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hmmm!

Identical twins die after seeking euthanasia when they discovered they would go blind and never see each other again - Europe - World - The Independent

Interesting issue. The catholic church condemns suicide to eternal damnation for the simple reason that life was so bad for so many people in early christian times ending it and going to paradise would seem a good option. They'd have lost most of their followers. Now to keep up the pretence they have successfully blocked it twice now in Scotland - supported by all the other Christian churches. They agree on some things it seems when they can make life miserable for non believers but still fall come to blows on whether their respective children should attend the same schools andd argue over the idolatry and all that other stuff. . Our politicians run scared of the churches most people in the country are in favour of it.

I think it was their choice to make.

It was their choice to make. Wish they contacted the Hemlock Society instead, & managed to do it on their own. The story is eerie to me, sad, scary & Clinical. I see doctor involvement when one can't do it on their own for reasons of a physical nature. This way was so easy, but yet, once the decision is made should it be hard to put into practice? Maybe it should. Maybe a situation can change, or the attitude can change, which it can't if you're dead. I don't know.

I'd agree it's their choice and that spending the rest of their lives both deaf and blind would be a daunting prospect for anyone, let alone twins who had spent their lives in each others pockets, but it is a tragic decision for them to make.

Going blind would not be enough for any criteria set by me.

The statistic that....

In 2011, there were 1,133 cases of euthanasia in Belgium, making up around one per cent of deaths in the country. is frightening.

I can understand the idea and agree with the right to end your own life under certain conditions, but this example would not be good enough for the authorities to turn a blind eye.

They could have done the deed without involving anybody else, why go the official route ?

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They could have done the deed without involving anybody else, why go the official route ?
I'm with you Bruv. The doctor met criteria, whatever that involved. Dr. Mengele, I think his name is. He was nice to the children, or so I've been told by a witness.

I'll just say this whole story is at best suspect.

With that aside, I am not a big fan of suicide for whatever reason.

My dad suffered much pain before he died, and it was never suggested by him, most certainly not by anyone else he just end it. It was all about how to alleviate the pain and give comfort.

The problems for the twins in that story looks more to me like they had no friends, much less family who gave a damn. There was something sick going on there.

But then again, we are talking about nameless individuals whose only legecy is a news paper story for people to talk about.

Her body, her choice. I don't think we have a right to interfere at all. No "certain conditions" or anything. At least in this case it's the woman's own life she's ending. If a person wants to commit suicide, I don't think we should place any legal apparatus in their way. If they can find someone to help them, I would expect a good amount of documentation proving that it was at the, um, not-victim's request, but then it shouldn't be considered a crime.

tude dog;1416689 wrote: I'll just say this whole story is at best suspect.

With that aside, I am not a big fan of suicide for whatever reason.

My dad suffered much pain before he died, and it was never suggested by him, most certainly not by anyone else he just end it. It was all about how to alleviate the pain and give comfort.

The problems for the twins in that story looks more to me like they had no friends, much less family who gave a damn. There was something sick going on there.

But then again, we are talking about nameless individuals whose only legecy is a news paper story for people to talk about.


Why do you think it was suspect? What gain does anyone have by making it up? Their parents were there as was their other brother no mention is made of friends but having had their own business for many years they were probably quite well known in the community. They are nameless because they want to be, why should they be named for the titillation of the gutter press and the tut tutters?.

Surely the key issue is it was their choice to make and no one should have the right to deny the choice, especially on what to many people are rather dubious religious grounds.

What would you have done if your dad had made the request that you end his life for him because he is incapable of doing so himself and just couldn't take any more? Don't feel obliged to answer that one as it's maybe a bit too personal. I'm not sure how I would answer it myself, I think it would depend on the circumstances.

This isn't someone who is mentally incompetent being put down it's someone with all their mental faculties intact making the decision for themselves. Rather than do it themselves in a back room in secret they died with their family with them.

Posted by accountable

Her body, her choice. I don't think we have a right to interfere at all. No "certain conditions" or anything. At least in this case it's the woman's own life she's ending. If a person wants to commit suicide, I don't think we should place any legal apparatus in their way. If they can find someone to help them, I would expect a good amount of documentation proving that it was at the, um, not-victim's request, but then it shouldn't be considered a crime.


It's not a crime in for a doctor to assist in Belgium provided certain conditions are met.

Used to be suicide was a crime - in the UK a suicide forfeited all his estate to the crown many other countries had similar laws - mortal sin and all that and suicides were buried in unconsecrated graves.

Some insurance companies will not pay out if the life assured commits suicide leaving the claimants to civil court and proving the suicide was committed while of unsound mind, presumably the view is that someone was of sound mind they did it for the money.

Top Stories - U.S. Military Still Considers Attempted Suicide a Crime - AllGov - News

Lazzaric T. Caldwell admitted to his superiors that he slit his wrists in January 2010 while stationed in Okinawa, Japan. He pleaded guilty to attempting suicide and was sentenced to 180 days in the brig. He also received a bad-conduct discharge, which bars him from receiving mental health benefits.


The US, or some sections of it, seems to have incredibly condemnatory and punitive attitudes about some things.

gmc;1416706 wrote: The US, or some sections of it, seems to have incredibly condemnatory and punitive attitudes about some things.
That's the problem with taking one reporter's spin as gospel, especially when the source document is so close at hand.

http://www.jag.navy.mil/courts/document ... 000557.pdf

The supposed charges against him for attempting suicide were set aside upon appeal. The discharge, if I read this right, was for possession of an illicit material called "spice", which I assume is some kind of herbal drug.

I understand that your mind is made up, and you will feel a need to find a way to twist this into some evil scheme, so go ahead. I won't respond.

Accountable;1416740 wrote: That's the problem with taking one reporter's spin as gospel, especially when the source document is so close at hand.

http://www.jag.navy.mil/courts/document ... 000557.pdf

The supposed charges against him for attempting suicide were set aside upon appeal. The discharge, if I read this right, was for possession of an illicit material called "spice", which I assume is some kind of herbal drug.

I understand that your mind is made up, and you will feel a need to find a way to twist this into some evil scheme, so go ahead. I won't respond.


I stumbled across is when checking the position in the US on insurance companies paying out on suicide - it was of passing interest. We too have our share of ex military showing mental health problems. Most of the UK insurance companies will pay out if it's a year after taking out the policy.

Suicide is one of those things that some people are incredibly condemnatory about with little sympathy for the deceased. The vitriol that those who propose the law be changed in this country receive is quite startling sometimes. I rather hope I will never be in a position where I want to die. If I were it should be my decision to take.

gmc;1416706 wrote: Why do you think it was suspect?


No names for a starter.

gmc;1416706 wrote: What gain does anyone have by making it up?


Maybe the rag which published it?

tude dog;1416890 wrote: No names for a starter.



Maybe the rag which published it?


Deaf Belgian twins euthanized after discovering that they are going blind

Marc and Eddy Verbessem,


The independent is hardly a rag. The names weren't important so far as the discussion piece was concerned and it would have taken you about a minute to find out the names if you wanted to. Euthanasia is legal in Belgium.

The rag as you out it carried a report on something happening it considered of interest. there are separate sections for comment on the matter under independent voices where you can usually find differing opinions.

The pain of the twins who chose euthanasia over blindness: thoughts of life without my sister are unbearable - Comment - Voices - The Independent

This is a right wing paper in the UK

Belgian identical twins in unique mercy killing - Telegraph

Note the more emotive term mercy killing.

For a totally different perspective on the case

Deaf Twins Going Blind Become Victims of Euthanasia in Belgium | LifeNews.com

Deaf Twins Going Blind Become Victims of Euthanasia in Belgium


Lifenews it would seem to me is worthy of the term rag - spouting it's own agenda none of this nonsense about lets have a rational discussion about the matter. A victim is someone who has no choice in the matter.