How Do You Feel About Body Scanners In Airports?

G#Gill · Post by **G#Gill** » Wed Jan 06, 2010 5:26 pm

TB, I am saddened that humanity has developed in the way it has, that causes such things to be introduced in order to protect the general public in their everyday pursuits. We should accept these items of protection with a certain amount of relief, and even a certain amount of gratitude. Not be shouting 'invasion of privacy!'

What we should all be ranting about are the pathetic governments of the different countries - UK, USA, etc. who the voting public put in power, but as soon as they get there are totally deaf to the voting public. They don't listen to us, they never have, THEY decide what to do, what is best ( ? ) for the country. THEY say that we voted them in to do our bidding. Did we say to go to war with Iraq? Did we say to let everybody, who wanted to come to our country to spunge off our resources, come and live in our country? Did we tell them to sell off our utilities to foreign countries? Did we say to let the hate ranting, non-western, 'leaders' of other faiths carry on living in our country, and carry on with their hate campaigns? etc etc etc No. We tried to stop the two war-mongers going into Iraq - my husband and son were on that first massive 'stop-the-war' rally in London, along with 2 million like-minded people. But Bush and B liar gave public opinion absolutely no heed, and with terrible lies went into Iraq. Most of the people in governments are corrupt, and most of them are only there to line their own pockets and make sure 'I'm all right Jack'.

That is what we should be ranting about ! That is what we should be physically doing something about !

Now just apologise for being so rude and bad-mouthing people. You don't know who people are who are members on this forum, or what they do. You assume that we are all pathetic, whimpy little creeps ! Well I've got news for you, there must be dozens of people in this forum who could buy you and sell you and swear they'd never seen you ! So I suggest to you that you grow up, go down to the corner shop, get a manner, come back, and apologise !

TruthBringer · Post by **TruthBringer** » Wed Jan 06, 2010 5:36 pm

You're going to give your government so much power, that one day they will go crazy with it and end up using it against you.

G#Gill · Post by **G#Gill** » Wed Jan 06, 2010 5:41 pm

TruthBringer;1279835 wrote: You're going to give your government so much power, that one day they will go crazy with it and end up using it against you.

Are you talking to me? Or are you just talking?

TruthBringer · Post by **TruthBringer** » Wed Jan 06, 2010 5:42 pm

G#Gill;1279836 wrote: Are you talking to me? Or are you just talking?

I'm talking to anyone who's willing to listen.

Post by **Bryn Mawr** » Wed Jan 06, 2010 5:44 pm

TruthBringer;1279838 wrote: I'm talking to anyone who's willing to listen.

That stopped when your insults started.

TruthBringer · Post by **TruthBringer** » Wed Jan 06, 2010 5:44 pm

Bryn Mawr;1279839 wrote: That stopped when your insults started.

Nothing I said can't be changed.

Post by **Bryn Mawr** » Wed Jan 06, 2010 5:47 pm

TruthBringer;1279840 wrote: Nothing I said can't be changed.

Then apologise and change it.

G#Gill · Post by **G#Gill** » Wed Jan 06, 2010 5:51 pm

He can't Bryn, because he hasn't been to the shop to get a manner, yet !

Mustang · Post by **Mustang** » Wed Jan 06, 2010 6:31 pm

I've spent most of my time on this forum bashing the governments and their policies

And how's that working for you so far?

These people are going to have their boots so far up your asses in the coming years it won't be funny

How about yours? You live in this Country regulated by the same government.

You people wouldn't have the guts to stand up even if you wanted to.

What are YOU doing (or done), besides posting at forums bashing the government and their policies that would help change the way you view the issues?

You're going to give your government so much power, that one day they will go crazy with it and end up using it against you.

It's YOUR government too, son.

Do you honestly think ranting at a forum IS going to change government policy?

Do you think dissing members opinions here, because they differ from yours, is going to get them to see your point of view and side with it?

Opinions were offered on this subject, both for and against.

Is it that difficult to accept what you cannot change, appreciate that members took the time to voice their opinion, and agree to disagree in a more respectful manner?

G#Gill · Post by **G#Gill** » Wed Jan 06, 2010 6:34 pm

Well said Mussy ! :yh_clap

CARLA · Post by **CARLA** » Wed Jan 06, 2010 7:43 pm

Well said Mustang here are a few fact about the scans

[QUOTE]Full body scanners. Which airports have them, who will be required to use them, and what do you need to know before you step inside? We spoke with Jon Allen, a TSA spokesman, to decode the mystery behind the machine.

Photos Courtesy of the TSA

Which airports have the full body scanners?

"There are 19 airports where millimeter wave machines have been deployed. The TSA's website includes a map of the locations."

Which airports are planning to get the devices?

While the exact times and locations where the scanners will be received have not been disclosed at the current time, the U.S. government is working to equip airports around the country with the machines.

"In the fall of 2009, TSA purchased 150 backscatter imaging technology units. A deployment schedule for these units has not been finalized. Funding exists to purchase an additional 300 advanced imaging technology units in 2010."

Will everybody be scanned, or only certain individuals?

"This screening option is completely voluntary to all passengers."

So can you decline a full-body scan?

Yes, for now, but you must submit to a full body pat-down.

Do they save the scanned images?

"There is no storage capability. No cameras, cellular telephones, or any device capable of capturing an image is permitted in the remotely-located resolution room. Use of such a device is a terminable offense."

Are they harmful for any individuals?

Two types of scanners currently exist: the millimeter wave scanner and the backscatter scanner.

"Millimeter wave technology bounces harmless electromagnetic waves off the human body to create a black and white image. The energy emitted by millimeter wave technology is 10,000 times less than what is permitted for a cell phone. "

"Backscatter technology projects an ionizing X-ray beam over the body surface at high speed. The reflection, or backscatter, of the beam is detected, digitized and displayed on a monitor. Each scan produces less than 10 microrem of emission, equivalent to the exposure each person receives in about two minutes on an airplane flight at altitude."

Who sees the images?

"Passenger privacy is ensured through the anonymity of the image. The transportation security officer attending the passenger cannot view the image, and the remotely-located officer who views the image cannot physically see the passenger. Images are not stored, transmitted or printed and are deleted immediately once viewed by the remotely-located officer."

Just how much is revealed in the full body scan?

"A privacy algorithm blurs facial features."

How long do the scans take?

"Screening takes approximately 15 seconds, while the scanning time is just a few seconds. The remotely located security officer who interprets the image takes approximately 12 seconds to do so. It takes a passenger with a joint replacement about 15 seconds to go through advanced imaging technology, versus a 2-4 minute pat down."

Will this solve the airport security problem?

"Advanced imaging technology safely screens passengers for metallic and nonmetallic threats including weapons, explosives and other objects concealed under layers of clothing without physical contact. Threats to aviation continue to evolve. The use of new and innovative technologies helps us stay ahead of those intent on harming our nation.

[/QUOTE]

AussiePam · Post by **AussiePam** » Wed Jan 06, 2010 9:24 pm

Well, in this thread I've been called a gutless coward, sick and been told my children should be taken away from me. This is very much out of order.

And all because I said that if I, as a non-American, need/want to go to the United States of America, and if that is dependent on going though a body scanner, I would do it. I don't live in fear. It is not my government imposing these new restrictions anyway. I have the choice of not travelling to the US. I'm about practicalities.

I don't believe a trillion little perverts are waiting to gaze at my naked form. I mean really - after a very short time, I'm sure every naked body, old young male female - gets pretty boringly the same. About as titillating as changerooms at the local gyms. Who looks after the first time? And Carla has calmly provided some actual facts - thank you!!! So it looks like all the apoplectic hype is just mega overreaction anyway.

It is indeed unfortunate that so many security measures are needed - but uninformed, hysterical and paranoid rants like this are not likely to advance world peace.

I am glad, Truthbringer, that your fellow Americans are calling you out for your general unpleasantness and arrogance. I think it's better if we others leave that to them.

G#Gill · Post by **G#Gill** » Thu Jan 07, 2010 5:06 am

Pam, he'll have an answer for that, because he seems to be an arrogant know-all, and not prepared to accept anybody else's opinion, even though he asks for them in the title of this thread. Thank you Carla for those facts. :-6

Clodhopper · Post by **Clodhopper** » Thu Jan 07, 2010 5:37 am

Hmm. Most of what "Truthbringer" posts is conspiracy theory, swallowed hook, line and sinker. If he's beginning to notice that it's a load of rubbish his world view could be being threatened. The sort of behaviour we see in this thread would be a likely result.

Btw, has anyone else noticed that people who call themselves things like "The Truth", or who make flat statements followed by the word "FACT!" are almost always wrong?

Raven · Post by **Raven** » Thu Jan 07, 2010 7:54 am

mikeinie;1279547 wrote: It’s bullsh1t.

This is all based on the recent incident and the fact is, that not only were security aware of the situation, but the father of the guy to tried to blow up the plane even phoned and warned them as he was concerned about his son’s activities.

The ‘intelligence’ agencies totally fail in their duties and the solution is to implement further invasions and incontinences to travelers.

It is amazing how fast they have come up with this solution; it is almost like they wanted to have another little scare to give them the excuse they need to bring this in.

There should be a worldwide boycott on travel and see how the airlines react to that.
I totally agree with you. I have said all along that it was a bit too neat and convenient. Would not be a bit suprised to learn that the person sitting next to him was a federal marshal. I am totally skeptical of ANYTHING America or Britain has to say about terrorism anymore. Trust the west to turn this into a major money making scheme.

YZGI · Post by **YZGI** » Thu Jan 07, 2010 3:30 pm

They can scan me if they want. All I ask is that it not be too cold and if it is I get some prep time before the scan.

ZAP · Post by **ZAP** » Thu Jan 07, 2010 5:17 pm

TruthBringer;1279562 wrote: You're willing to subject your innocent children to naked body scans? You should have your children taken away from you. And you make me sick.

Outrageously stupid!!

Thank you Carla for posting the facts about the scanners.

TruthBringer · Post by **TruthBringer** » Thu Jan 07, 2010 7:40 pm

Raven;1279964 wrote: I totally agree with you. I have said all along that it was a bit too neat and convenient. Would not be a bit suprised to learn that the person sitting next to him was a federal marshal. I am totally skeptical of ANYTHING America or Britain has to say about terrorism anymore. Trust the west to turn this into a major money making scheme.

Right Raven. And what some of these people don't realize is that these machines were ordered over a year ago. The plans for them were not put into place right after the crotch bomber successfully got onto the plane, but they were instead put in place long long before the incident ever happened in the first place!

To break it down for all of you body scan lovers....this means that the government was planning to scan your bodies way before the FAILED crotch bombing attempt. Not after it. All they needed was the excuse to implement them. And now they have it. And you fell for it. "Hook, line, and sinker".

G#Gill · Post by **G#Gill** » Fri Jan 08, 2010 4:31 am

TruthBringer;1280195 wrote: Right Raven. And what some of these people don't realize is that these machines were ordered over a year ago. The plans for them were not put into place right after the crotch bomber successfully got onto the plane, but they were instead put in place long long before the incident ever happened in the first place!

To break it down for all of you body scan lovers....this means that the government was planning to scan your bodies way before the FAILED crotch bombing attempt. Not after it. All they needed was the excuse to implement them. And now they have it. And you fell for it. "Hook, line, and sinker".

If these scanners had been in use before this failed bomb attack, then the matter would never have arisen ! I bet the 'powers that be' are regretting their tardiness right now! TB just think about it! From what I have read in this thread, I think there has been a certain amount of resignation from most people, that this sort of 'checking' has become inevitable. However, I don't think these scanners would have prevented the 9/11 atrocities, so security has to be considerably tightened up there.

This security business is an ongoing battle against terrorists, as the terrorists will always try to think of different ways to attack the innocent population. Yes I know that you are on about the 'business/financial gain' side of it, but unfortunately or fortunately (whichever) there will be certain companies who stand to make huge profits from the evil and nasty actions of the evil and nasty factions in our world. If we want to stay as safe as possible, then we will have to swallow our sense of 'invasion of privacy'. You have seen how these scanners work, thanks to the various pics and descriptions posted by members, so I think you should accept that there are a lot of people who are quite prepared to accept these safeguards, to try to protect themselves and their families. It is their decision. their opinion - if they want or need to travel about the world. You TB must do as you wish - that is your decision, your opinion. Has anybody called you nasty names, or ridiculed you because you have passed your opinion ? I have not noticed any.

You asked for other peoples' thoughts on this subject, you have several replies, so don't rant at people if their views don't tally with yours !

Raven · Post by **Raven** » Fri Jan 08, 2010 5:22 am

AussiePam;1279868 wrote: Well, in this thread I've been called a gutless coward, sick and been told my children should be taken away from me. This is very much out of order.

And all because I said that if I, as a non-American, need/want to go to the United States of America, and if that is dependent on going though a body scanner, I would do it. I don't live in fear. It is not my government imposing these new restrictions anyway. I have the choice of not travelling to the US. I'm about practicalities.

I don't believe a trillion little perverts are waiting to gaze at my naked form. I mean really - after a very short time, I'm sure every naked body, old young male female - gets pretty boringly the same. About as titillating as changerooms at the local gyms. Who looks after the first time? And Carla has calmly provided some actual facts - thank you!!! So it looks like all the apoplectic hype is just mega overreaction anyway.

It is indeed unfortunate that so many security measures are needed - but uninformed, hysterical and paranoid rants like this are not likely to advance world peace.

I am glad, Truthbringer, that your fellow Americans are calling you out for your general unpleasantness and arrogance. I think it's better if we others leave that to them.
As a medical professional who views people at their most vulnerable every day, I can assure those folks who are a bit shy about this, NONE view these people with anything other than what is intended. Pam you are right. Most likely there will not be pervy people looking at these slides. They are too busy looking for stuff that shouldnt be there. Drugs, bombs, guns, sharp things, etc.

However, having said that, I cant say they are held to the same ethical standards as the medical boards hold us. And airport bosses are not as concerned with backgrounds of the people they hire as the medical profession.

But social behaviurs prove that people will endure whatever they must to acheive certain goals. In other words, I dont think Disney World profits will suffer because of this. Neither will Las Vegas.

TruthBringer · Post by **TruthBringer** » Fri Jan 08, 2010 5:39 am

G#Gill;1280254 wrote: If these scanners had been in use before this failed bomb attack, then the matter would never have arisen ! I bet the 'powers that be' are regretting their tardiness right now! TB just think about it! From what I have read in this thread, I think there has been a certain amount of resignation from most people, that this sort of 'checking' has become inevitable. However, I don't think these scanners would have prevented the 9/11 atrocities, so security has to be considerably tightened up there.

This security business is an ongoing battle against terrorists, as the terrorists will always try to think of different ways to attack the innocent population. Yes I know that you are on about the 'business/financial gain' side of it, but unfortunately or fortunately (whichever) there will be certain companies who stand to make huge profits from the evil and nasty actions of the evil and nasty factions in our world. If we want to stay as safe as possible, then we will have to swallow our sense of 'invasion of privacy'. You have seen how these scanners work, thanks to the various pics and descriptions posted by members, so I think you should accept that there are a lot of people who are quite prepared to accept these safeguards, to try to protect themselves and their families. It is their decision. their opinion - if they want or need to travel about the world. You TB must do as you wish - that is your decision, your opinion. Has anybody called you nasty names, or ridiculed you because you have passed your opinion ? I have not noticed any.

You asked for other peoples' thoughts on this subject, you have several replies, so don't rant at people if their views don't tally with yours !

Look I see that you at least understand that there is corruption running amuck, and I do respect the fact that you made some good points before about the government ignoring the people and invading Iraq, if millions of people are marching around in a country and that country's government decides to ignore their plea, and to attack anyways, then there is seriously something wrong with that picture. I mean really...how does a government justify ignoring millions of it's own citizens? But that's beside the point.

To the rest of you aside from a few. I must say. You are making me very frustrated. I am unhappy that you still have some freedoms and liberties left yet to be taken away. What the hell is wrong with you people? You're only half assing it at the moment. You have given many of your liberties up in the name of security, yes, this is true, but you still have the rest to give up. What are you holding onto them still for? You know they are going to be taken away from you very soon, so why not give them all up now? All the rest that you still have? What are you waiting for. There are terrorists everywhere. In your city, in your neighborhood, on planes, busses, in the subways, they are everywhere. And yet you still have some freedom left? What's wrong with that picture. Think about it....and when you are done, do the right thing and at least make an effort to start offering up the liberties you have left to the government, I can't believe you haven't done this yet, but be it in the form of letters saying that you are willing to give up any liberty you have remaining from the constitution that your forefathers had given you, and any other liberty you have been given since then, so that you can ensure the protection of you and your family. This is serious business folks. There is no time to waste here. You need to start funneling your money towards homeland security. Do what ever you need to do. Stop going to the movies already. Stop taking your family out to eat. You simply don't know who's watching, or planning on entering that building to do harm to you and your loved ones. Stop it. By doing this you are hurting your fellow citizens in the process. You don't deserve a single liberty if you are responsible for the death of even 1 person on a plane. And you know this is true. So give them up faster is all I'm trying to say. Speed the process up. Make it easier for the government to do their job already. This slow trickle down process is not only boring it is uneccessary. Right now what you are doing is a shame both to you as individuals and also to your country. So do the right thing. That's all I ask.

G#Gill · Post by **G#Gill** » Fri Jan 08, 2010 5:54 am

And you are being very sarcastic !

Post by **spot** » Fri Jan 08, 2010 6:00 am

You know, autopsy photographs are far more explicit and you've just as little choice in the matter as you do over these airport security screening images. They're both done for exactly the same reason on a similar proportion of the public, to improve the safety of the population at large from a real and present danger. Are you allowed to say "I don't want an autopsy performing" in your country, in those circumstances where law enforcement demand one? I think not. The chance of the screening images leaking into the public domain are as remote as the chance of the autopsy photos getting out.

There are democratic processes available to have the policy changed if you want to try them. Most people, I suspect, would rather have the increased safety. The greater the government surveillance the better, assuming there's a will to prosecute all detected crime. I'm all for it.

TruthBringer · Post by **TruthBringer** » Fri Jan 08, 2010 6:25 am

spot;1280291 wrote: You know, autopsy photographs are far more explicit and you've just as little choice in the matter as you do over these airport security screening images. They're both done for exactly the same reason on a similar proportion of the public, to improve the safety of the population at large from a real and present danger. Are you allowed to say "I don't want an autopsy performing" in your country, in those circumstances where law enforcement demand one? I think not. The chance of the screening images leaking into the public domain are as remote as the chance of the autopsy photos getting out.

There are democratic processes available to have the policy changed if you want to try them. Most people, I suspect, would rather have the increased safety. The greater the government surveillance the better, assuming there's a will to prosecute all detected crime. I'm all for it.

Yes Spot but it's a shame that we have to sit and wait while all this is being done. What about the right to bare arms? That is obsolete. It is highly dangerous. What if a terrorist gets their hand on your gun? Do you want to be responsible for such a thing? What if a terrorist aquires a gun through the same process that you can? Have you considered the effects of that? No...the right to bare arms must be obliterated if you are ever going to be safe. But herein lies the problem, because after the right to bare arms has been taken away, and I have no doubt the government is looking out for your best interests and has already been planning different ways to do this (I'm speaking to Americans on this issue), you will no longer be safe in your own homes. And this is a dilemma that MUST be fixed. We can not have a single person killed in their homes just for not being able to defend themselves properly. So what I propose is the same thing that I think the government is planning (great minds think alike), and I propose that after the guns have been taken away, I hope it's sooner than later, that people no longer be allowed to live in their own homes. It's just not safe anymore.

In fact, buildings, camps, whatever you choose to call them, need to be constructed for the purpose of housing American citizens in a safe environment. Jobs are going to be extremely dangerous soon too, because all it takes is one little nuclear suitcase bomb while you are at work and you're talking about an entire radius of disaster, including the death of you and all of your co-workers. The radiation alone would cause the death of many more. So what I propose is a civilian workforce inside the camps. Something to keep people buisy. It's not safe for people to be sitting inside of these places with nothing to do, because what if there is a terrorist living inside them as well? Or many terrorists, sitting around plotting with eachother on how to disrupt the camps. An extremely dangerous situation indeed. And one that not need be created. So the civilian workforce would ensure that all people, even children, will work either all or most of the day (I haven't figured this out yet), so that it will be easier to track all of their movements, and to weed out any signs of terrorist activity.

The only thing that urks me about all this is that the plans may be in the works, but I do believe the government is moving WAY too slow on them. And I've always looked at the government as smart, loyal, protective, and all-loving. Kind of like how some religious followers view their deities. But I just don't understand why the government has been moving so slow on these issues. I thought they had the resources to get all this done. I guess we'll just have to keep our faith in them, because they do know best, and we can't pretend that we are nearly as intelligent as they are when it comes to living our lives. Bottom line, NOBODY is equal to the government. So I don't know perhaps more movies like Air Force One need to be created, or something to that effect, because most of you citizens for whatever reason still seem to not be able to grasp the serious nature of these terrorists.

I'll just keep my eye on the ball. And I'll keep trying to explan this all in a way that I feel that all of you will understand. I mean I'm not FOX news or CNN, so I could never reach that kind of a communication level with any of you, or nearly as much of a close nit relationship with you guys, and I am so grateful that we have them to tell us every four years that either Republicans are better or Democrats are better, because I get confused about that and without them I would not be able to quite understand it all. So I believe at the moment Democrats know best, and they are carefully taking care of our health care concerns, but I know that this could at anytime be declared to not be the case, and it is very possible that very soon FOX news is going to announce to all of us that Republicans should now be in charge of something major, including the whitehouse, and right now it looks like that might just be the case, so I am keeping my ears 100% open and I am still waiting to get all of this information so that I will know what move to make next. When I do, I'll be sure to jot it all down, and I'll try and keep you guys updated though. It's the least I can do as I am only a citizen like you with so much more information to receive from the various sources that the whitehouse provides us with. So I hope you guys will all be doing the same.

Truthbringer

Post by **spot** » Fri Jan 08, 2010 6:32 am

Just to see what would happen if you addressed my point, would you like to address my point for once? It's a well-made one, it's relevant and you completely ignored it.

TruthBringer · Post by **TruthBringer** » Fri Jan 08, 2010 6:37 am

spot;1280304 wrote: Just to see what would happen if you addressed my point, would you like to address my point for once? It's a well-made one, it's relevant and you completely ignored it.

I'm sorry Spot it's just I get so clumsy sometimes when I try to do things on my own with my own thoughts. I will try to see a priest on the matter or something it's just I have been so scared lately with all of the possible terrorist activities out there, and you know I have been wondering if there might even be a terrorist watching some of the buildings I have been visiting lately. The different media outlets have stated that they might be doing just that, so I've opted to sit in my room with my eyes glued to the tv in the meantime. Please bare with me.

Post by **spot** » Fri Jan 08, 2010 6:40 am

TruthBringer;1280306 wrote: I'm sorry Spot it's just I get so clumsy sometimes when I try to do things on my own with my own thoughts. I will try to see a priest on the matter or something it's just I have been so scared lately with all of the possible terrorist activities out there, and you know I have been wondering if there might even be a terrorist watching some of the buildings I have been visiting lately. The different media outlets have stated that they might be doing just that, so I've opted so sit in my room with my eyes glued to the tv in the meantime. Please bare with me.

Meanwhile, just to see what would happen if you addressed my point, would you like to address my point for once? It's a well-made one, it's relevant and you completely ignored it.

TruthBringer · Post by **TruthBringer** » Fri Jan 08, 2010 6:48 am

spot;1280308 wrote: Meanwhile, just to see what would happen if you addressed my point, would you like to address my point for once? It's a well-made one, it's relevant and you completely ignored it.

Well I'd like to add to your point actually. Because I feel that the body scanners are irrelevant as I hear that there might also be plans in the works for electric shock bracelets (I believe I have that right), which will be attached to the wrists of all citizens who choose to travel by air? Yes, these I believe will be added for extra protection, because if any of us get out of line we can be zapped back into order, and this is where the real security will come in. I'm not kidding about the shock bracelets, so don't worry I am pretty sure they are real, I wouldn't want to get your guys hopes up though for nothing if it turns out that they will not be implemented. But....together, coupled with the Body Scanners, we should be on the right track.

Until then though arguing about the body scanners is not going to keep us safe, so I'll just pass on that. I'm eagerly awaiting the shock bracelets because I feel that we will all be alot safer wearing those than we will be with just the body scanners alone.

Post by **spot** » Fri Jan 08, 2010 7:11 am

TruthBringer;1280309 wrote: Well I'd like to add to your point actually. Because I feel that the body scanners are irrelevant as I hear that there might also be plans in the works for electric shock bracelets (I believe I have that right), which will be attached to the wrists of all citizens who choose to travel by air? Yes, these I believe will be added for extra protection, because if any of us get out of line we can be zapped back into order, and this is where the real security will come in. I'm not kidding about the shock bracelets, so don't worry I am pretty sure they are real, I wouldn't want to get your guys hopes up though for nothing if it turns out that they will not be implemented. But....together, coupled with the Body Scanners, we should be on the right track.

Until then though arguing about the body scanners is not going to keep us safe, so I'll just pass on that. I'm eagerly awaiting the shock bracelets because I feel that we will all be alot safer wearing those than we will be with just the body scanners alone.
Sarcasm is a long way short of reasoned argument.

Autopsy photographs are far more explicit and you've just as little choice in the matter as you do over these airport security screening images. They're both done for exactly the same reason on a similar proportion of the public, to improve the safety of the population at large from a real and present danger. Are you allowed to say "I don't want an autopsy performing" in your country, in those circumstances where law enforcement demand one? I think not. The chance of the screening images leaking into the public domain are as remote as the chance of the autopsy photos getting out.

CARLA · Post by **CARLA** » Fri Jan 08, 2010 7:41 am

Nah!! bracelets to time consuming for all concerned. Actually the best way for the public to fly safely would be to sedate each flight after the doors are closed nothing major just light sleep till we reach our destination. I actually would like that form of flight as you just wake up and your there fresh and ready to go. Lots of flyers sedate themselve now to get through the flight might as well do all the passengers. You don't have to feed anyone or even have restrooms except for the flight crew. Long flights are annoying anyway why not sleep through the whole thing. :rolleyes: Of course we still have to go through the body scanner before we are sedated.

Originally Posted by TruthBringer

Well I'd like to add to your point actually. Because I feel that the body scanners are irrelevant as I hear that there might also be plans in the works for electric shock bracelets (I believe I have that right), which will be attached to the wrists of all citizens who choose to travel by air? Yes, these I believe will be added for extra protection, because if any of us get out of line we can be zapped back into order, and this is where the real security will come in. I'm not kidding about the shock bracelets, so don't worry I am pretty sure they are real, I wouldn't want to get your guys hopes up though for nothing if it turns out that they will not be implemented. But....together, coupled with the Body Scanners, we should be on the right track.

Until then though arguing about the body scanners is not going to keep us safe, so I'll just pass on that. I'm eagerly awaiting the shock bracelets because I feel that we will all be alot safer wearing those than we will be with just the body scanners alone.

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Post by **Betty Boop** » Fri Jan 08, 2010 8:44 am

CARLA;1280318 wrote: Nah!! bracelets to time consuming for all concerned. Actually the best way for the public to fly safely would be to sedate each flight after the doors are closed nothing major just light sleep till we reach our destination. I actually would like that form of flight as you just wake up and your there fresh and ready to go. Lots of flyers sedate themselve now to get through the flight might as well do all the passengers. You don't have to feed anyone or even have restrooms except for the flight crew. Long flights are annoying anyway why not sleep through the whole thing. :rolleyes: Of course we still have to go through the body scanner before we are sedated.

The obvious answer there then is to sedate first, wheel 'em through the scanner and then on to the plane, tip 'em in a seat and away we go

CARLA · Post by **CARLA** » Fri Jan 08, 2010 8:46 am

I like that even better if you have ever been on an international flight sedation is necessary.

Post by **Bryn Mawr** » Sat Jan 09, 2010 7:15 am

TruthBringer;1280195 wrote: Right Raven. And what some of these people don't realize is that these machines were ordered over a year ago. The plans for them were not put into place right after the crotch bomber successfully got onto the plane, but they were instead put in place long long before the incident ever happened in the first place!

To break it down for all of you body scan lovers....this means that the government was planning to scan your bodies way before the FAILED crotch bombing attempt. Not after it. All they needed was the excuse to implement them. And now they have it. And you fell for it. "Hook, line, and sinker".

I do not know about over there but the plans to bring these scanners in were published months ago - not some conspiracy theory that they waited for an excuse but part of the government's ongoing strategy for maintaining safety.

Post by **spot** » Sat Jan 09, 2010 7:43 am

BBC NEWS | Europe | Europe eyes airport X-ray vision is from 2008, the discussion has been public for quite a while. I've been patted down at airports, these body scanners are far less invasive than that. Does Truthbringer object in principle to pat-downs? Given the choice, I'd rather be scanned.

CARLA · Post by **CARLA** » Sat Jan 09, 2010 10:49 am

There is only 1 Country that has Airport security right that would be Israel. They use every method at their disposal profiling (not necessarily by race but your actions sweating, nervous etc), scanning, pat down, strip searches, armed guards at all enterances, parking lots asking you questions, more guards and questions as you enter the airport their extensive use of questions is what sets them apart, no bathroom use the last hour of any flight, or refusing to let you on at the gate doesn't matter to them your flight is their concern and its safety. They guard their borders better than any other country why because they have to. Israel has more experience than any country in this area.

We could learn something from them but we won't because everyone will be up in arms about everything. So they fly safe we will continue to have planes fall out of the sky because of terroists.

Post by **spot** » Sat Jan 09, 2010 2:54 pm

That sounds very odd Carla. When I went through Tel Aviv it felt quite like Bristol Airport. A lot quicker than Heathrow by miles.

fuzzywuzzy · Post by **fuzzywuzzy** » Sat Jan 09, 2010 3:01 pm

The only time I've come even close to being touched by airport security was a scanner thingy being run over my body leaving Australia for Britain on the evening of the transalantic terrorist flare-up.........And it' seemed to me that this only happened because the young bloke was being trained at the time.

Wouldn't have minded a bit of sedation for that long haul though. Next time I'll go by ship.

AussiePam · Post by **AussiePam** » Sat Jan 09, 2010 3:16 pm

I've been patted down umpteen times, strip searched twice, had my bags taken apart twice including probing my makeup and sniffing my perfume. I've been explosives swabbed, questioned at length, had my professional work checked while I was isolated. I've had to assooom the position while bods with drawn guns fiddled about in my bag (that time it was a dense guide book on Georgia which set off the alarms). Every time I go to the US, I get fingerprinted, eye photo'd etc, etc. From last year we have to get an online upfront clearance as well before we even leave Australia.

Why? I think it's the fact I travel a lot and often by unusual routes, and occasionally at times when there are special alerts in force. I have no police record, no strange habits apart from being a member of FG. I used to work for the government here with top clearances, but that was yonks ago, and anyway - Australia is an ally etc etc. Profiling - I'm the wrong age, sex, religion, colouring, etc etc. I have never published any political views. Possibly I look suss. Possibly I'm so delectable, they just want to keep me there a bit longer.. Nar. Luck of the draw. Random.

In all that time, I've only had one "negative" experience with it. Usually everyone has been friendly, apologetic even, fast, professional. And there's a kind of camaraderie. As I said before, if I want/need to go from Timbuctu to Reykjavik by way or Shamrock, Texas and then to Whistler to ski and back to Shreveport, Mississippi via Amsterdam... I expect someone may wonder why..... (Meeting people on line and visiting them has its downsides.... :sneaky:)

fuzzywuzzy · Post by **fuzzywuzzy** » Sat Jan 09, 2010 3:25 pm

Pammy it's obvious, they just want your body, you hot thing you.

TruthBringer · Post by **TruthBringer** » Mon Jan 11, 2010 1:12 am

CARLA;1280711 wrote: There is only 1 Country that has Airport security right that would be Israel. They use every method at their disposal profiling (not necessarily by race but your actions sweating, nervous etc), scanning, pat down, strip searches, armed guards at all enterances, parking lots asking you questions, more guards and questions as you enter the airport their extensive use of questions is what sets them apart, no bathroom use the last hour of any flight, or refusing to let you on at the gate doesn't matter to them your flight is their concern and its safety. They guard their borders better than any other country why because they have to. Israel has more experience than any country in this area.

We could learn something from them but we won't because everyone will be up in arms about everything. So they fly safe we will continue to have planes fall out of the sky because of terroists.

lol. Look the people don't want these scanners, they wouldn't have protected us against the dreaded christmas day underwear bomber, the government admits this, and now the government is even talking about "mobile" naked body scanners driving around on the street, there have been sources that have admitted that this does radiate your body similar to x-ray machines at the doctors office, some doctors have stated that it is possible to get cancer from these machines, and the list goes on.

Israel's citizens get killed all the time from missiles being launched across their borders. That's probably why no one is using their planes to kill people because they could easily just launch a missile over a wall and take out 10-15 people. Or attack a bus, or something like that. Israel is in a state of daily chaos.

We are not Israel.

TruthBringer · Post by **TruthBringer** » Mon Jan 11, 2010 1:14 am

People are starting to wake up and see the bigger picture here.

Nomad · Post by **Nomad** » Mon Jan 11, 2010 2:16 am

TruthBringer;1281190 wrote: People are started to wake up and see the bigger picture here.

No offense, seriously. I mean no disrepect here but Id rather be dead than worry as much as you do.

Life just wouldnt be worth living to me if I was jammed up about as many things as you are.

Have you ever considered anti anxiety medication?

Theres no shame in that and you might be able to relax once in awhile.

TruthBringer · Post by **TruthBringer** » Mon Jan 11, 2010 3:55 am

Nomad;1281199 wrote: No offense, seriously. I mean no disrepect here but Id rather be dead than worry as much as you do.

Life just wouldnt be worth living to me if I was jammed up about as many things as you are.

Have you ever considered anti anxiety medication?

Theres no shame in that and you might be able to relax once in awhile.

Well that's fine if you feel that way. But if there was a medication I could give you that would open your mind just a little bit, just enough to see the truth, than I would administer it to you. lol.

Post by **spot** » Mon Jan 11, 2010 4:28 am

TruthBringer;1281206 wrote: Well that's fine if you feel that way. But if there was a medication I could give you that would open your mind just a little bit, just enough to see the truth, than I would administer it to you. lol.

Sadly there's no truth in you. Every time I've taken the trouble to pick a section of your inaccuracies apart you've walked straight past it without a glance, much less a reply. If you responded to criticism I'd bother to criticize.

Autopsy photographs are far more explicit and you've just as little choice in the matter as you do over these airport security screening images. They're both done for exactly the same reason on a similar proportion of the public, to improve the safety of the population at large from a real and present danger. Are you allowed to say "I don't want an autopsy performing" in your country, in those circumstances where law enforcement demand one? I think not. The chance of the screening images leaking into the public domain are as remote as the chance of the autopsy photos getting out.

Saint_ · Post by **Saint_** » Mon Jan 11, 2010 10:44 am

Scrat;1281265 wrote:

On a more serious note people we will never be completely safe on the airliners out there in the big blue yonder. If somebody wants to get something on board they will. What this guy did was to be expected. The next one will have something up their rectum or elsewhere. These scanners simply make things harder on them and gives us another layer of protection.

LOL! Bingo! Will they call him the "Rectum Bomber?"

Bobby Joe: "Did you se that "Rectum bomber on the news?"

Billy bob: "Yup! He sure 'recked 'em, didn't he?! HARHARHAR!!!"

Reminds me of that old internet quote, "Thanks for flying Northwest Airlines, and if you ever feel the need to strap yourself into a pressurized aluminum tube and go streaking through the atmosphere again, we hope you'll think of us!":D

cars · Post by **cars** » Wed Jan 13, 2010 9:18 am

It is becoming obvious that the TSA isn't asking for new technology because of smart terrorists -- they need all these new machines because they are incapable of doing their job.

A passenger boarded a plane at Milwaukee General Mitchell airport, but realized he had left some shotgun shells in his bag. Being a good citizen, he reported this to the flight attendant, who informed the pilot.

The plane then returned to the gate so the passenger could turn the ammo into the local police. The man was re-screened, and allowed back on the plane.

After the failed terror attempt on Christmas day, one would expect TSA agents to be extra vigilant. The agency has been asking for more money to invest in full body scanners, and other detection equipment. But at the end of the day, even the most impressive piece of equipment in the world becomes another useless gadget when staffed by incompetent staff! :-5