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As for myself, I apply the same rule I apply to terrorists: Once you find it necessary to kill for your cause, then your cause wasn't righteous in the first place.


Even if you kill milions in the name of freedom and stopping communism?

Scrat;1419997 wrote: Even if you kill milions in the name of freedom and acquiring oil?


Fixed it for you.

Dorner apparently surrounded by police in cabin in Big Bear, two police

officers airlifted to trauma center, two people apparently tied up

have been released and cleared by paramedics, reportedly

hundreds of rounds fired but so far Dorner is NOT in custody.

I'll give more as I get it, but CNN has live reports now.

Scrat;1419997 wrote: Even if you kill milions in the name of freedom and stopping communism?


Quite right, that's why I think Vietnam wasn't righteous.

But when you are defending against an aggressor (See: WWII, Korea, and Desert Storm) then you're OK.

One mans aggressor is another mans freedom fighter ?

Bruv;1420045 wrote: One mans aggressor is another mans freedom fighter ? Oh you are naughty

Saint_;1420044 wrote: Quite right, that's why I think Vietnam wasn't righteous.

But when you are defending against an aggressor (See: WWII, Korea, and Desert Storm) then you're OK.


Vietnam. The worst mistake ever which we haven't learned from.

Vietnam. The worst thing we have ever done besides decimate our native population.

Vietnam asked the US for help to stop the French from looting the country. We said no, so they asked China. We sent troops.

North Korea asked the US to remain one country with South Korea and get some of the economic help they were getting from the US. We said no, so they asked China. We sent troops. We still haven't learned any lessons from those unnecessary wars.

I just heard they've captured him

Haven't heard that yet Oscar, the cabin where he was holed up is on

fire from tear gas canisters.

valerie;1420057 wrote: Haven't heard that yet Oscar, the cabin where he was holed up is on

fire from tear gas canisters.


Just heard now he's got hostages

They're waiting for the cabin to burn down - waiting when it's safe to examine the scene

looking for a body.?

Patsy

oscar;1420058 wrote: Just heard now he's got hostages


I don't think so, the police would not have fired tear gas into the cabin

if there were hostages.

The owner of the cabin contacted police earlier and said the cabin was

not rented out, there would have been nobody there.

Here's a link to the LA Times.

Dorner gun battle: 2 officers shot, 'deputies are everywhere' - latimes.com

I figured he would have offed himself already.

Dorner's body found in cabin.

Thanks for update valerie. Been watching SOTU.

As of 11pm ET--NO BODY FOUND. Cabin too hot to enter. Reports of body found, at this time, are Wrong.

Christopher Dorner: Ex-LAPD cop barricaded near Big Bear after shooting 2 more officers | Mail Online

AnneBoleyn;1420069 wrote: As of 11pm ET--NO BODY FOUND. Cabin too hot to enter. Reports of body found, at this time, are Wrong.


You are right AB, makes total sense, and I wonder how reporters got it so wrong?

LAPD saying recovery/identification may take quite some time. DNA, etc. depending

on condition, but the way that cabin was blazing, hard to believe there will be much left.

oscar;1420070 wrote: Christopher Dorner: Ex-LAPD cop barricaded near Big Bear after shooting 2 more officers | Mail Online


Oscar, do you guys over there have any real time news sources? I'm not familiar with

what is available to you.

BBC is usually more accurate than many of our news sources.

Seems we have a man who decided to experience hell before experiencing hell?

I wonder if they will still review the firing process he went through..

SnoozeAgain;1420074 wrote: BBC is usually more accurate than many of our news sources.


I don't doubt that, just wondering more about timeline, them hours away versus

me being in California and hearing/seeing stuff on a 'live' feed.

Still... It'll save money on cremating him.



What ?

oscar;1420104 wrote: Still... It'll save money on cremating him.



What ?


LOL! OUCH! That was soooooo harsh. (but funny!):wah:

In a case like this - who's responsible for the burned cabin?

The individual's Ins. won't cover all this

So - re-imbursed from the County - State?

just curious

Patsy

Was it privately owned or owned by the Big Bear State Park & rented out to tourists?

Anne

The burned cabin is privately owned

Family owns @ 10 acres - and has 5 cabins & a barn on the property

I was just curious who would be responsible - what a headache to work out.

Patsy

"Ok, we're gonna go forward with the plan, with the burn ... like we talked about."

"Seven burners deployed and we have a fire."

"Copy. Seven burners deployed and we have a fire."

These purported police commands come from 5 minutes and 17 seconds of audio allegedly recorded off law enforcement radios during Tuesday’s tense standoff between SWAT officers and suspected serial killer Christopher Dorner.

The audio, posted to YouTube, has fueled speculation that authorities may have purposely started the fire to either kill Dorner or force him to surrender.


Cause of cabin fire fuels debate on Christopher Dorner standoff | The Lookout - Yahoo! News

Patsy Warnick;1420152 wrote: In a case like this - who's responsible for the burned cabin?

The individual's Ins. won't cover all this

So - re-imbursed from the County - State?

just curious

Patsy
Another teacher and I were discussing the same thing. The gov't likely won't pay without a big fight - it was just incidental to the police doing their duty in protecting society. The murderer's family probably won't get anything from his life insurance because there's probably some clause to void the policy in case of psycho mass murder or something.

It's a puzzle alright.

And they might try to weasel out of the million dollar reward I heard,

because it was for the "capture and conviction" of Dorner.

Maybe officials will give the reward money to the cabin owner:yh_rotfl NO.?

I think the cabin owner will be hanging out to dry.

Patsy

valerie;1420195 wrote: And they might try to weasel out of the million dollar reward I heard,

because it was for the "capture and conviction" of Dorner.


There was no way in hell they ever intended to capture him unless "dead" was one of the categories.

Just an outsiders observation, but why worry about a cabin when 4 people plus the perp are dead?

Bruv;1420206 wrote: Just an outsiders observation, but why worry about a cabin when 4 people plus the perp are dead?
It's a loose end with no obvious conclusion, I guess.

He's toast.

Bruv

I question the out come for all.

As the scenario played out - I asked (my hub) if the cabin owner was watching.?

So, I questioned the end result for the cabin owner? that's all

If you owned the cabin the officials just took over & destroyed - you'd have questions?

Patsy

I agree with bruv.... who cares about a cabin with 4 Innocent people dead?

The cabin owner would have his own buildings Insurance.

oscar;1420231 wrote: I agree with bruv.... who cares about a cabin with 4 Innocent people dead?

The cabin owner would have his own buildings Insurance.
I'm pretty sure the policy doesn't cover police ordnance during shootout with a mass murderer. ijs

Accountable;1420232 wrote: I'm pretty sure the policy doesn't cover police ordnance during shootout with a mass murderer. ijs It should.... this is British but same would apply ....

What does home buildings insurance cover?

Buildings insurance covers the main structure of your home. If your home were to subside, burn, or be damaged by extreme weather, your buildings insurance policy covers the costs of rebuilding or repair.

UK home insurance - Building Insurance Quotes - Aviva

The Insurance company could then seek recompense from the police.

Accountable;1420232 wrote: I'm pretty sure the policy doesn't cover police ordnance during shootout with a mass murderer. ijs


I know most have an 'acts of war' exclusion.. do you suppose that covers police actions?

YZGI;1420226 wrote: He's toast.


I'll bet that burns him up.

Ins. Coverage will not cover this"act of war".

The property owner will need a good attorney. This fight will go on for yrs.

In the mean time - property owner will be fined for hazard & eye sore etc. until the legal process appoints some one responsible to clean up & rebuild.

We can't stop these looney's from shooting - but we can change the recovery process that's destroyed in the path.

Patsy