The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
spot wrote: You missed it, Abbey. The thread has a post inviting Koan to put her daughter at what the poster regards as high risk, which is about as personal an attack as you could hope to land. Nobody has ever offered me any abuse. I suspect that the assumption is that Koan can take it, being tough, but that I'd crumple.this is my exact quote spot...i see no "invitation". simply a question, albiet sarcastic. "so you'll be renting her a room then? and introducing her to your young daughter? ".where's the so-called attack? perhaps there's another thread you could go hijack somewhere.
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
lady cop wrote: this is my exact quote spot...i see no "invitation". simply a question, albiet sarcastic. "so you'll be renting her a room then? and introducing her to your young daughter? ".where's the so-called attack? perhaps there's another thread you could go hijack somewhere. You must, surely, be joking, Lady. If you don't see the unpleasant side of that, you should ask for advice.
Perhaps you could replace that ignore setting, it was quite peaceful while you had it set.
Perhaps you could replace that ignore setting, it was quite peaceful while you had it set.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
spot wrote: You must, surely, be joking, Lady. If you don't see the unpleasant side of that, you should ask for advice.
Perhaps you could replace that ignore setting, it was quite peaceful while you had it set.i don't disturb the peace spot, i rarely acknowledge you. but now you've backpedaled from all-out "attack" to "unpleasant"? why, pray, do i need 'advice'? because i am anti-criminal -murderer -pervert -pedophile? well beat me, whip me, make me write bad checks. i am totally unrepentant and don't give a damn, it's my purpose in life, to keep scum like karla from getting to other peoples' kids. yes i was sarcastic...there's a device YOU have never employed. this entire thread is rife with those who disagree with you. yet i am your handy target. i did not attack anyone! show me where i did.
Perhaps you could replace that ignore setting, it was quite peaceful while you had it set.i don't disturb the peace spot, i rarely acknowledge you. but now you've backpedaled from all-out "attack" to "unpleasant"? why, pray, do i need 'advice'? because i am anti-criminal -murderer -pervert -pedophile? well beat me, whip me, make me write bad checks. i am totally unrepentant and don't give a damn, it's my purpose in life, to keep scum like karla from getting to other peoples' kids. yes i was sarcastic...there's a device YOU have never employed. this entire thread is rife with those who disagree with you. yet i am your handy target. i did not attack anyone! show me where i did.
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
koan wrote: Only lynch mob mentality refuses to care or to put the effort into prevention.
If the mob lynches a serial killer, doesn't that "prevent" them from committing further crimes?
:wah:
If the mob lynches a serial killer, doesn't that "prevent" them from committing further crimes?
:wah:
All the world's a stage and the men and women merely players...Shakespeare
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
I'm with LadyCop on this one. Koan, you opened the door with the permissive / dismissive attitude and all LC did was call you on it.
All the world's a stage and the men and women merely players...Shakespeare
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
:yh_rotfl
There ya go. Don't you feel better now you got that off your chest, FR?
Jives wrote: If the mob lynches a serial killer, doesn't that "prevent" them from committing further crimes?
You missed the point. That one killer is gone but more will follow. I have never said I thought that Homolka should be pitied. I am against the death penalty for a variety of reasons but that has been covered in other threads.
Far from inviting her to my home, which is patently ridiculous, I suggest that there may be ways to prevent more people from becoming serial killers, bank robbers, rapists, and the like. My clinical attitude towards the subject seems to cause knee-jerk reactions of outrage. Society will never be finished advancing, one can only hope. But hope does not make improvements, study and proactive response are required. One of the points here is we have to live with the society that has been created and the laws that are in place. If it is not satisfactory then we must think of how to improve them. Where the heat comes on is the debate over what changes would be a legitimate improvement. The idea that criminal attitudes could be treated before the crime is commited, I think, is a rather grand one.
I dislike having my thought out comments on this thread thrown to the wind by ridiculous assumptions and sweeping generalizations. I believe the Garden is capable of serious thought and consideration.
Far Rider. Thanks for a good chuckle.
There ya go. Don't you feel better now you got that off your chest, FR?
Jives wrote: If the mob lynches a serial killer, doesn't that "prevent" them from committing further crimes?
You missed the point. That one killer is gone but more will follow. I have never said I thought that Homolka should be pitied. I am against the death penalty for a variety of reasons but that has been covered in other threads.
Far from inviting her to my home, which is patently ridiculous, I suggest that there may be ways to prevent more people from becoming serial killers, bank robbers, rapists, and the like. My clinical attitude towards the subject seems to cause knee-jerk reactions of outrage. Society will never be finished advancing, one can only hope. But hope does not make improvements, study and proactive response are required. One of the points here is we have to live with the society that has been created and the laws that are in place. If it is not satisfactory then we must think of how to improve them. Where the heat comes on is the debate over what changes would be a legitimate improvement. The idea that criminal attitudes could be treated before the crime is commited, I think, is a rather grand one.
I dislike having my thought out comments on this thread thrown to the wind by ridiculous assumptions and sweeping generalizations. I believe the Garden is capable of serious thought and consideration.
Far Rider. Thanks for a good chuckle.
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
This might help the thread along, maybe:
[20:50] Koan: nobody seemed to get that I am not an Homolka apologist...I do believe that the law is the law though. One permitted vigilante throws law to chaos.
[20:51] Spot: I don't think there can be many people who feel she should not have been jailed. Wouldn't that be an apologist?
[20:52] Koan: an apologist is one who justifies and defends someone/thing.
[20:53] Koan: in a way, saying society is to blame for Homolka is being an apologist but the point was never to justify her only to prevent more "hers" from happening.
[20:53] Spot: so one could be a non-apologist for her actions but an apologist for her current attempt to move back into community life? I've never thought society was to blame for her actions.
[20:55] Koan: exactly the term does not really apply to either of our positions.
[20:56] Spot: I've never had an abusive partner threaten me with death if I didn't go along with him. I've seen couples like it, it's very hard to get between them and show the abused one that she can walk away in safety. I've done that, once. It took months.
[20:57] Koan: I've tried to help many abused women leave. It doesn't work very often. For a short time then they often go back.
[20:58] Koan: I'm not convinced that she was completely coerced in the crimes. But drs say she is not exhibiting psychopathy, they would know better than any of us.
[21:00] Spot: All I'm certain of is that she's no more a danger to the community than you are. Given which, she can have any benefit of the doubt that's going, from me. I much prefer to take people at their word a dozen times, than miss the moment when they're being straight.
[21:01] Spot: I'm quite sure she'd never have murdered anyone if she hadn't got tied up with that guy in the first place, too.
[21:01] Koan: she would never get away with it again. not even a lesser crime. she'll be pulled in and questioned on anything that happens in her neighbourhood.
[21:01] Spot: isn't that as good a reason as her being completely reformed? It sets the scene for her to work out her own life without endangering anyone else.
[21:02] Koan: absolutely. she's probably of less danger to society than I am.
[20:50] Koan: nobody seemed to get that I am not an Homolka apologist...I do believe that the law is the law though. One permitted vigilante throws law to chaos.
[20:51] Spot: I don't think there can be many people who feel she should not have been jailed. Wouldn't that be an apologist?
[20:52] Koan: an apologist is one who justifies and defends someone/thing.
[20:53] Koan: in a way, saying society is to blame for Homolka is being an apologist but the point was never to justify her only to prevent more "hers" from happening.
[20:53] Spot: so one could be a non-apologist for her actions but an apologist for her current attempt to move back into community life? I've never thought society was to blame for her actions.
[20:55] Koan: exactly the term does not really apply to either of our positions.
[20:56] Spot: I've never had an abusive partner threaten me with death if I didn't go along with him. I've seen couples like it, it's very hard to get between them and show the abused one that she can walk away in safety. I've done that, once. It took months.
[20:57] Koan: I've tried to help many abused women leave. It doesn't work very often. For a short time then they often go back.
[20:58] Koan: I'm not convinced that she was completely coerced in the crimes. But drs say she is not exhibiting psychopathy, they would know better than any of us.
[21:00] Spot: All I'm certain of is that she's no more a danger to the community than you are. Given which, she can have any benefit of the doubt that's going, from me. I much prefer to take people at their word a dozen times, than miss the moment when they're being straight.
[21:01] Spot: I'm quite sure she'd never have murdered anyone if she hadn't got tied up with that guy in the first place, too.
[21:01] Koan: she would never get away with it again. not even a lesser crime. she'll be pulled in and questioned on anything that happens in her neighbourhood.
[21:01] Spot: isn't that as good a reason as her being completely reformed? It sets the scene for her to work out her own life without endangering anyone else.
[21:02] Koan: absolutely. she's probably of less danger to society than I am.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
was that supposed to have a point? if karla homolka spit on the sidewalk i'd make sure her probation was violated. and if that makes me a braying lynch mob, OH WELL. i noticed you didn't address this post infra spot.....i hope we're not going to be treated to many more of your private conversations signifying nothing. oh , and lest anyone who has NEVER read my posts or threads misunderstand, i believe in lady justice and due process with all my being. don't disturb the peace spot, i rarely acknowledge you. but now you've backpedaled from all-out "attack" to "unpleasant"? why, pray, do i need 'advice'? because i am anti-criminal -murderer -pervert -pedophile? well beat me, whip me, make me write bad checks. i am totally unrepentant and don't give a damn, it's my purpose in life, to keep scum like karla from getting to other peoples' kids. yes i was sarcastic...there's a device YOU have never employed. this entire thread is rife with those who disagree with you. yet i am your handy target. i did not attack anyone! show me where i did.
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
koan wrote: I suggest that there may be ways to prevent more people from becoming serial killers, bank robbers, rapists, and the like..
And I suggest that there are people such as this woman who can never be helped or changed, no matter how much "therapy" they recieve. Death is the only solution to keep society safe from them.
And I suggest that there are people such as this woman who can never be helped or changed, no matter how much "therapy" they recieve. Death is the only solution to keep society safe from them.
All the world's a stage and the men and women merely players...Shakespeare
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
spot wrote: This might help the thread along, maybe:
[20:50] Koan: nobody seemed to get that I am not an Homolka apologist...I do believe that the law is the law though. One permitted vigilante throws law to chaos.
[20:51] Spot: I don't think there can be many people who feel she should not have been jailed. Wouldn't that be an apologist?
[20:52] Koan: an apologist is one who justifies and defends someone/thing.
[20:53] Koan: in a way, saying society is to blame for Homolka is being an apologist but the point was never to justify her only to prevent more "hers" from happening.
[20:53] Spot: so one could be a non-apologist for her actions but an apologist for her current attempt to move back into community life? I've never thought society was to blame for her actions.
[20:55] Koan: exactly the term does not really apply to either of our positions.
[20:56] Spot: I've never had an abusive partner threaten me with death if I didn't go along with him. I've seen couples like it, it's very hard to get between them and show the abused one that she can walk away in safety. I've done that, once. It took months.
[20:57] Koan: I've tried to help many abused women leave. It doesn't work very often. For a short time then they often go back.
[20:58] Koan: I'm not convinced that she was completely coerced in the crimes. But drs say she is not exhibiting psychopathy, they would know better than any of us.
[21:00] Spot: All I'm certain of is that she's no more a danger to the community than you are. Given which, she can have any benefit of the doubt that's going, from me. I much prefer to take people at their word a dozen times, than miss the moment when they're being straight.
[21:01] Spot: I'm quite sure she'd never have murdered anyone if she hadn't got tied up with that guy in the first place, too.
[21:01] Koan: she would never get away with it again. not even a lesser crime. she'll be pulled in and questioned on anything that happens in her neighbourhood.
[21:01] Spot: isn't that as good a reason as her being completely reformed? It sets the scene for her to work out her own life without endangering anyone else.
[21:02] Koan: absolutely. she's probably of less danger to society than I am.How does this help the thread along?
You and Koan are entitled to your softly softly approach to murdering scum, as are us sensible people that would like nothing more than to see them rot in hell.
I get so fed up of bleeding heart liberals that feel the need to re-introduce scum like this back into society, i would'nt like her living in my neighbourhood, what's to say she is'nt going to go into another alledged abusive relationship and ordered to help them rape & murder?
[20:50] Koan: nobody seemed to get that I am not an Homolka apologist...I do believe that the law is the law though. One permitted vigilante throws law to chaos.
[20:51] Spot: I don't think there can be many people who feel she should not have been jailed. Wouldn't that be an apologist?
[20:52] Koan: an apologist is one who justifies and defends someone/thing.
[20:53] Koan: in a way, saying society is to blame for Homolka is being an apologist but the point was never to justify her only to prevent more "hers" from happening.
[20:53] Spot: so one could be a non-apologist for her actions but an apologist for her current attempt to move back into community life? I've never thought society was to blame for her actions.
[20:55] Koan: exactly the term does not really apply to either of our positions.
[20:56] Spot: I've never had an abusive partner threaten me with death if I didn't go along with him. I've seen couples like it, it's very hard to get between them and show the abused one that she can walk away in safety. I've done that, once. It took months.
[20:57] Koan: I've tried to help many abused women leave. It doesn't work very often. For a short time then they often go back.
[20:58] Koan: I'm not convinced that she was completely coerced in the crimes. But drs say she is not exhibiting psychopathy, they would know better than any of us.
[21:00] Spot: All I'm certain of is that she's no more a danger to the community than you are. Given which, she can have any benefit of the doubt that's going, from me. I much prefer to take people at their word a dozen times, than miss the moment when they're being straight.
[21:01] Spot: I'm quite sure she'd never have murdered anyone if she hadn't got tied up with that guy in the first place, too.
[21:01] Koan: she would never get away with it again. not even a lesser crime. she'll be pulled in and questioned on anything that happens in her neighbourhood.
[21:01] Spot: isn't that as good a reason as her being completely reformed? It sets the scene for her to work out her own life without endangering anyone else.
[21:02] Koan: absolutely. she's probably of less danger to society than I am.How does this help the thread along?
You and Koan are entitled to your softly softly approach to murdering scum, as are us sensible people that would like nothing more than to see them rot in hell.
I get so fed up of bleeding heart liberals that feel the need to re-introduce scum like this back into society, i would'nt like her living in my neighbourhood, what's to say she is'nt going to go into another alledged abusive relationship and ordered to help them rape & murder?
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
Jives wrote: And I suggest that there are people such as this woman who can never be helped or changed, no matter how much "therapy" they recieve. Death is the only solution to keep society safe from them.
Neither of us is alone in our opinion.
The death penalty has not shown to be a legitimate deterrent to crime. It has been shown to be the executor of innocent people. Why do we not mourn for those wrongfully executed as much as we mourn for the victims of the crime these folk didn't commit?
But this is turning into a death penalty thread which is not desirable or intended.
I thought this thread was about whether vigilantes should be allowed retribution...or whether people earn their freedom after their sentence has been served...or even about how to prevent citizens from becoming murderers. The death penalty only applies after a murder has been committed, and that's too late. Unless we are not trying to save people, just avenge them.
Neither of us is alone in our opinion.
The death penalty has not shown to be a legitimate deterrent to crime. It has been shown to be the executor of innocent people. Why do we not mourn for those wrongfully executed as much as we mourn for the victims of the crime these folk didn't commit?
But this is turning into a death penalty thread which is not desirable or intended.
I thought this thread was about whether vigilantes should be allowed retribution...or whether people earn their freedom after their sentence has been served...or even about how to prevent citizens from becoming murderers. The death penalty only applies after a murder has been committed, and that's too late. Unless we are not trying to save people, just avenge them.
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
koan wrote: The death penalty has not shown to be a legitimate deterrent to crime.
Wrong. Not a SINGLE CRIME has ever been committed by a criminal who was put to death. Now that's what I call a good deterrent!
(and that includes crimes against other inmates!)
Wrong. Not a SINGLE CRIME has ever been committed by a criminal who was put to death. Now that's what I call a good deterrent!
(and that includes crimes against other inmates!)
All the world's a stage and the men and women merely players...Shakespeare
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
Worse yet, this murderer is UNREMORSEFUL AND UNREHABILITATED! There's a high probability that someone will die because of this. 
All the world's a stage and the men and women merely players...Shakespeare
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
Jives wrote: Wrong. Not a SINGLE CRIME has ever been committed by a criminal who was put to death. Now that's what I call a good deterrent!
(and that includes crimes against other inmates!) :DJives, do you know what the word deterrent means? It doesn't mean preventative. It's about deterring others, not preventing repeat offences. It is the most unlikely and undemonstrated effect of either capital punishment or of jail time that I've ever read about.
http://www.forumgarden.com/forums/showp ... stcount=26 mentions, in passing, over a dozen innocent people who would have undoubtedly been killed by the state, had the state retained the death penalty. That's the thread to discuss the death penaly in.
And in saying "Worse yet, this murderer is UNREMORSEFUL AND UNREHABILITATED!", are you saying that remorse does actually make a difference whether a person should be paroled or released into society? I thought the consensus was that it made not a jot of difference at all. I thought "what in the hell good is an apology after the crime??? It means squat", and "Theres no second chances when you commit a violent crime in my book", and "Not being trusted to freely walk society again is one of those consequences" was the general view of the thread. Where does remorse fit into your scheme of life, if your attitude regardless is "Lock 'em all up and throw away the key"?
(and that includes crimes against other inmates!) :DJives, do you know what the word deterrent means? It doesn't mean preventative. It's about deterring others, not preventing repeat offences. It is the most unlikely and undemonstrated effect of either capital punishment or of jail time that I've ever read about.
http://www.forumgarden.com/forums/showp ... stcount=26 mentions, in passing, over a dozen innocent people who would have undoubtedly been killed by the state, had the state retained the death penalty. That's the thread to discuss the death penaly in.
And in saying "Worse yet, this murderer is UNREMORSEFUL AND UNREHABILITATED!", are you saying that remorse does actually make a difference whether a person should be paroled or released into society? I thought the consensus was that it made not a jot of difference at all. I thought "what in the hell good is an apology after the crime??? It means squat", and "Theres no second chances when you commit a violent crime in my book", and "Not being trusted to freely walk society again is one of those consequences" was the general view of the thread. Where does remorse fit into your scheme of life, if your attitude regardless is "Lock 'em all up and throw away the key"?
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
I found the following site that summarized my POV quite nicely. I agree with this bloke.
The Media has whipped the public into a frenzy.
The Media, The Crown, Tim Danson and others have played fast-and-loose with the facts.
The Deal with the Devil was a miscarriage of justice and a serious screwup by the Crown, but the crown gets to take comfort in the fact that the public, somewhat blindly, blames it on Karla -- who had it handed to her on a silver platter. But make no mistake, the Crown is responsible, not Karla.
IF Karla had received life in prison? I think that would've been spiffy. But she didn't.
Karla has served her time and is now free -- threatening, stalking, and treating her like an animal only raises the spectre that she'll act like an animal. I suspect that if left alone, she'll be fine.
Karla HAS expressed remorse. That is a fact, despite what Tim Danson and others say. The public refuses to accept her expressions of remorse, and that's different than her not expressing it at all.
No matter what Karla does or says, Tim Danson and various media outlets will only see sinister motives behind it. If she were to save a drowning child from a raging river, Karla detractors would say it was simply because she intended to victimize the child later on.
Karla probably isn't a psychopath. Of the 10 psychologists/psychiatrists that have directly evaluated her, all 10 have agreed on that. Tim Danson is fond of quoting TWO who only reviewed her files, but never evaluated her directly. Those two said she was a psychopath.
Karla should not do any more media interviews. They don't help her.
What Karla did was disgusting and outrageous -- and if Canadians don't like the outcome, they need to direct their anger at the Crown, not at Karla -- or they run the risk of making the same mistake over and over again. Don't let them fool you into directing your displeasure over "the deal" at the wrong target.
The Media has whipped the public into a frenzy.
The Media, The Crown, Tim Danson and others have played fast-and-loose with the facts.
The Deal with the Devil was a miscarriage of justice and a serious screwup by the Crown, but the crown gets to take comfort in the fact that the public, somewhat blindly, blames it on Karla -- who had it handed to her on a silver platter. But make no mistake, the Crown is responsible, not Karla.
IF Karla had received life in prison? I think that would've been spiffy. But she didn't.
Karla has served her time and is now free -- threatening, stalking, and treating her like an animal only raises the spectre that she'll act like an animal. I suspect that if left alone, she'll be fine.
Karla HAS expressed remorse. That is a fact, despite what Tim Danson and others say. The public refuses to accept her expressions of remorse, and that's different than her not expressing it at all.
No matter what Karla does or says, Tim Danson and various media outlets will only see sinister motives behind it. If she were to save a drowning child from a raging river, Karla detractors would say it was simply because she intended to victimize the child later on.
Karla probably isn't a psychopath. Of the 10 psychologists/psychiatrists that have directly evaluated her, all 10 have agreed on that. Tim Danson is fond of quoting TWO who only reviewed her files, but never evaluated her directly. Those two said she was a psychopath.
Karla should not do any more media interviews. They don't help her.
What Karla did was disgusting and outrageous -- and if Canadians don't like the outcome, they need to direct their anger at the Crown, not at Karla -- or they run the risk of making the same mistake over and over again. Don't let them fool you into directing your displeasure over "the deal" at the wrong target.
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
lady cop wrote: was that supposed to have a point? if karla homolka spit on the sidewalk i'd make sure her probation was violated. and if that makes me a braying lynch mob, OH WELL. i noticed you didn't address this post infra spot.....i hope we're not going to be treated to many more of your private conversations signifying nothing. oh , and lest anyone who has NEVER read my posts or threads misunderstand, i believe in lady justice and due process with all my being. don't disturb the peace spot, i rarely acknowledge you. but now you've backpedaled from all-out "attack" to "unpleasant"? why, pray, do i need 'advice'? because i am anti-criminal -murderer -pervert -pedophile? well beat me, whip me, make me write bad checks. i am totally unrepentant and don't give a damn, it's my purpose in life, to keep scum like karla from getting to other peoples' kids. yes i was sarcastic...there's a device YOU have never employed. this entire thread is rife with those who disagree with you. yet i am your handy target. i did not attack anyone! show me where i did.
THIS is who makes our neighborhoods safe!! Not a Freudian analyst who thinks Karla's problems were because of her repressed anger towards her mother/father....(fill in your choice)....and she's all better now!
Could not agree more, LC!
THIS is who makes our neighborhoods safe!! Not a Freudian analyst who thinks Karla's problems were because of her repressed anger towards her mother/father....(fill in your choice)....and she's all better now!
Could not agree more, LC!
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
Far Rider wrote: She shoudl stop whining and start realizing because of her actions most reasonable people would not trust her.Just so I can follow your argument, how would she do that if she were, as you wish, dead? What good is such a realization going to be to her if a vigilante succeeds in murdering her? What option does she have that would bring her any benefit for the rest of her natural life, in your view of things, if remorse is something she's not capable of and rehabilitation is something you deny her? It's just as well none of us have an influence over her fate.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
Far Rider wrote: There is no rehabilitation for murder. You murder and you die, thats justice.What you mean is there's no rehabilitation for being convicted of murder. Your way, if you're convicted of murder, you die. You know as well as I do that a proportion of those convicted of murder are innocent. You'd have them dead too. That's not justice, however judicial it is. You never seem to have addressed that.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
KARLA, Is a killer, my guess she will kill again. She got her sorry butt out this time because she turned on her husband. I will put money on her killing again. There is no rehab for the likes of her, she is using the system now, and will continue to do so till she sets the stage for another slaughter. Keep her sorry ass in Canada let her prey on your loved ones, believe me she will kill again.
I have no pity for her, or anyone who murders over and over again for the thrill, this is evil through and through.
Koan, and Spot You can defend her till the cows come, you can study her for any reason's you like, and it still won't change the facts, she is a monster of a human being who kills for the thrill of it, and she will kill again. :-5
Your arguments are wasted on all of us who have an ounce of common sense. I hope some one kills her sorry ass, before she kills again. She is useless member of society and she has no one to blame but her murdering sorry butt. :-5
I have no pity for her, or anyone who murders over and over again for the thrill, this is evil through and through.
Koan, and Spot You can defend her till the cows come, you can study her for any reason's you like, and it still won't change the facts, she is a monster of a human being who kills for the thrill of it, and she will kill again. :-5
Your arguments are wasted on all of us who have an ounce of common sense. I hope some one kills her sorry ass, before she kills again. She is useless member of society and she has no one to blame but her murdering sorry butt. :-5
ALOHA!!
MOTTO TO LIVE BY:
"Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, chocolate in one hand, champagne in the other, body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming.
WOO HOO!!, what a ride!!!"
MOTTO TO LIVE BY:
"Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, chocolate in one hand, champagne in the other, body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming.
WOO HOO!!, what a ride!!!"
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
Thanks for that personal opinion, CARLA. I will take it for what it means to me, and you know what that is.
FR
you must appreciate that spot and I are both asked for statistical proof of most of what we say and usually are able to find it. That is how much we care about what we say here. We both spend a lot of time finding proof for our arguments while every opposing statement is blatantly accepted as the status quo. What you ask for is very time consuming but we will look for numbers because they exist. Unfortunately our efforts are rarely complimented or rewarded.
FR
you must appreciate that spot and I are both asked for statistical proof of most of what we say and usually are able to find it. That is how much we care about what we say here. We both spend a lot of time finding proof for our arguments while every opposing statement is blatantly accepted as the status quo. What you ask for is very time consuming but we will look for numbers because they exist. Unfortunately our efforts are rarely complimented or rewarded.
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
this thread is not about statistics. it's about homolka. and the opinions and or life/work experiences of people who post are as important as any stats. including Carla's. sorry no compliments or rewards were forthcoming. :-1
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
Far Rider wrote: Well let me see... name the number of folks that have been put to death for Murder in the US that didn't do it. And you have judicial proof that they didnt do it.
And I did address it, I said you murder you die. You have to test for who murdered and who didn't. The only test you have is those found guilty of murder. You know perfectly well that that total will include some who didn't commit the crime of which they were found guilty. You know perfectly well that your "you murder you die" formula involves killing some people who didn't commit the crime of which they were found guilty, along with those who did. When I said "What you mean is there's no rehabilitation for being convicted of murder", that's the only way you can implement your mantra. You murder, you die. You get convicted of a murder you didn't commit, you die too.
I have the totals you were asking for, though they're for my own part of the world since here I have UK source material on my shelves to work with. I'm not American. If you want the American figures as well, I'm sure you're up to finding them.
A total of 195 people were hanged in England and Wales between 1945 and 1965, when the death penalty was abolished. That gives us a baseline of what the minimum proportion of innocent people killed by the state here has been, because of those 195, three have so far been granted posthumous pardons. None of the three pardoned had, it turned out, killed anyone. One had burgled. Two had never committed crimes. That's one innocent man executed each seven years.
The other figure I have is that of all the convicted killers released "on licence" between 1972 and 1990, at a rate of 50 a year, a total of thirteen killed again, mostly within two years of their release. That's one murder by a released killer every year and a half, by one in 75 of those released.
Now, let's not play lives-in-a-balance with those numbers. In my opinion, they have nothing to do with each other. The 1.5% innocent death rate is appalling. The 1.5% repeat murder rate is appalling. I think the first is high enough to warrant a refusal to kill convicted murderers, and I don't see any way of reducing it, that's the total in the best judicial environment on the planet. I think the second needs to be reduced, it's a terrible total. It's why I'm arguing for an increase in effective rehabilitation effort, instead of equating jail time to punishment or deterrence.
And I did address it, I said you murder you die. You have to test for who murdered and who didn't. The only test you have is those found guilty of murder. You know perfectly well that that total will include some who didn't commit the crime of which they were found guilty. You know perfectly well that your "you murder you die" formula involves killing some people who didn't commit the crime of which they were found guilty, along with those who did. When I said "What you mean is there's no rehabilitation for being convicted of murder", that's the only way you can implement your mantra. You murder, you die. You get convicted of a murder you didn't commit, you die too.
I have the totals you were asking for, though they're for my own part of the world since here I have UK source material on my shelves to work with. I'm not American. If you want the American figures as well, I'm sure you're up to finding them.
A total of 195 people were hanged in England and Wales between 1945 and 1965, when the death penalty was abolished. That gives us a baseline of what the minimum proportion of innocent people killed by the state here has been, because of those 195, three have so far been granted posthumous pardons. None of the three pardoned had, it turned out, killed anyone. One had burgled. Two had never committed crimes. That's one innocent man executed each seven years.
The other figure I have is that of all the convicted killers released "on licence" between 1972 and 1990, at a rate of 50 a year, a total of thirteen killed again, mostly within two years of their release. That's one murder by a released killer every year and a half, by one in 75 of those released.
Now, let's not play lives-in-a-balance with those numbers. In my opinion, they have nothing to do with each other. The 1.5% innocent death rate is appalling. The 1.5% repeat murder rate is appalling. I think the first is high enough to warrant a refusal to kill convicted murderers, and I don't see any way of reducing it, that's the total in the best judicial environment on the planet. I think the second needs to be reduced, it's a terrible total. It's why I'm arguing for an increase in effective rehabilitation effort, instead of equating jail time to punishment or deterrence.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
lc
I beg to differ. CARLA spoke about "facts". I want to see them.
I haven't noticed my or spots opinions being considered valuable, excuse me for defending myself...make me write bad cheques.
I beg to differ. CARLA spoke about "facts". I want to see them.
I haven't noticed my or spots opinions being considered valuable, excuse me for defending myself...make me write bad cheques.
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
my god I hope we all can meet here again same group same place when they release Paul Bernardo Karla Homalka's ex husband an co murderer. Oh what a donny brook that will be.
And for the record poor poor frightened goldilocks oooops Carla Homalka remains holed up hiding in some appartment in Montreal (I think) fearing the media. GOOOD may she bloody fear something!!!!!!
And for the record poor poor frightened goldilocks oooops Carla Homalka remains holed up hiding in some appartment in Montreal (I think) fearing the media. GOOOD may she bloody fear something!!!!!!
�You only live once, but if you do it right, once is enough.�
• Mae West
• Mae West
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
minks wrote: my god I hope we all can meet here again same group same place when they release Paul Bernardo Karla Homalka's ex husband an co murderer. Oh what a donny brook that will be.It seems unlikely that we can. His earliest parole, if the board ignores the recommendations, is in 2020, and he's likely to be there at least ten years beyond that point with the "dangerous" tag that was added later. That puts him in his mid-sixties. Where does it put the rest of us? Underground? I, for one, don't expect to be typing any longer.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
oh and let's not forget in "protective custody" I might add.
2020 huh ok I will aim to hang on till then hehehehe
2020 huh ok I will aim to hang on till then hehehehe
�You only live once, but if you do it right, once is enough.�
• Mae West
• Mae West
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
minks wrote: 2020 huh ok I will aim to hang on till then heheheheWhen we get there, maybe you'll occasionally lend me your remaining tooth, minks? I certainly don't expect to have a full set left by then. We could hand an ear-trumpet back and forth and shout at each other.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
spot wrote: When we get there, maybe you'll occasionally lend me your remaining tooth, minks? I certainly don't expect to have a full set left by then. We could hand an ear-trumpet back and forth and shout at each other.
perfect meet ya here in 2020 I will besure to bring an extra bottle of oxygen as I sense some rather erratic breathing going on as the discussion intensifies.
Would love to stay and jaw with you but I am darn tired.
Cheers
perfect meet ya here in 2020 I will besure to bring an extra bottle of oxygen as I sense some rather erratic breathing going on as the discussion intensifies.
Would love to stay and jaw with you but I am darn tired.
Cheers
�You only live once, but if you do it right, once is enough.�
• Mae West
• Mae West
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
lady cop wrote: so you'll be renting her a room then? and introducing her to your young daughter? poor karla, a product of her environment and the media spotlight. but wait--she had no media attention prior to committing her depraved murderous acts... oh, i know, it's her parents' fault! yes, that's it... no, it's her husband's fault, just because she looked positively gleeful in the videos of torture and murder it's society's fault! am i getting warm? whose fault is it again? yes,stone killers are solely here for our hanging entertainment.
Some poeple think they could intellectualize an issue as terrible as this, which amounts to hopeless pedantic jargons that are of no help to anybody. The likes of Karla know not the value of life hence do not deserve it. It will be a judicial blunder to let her out on the streets. She (Karla) is not helped in this regard, neither is society, rather, it's just more (unnecessary) work for the cops, who already have a lot on their hands.
Some poeple think they could intellectualize an issue as terrible as this, which amounts to hopeless pedantic jargons that are of no help to anybody. The likes of Karla know not the value of life hence do not deserve it. It will be a judicial blunder to let her out on the streets. She (Karla) is not helped in this regard, neither is society, rather, it's just more (unnecessary) work for the cops, who already have a lot on their hands.
A formula for tact: "Be brief politely, be aggressive smilingly, be emphatic pleasantly, be positive diplomatically, be right graciously".
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
I don't get it. Are people now supposed to feel secure because some shrinks say she's not a psychopath? She was never deemed a psychopath by the shrinks after she was first locked up!!
But hey, she's reformed now - she says so herself! What else do you think she would say - ''Well, no, I'm itching to kill some more young girls, so you better keep me locked up!''
She took part in three known murders, one of which was her own sister. She took part in an unknown number of rapes. All over a six year span that only ended because she was caught. Let's seriously consider that if they did this over six years, there may be a few more bodies we don't know about - one murder every two years would have been pretty boring for them, I would imagiine. I mean, they got such a thrill out of it, they extended their fun with a few days of torture for each victim.
So if she wasn't a psychopath then, and isn't one now, I guess we should all feel good knowing prison hasn't changed her for the worse!!
But hey, she's reformed now - she says so herself! What else do you think she would say - ''Well, no, I'm itching to kill some more young girls, so you better keep me locked up!''
She took part in three known murders, one of which was her own sister. She took part in an unknown number of rapes. All over a six year span that only ended because she was caught. Let's seriously consider that if they did this over six years, there may be a few more bodies we don't know about - one murder every two years would have been pretty boring for them, I would imagiine. I mean, they got such a thrill out of it, they extended their fun with a few days of torture for each victim.
So if she wasn't a psychopath then, and isn't one now, I guess we should all feel good knowing prison hasn't changed her for the worse!!
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
Well said Mink,
Poor Karla is afraid, to damn bad. Now maybe she can feel the fear all her young victims felt as she bound and tortured them for days before killing them. Nah!! she has no conscience never did, never will. The only person KARLA worries about is KARLA. Poor baby is afraid someone might hurt her Murdering ass, I hope they torment her to death daily. She belongs back in jail, let the inmates take care of her. This women is no more reformed than Charlie Manson is. Big mistake letter her out and on the streets, I wonder how many more will die at the hands of KARLA.
my god I hope we all can meet here again same group same place when they release Paul Bernardo Karla Homalka's ex husband an co murderer. Oh what a donny brook that will be.
And for the record poor poor frightened goldilocks oooops Carla Homalka remains holed up hiding in some appartment in Montreal (I think) fearing the media. GOOOD may she bloody fear something!!!!!!
Poor Karla is afraid, to damn bad. Now maybe she can feel the fear all her young victims felt as she bound and tortured them for days before killing them. Nah!! she has no conscience never did, never will. The only person KARLA worries about is KARLA. Poor baby is afraid someone might hurt her Murdering ass, I hope they torment her to death daily. She belongs back in jail, let the inmates take care of her. This women is no more reformed than Charlie Manson is. Big mistake letter her out and on the streets, I wonder how many more will die at the hands of KARLA.
my god I hope we all can meet here again same group same place when they release Paul Bernardo Karla Homalka's ex husband an co murderer. Oh what a donny brook that will be.
And for the record poor poor frightened goldilocks oooops Carla Homalka remains holed up hiding in some appartment in Montreal (I think) fearing the media. GOOOD may she bloody fear something!!!!!!
ALOHA!!
MOTTO TO LIVE BY:
"Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, chocolate in one hand, champagne in the other, body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming.
WOO HOO!!, what a ride!!!"
MOTTO TO LIVE BY:
"Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, chocolate in one hand, champagne in the other, body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming.
WOO HOO!!, what a ride!!!"
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
polycarp wrote: Some poeple think they could intellectualize an issue as terrible as this, which amounts to hopeless pedantic jargons that are of no help to anybody.
I disagree. What seems like useless/hopeless jargon is the current justice system. Neither the death penalty nor incarceration have deterred crime in it's long history. To refuse to look at it intellectually means living with a failing system.
This thread, for instance, has a circular, useless quality to it. It seems that the point is to yell and scream "Monster" to make ourselves feel better. For me it doesn't. I just end up wondering why we are doing nothing to prevent the next "monster" from developing. Criminals don't plan on getting caught. This being the case it is useless in deterrence to focus on what we do to them afterward. It is of no help to anybody to vent frustrations with a bunch of name calling and pretend that killers are not human.
I disagree. What seems like useless/hopeless jargon is the current justice system. Neither the death penalty nor incarceration have deterred crime in it's long history. To refuse to look at it intellectually means living with a failing system.
This thread, for instance, has a circular, useless quality to it. It seems that the point is to yell and scream "Monster" to make ourselves feel better. For me it doesn't. I just end up wondering why we are doing nothing to prevent the next "monster" from developing. Criminals don't plan on getting caught. This being the case it is useless in deterrence to focus on what we do to them afterward. It is of no help to anybody to vent frustrations with a bunch of name calling and pretend that killers are not human.
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
KOAN,
Well how would you go about doing that to begin with. We all know monsters aren't born they are made. It usually goes back to some tormented childhood, and bad parenting. Then again sometimes people just become monsters on their own, with no apparent backgound to indicate they would. I think we have enough studies to indicate letting a killer back out on the street is a dangerous move period. Now if she was 70 or 80 years old and being let out I would say we are pretty safe, she isn't she is young and could kill again easily, she enjoys killing, especially her own flesh and blood ( her own sister ).
There aren't enough resources in the world to prevent a monster from being made. The human mind is to complex for us to ever figure out fully. What we have to do is keep the violent murders off the street forever, then we wouldn't have to worry about what they might do again.
I remember watching a interview with a child molester who had killed over and over again. He looked right at the camera and said don't ever think we can be cured, we can't the damage is done are demons are to many, and don't ever let us back on the street we will do it again, and again. That was straight from the mouth of a killer who was on his way to the electric chair. Doesn't get anymore profound than that, now does it.
I just end up wondering why we are doing nothing to prevent the next "monster" from developing.
Well how would you go about doing that to begin with. We all know monsters aren't born they are made. It usually goes back to some tormented childhood, and bad parenting. Then again sometimes people just become monsters on their own, with no apparent backgound to indicate they would. I think we have enough studies to indicate letting a killer back out on the street is a dangerous move period. Now if she was 70 or 80 years old and being let out I would say we are pretty safe, she isn't she is young and could kill again easily, she enjoys killing, especially her own flesh and blood ( her own sister ).
There aren't enough resources in the world to prevent a monster from being made. The human mind is to complex for us to ever figure out fully. What we have to do is keep the violent murders off the street forever, then we wouldn't have to worry about what they might do again.
I remember watching a interview with a child molester who had killed over and over again. He looked right at the camera and said don't ever think we can be cured, we can't the damage is done are demons are to many, and don't ever let us back on the street we will do it again, and again. That was straight from the mouth of a killer who was on his way to the electric chair. Doesn't get anymore profound than that, now does it.
I just end up wondering why we are doing nothing to prevent the next "monster" from developing.
ALOHA!!
MOTTO TO LIVE BY:
"Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, chocolate in one hand, champagne in the other, body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming.
WOO HOO!!, what a ride!!!"
MOTTO TO LIVE BY:
"Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, chocolate in one hand, champagne in the other, body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming.
WOO HOO!!, what a ride!!!"
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
CARLA
unlike you, my name is spelled in lower case letter...I am actually quite a humble person despite popular belief.
your opinion that nothing works in rehabilitation is quite common in the US.
Does the criminal justice system have a duty to rehabilitate prisoners? To a Briton the answer is “Of course it does!†To an American, the answer is often less clear cut. For a variety of reasons we will examine, the American federal sentencing guidelines state that a prison’s purpose is to provide retribution, to educate, to deter and to incapacitate. Except in so far as education promotes rehabilitation, the concept is noticeably absent.
I am quite busy reading this lengthy article in order to summarize the best parts. I like to understand everything...even Americans.
unlike you, my name is spelled in lower case letter...I am actually quite a humble person despite popular belief.
your opinion that nothing works in rehabilitation is quite common in the US.
Does the criminal justice system have a duty to rehabilitate prisoners? To a Briton the answer is “Of course it does!†To an American, the answer is often less clear cut. For a variety of reasons we will examine, the American federal sentencing guidelines state that a prison’s purpose is to provide retribution, to educate, to deter and to incapacitate. Except in so far as education promotes rehabilitation, the concept is noticeably absent.
I am quite busy reading this lengthy article in order to summarize the best parts. I like to understand everything...even Americans.
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
koan wrote: I disagree. What seems like useless/hopeless jargon is the current justice system. Neither the death penalty nor incarceration have deterred crime in it's long history. To refuse to look at it intellectually means living with a failing system.
This thread, for instance, has a circular, useless quality to it. It seems that the point is to yell and scream "Monster" to make ourselves feel better. For me it doesn't. I just end up wondering why we are doing nothing to prevent the next "monster" from developing. Criminals don't plan on getting caught. This being the case it is useless in deterrence to focus on what we do to them afterward. It is of no help to anybody to vent frustrations with a bunch of name calling and pretend that killers are not human.
So how many innocents will we loose while we sit around probing the lunatic minds of killers like these??????
This thread, for instance, has a circular, useless quality to it. It seems that the point is to yell and scream "Monster" to make ourselves feel better. For me it doesn't. I just end up wondering why we are doing nothing to prevent the next "monster" from developing. Criminals don't plan on getting caught. This being the case it is useless in deterrence to focus on what we do to them afterward. It is of no help to anybody to vent frustrations with a bunch of name calling and pretend that killers are not human.
So how many innocents will we loose while we sit around probing the lunatic minds of killers like these??????
�You only live once, but if you do it right, once is enough.�
• Mae West
• Mae West
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
minks wrote: So how many innocents will we loose while we sit around probing the lunatic minds of killers like these??????
no more than we do already
no more than we do already
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
Oh I dunno
by locking the killers up I think this keeps the tally down somewhat.
by locking the killers up I think this keeps the tally down somewhat.
�You only live once, but if you do it right, once is enough.�
• Mae West
• Mae West
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
perhaps this is the confusion: Homolka is deemed free by our courts. There is nothing that can be done about that now. Don't blame her blame the system. She is deemed to not be a psychopath by the psychiatrists who have analysed her. What right do we have to doubt them or override their conclusions. Who on this site has a degree in psychology and has met with the woman? In the meantime...let's focus on prevention. In fact I'm not going to reply in this thread anymore. It is for people who want to rant and shout and carry on. I will be in the retribution thread discussing possible solutions in a, hopefully, productive way.
Vigilante threads are counter to law and order. Anger is easy to feed. I suggest we feed our minds instead.
Vigilante threads are counter to law and order. Anger is easy to feed. I suggest we feed our minds instead.
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
The problem though, is that she was not deemed to be a psychopath even at the time she was first put away! So what can we conclude other than that you don't need to be a "certified" psychopath to actually be a psychopath! So there is absolutely nothing that would suggest she has "reformed" while in prison!
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
koan wrote: perhaps this is the confusion: Homolka is deemed free by our courts. There is nothing that can be done about that now. Don't blame her blame the system. She is deemed to not be a psychopath by the psychiatrists who have analysed her. What right do we have to doubt them or override their conclusions. Who on this site has a degree in psychology and has met with the woman? In the meantime...let's focus on prevention. In fact I'm not going to reply in this thread anymore. It is for people who want to rant and shout and carry on. I will be in the retribution thread discussing possible solutions in a, hopefully, productive way.
Vigilante threads are counter to law and order. Anger is easy to feed. I suggest we feed our minds instead.
to each his own. You know it's human nature to feel vigilant and I would hazard a guess that those of us here with vigilante thoughts are not going to run out and act upon them without some serious thought or who knows maybe we will "feed our minds" first and then make our decisions.
You know until you find someone who has done something inappropriate please keep your "better than thou thoughts to a minimum"
Vigilante threads are counter to law and order. Anger is easy to feed. I suggest we feed our minds instead.
to each his own. You know it's human nature to feel vigilant and I would hazard a guess that those of us here with vigilante thoughts are not going to run out and act upon them without some serious thought or who knows maybe we will "feed our minds" first and then make our decisions.
You know until you find someone who has done something inappropriate please keep your "better than thou thoughts to a minimum"
�You only live once, but if you do it right, once is enough.�
• Mae West
• Mae West
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
koan wrote: CARLA
unlike you, my name is spelled in lower case letter...I am actually quite a humble person despite popular belief.
it seems the dalai lama and yoda may deign to descend from the mountain. i shall be prepared to genuflect. be ready all, to bend the knee... or your minds.
unlike you, my name is spelled in lower case letter...I am actually quite a humble person despite popular belief.
it seems the dalai lama and yoda may deign to descend from the mountain. i shall be prepared to genuflect. be ready all, to bend the knee... or your minds.
The Monster, Karla Homolka, To Be Released
turbonium wrote: The problem though, is that she was not deemed to be a psychopath even at the time she was first put away! So what can we conclude other than that you don't need to be a "certified" psychopath to actually be a psychopath! So there is absolutely nothing that would suggest she has "reformed" while in prison!Psychopathy, to remind you, is (to quote our Mental Health Act) ‘a persistent disorder or disability of mind (whether or not including significant impairment of intelligence) which results in abnormally aggressive or seriously irresponsible conduct on the part of the person concerned.’, and in the UK psychopaths are not necessarily imprisoned, they can alternatively be held in secure hospital treatment units. There was considerable debate, a decade ago, whether secure mental hospitals should continue to hold patients for whom they held no hope of treatment. It was decided (in the case of Hutchison Reid v United Kingdom, which is relevant case law in Canada) and confirmed by the European Court of Human Rights that "detention could be lawful even where the patient is suffering from a psychopathic disorder that cannot be treated in hospital". Where it is considered unsafe to release such a patient, on the grounds of public safety, that patient is held indefinitely. To quote again, this time from the House of Lords appeal decision:
Broadly stated, where a psychopath is convicted before a court of killing or injuring another[, at] present two courses are open to the court. The court may sentence the psychopath to imprisonment for life or for a fixed term of years or, as in this case, the court may order him to be detained in hospital with a restriction on his discharge without limit of time. Great public concern arises as to whether a convicted psychopath should be released from hospital where there is a real risk that after release he may again cause death or injury.None of this has any bearing whatever on a prisoner held for a fixed term in prison where the medical assessment makes no diagnosis of psychopathic disorder. As you so rightly say, "she was not deemed to be a psychopath even at the time she was first put away". Are you trying to redefine the language, saying you can have a thing even if you've been positively diagnosed to be without it? All you're doing is abusing technical terms, which is par for the general public. One does not reform a pathology, if it goes away then either one has cured it or one has observed a spontaneous remission. If you're challenging the competence of - what was it? eight? - qualified practitioners, in their area of expertise, then that's a layman's folly that just muddies the water.
Broadly stated, where a psychopath is convicted before a court of killing or injuring another[, at] present two courses are open to the court. The court may sentence the psychopath to imprisonment for life or for a fixed term of years or, as in this case, the court may order him to be detained in hospital with a restriction on his discharge without limit of time. Great public concern arises as to whether a convicted psychopath should be released from hospital where there is a real risk that after release he may again cause death or injury.None of this has any bearing whatever on a prisoner held for a fixed term in prison where the medical assessment makes no diagnosis of psychopathic disorder. As you so rightly say, "she was not deemed to be a psychopath even at the time she was first put away". Are you trying to redefine the language, saying you can have a thing even if you've been positively diagnosed to be without it? All you're doing is abusing technical terms, which is par for the general public. One does not reform a pathology, if it goes away then either one has cured it or one has observed a spontaneous remission. If you're challenging the competence of - what was it? eight? - qualified practitioners, in their area of expertise, then that's a layman's folly that just muddies the water.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.