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Avuncular one.... (((((HUGS))))) He's the one missing out. And I'm sure you know that, even if he DID come to see you, the relationship will never be what you'd like it to be. Some things are possibly better left alone.

Do your best to forgive him and pity him and get on with life.

Wanna' glass of wine, some cheese & crackers? I just happen to have some in this cooler....:-4

Lulu2;536123 wrote: Wanna' glass of wine, some cheese & crackers? I just happen to have some in this cooler....:-4


If Krammy says no, can I have some? :p

If you're there, Cher....he'll join in! We can tickle him until he giggles & feels happy again!;)

Lulu2;536253 wrote: If you're there, Cher....he'll join in! We can tickle him until he giggles & feels happy again!;)


Oh that would be fantastic!

Anything for a good friend :-4

cherandbuster;536207 wrote: If Krammy says no, can I have some? :p


I'm not going to say no am I?.....but I will Cher them (see what I did there?:D )

Krammy-you are not alone..i have a dad i had to let go of for the very same reasons....it hurts but in the long run i am alot better off.....



as far as your dad goes,,it's his loss.....he is missing out on one of the best people i know.....:-4

Good advice! Now...come here, Krammy....have a biscuit.

mrsK;536373 wrote: Big huggs to you Unc.:-4 :-4 :-4

Families can be trying at times.

Feel the love from your online family,not the same I know but it helps:-6


Yeah, it sure does

Magenta flame;536429 wrote: OK before everybody comes down on me like a ton of bricks......Uncs I want to ask you something



Do you look like your father?
Yeah a little bit. My brother is more like my Mom though. Not good really as my Dad has thinner hair than my Mom :wah:

Uncle Kram;536047 wrote: Well here I am again venting in this tired old thread.


Ask yourself why. Tired? Hm. Why is it still going? The only thing I'll say is that

if you have come to a decision about him (and your past relationship with him)

based only by talking to those who talk to him, and you are OK with that, well -

full stop. Even so that be the case, then you have absolutely nothing to lose

by talking to him man to man, speaking your mind and expecting a man to man

reply, rather than relying on an interpreter. People are sometimes have difficulty

in communicating their feelings and emotions - me & my old old boy experience

this. In yours, and anyone else's case? I really don't know. However, it wouldn't

hurt to communicate directly, would it? *I* may not be communicating well here,

but I have had a shock today, and am pissed up. I have probably cocked up the

gist of what I hoped to convey. Pardon me. No offence. £1.49/2L. Yours, with

utmost care in writing,

Uncle Kram;536047 wrote: As it stands, with the help and support of my RL and FG friends, I have squared this in my head now. I made multiple efforts, he made none. I have no reason to reproach myself for a lack of effort. I know I'm not a bad person. I know I'm worthy of the pride my Mom has in me. I know I have the adulation of my kids.
*Slaps a friendly hand on Unc's shoulder and hands him a cyber-beer*

Dads and sons are weird unc. My dad and I are about the same as you and yours. I cant figure it out either. I suppose some dads and sons are best friends and all that but I think many are strained relationships as well. I wish I had some magic advice but I dont. Maybe it would help to think about the big picture. How does dad get on with his dad ? If that was weird too maybe he just cant work through it. My best guess is hes having a hard time figuring the whole thing out. I dont know but its something to think about.

Nomad;536472 wrote: Dads and sons are weird unc. [...] My best guess is hes having a hard time figuring the whole thing out. I dont know but its something to think about.


That had crossed my mind, too (what there is of it).

Bill Sikes;536476 wrote: That had crossed my mind, too (what there is of it).




Your preaching to the choir my man

Well I guess his attendance or failure to attend tomorrow will be a defining moment one way or the other. At the end of the day I know a lot about him and he knows Jack sh1t about me. Has no idea what I'm like really. Guess I'm forever 17 to him with a handful of flashbacks to when I was around 40.

Nomad;536483 wrote: Your preaching to the choir my man


Coming, going, gone. Oh well. I'd stay up for a nice game of dominoes, but I've

got to get up in the morning. Cnickers.

Getting pissed might be just what you need unc.

Im just pulling this out of the air so Ill butt out now but sometimes getting angry brings things front and center.

Uncle Kram;536490 wrote: Well I guess his attendance or failure to attend tomorrow will be a defining moment one way or the other. At the end of the day I know a lot about him and he knows Jack sh1t about me. Has no idea what I'm like really. Guess I'm forever 17 to him with a handful of flashbacks to when I was around 40.


Effit. *why*[1] (1st. sentence)? I'm sure you have lovely knees, or shins, or

whatever has been mentioned recently, and I'm not "getting at you". Shoes,

other people's.



[1] This is a rhetorical question, by the way.

From the Heart

It seemed to me when I was a lad

It wasn't much fun being the Son of my Dad

Always afraid of what he'd do or say

I lived in fear almost every day

Until one day when I stood my ground

To signal the end of being pushed around

So I left home and I shed the skin

Of the life of fear I'd been living in

Then I was married became a young Dad

Resolved to give love I never had

Someone like my Dad had become my wife

But I resurfaced into a contented life

Where I have my kids, they tell me I'm great

Raised by love he failed to appreciate

He didn't do what he shoulda oughta

He lost 2 Sons but he gained a Daughter

Never understood where he's coming from

This man I wanted to be like my Mom

I can say I tried and I played my part

All that's left is a silly poem from the heart

You have to do what you feel is right. Hopefully, that makes since. Just do what your heart says to do at the time.

Lots of :yh_hugs and :-4 to you Kram

Hey Unk, your one of the good guys ...never forget that .:-6

hey krambo , my dad was the worst of the worst , beatings , we were dressed in rags , starved ,treated like slave labour on a farm and in general treated like , well worse than any animal should be treated . now he is really ill and wants to see me , other people have said he is not the same man that beat and kicked you and made your life a living hell , and that i should go and see him but its really not that easy , i know i have to make up my mind he aint gona be here much longer what do you think krambo ?, i always value your opinion

jimbo;537095 wrote: hey krambo , my dad was the worst of the worst , beatings , we were dressed in rags , starved ,treated like slave labour on a farm and in general treated like , well worse than any animal should be treated . now he is really ill and wants to see me , other people have said he is not the same man that beat and kicked you and made your life a living hell , and that i should go and see him but its really not that easy , i know i have to make up my mind he aint gona be here much longer what do you think krambo ?, i always value your opinion
Yeah that's a tough call Jimbo and I have to say that it's a scenario I've run through my own mind on several occasions. It is the dilema at the very root of this thread : the potential impact later of our actions now. These guys don't deserve our love or affection. Would they be coming to see us?. We know the answer to that. But the thing that seperates us from them is our hearts. We feel compelled to do the decent and honourable thing. Does he want to see you to absolve his guilt?, does he have genuine remorse and recognise the special person that we all see here on this forum?. Unlikely if he is a stranger. I have drifted between the two schools of thought and if this situation presented itself in my life, I suspect that if my Dad was dying in hospital and asked for me, I would probably go to get closure one way or the other. Either confirmation once and for all that he's a total loser, or sending him on his way with forgiveness and nothing to trouble me or beat myself up over later. I am almost 100% certain that I would not attend a funeral though. I wouldn't have the heart to lament a squandoured opportunity. Go with your big heart Jimbo. It has always served you well my friend.

Needless to say, my old man didn't grace my home with his presence this afternoon. He probably had the full SP from my ex on my belligerent comments yesterday. I've got a lot of love to give and a lot of people to give it to. He's got his wife, his very old mother-in-law and my ex-wife.....that's it.

The End.

jimbo;537095 wrote: hey krambo , my dad was the worst of the worst , beatings , we were dressed in rags , starved ,treated like slave labour on a farm and in general treated like , well worse than any animal should be treated . now he is really ill and wants to see me , other people have said he is not the same man that beat and kicked you and made your life a living hell , and that i should go and see him but its really not that easy , i know i have to make up my mind he aint gona be here much longer what do you think krambo ?, i always value your opinion :confused


If you don't mind another opinion, you ought to go - else you will never know.

Problem is Bill, if people haven't changed by now I really doubt they ever will

SuzyB;537195 wrote: Problem is Bill, if people haven't changed by now I really doubt they ever will True. But the meeting would primarily be for Jimbos benefit. Wiping the slate clean so to speak. Bill is probably right.

I'd always support Jim in what ever he decides to do, but this has been tried on at least 3 occasions over the ten years we've been together, and it's always had the same result.

Laura just phoned me. My Dad was round there for 3½ hours with my ex saying that as he's 77, after driving 20 miles to hers, it was unreasonable of me to expect him to drive another 1.9 miles to my house. I don't see that, and particularly as he is chauffered by his 63 year old wife. That's only 17 years older than me for crying out loud. I know I shouldn't, but I'm thinking that word that ladies don't like

I'm sorry Krammi, you really don't deserve to be treated like that. We all love ya :-4 :-4

Uncle Kram;537232 wrote: Laura just phoned me. My Dad was round there for 3½ hours with my ex saying that as he's 77, after driving 20 miles to hers, it was unreasonable of me to expect him to drive another 1.9 miles to my house. I don't see that, and particularly as he is chauffered by his 63 year old wife. That's only 17 years older than me for crying out loud. I know I shouldn't, but I'm thinking that word that ladies don't like


Does make you wonder though, did your ex pass on what you said yesterday or did she just say to him, ' Well I have no idea where he is, I did tell him you were coming, I thought he may have called in for a coffee.......'

Betty Boop;537235 wrote: Does make you wonder though, did your ex pass on what you said yesterday or did she just say to him, ' Well I have no idea where he is, I did tell him you were coming, I thought he may have called in for a coffee.......' A full verbatim blow by blow account would be my guess, but she'll tell herself she extended an olive branch

Uncle Kram;537232 wrote: Laura just phoned me. My Dad was round there for 3½ hours with my ex saying that as he's 77, after driving 20 miles to hers, it was unreasonable of me to expect him to drive another 1.9 miles to my house. I don't see that, and particularly as he is chauffered by his 63 year old wife. That's only 17 years older than me for crying out loud. I know I shouldn't, but I'm thinking that word that ladies don't like


It wasnt in the slightest bit unreasonable, in fact YOU and yours should have been the first place ur dad visited with a drop in to ur ex IF he could manage etc.

Plus you dont know what she's really telling them either do you, it could be a whole diff story to what she tells you...

Red;537349 wrote: It wasnt in the slightest bit unreasonable, in fact YOU and yours should have been the first place ur dad visited with a drop in to ur ex IF he could manage etc.

Plus you dont know what she's really telling them either do you, it could be a whole diff story to what she tells you... My ex is quite mendacious. I don't think my Dad could possibly live long enough to undo the damage it's caused.

Uncle Kram;537403 wrote: My ex is quite mendacious. I don't think my Dad could possibly live long enough to undo the damage it's caused.


right now mr...mendacious...pls ive had 2 large/huge glasses of red, i can barely work out the meaning of my own name!:p

We love you though - Krammy hugs are rather nice:sneaky:

Red;537407 wrote: right now mr...mendacious...pls ive had 2 large/huge glasses of red, i can barely work out the meaning of my own name!:p Well you were thirsty weren't you?

Imladris;537408 wrote: We love you though - Krammy hugs are rather nice:sneaky: Ok ...you twisted my arm :yh_hugs :yh_hugs ..............better?

Uncle Kram;537430 wrote: Ok ...you twisted my arm :yh_hugs :yh_hugs ..............better?


Oooooh! Lovely.







I might just have to develop a crush now! xx :wah:

Imladris;537433 wrote: Oooooh! Lovely.







I might just have to develop a crush now! xx :wah:


Will you require a darkroom? :wah:

Uncle Kram;537437 wrote: Will you require a darkroom? :wah:


I look better in the dark - apparantly



(last time hubby said that though he got a slap)

Imladris;537445 wrote: I look better in the dark - apparantly



(last time hubby said that though he got a slap)


you look fine in the daylight immy... and you cook good what more could a guy want

:D

jimbo;537482 wrote: you look fine in the daylight immy... and you cook good what more could a guy want

:D


According to him Kate Winslett and lots of grown up cuddles - sheesh, men!

Okay, now that Wendy doesn't have tears in her eyes from catching up on this thread...

Krammy, I've stated that my ex had this type of up-bringing with his father, the sad part is he's repeating it with his own children. As for the funeral part, he had a horrible Mother also, and said he would NEVER go to her funeral, and did...sad part is it never gave him closure. (It's hard to say, the important thing is forgiving them and going on with your life-IMO)

The up-side of all this is that you have over-come this...YOU are a wonderful person, awesome Dad...and alot to be proud of!!

Sending lots of :-4 and:yh_hugs to Krammy