He/she who shouts loudest wins?

Violetmay · Post by **Violetmay** » Sun Nov 16, 2008 4:18 pm

I'm new. I've stuck to visiting friends rooms, and making small talk about cookies and pickles. Some lovely people here.

I've read the rest of the forums and wanted to post a reply on certain threads. But actually felt quite inadequate no, intimidated in posting. There are some subjects I know a bit about from work, life and experience. And I can only post from that point of view.

I do not mind a respectful debate, but cannot quote as an expert. So when my experience or feelings are aired only to be shouted down as being wrong, outdated or not as well backed up I think why did I bother. I could reply but without bullet point facts, and that sadly deters me from taking part in things where he/she shouts loudest and tells people they are wrong.

Please don't get me wrong I am not saying FG members are nasty or shouters but my first outings have been pitiful and I am not one of life's cowards.

I think I'll go back to the safety of my room where I don't need facts and figures to justify myself.

That was honest of me eh?:(

Post by **spot** » Sun Nov 16, 2008 4:23 pm

Could you give us some threads this happened in so we can go and look? We take criticism seriously.

Chezzie · Post by **Chezzie** » Sun Nov 16, 2008 4:27 pm

Thats why quite a few stay out of the serious debates. Some people take it too far. Im the type that takes offence so I keep out. First though, I type my response then I delete it, makes me feel like I had my say without the drama:yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl

Post by **spot** » Sun Nov 16, 2008 4:36 pm

There *are* no serious debates! There are discussions. Debates have rules, serious ones even more so.

I think I found the thread Violetmay reacted to. http://www.forumgarden.com/forums/presi ... -past.html

As far as I can tell, oscar reacted to "I did not vote for Gordon Brown" + "Me neither mate" by saying that nobody has ever voted for Gordon Brown other than his own constituency voters, until last week when he won the first by-election held since he became Prime Minister.

Maybe that doesn't seem relevant to Chezzie and Violetmay but it obviously does to oscar. "I did not vote for Gordon Brown" + "Me neither mate" suggests that everyone's had a chance to vote for him. Oscar says that only happens for the first time when there's a General Election.

Why's it intimidating to have a logical point untangled like that?

I may be the wrong person to answer the thread, I'll invite some other mods over.

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Sun Nov 16, 2008 4:44 pm

spot;1060013 wrote: There *are* no serious debates! There are discussions. Debates have rules, serious ones even more so.

I think I found the thread Violetmay reacted to. http://www.forumgarden.com/forums/presi ... -past.html

As far as I can tell, oscar reacted to "I did not vote for Gordon Brown" + "Me neither mate" by saying that nobody has ever voted for Gordon Brown other than his own constituency voters, until last week when he won the first by-election held since he became Prime Minister.

Maybe that doesn't seem relevant to Chezzie and Violetmay but it obviously does to oscar. "I did not vote for Gordon Brown" + "Me neither mate" suggests that everyone's had a chance to vote for him. Oscar says that only happens for the first time when there's a General Election.

Why's it intimidating to have a logical point untangled like that?

I may be the wrong person to answer the thread, I'll invite some other mods over.

As i have just said in my answer to Voiletmay. It is impossible to 'vote' for Gordon Brown unless you are living in 'Fife, Scotland' where Brown has his own constituancy and last weeks by-Election or if you were a member of the Cabinet.

Purely stating a fact. Not shouting anyone down.

Chezzie · Post by **Chezzie** » Sun Nov 16, 2008 4:49 pm

spot;1060013 wrote: There *are* no serious debates! There are discussions. Debates have rules, serious ones even more so.

I think I found the thread Violetmay reacted to. http://www.forumgarden.com/forums/presi ... -past.html

As far as I can tell, oscar reacted to "I did not vote for Gordon Brown" + "Me neither mate" by saying that nobody has ever voted for Gordon Brown other than his own constituency voters, until last week when he won the first by-election held since he became Prime Minister.

Maybe that doesn't seem relevant to Chezzie and Violetmay but it obviously does to oscar. "I did not vote for Gordon Brown" + "Me neither mate" suggests that everyone's had a chance to vote for him. Oscar says that only happens for the first time when there's a General Election.

Why's it intimidating to have a logical point untangled like that?

I may be the wrong person to answer the thread, I'll invite some other mods over.

Ok I will bite.

I think all the debates here are serious?? They are debated in a serious fashion and the people in them I feel are serious in their replies. Im not talking proper debates where you have a chair etc...

I wasnt referring to any thread in particular and had no idea what VioletMay may be referring to, I just gave an honest reply as to how I have felt myself when trying to give an opinion on some issues here in the garden.

I wasnt sure their was a particular thread Violet was referring to so I hope you pointed out the correct one Spot:sneaky:

Post by **spot** » Sun Nov 16, 2008 4:51 pm

Chezzie;1060024 wrote: Ok I will bite.

I think all the debates here are serious?? They are debated in a serious fashion and the people in them I feel are serious in their replies. Im not talking proper debates where you have a chair etc...

I wasnt referring to any thread in particular and had no idea what VioletMay may be referring to, I just gave an honest reply as to how I have felt myself when trying to give an opinion on some issues here in the garden.

I wasnt sure their was a particular thread Violet was referring to so I hope you pointed out the correct one Spot:sneaky:

Me too. But I did ask.

Why do you suppose we have two words, debate and discuss? What's the point of "discuss" as a word if it has nothing to describe?

Post by **spot** » Sun Nov 16, 2008 5:00 pm

fuzzy butt;1060036 wrote: discussion .........................debate...............................bullying.

No, I've seen too many obscure posts with no verbs to try sucking a message from another one. What do you mean, fuzzy?

Chezzie · Post by **Chezzie** » Sun Nov 16, 2008 5:03 pm

spot;1060026 wrote: Me too. But I did ask.

Why do you suppose we have two words, debate and discuss? What's the point of "discuss" as a word if it has nothing to describe?

I personally think you go too deep Spot, chill out:D

Welcome to our community! ForumGarden is a remarkable online forum. Our community consists of people from all walks of life - eager to discuss, debate, share, or just make friends.

Online debating

With the increasing popularity and availability of the Internet, differing opinions arise frequently. Though they are often expressed via flaming and other forms of argumentation, which consist primarily of assertions, there do exist formalized debating websites, typically in the form of online forums or bulletin boards. The debate style is interesting, as research and well thought out points and counterpoints are possible because of the obvious lack of time restraints (although practical time restraints usually are in effect, e.g., no more than 5 days between posts, etc.). Many people use this to strengthen their points, or drop their weaker opinions on things, many times for debate in formal debates (such as the ones listed above) or for fun arguments with friends. The ease-of-use and friendly environments make new debaters welcome to share their opinions in many communities.:-6

Post by **spot** » Sun Nov 16, 2008 5:06 pm

Eww! So we have "fun arguments with friends"?

I'd so much rather have a discussion!

flopstock · Post by **flopstock** » Sun Nov 16, 2008 5:07 pm

Here's my unsolicited advice to you VM. You should post however you are comfortable posting. If you want to post an opinion without footnotes or links, do it. And don't apologize for it. Don't let the manner in which anyone else is posting intimidate you.

Most of what I post is simply my opinion. I save technical posts for technical forums. I save sex related posts for sex related forums. This is a general forum and I don't think I've ever bothered to care if someone wants to hear my opinion, before offering it..

Be brave, plunge in... just believe in yourself. :-6

Post by **spot** » Sun Nov 16, 2008 5:11 pm

flopstock;1060045 wrote: Most of what I post is simply my opinion. It's another of those transatlantic differences in words floppy - we'd call what you post baloney, you-all call it hogwash.

sorry. I'll just watch, how's that?

Chezzie · Post by **Chezzie** » Sun Nov 16, 2008 5:12 pm

spot;1060044 wrote: Eww! So we have "fun arguments with friends"?

I'd so much rather have a discussion!

Horses for courses:D

along-for-the-ride · Post by **along-for-the-ride** » Sun Nov 16, 2008 5:14 pm

I agree with Flopstock. Your opinion matters. If you want to express it, do so.

Actually, everybody "wins" on a thread when they express themselves. But, just what is the prize?

abbey · Post by **abbey** » Sun Nov 16, 2008 5:17 pm

I've read the rest of the forums and wanted to post a reply on certain threads. But actually felt quite inadequate no, intimidated in posting. There are some subjects I know a bit about from work, life and experience. And I can only post from that point of view.

That's all we ask of anyone Violetmay.

It's sad that you have been made to feel this way, some of the debates get a little heated, especially the political ones.

You just post your little heart out girl and if anyone gets on your case just put them on ignore.

As for not being able to quote an expert, one word of advice, Google, it's the best thing since sliced bread.

flopstock · Post by **flopstock** » Sun Nov 16, 2008 5:19 pm

spot;1060048 wrote: It's another of those transatlantic differences in words floppy - we'd call what you post baloney, you-all call it hogwash.

sorry. I'll just watch, how's that?

that's y'all sweetie... work on that could you?:D

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Sun Nov 16, 2008 5:23 pm

flopstock;1060054 wrote: that's y'all sweetie... work on that could you?:D

Hey, you have a nice day now :wah:

chonsigirl · Post by **chonsigirl** » Sun Nov 16, 2008 5:25 pm

Post away Violet.....................

Victoria · Post by **Victoria** » Mon Nov 17, 2008 2:45 am

violetmay

You should post just offer your opinion thats what the forum is for, as for those who shout and there are some who get a bit carried away at times. Take no notice.

While I put my fingers in my ears to block out the shouters I will lean a little closer to hear the one who whispers.

Milly · Post by **Milly** » Mon Nov 17, 2008 2:50 am

Just post and be damned VioletMay..... very often people can see that others are coming at them unnecessarily, when infact, they are just as passionate in their postings as you are in yours.... Talking in general terms - If you feel strongly about what you have to say... don't whinge about it when they come back at you.... get back in there and give as good as you get hun!

Just to add - I've no idea what thread or threads your post relates to BTW, so if you feel this is a case of bullying rather than debating maybe you should report the offender so that your concerns can be dealt with....

.

Violetmay · Post by **Violetmay** » Mon Nov 17, 2008 8:08 am

Thank you for your input all of you.

I think where I am coming from is, although I am not stupid, I have only my thoughts, feelings and experiences to post from. And feel a little up against people more able to post from a higher level or so it would seem, and I like to acknowledge if I agree with someone as well as disagree and show some respect, and not make them look stupid in order to prove my point. I feel perhaps I was made to feel a bit stupid.

sunny104 · Post by **sunny104** » Mon Nov 17, 2008 8:49 am

I don't take this place too seriously, that's why I mostly post goofy comments everywhere. :p

Fyrenza · Post by **Fyrenza** » Mon Nov 17, 2008 9:12 am

Oh, Violet, i know what you're saying ~ i just went through that on another forum, my own self.

It's hard, 'cuz you don't want to come off as some sort of ignoramous ~ which, BTW, you definitely DON'T! ~ but you don't want to spend hours doing research just in order to post one reply.

The good news is, you don't have to. Say what you feel, and when anyone disagrees with you, THAT's your chance to learn more about whatever it is!

It might change your opinion; it might not ~ but at least you'll have current facts to base your opinion on.

And don't let condescension get to you ~ we're all guilty of it, at times, and some folks take it really well, while it hurts other people's feelings. i've found that if, in my posts back, i will highlight any of this and bring it to the other's attention, they'll usually back off on doing it to me.

Believe it or not, after a while, you'll get to the point that it really won't even bother you anymore, and you'll be trading insults with the best of 'em!!! :yh_rotfl

i think if you just look at it as a learning experience (the disCUSSions, that is), and don't take anything too seriously, you'll be fine!

i haven't been here very long, either, but i can tell you that i think the Forum Garden is like a big, huge family ~ you've got your grouchy Uncle Ernie; your tipsy Aunt Clara; a few Beavis and Buttheads; so and so forth ~ and will BE a family to you, because the folks here actually CARE about each other and their n00bs!

p.s. If something gets you down, go to the humor boards for a while ~ you'll come back with a smile on your face, guananteed!

Chezzie · Post by **Chezzie** » Mon Nov 17, 2008 9:15 am

Fyrenza;1060627 wrote: Oh, Violet, i know what you're saying ~ i just went through that on another forum, my own self.

It's hard, 'cuz you don't want to come off as some sort of ignoramous ~ which, BTW, you definitely DON'T! ~ but you don't want to spend hours doing research just in order to post one reply.

The good news is, you don't have to. Say what you feel, and when anyone disagrees with you, THAT's your chance to learn more about whatever it is!

It might change your opinion; it might not ~ but at least you'll have current facts to base your opinion on.

And don't let condescension get to you ~ we're all guilty of it, at times, and some folks take it really well, while it hurts other people's feelings. i've found that if, in my posts back, i will highlight any of this and bring it to the other's attention, they'll usually back off on doing it to me.

Believe it or not, after a while, you'll get to the point that it really won't even bother you anymore, and you'll be trading insults with the best of 'em!!! :yh_rotfl

i think if you just look at it as a learning experience (the disCUSSions, that is), and don't take anything too seriously, you'll be fine!

i haven't been here very long, either, but i can tell you that i think the Forum Garden is like a big, huge family ~ you've got your grouchy Uncle Ernie; your tipsy Aunt Clara; a few Beavis and Buttheads; so and so forth ~ and will BE a family to you, because the folks here actually CARE about each other and their n00bs!

p.s. If something gets you down, go to the humor boards for a while ~ you'll come back with a smile on your face, guananteed!

Lovely Post Mrs N00b:D

Touchstone · Post by **Touchstone** » Mon Nov 17, 2008 9:36 am

Violetmay;1059997 wrote: I'm new. I've stuck to visiting friends rooms, and making small talk about cookies and pickles. Some lovely people here.

I've read the rest of the forums and wanted to post a reply on certain threads. But actually felt quite inadequate no, intimidated in posting. There are some subjects I know a bit about from work, life and experience. And I can only post from that point of view.

I do not mind a respectful debate, but cannot quote as an expert. So when my experience or feelings are aired only to be shouted down as being wrong, outdated or not as well backed up I think why did I bother. I could reply but without bullet point facts, and that sadly deters me from taking part in things where he/she shouts loudest and tells people they are wrong.

Please don't get me wrong I am not saying FG members are nasty or shouters but my first outings have been pitiful and I am not one of life's cowards.

I think I'll go back to the safety of my room where I don't need facts and figures to justify myself.

That was honest of me eh?:(

Assert yourself Violetmay! You have been accepted as a member of this Forum therefor you are as entitled to be heard as those members who have been here from day one.

Don't be a shrinking Violet(may)!

Don't feel intimidated or inadequate because it is clear from this thread you have posted that you are not! Boldy post on all threads and not only on those about which you are familiar. Wing it honey, its quite clear that most people here do!

Knowledge and understanding are but a Google away!

Ryan.

Post by **spot** » Mon Nov 17, 2008 9:46 am

Touchstone;1060673 wrote: Knowledge and understanding are but a Google away!Goodness gracious. I got pummelled when I offered that advice earlier this week.

Imladris · Post by **Imladris** » Mon Nov 17, 2008 10:01 am

VioletMay - just jump in offer what you feel is appropriate and if you want to give a personal example of why you feel/think what you do then go ahead.

Someone will always have a different view here, but there are very few here who will hold a grudge. If you feel bullied however that is a matter for the mods to sort out, they're a good bunch

.

Anyway, if someone annoys you just pick on Jimbo until you feel better - works for me all the time!!

Oh, and if Spot is ever out of line just threaten him with a visit and a hug from me - then he usually behaves!:sneaky:

Imladris · Post by **Imladris** » Mon Nov 17, 2008 10:02 am

spot;1060708 wrote: Goodness gracious. I got pummelled when I offered that advice earlier this week.

Quite right too, and if you do it again it'll be the naughty step for you.:p

Post by **spot** » Mon Nov 17, 2008 10:03 am

Imladris;1060757 wrote: Quite right too, and if you do it again it'll be the naughty step for you.:p

But it was BY TOUCHSTONE!!

Imladris · Post by **Imladris** » Mon Nov 17, 2008 10:04 am

spot;1060761 wrote: But it was BY TOUCHSTONE!!

Stop making excuses

do I have to come over there and sort you out?

Chezzie · Post by **Chezzie** » Mon Nov 17, 2008 10:05 am

spot;1060761 wrote: But it was BY TOUCHSTONE!!

Touchstone the new young and fit looking dude?....Yes you deserved your pummel:yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl

Post by **spot** » Mon Nov 17, 2008 10:06 am

I'll go and browse in the ten acre meadow then, shall I?

That's what I'll do.

That'll teach them.

Hope6 · Post by **Hope6** » Mon Nov 17, 2008 10:08 am

Violetmay, you post whatever you feel like saying wherever you want to say it darlin!

don't let anything anyone else says bother you!

and if you ever need anything feel free to call on me, i will help you any way i can.:-6

Imladris · Post by **Imladris** » Mon Nov 17, 2008 10:09 am

spot;1060767 wrote: I'll go and browse in the ten acre meadow then, shall I?

That's what I'll do.

That'll teach them.

No, you should post pictures of yourself looking extremely gorgeous and then all the girlies will be on your side whatever you do.

Not listening to a word that comes out of you mouth but droolling over your photo!

Hope6 · Post by **Hope6** » Mon Nov 17, 2008 10:10 am

spot;1060767 wrote: I'll go and browse in the ten acre meadow then, shall I?

That's what I'll do.

That'll teach them.

awwwwww Spot! why are they so mean to you?

Post by **spot** » Mon Nov 17, 2008 10:11 am

Hope6;1060780 wrote: awwwwww Spot! why are they so mean to you?

Sheer force of habit.

Chezzie · Post by **Chezzie** » Mon Nov 17, 2008 10:39 am

Imladris;1060774 wrote: No, you should post pictures of yourself looking extremely gorgeous and then all the girlies will be on your side whatever you do.

Not listening to a word that comes out of you mouth but droolling over your photo!

I havent found this pic yet.........Do I need to Google:yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl

Imladris · Post by **Imladris** » Mon Nov 17, 2008 11:07 am

Chezzie;1060859 wrote: I havent found this pic yet.........Do I need to Google:yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl

Just going to check it's still there....................

Imladris · Post by **Imladris** » Mon Nov 17, 2008 11:08 am

http://www.forumgarden.com/forums/membe ... 894-a.html

it's still there :sneaky::D

Imladris · Post by **Imladris** » Mon Nov 17, 2008 11:09 am

:-5:-5 Oh god am I thick today! ..................google the picture! I get it!!!

:yh_rotfl

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Mon Nov 17, 2008 11:42 am

spot;1060708 wrote: Goodness gracious. I got pummelled when I offered that advice earlier this week.

Well, i only learnt from you Yoda :wah:

Post by **spot** » Tue Nov 18, 2008 12:32 am

oscar;1060990 wrote: Well, i only learnt from you Yoda :wah:

There's dreadful grain of truth somewhere behind that. My karma's going to be the death of me.

Odie · Post by **Odie** » Tue Nov 18, 2008 10:26 am

- what about my 'Christmas lights in Toronto' thread?

- about a Christmas song?:rolleyes::rolleyes::-5:-5

-its true what they say, if you have nothing good to say, don't say it at all!

-and it's supposed to be Christmas?

hoxtonchris · Post by **hoxtonchris** » Tue Nov 18, 2008 10:36 am

Violetmay;1059997 wrote: I'm new. I've stuck to visiting friends rooms, and making small talk about cookies and pickles. Some lovely people here.

I've read the rest of the forums and wanted to post a reply on certain threads. But actually felt quite inadequate no, intimidated in posting. There are some subjects I know a bit about from work, life and experience. And I can only post from that point of view.

I do not mind a respectful debate, but cannot quote as an expert. So when my experience or feelings are aired only to be shouted down as being wrong, outdated or not as well backed up I think why did I bother. I could reply but without bullet point facts, and that sadly deters me from taking part in things where he/she shouts loudest and tells people they are wrong.

Please don't get me wrong I am not saying FG members are nasty or shouters but my first outings have been pitiful and I am not one of life's cowards.

I think I'll go back to the safety of my room where I don't need facts and figures to justify myself.

That was honest of me eh?:(you stick to your guns and have your say and if others dont like it well tough.

southern yankee · Post by **southern yankee** » Tue Nov 18, 2008 10:37 am

Odie;1062151 wrote: -what about my 'Christmas lights in Toronto' thread?

- about a Christmas song?:rolleyes::rolleyes::-5:-5

it's true what they say.....if you have nothing good to say, don't say it at all.

-and it's supposed to be Christmas?

Hurting people's feeling. Is uncalled for. I try to to think twice before i type. We all know how it is to be stepped on. So more thinking should be put into our words. Before we post them.

Odie · Post by **Odie** » Tue Nov 18, 2008 10:42 am

southern yankee;1062166 wrote: Hurting people's feeling. Is uncalled for. I try to to think twice before i type. We all know how it is to be stepped on. So more thinking should be put into our words. Before we post them.

now I know how violetmay feels.

southern yankee · Post by **southern yankee** » Tue Nov 18, 2008 10:44 am

Odie;1062175 wrote: now I know how violetmay feels.

being hateful or mean is uncalled for:(