it be a bad thing if your religion was the minority?
Would it be a bad thing if your religion was the minority?
Muslim Demographics
Swimming maggie;1183102 wrote: I think 10% is an understatement too, I used to teach people to drive in Batley and Dewsbury and most of those areas had a higher Muslim population, in some areas you found it hard to find a non muslim person.
In Dewsbury, Muslims are definitely in the majority.
In Dewsbury, Muslims are definitely in the majority.
Muslim Demographics
Islam in the United Kingdom - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
-
Oscar Namechange
- Posts: 31842
- Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:26 am
Muslim Demographics
OpenMind;1183101 wrote: I honestly don't know how many Muslims there are in the UK. 10% seems to be an underestimate to me.
A couple of months ago there was a rally in Leeds town centre that started outside the Henry Moore museum. The first banner I read was Leeds for Freedom. As the participants slowly gathered though, it soon became clear that it was a Muslim rally. That rather gave me the impression that the Muslims here think they dominate Leeds and they could well be right. Harehills is predominantly Muslim from what I see of it. Years ago, i lived in Harehills for a brief period and i absolutely loved it. It was a deprived area at the time, it may have changed since then, and prostitution was the biggest worry for police there. It was cheap digs for me and that's why i was there. There was a real sense of community and you could leave your back door open all night. Bradford seemed the place where there was large muslim community's. When i looked at the BNP, i noticed that their stronghole is in the north of England.
A couple of months ago there was a rally in Leeds town centre that started outside the Henry Moore museum. The first banner I read was Leeds for Freedom. As the participants slowly gathered though, it soon became clear that it was a Muslim rally. That rather gave me the impression that the Muslims here think they dominate Leeds and they could well be right. Harehills is predominantly Muslim from what I see of it. Years ago, i lived in Harehills for a brief period and i absolutely loved it. It was a deprived area at the time, it may have changed since then, and prostitution was the biggest worry for police there. It was cheap digs for me and that's why i was there. There was a real sense of community and you could leave your back door open all night. Bradford seemed the place where there was large muslim community's. When i looked at the BNP, i noticed that their stronghole is in the north of England.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Muslim Demographics
I understand that 10% of Egyptians are christian, so what does that statistic prove ?
You can make statistics prove anything you want of its layed out in a certain fashion.
If a statistic says that children with bigger feet spell better, should we stretch our childrens feet ?. No of course not. The information is correct, its just laid out wrong to misconstrue. Children with bigger feet may well be better spellers on the whole because children with bigger feet are usually older
You can make statistics prove anything you want of its layed out in a certain fashion.
If a statistic says that children with bigger feet spell better, should we stretch our childrens feet ?. No of course not. The information is correct, its just laid out wrong to misconstrue. Children with bigger feet may well be better spellers on the whole because children with bigger feet are usually older
"He has all the virtues I dislike and none of the vices I admire."
Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill
-
Oscar Namechange
- Posts: 31842
- Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:26 am
Muslim Demographics
Religion is a choice and a choice that we have the liberty to change any time we like. In this day and age of commercial travel and re-patronisation, reigion of one kind is not limited to parts of the world or individual country any more.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Muslim Demographics
Snowfire;1183183 wrote: I understand that 10% of Egyptians are christian, so what does that statistic prove ?
You can make statistics prove anything you want of its layed out in a certain fashion.
If a statistic says that children with bigger feet spell better, should we stretch our childrens feet ?. No of course not. The information is correct, its just laid out wrong to misconstrue. Children with bigger feet may well be better spellers on the whole because children with bigger feet are usually older
So far, I don't think anyone has said that the stats are proving anything, or am I missing something?
You can make statistics prove anything you want of its layed out in a certain fashion.
If a statistic says that children with bigger feet spell better, should we stretch our childrens feet ?. No of course not. The information is correct, its just laid out wrong to misconstrue. Children with bigger feet may well be better spellers on the whole because children with bigger feet are usually older
So far, I don't think anyone has said that the stats are proving anything, or am I missing something?
Muslim Demographics
Lon;1183186 wrote: So far, I don't think anyone has said that the stats are proving anything, or am I missing something?
You were missing something, Lon. The video is full of stats to prove that the Western World is going to become predominantly Muslim. Why else did you post this video?
You were missing something, Lon. The video is full of stats to prove that the Western World is going to become predominantly Muslim. Why else did you post this video?
Muslim Demographics
OpenMind;1183187 wrote: You were missing something, Lon. The video is full of stats to prove that the Western World is going to become predominantly Muslim. Why else did you post this video?
The stats speak for themselves and are apparently valid. I was interested in getting feedback on how different people feel about it, are they alarmed, upset, fearful, or just don't care. Only one poster so far expressed and opinion and then when queried for more feedback never followed through. Muslims were considered to have enlightened Europe in the 11th Century. Could this be happening again, but on a larger scale?
The stats speak for themselves and are apparently valid. I was interested in getting feedback on how different people feel about it, are they alarmed, upset, fearful, or just don't care. Only one poster so far expressed and opinion and then when queried for more feedback never followed through. Muslims were considered to have enlightened Europe in the 11th Century. Could this be happening again, but on a larger scale?
Muslim Demographics
Lon;1183194 wrote: The stats speak for themselves and are apparently valid. I was interested in getting feedback on how different people feel about it, are they alarmed, upset, fearful, or just don't care. Only one poster so far expressed and opinion and then when queried for more feedback never followed through. Muslims were considered to have enlightened Europe in the 11th Century. Could this be happening again, but on a larger scale?
I believe that Islamism can be considered a true faith insofar as it has held to its ancient principles such as the sunservience of women. In the 11th century, it was probably a modern ideal but today it is a repressive religion. Perhaps if Muslims conquered the western world instead of Christianity, our history books would be full of witch burnings and dunkings by Muslims instead of by Christians.
I believe that Islamism can be considered a true faith insofar as it has held to its ancient principles such as the sunservience of women. In the 11th century, it was probably a modern ideal but today it is a repressive religion. Perhaps if Muslims conquered the western world instead of Christianity, our history books would be full of witch burnings and dunkings by Muslims instead of by Christians.
Muslim Demographics
OpenMind;1183196 wrote: I believe that Islamism can be considered a true faith insofar as it has held to its ancient principles such as the sunservience of women. In the 11th century, it was probably a modern ideal but today it is a repressive religion. Perhaps if Muslims conquered the western world instead of Christianity, our history books would be full of witch burnings and dunkings by Muslims instead of by Christians.
I find it interesting that there is such variance in how both Islam and Christianity are practiced and used to justify less than humane or fair behavior. If the world were totally Muslim it would in my opinion be no better or worse than if the world were totally Christian. The world would probably be better off without either.
I find it interesting that there is such variance in how both Islam and Christianity are practiced and used to justify less than humane or fair behavior. If the world were totally Muslim it would in my opinion be no better or worse than if the world were totally Christian. The world would probably be better off without either.
Muslim Demographics
Lon;1183204 wrote: I find it interesting that there is such variance in how both Islam and Christianity are practiced and used to justify less than humane or fair behavior. If the world were totally Muslim it would in my opinion be no better or worse than if the world were totally Christian. The world would probably be better off without either.
Most universities began as Christian schools. Harvard University, and Yale University, both began as Congregational institutions. Princeton started as a Presbyterian college. Oxford, Paris, Cambridge, Heidelberg and Basel were all founded by Christian ministers. Then there are hospitals and charitable organizations. Would we really be better off without them?
Most universities began as Christian schools. Harvard University, and Yale University, both began as Congregational institutions. Princeton started as a Presbyterian college. Oxford, Paris, Cambridge, Heidelberg and Basel were all founded by Christian ministers. Then there are hospitals and charitable organizations. Would we really be better off without them?
Schooling results in matriculation. Education is a process that changes the learner.
Muslim Demographics
Oh brother !
"Its time to wake up"
"Its time for action"
Im surprised he didnt recommend genocide.
People are afraid of that which they dont understand.
To the Muslims I say go in peace my brothers.
"Its time to wake up"
"Its time for action"
Im surprised he didnt recommend genocide.
People are afraid of that which they dont understand.
To the Muslims I say go in peace my brothers.
I AM AWESOME MAN
Muslim Demographics
Clint;1183209 wrote: Most universities began as Christian schools. Harvard University, and Yale University, both began as Congregational institutions. Princeton started as a Presbyterian college. Oxford, Paris, Cambridge, Heidelberg and Basel were all founded by Christian ministers. Then there are hospitals and charitable organizations. Would we really be better off without them?
I dunno Clint------would we really be better off if the Muslims hadn't been responsible for the first medical school, public health facility, drugs and medications, their contribution to architecture & hygiene etc. etc. and would we better off if the Pope during WW 2 had interceded in behalf of the Jews, or if the Inquisition had never occurred, or if the KKK had not used the Christian bible to justify their racism etc. etc.
I dunno Clint------would we really be better off if the Muslims hadn't been responsible for the first medical school, public health facility, drugs and medications, their contribution to architecture & hygiene etc. etc. and would we better off if the Pope during WW 2 had interceded in behalf of the Jews, or if the Inquisition had never occurred, or if the KKK had not used the Christian bible to justify their racism etc. etc.
-
fuzzywuzzy
- Posts: 6596
- Joined: Mon Feb 02, 2009 5:35 pm
Muslim Demographics
Lon;1183088 wrote: Why?
Oh dear. Lon you're an arsehole and you know why. You're submersive in your bigotry.
And I'll get the warning when you complain about being called an arsehole.
( SHAKES HEAD IN DISGUST)
Oh dear. Lon you're an arsehole and you know why. You're submersive in your bigotry.
And I'll get the warning when you complain about being called an arsehole.
( SHAKES HEAD IN DISGUST)
Muslim Demographics
oscar;1183096 wrote: In the 60's. Enoch Powell predicted that by today, one tenth of England would be Muslim....... how right he was.
Go on, tell me when and where, I don't believe he did.
I didn't see the relevance of teenage mothers on benefit either, unless you were trying to point out how small a fraction of them are Muslims.
Go on, tell me when and where, I don't believe he did.
I didn't see the relevance of teenage mothers on benefit either, unless you were trying to point out how small a fraction of them are Muslims.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
Muslim Demographics
fuzzywuzzy;1183258 wrote: Oh dear. Lon you're an arsehole and you know why. You're submersive in your bigotry.
I'm not sure you've read his posts in the thread then. Lon's definitively unbigoted as far as I can tell.
I'm not sure you've read his posts in the thread then. Lon's definitively unbigoted as far as I can tell.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
Muslim Demographics
Lon;1183062 wrote: I was not alarmed, just found it interesting and curious about how others felt about it. I guess one could do a bit of research to determine if the stats as presented on the U Tube video are valid.
It looks like the states will be a predominantly catholic country before very long. How do you feel about that? Do you foresee religious warfare in the states. What would be your attitude is senators and congressmen voted as dictated by the pope rather than reflecting the views of their electorate?
It looks like the states will be a predominantly catholic country before very long. How do you feel about that? Do you foresee religious warfare in the states. What would be your attitude is senators and congressmen voted as dictated by the pope rather than reflecting the views of their electorate?
Muslim Demographics
gmc;1183325 wrote: It looks like the states will be a predominantly catholic country before very long. How do you feel about that? Do you foresee religious warfare in the states. What would be your attitude is senators and congressmen voted as dictated by the pope rather than reflecting the views of their electorate?
Right now the US is 22% Roman Catholic and as more and more immigrants (both legal & illegal) reside in the US that percentage will increase. No, I don't see religious warfare in the states nor do I see politicians voting as dictated by the pope, however, they will vote yea or nay based on their church imbued moral values. We still have separation of church and state which will prevent any new legislation from being enacted that would force one set of religious values over another. There have been in the past, and will continue into the future, constitutional battles over such things as having the Ten Commandments carved into the entry wall of a state capitol.
Right now the US is 22% Roman Catholic and as more and more immigrants (both legal & illegal) reside in the US that percentage will increase. No, I don't see religious warfare in the states nor do I see politicians voting as dictated by the pope, however, they will vote yea or nay based on their church imbued moral values. We still have separation of church and state which will prevent any new legislation from being enacted that would force one set of religious values over another. There have been in the past, and will continue into the future, constitutional battles over such things as having the Ten Commandments carved into the entry wall of a state capitol.
Muslim Demographics
I kind of got the feeling the orator was implying if Christians hold the majority they win. If Muslims infiltrate the world with their nasty little beliefs Christians lose.
Its a game...like Jeapordy but instead of cash you get to keep your soul.
Its a game...like Jeapordy but instead of cash you get to keep your soul.
I AM AWESOME MAN
Muslim Demographics
Lon;1183395 wrote: Right now the US is 22% Roman Catholic and as more and more immigrants (both legal & illegal) reside in the US that percentage will increase. No, I don't see religious warfare in the states nor do I see politicians voting as dictated by the pope, however, they will vote yea or nay based on their church imbued moral values. We still have separation of church and state which will prevent any new legislation from being enacted that would force one set of religious values over another. There have been in the past, and will continue into the future, constitutional battles over such things as having the Ten Commandments carved into the entry wall of a state capitol.
The mentality of the christian right (for want of a better term) is every bit as bad as muslim extremist imo. As a non-american it's hard to get a sense of how influential religion really is in america-you tend just to see the more extreme examples.
Europe is largely secular but there has been a tremendous amount of warfare to get to that point. Even now catholic/protestant arguments occasionally flare to life-in northrn ireland they never really stopped.
left alone muslims would probably start fighting each other about which sect worships the true god. It's funny how religions that preach tolerance can never tolerate those who just want to be left alone.
The mentality of the christian right (for want of a better term) is every bit as bad as muslim extremist imo. As a non-american it's hard to get a sense of how influential religion really is in america-you tend just to see the more extreme examples.
Europe is largely secular but there has been a tremendous amount of warfare to get to that point. Even now catholic/protestant arguments occasionally flare to life-in northrn ireland they never really stopped.
left alone muslims would probably start fighting each other about which sect worships the true god. It's funny how religions that preach tolerance can never tolerate those who just want to be left alone.
Muslim Demographics
gmc;1183566 wrote: The mentality of the christian right (for want of a better term) is every bit as bad as muslim extremist imo. As a non-american it's hard to get a sense of how influential religion really is in america-you tend just to see the more extreme examples.
There is the Right & the Christian Right. I have always been a tad to the right myself, but in recent years I have been so turned off by the Christian Right that I have moved to what is considered left, and though a minority, I am not alone. Religion I'm sorry to say, is quite influential in the US. It permeates a couple of the top ranked news programs via the hosts personal religious and moral values. By topped ranked, I mean as a pecentage of viewers compared to other news programs.
There is the Right & the Christian Right. I have always been a tad to the right myself, but in recent years I have been so turned off by the Christian Right that I have moved to what is considered left, and though a minority, I am not alone. Religion I'm sorry to say, is quite influential in the US. It permeates a couple of the top ranked news programs via the hosts personal religious and moral values. By topped ranked, I mean as a pecentage of viewers compared to other news programs.
Muslim Demographics
OpenMind;1182986 wrote: I found the video was heavily loaded with terms to alarm the viewer. Are there any comparative figures for Christians and Jews? These would be useful to get a fuller picture of the situation.
Don't bother - the figures being quoted are lies in the first place.
Apart from being emotive claptrap designed to scare, it is full of logical non-sequiters and false conclusions and the underlying statistics, out of context as they are, are in themself wrong.
Don't bother - the figures being quoted are lies in the first place.
Apart from being emotive claptrap designed to scare, it is full of logical non-sequiters and false conclusions and the underlying statistics, out of context as they are, are in themself wrong.
Muslim Demographics
oscar;1183096 wrote: In the 60's. Enoch Powell predicted that by today, one tenth of England would be Muslim....... how right he was.
Trouble is, he also predicted that we would be a country in meltdown with rivers of blood flowing down the street from racial anarchy.
Trouble is, he also predicted that we would be a country in meltdown with rivers of blood flowing down the street from racial anarchy.
-
Oscar Namechange
- Posts: 31842
- Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:26 am
Muslim Demographics
Bryn Mawr;1183668 wrote: Trouble is, he also predicted that we would be a country in meltdown with rivers of blood flowing down the street from racial anarchy. True. He was in my opinion a visionary but that's not to say he was correct 100% with his predictions.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Muslim Demographics
oscar;1183681 wrote: True. He was in my opinion a visionary but that's not to say he was correct 100% with his predictions.
Selective quoting of his opinions does him no credit.
Selective quoting of his opinions does him no credit.
-
Oscar Namechange
- Posts: 31842
- Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:26 am
Muslim Demographics
Bryn Mawr;1183687 wrote: Selective quoting of his opinions does him no credit. I could equally argue that selective quoting of his failed preminitions do him no credit either.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Muslim Demographics
oscar;1183697 wrote: I could equally argue that selective quoting of his failed preminitions do him no credit either.
oscar wrote: In the 60's. Enoch Powell predicted that by today, one tenth of England would be Muslim....... how right he was.
Go on, tell me when and where, I don't believe he did.
oscar wrote: In the 60's. Enoch Powell predicted that by today, one tenth of England would be Muslim....... how right he was.
Go on, tell me when and where, I don't believe he did.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
Muslim Demographics
Bryn Mawr;1183668 wrote: Trouble is, he also predicted that we would be a country in meltdown with rivers of blood flowing down the street from racial anarchy.
In don't know-if muslim extremists here started an intense bombing campaign I could see a few mosques getting fire=bombed and riots on the street-probably with blacks and whites against the asians.
In don't know-if muslim extremists here started an intense bombing campaign I could see a few mosques getting fire=bombed and riots on the street-probably with blacks and whites against the asians.
Muslim Demographics
gmc;1183810 wrote: In don't know-if muslim extremists here started an intense bombing campaign I could see a few mosques getting fire=bombed and riots on the street-probably with blacks and whites against the asians.
If Christian literalists did the same they'd get the same reaction. Or Hindu extremists, or Buddhist supremacists if there's such a thing. Or the Real IRA. It's what they do that matters, not what they're ignorantly accused of believing.
If Christian literalists did the same they'd get the same reaction. Or Hindu extremists, or Buddhist supremacists if there's such a thing. Or the Real IRA. It's what they do that matters, not what they're ignorantly accused of believing.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
-
Oscar Namechange
- Posts: 31842
- Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:26 am
Muslim Demographics
spot;1183800 wrote: Go on, tell me when and where, I don't believe he did.
An excert from Enoch Powells 'Rivers of Blood' speech.
"Like the Roman, I see the River Tiber foaming with much blood"
The supreme function of statesmanship is to provide against preventable evils. In seeking to do so, it encounters obstacles which are deeply rooted in human nature. One is that by the very order of things such evils are not demonstrable until they have occurred: at each stage in their onset there is room for doubt and for dispute whether they be real or imaginary. By the same token, they attract little attention in comparison with current troubles, which are both indisputable and pressing: whence the besetting temptation of all politics to concern itself with the immediate present at the expense of the future. Above all, people are disposed to mistake predicting troubles for causing troubles and even for desiring troubles: "If only," they love to think, "if only people wouldn't talk about it, it probably wouldn't happen."
Perhaps this habit goes back to the primitive belief that the word and the thing, the name and the object, are identical. At all events, the discussion of future grave but, with effort now, avoidable evils is the most unpopular and at the same time the most necessary occupation for the politician.
Those who knowingly shirk it deserve, and not infrequently receive, the curses of those who come after. A week or two ago I fell into conversation with a constituent, a middle-aged, quite ordinary working man employed in one of our nationalised industries. After a sentence or two about the weather, he suddenly said: "If I had the money to go, I wouldn't stay in this country." I made some deprecatory reply to the effect that even this government wouldn't last for ever; but he took no notice, and continued: "I have three children, all of them been through grammar school and two of them married now, with family. I shan't be satisfied till I have seen them all settled overseas. In this country in 15 or 20 years' time the black man will have the whip hand over the white man."
I can already hear the chorus of execration. How dare I say such a horrible thing? How dare I stir up trouble and inflame feelings by repeating such a conversation? The answer is that I do not have the right not to do so. Here is a decent, ordinary fellow Englishman, who in broad daylight in my own town says to me, his Member of Parliament, that his country will not be worth living in for his children. I simply do not have the right to shrug my shoulders and think about something else. What he is saying, thousands and hundreds of thousands are saying and thinking - not throughout Great Britain, perhaps, but in the areas that are already undergoing the total transformation to which there is no parallel in a thousand years of English history. In 15 or 20 years, on present trends, there will be in this country three and a half million Commonwealth immigrants and their descendants. That is not my figure. That is the official figure given to parliament by the spokesman of the Registrar General's Office. There is no comparable official figure for the year 2000, but it must be in the region of five to seven million, approximately one-tenth of the whole population, and approaching that of Greater London. Of course, it will not be evenly distributed from Margate to Aberystwyth and from Penzance to Aberdeen. Whole areas, towns and parts of towns across England will be occupied by sections of the immigrant and immigrant-descended population.
As time goes on, the proportion of this total who are immigrant descendants, those born in England, who arrived here by exactly the same route as the rest of us, will rapidly increase. Already by 1985 the native-born would constitute the majority. It is this fact which creates the extreme urgency of action now, of just that kind of action which is hardest for politicians to take, action where the difficulties lie in the present but the evils to be prevented or minimised lie several parliaments ahead.
My apologies for stating that he said one tenth would be muslim. It was one tenth immigrant and immigrant descendants. I stand corrected on that score.
An excert from Enoch Powells 'Rivers of Blood' speech.
"Like the Roman, I see the River Tiber foaming with much blood"
The supreme function of statesmanship is to provide against preventable evils. In seeking to do so, it encounters obstacles which are deeply rooted in human nature. One is that by the very order of things such evils are not demonstrable until they have occurred: at each stage in their onset there is room for doubt and for dispute whether they be real or imaginary. By the same token, they attract little attention in comparison with current troubles, which are both indisputable and pressing: whence the besetting temptation of all politics to concern itself with the immediate present at the expense of the future. Above all, people are disposed to mistake predicting troubles for causing troubles and even for desiring troubles: "If only," they love to think, "if only people wouldn't talk about it, it probably wouldn't happen."
Perhaps this habit goes back to the primitive belief that the word and the thing, the name and the object, are identical. At all events, the discussion of future grave but, with effort now, avoidable evils is the most unpopular and at the same time the most necessary occupation for the politician.
Those who knowingly shirk it deserve, and not infrequently receive, the curses of those who come after. A week or two ago I fell into conversation with a constituent, a middle-aged, quite ordinary working man employed in one of our nationalised industries. After a sentence or two about the weather, he suddenly said: "If I had the money to go, I wouldn't stay in this country." I made some deprecatory reply to the effect that even this government wouldn't last for ever; but he took no notice, and continued: "I have three children, all of them been through grammar school and two of them married now, with family. I shan't be satisfied till I have seen them all settled overseas. In this country in 15 or 20 years' time the black man will have the whip hand over the white man."
I can already hear the chorus of execration. How dare I say such a horrible thing? How dare I stir up trouble and inflame feelings by repeating such a conversation? The answer is that I do not have the right not to do so. Here is a decent, ordinary fellow Englishman, who in broad daylight in my own town says to me, his Member of Parliament, that his country will not be worth living in for his children. I simply do not have the right to shrug my shoulders and think about something else. What he is saying, thousands and hundreds of thousands are saying and thinking - not throughout Great Britain, perhaps, but in the areas that are already undergoing the total transformation to which there is no parallel in a thousand years of English history. In 15 or 20 years, on present trends, there will be in this country three and a half million Commonwealth immigrants and their descendants. That is not my figure. That is the official figure given to parliament by the spokesman of the Registrar General's Office. There is no comparable official figure for the year 2000, but it must be in the region of five to seven million, approximately one-tenth of the whole population, and approaching that of Greater London. Of course, it will not be evenly distributed from Margate to Aberystwyth and from Penzance to Aberdeen. Whole areas, towns and parts of towns across England will be occupied by sections of the immigrant and immigrant-descended population.
As time goes on, the proportion of this total who are immigrant descendants, those born in England, who arrived here by exactly the same route as the rest of us, will rapidly increase. Already by 1985 the native-born would constitute the majority. It is this fact which creates the extreme urgency of action now, of just that kind of action which is hardest for politicians to take, action where the difficulties lie in the present but the evils to be prevented or minimised lie several parliaments ahead.
My apologies for stating that he said one tenth would be muslim. It was one tenth immigrant and immigrant descendants. I stand corrected on that score.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Muslim Demographics
oscar;1183819 wrote: My apologies for stating that he said one tenth would be muslim. It was one tenth immigrant and immigrant descendants. I stand corrected on that score.
And you seriously don't think that's a relevant observation in a thread about Muslim demographics? Surely it makes the observation just as irrelevant as the proportion of teenage mothers on benefit, unless you were trying to point out how small a fraction of those are Muslims. Rather than standing corrected on both scores you might like to apologize on both counts for misleading people.
And you seriously don't think that's a relevant observation in a thread about Muslim demographics? Surely it makes the observation just as irrelevant as the proportion of teenage mothers on benefit, unless you were trying to point out how small a fraction of those are Muslims. Rather than standing corrected on both scores you might like to apologize on both counts for misleading people.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
-
Oscar Namechange
- Posts: 31842
- Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:26 am
Muslim Demographics
spot;1183822 wrote: And you seriously don't think that's a relevant observation in a thread about Muslim demographics? Surely it makes the observation just as irrelevant as the proportion of teenage mothers on benefit, unless you were trying to point out how small a fraction of those are Muslims. Rather than standing corrected on both scores you might like to apologize on both counts for misleading people. I accept that going into teenage pregnacy may have been off tangent, however the opening video was population statistics, my refernce was to the growing population in this country and teenagers here have the highest rate of pregnacy in Europe...... it was a refernce to population not to divert.
My refernece to Enoch Powell was to merely point out that in the 60's he predicted the rise of immigrants and again that is what also, the opening video was about.
My refernece to Enoch Powell was to merely point out that in the 60's he predicted the rise of immigrants and again that is what also, the opening video was about.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Muslim Demographics
oscar;1183825 wrote: My refernece to Enoch Powell was to merely point out that in the 60's he predicted the rise of immigrants and again that is what also, the opening video was about.
You seem unable to distinguish winners from losers over the last century.
The self-interested enfranchised Tory landowners who destroyed an entire generation in World War 1 were the losers, their actions politicized the lower classes as nothing before it had and led directly to their own impoverishment and sidelining over the next seventy years. They didn't aim to achieve that, they aimed to stay on top but they lost. Good. The price was well worth the result. Three quarters of a million Britons died and I won, along with the majority of people in the country.
The self-interested Imperialists who bankrupted the country by declaring war on Germany in 1939 were the losers, their actions led directly to self-rule in all those colonies over the next thirty years. They didn't aim to achieve that, they aimed to stay on top but they lost. Good. The price was well worth the result. Another half million Britons died and I won, along with the majority of people in the country. The Empire was an abomination.
The self-interested Capitalists who opened the county's borders to mass immigration in the early 1950s were the losers, they had no intention whatever of changing the ethnographic complexity of the country, they were just out as usual for another quick fortune. Their action led directly to the multiculturalism we have today, the rough balance in church attendance between Christian and Muslim communities, the liberalization of values and the long-term triumph of socialist principles. They lost. Enoch Powell may well have been accurate in some of his observations (but not in the key ones - "In this country in 15 or 20 years' time the black man will have the whip hand over the white man" was an appalling error, for example) but he lost. Good. The price was well worth the result. Far more people have benefited than have died as a result. I won, along with the majority of people in the country. Racism, and it was mass dyed-in-the-wool support for South African apartheid I'm talking about, racism was an abomination.
Now, would you like to agree that the more Muslim teenage girls there are as a proportion of teenage girls in this country, the lower the teenage pregnancy rate will fall, other things being equal?
You seem unable to distinguish winners from losers over the last century.
The self-interested enfranchised Tory landowners who destroyed an entire generation in World War 1 were the losers, their actions politicized the lower classes as nothing before it had and led directly to their own impoverishment and sidelining over the next seventy years. They didn't aim to achieve that, they aimed to stay on top but they lost. Good. The price was well worth the result. Three quarters of a million Britons died and I won, along with the majority of people in the country.
The self-interested Imperialists who bankrupted the country by declaring war on Germany in 1939 were the losers, their actions led directly to self-rule in all those colonies over the next thirty years. They didn't aim to achieve that, they aimed to stay on top but they lost. Good. The price was well worth the result. Another half million Britons died and I won, along with the majority of people in the country. The Empire was an abomination.
The self-interested Capitalists who opened the county's borders to mass immigration in the early 1950s were the losers, they had no intention whatever of changing the ethnographic complexity of the country, they were just out as usual for another quick fortune. Their action led directly to the multiculturalism we have today, the rough balance in church attendance between Christian and Muslim communities, the liberalization of values and the long-term triumph of socialist principles. They lost. Enoch Powell may well have been accurate in some of his observations (but not in the key ones - "In this country in 15 or 20 years' time the black man will have the whip hand over the white man" was an appalling error, for example) but he lost. Good. The price was well worth the result. Far more people have benefited than have died as a result. I won, along with the majority of people in the country. Racism, and it was mass dyed-in-the-wool support for South African apartheid I'm talking about, racism was an abomination.
Now, would you like to agree that the more Muslim teenage girls there are as a proportion of teenage girls in this country, the lower the teenage pregnancy rate will fall, other things being equal?
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.