Themis;1104664 wrote: Did he imprison them, I need to be enlightened in this matter..
can you help? will they return for five months? what does God say?
Please reference what you read (location) that generates this question? I'm assuming this is from the book of Revelation.
What did God do to the fallen ones?
What did God do to the fallen ones?
"Out, damned spot! out, I say!"
- William Shakespeare, Macbeth, 5.1
What did God do to the fallen ones?
Unfortunately folks read Re Revelation as if it were some great prediction of the end of the world..
Revelation was and remains a stinging attack on the world of John's (whomever he was) day. Crossan, Borg, Fox, Phillips and others.
In the past the prophets were not speaking of some distant time in the future but were speaking to the people of their own time, calling them back God.
Shalom
Ted:-6
Revelation was and remains a stinging attack on the world of John's (whomever he was) day. Crossan, Borg, Fox, Phillips and others.
In the past the prophets were not speaking of some distant time in the future but were speaking to the people of their own time, calling them back God.
Shalom
Ted:-6
What did God do to the fallen ones?
Themis:-6
Scholars today have come to the conclusion that Revelation was a stinging attack on the Roman Empire and nothing more. If it had to do with the future it was the immediate future. It is what is referred to as apocalyptic literature which as an attempt to predict the immediate future.
That prophesy does not deal with the distant future has been well shown in "Understanding the Old Testament". The prophets were not speaking of some day in the distant future but of their own time.
This position is held by a number of world renowned biblical scholars such as: Marcus Borg, Dom. Crossan, John Spong, and others as well as pointed out in several Bible commentaries.
There is even a good site on the dozens of predictions down through the years, of the "Day of the Lord".
220 Dates for the End of the world!!! Date Setters!
Perhaps this will help.
Shalom
Ted:-6
Scholars today have come to the conclusion that Revelation was a stinging attack on the Roman Empire and nothing more. If it had to do with the future it was the immediate future. It is what is referred to as apocalyptic literature which as an attempt to predict the immediate future.
That prophesy does not deal with the distant future has been well shown in "Understanding the Old Testament". The prophets were not speaking of some day in the distant future but of their own time.
This position is held by a number of world renowned biblical scholars such as: Marcus Borg, Dom. Crossan, John Spong, and others as well as pointed out in several Bible commentaries.
There is even a good site on the dozens of predictions down through the years, of the "Day of the Lord".
220 Dates for the End of the world!!! Date Setters!
Perhaps this will help.
Shalom
Ted:-6
What did God do to the fallen ones?
Themis:-6
I am not the least bit interested in those who wield political or economic power.
Where is God? H/She is watching and weeping at what man has done to creation. There will be no great cosmic cleanup. The Divine is waiting for the human race to smarten up. Of course, even here, "watching and weeping" are metaphors because God is not an entity as we think: no hands, no feet etc.
We cannot have it both ways. Either we wish to be completely free or we wish to have God controlling everything. Man was given freedom. He can't then turn around when the going gets tough and bail us out. We've messed up and now it is up to us to straighten up.
Shalom
Ted:-6
I am not the least bit interested in those who wield political or economic power.
Where is God? H/She is watching and weeping at what man has done to creation. There will be no great cosmic cleanup. The Divine is waiting for the human race to smarten up. Of course, even here, "watching and weeping" are metaphors because God is not an entity as we think: no hands, no feet etc.
We cannot have it both ways. Either we wish to be completely free or we wish to have God controlling everything. Man was given freedom. He can't then turn around when the going gets tough and bail us out. We've messed up and now it is up to us to straighten up.
Shalom
Ted:-6
What did God do to the fallen ones?
Themis:-6
Part of the issue here is what one thinks about the Bible as a book and what the Divine is like.
The Bible was never meant to be taken literally. Such a view leads one into all kinds of absurdities.
Down through the millenia man has been searching for God. Brain research has shown that there is a part of the brain dealing with that search and it has been there since man began. So down through the years humans have had experiences of the Divine and here I am not speaking of the God of the gaps. If one studies the basis of all of the world's great faiths it becomes clear that there were two; justice and compassion. Personally I think there can be nothing more important. Thus there were many different experiences and interpretations of those experiences.
The reality of the Divine is not provable in scientific terms. Science is far too limited.
There have been sever very spiritual people down through the centuries all pointing to the Divine. Oh, they gave the Divine many names: the Great Spirit, Allah, YHWH , Elohim etc. When it comes down to it, if one accepts the reality of God there is only one ultimate source and some of us have chosen the name "God"
However, we face a very difficult task in trying to decide what God is like and what he looks like etc. The Divine is simply beyond human language and comprehension abilities. The moment we try to define or describe this reality we are attempting to box the Divine in and this is impossible.
Some read "Revelation" as a predictor of the end times. That is not what it was written about. At best the Bible consists of interpretations of events of the various writers.. We have no idea what the future holds. We believe that at sometime there will be some great consummation but ????? There will be no great Divine cleanup as some think.
The whole point is to go back to those bases. Look at what not only Jesus taught, but the prophets and the other great spiritual leaders of the past.
The messaage is very short and clear both in the OT in Micah 6:8 and Matt 22.
We are to do justice, be compassionate and walk humbly with God. Part of the problem is the use of the term believe. The Greek word translated as believe is more correctly translated as trust. It is not about right belief but about living in a loving, transforming relationship with God. We can find this in all of the great faiths around the world. We just have to get past the fundamentalist approach which is inappropriate.
It is up to us to help bring about God's kingdom here on earth and trust God for the future.
I do hope this helps.
Shalom
Ted:-6
Part of the issue here is what one thinks about the Bible as a book and what the Divine is like.
The Bible was never meant to be taken literally. Such a view leads one into all kinds of absurdities.
Down through the millenia man has been searching for God. Brain research has shown that there is a part of the brain dealing with that search and it has been there since man began. So down through the years humans have had experiences of the Divine and here I am not speaking of the God of the gaps. If one studies the basis of all of the world's great faiths it becomes clear that there were two; justice and compassion. Personally I think there can be nothing more important. Thus there were many different experiences and interpretations of those experiences.
The reality of the Divine is not provable in scientific terms. Science is far too limited.
There have been sever very spiritual people down through the centuries all pointing to the Divine. Oh, they gave the Divine many names: the Great Spirit, Allah, YHWH , Elohim etc. When it comes down to it, if one accepts the reality of God there is only one ultimate source and some of us have chosen the name "God"
However, we face a very difficult task in trying to decide what God is like and what he looks like etc. The Divine is simply beyond human language and comprehension abilities. The moment we try to define or describe this reality we are attempting to box the Divine in and this is impossible.
Some read "Revelation" as a predictor of the end times. That is not what it was written about. At best the Bible consists of interpretations of events of the various writers.. We have no idea what the future holds. We believe that at sometime there will be some great consummation but ????? There will be no great Divine cleanup as some think.
The whole point is to go back to those bases. Look at what not only Jesus taught, but the prophets and the other great spiritual leaders of the past.
The messaage is very short and clear both in the OT in Micah 6:8 and Matt 22.
We are to do justice, be compassionate and walk humbly with God. Part of the problem is the use of the term believe. The Greek word translated as believe is more correctly translated as trust. It is not about right belief but about living in a loving, transforming relationship with God. We can find this in all of the great faiths around the world. We just have to get past the fundamentalist approach which is inappropriate.
It is up to us to help bring about God's kingdom here on earth and trust God for the future.
I do hope this helps.
Shalom
Ted:-6
What did God do to the fallen ones?
Themis:-6
I understand your position as well.
I too faced that but then decided to do something about it. It really is up to us to change what we do not like in our society. It is true that one person cannot do a great deal but at least it is a start. The more folks who get on board the better chance we have of making changes.
Might I suggest you read Matthew 25:31ff.
There are pockets of people around the world and they are making a defference in their own societies.
Shalom
Ted:-6
I understand your position as well.
I too faced that but then decided to do something about it. It really is up to us to change what we do not like in our society. It is true that one person cannot do a great deal but at least it is a start. The more folks who get on board the better chance we have of making changes.
Might I suggest you read Matthew 25:31ff.
There are pockets of people around the world and they are making a defference in their own societies.
Shalom
Ted:-6