Its hard and to be honest theres a lot of PC B.S going around about forgiveness being good for you.
Make peace with yourself if you can move on and don't feel the need or want to have this man in your life then don't.
In my situation its reversed I remember my father when he was fun, happy and at home, my brothers remember him as moody, as the man who walked out on us, the dad that left.
I understand that he was ill ( bi polar) and couldn't help much of his behaviour my brothers don't know or don't care.
I accept that and know the hurt they feel is real the dad I knew and remember is really a different man to the one they knew, so I don't expect them to come round to my way of thinking.
Your younger brothers and sisters need to respect your decision.
Good Luck
is there a time to forgive
is there a time to forgive
You have to go with your feelings. After his death, will you be able to live with yourself if you don't see him again? I'm a strong believer in forgiveness. Holding a grudge just can't be healthy IMO. BUT in your situation, I cannot honestly say I'd be so forgiving. Sounds like he hasn't changed a bit. 
-
RedGlitter
- Posts: 15777
- Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2005 3:51 am
is there a time to forgive
Just because you go to him for a final word doesn't mean you need to forgive. Forgive him if you want to or if you can but don't beat yourself up if you opt not to. I know forgiveness is the Christian thing to do but I figure the ones you can't forgive, well, see if God will. There's a song about forgiveness I can't remember now but it sings....
God will but I won't
God does but I don't
And that's the difference
Between God and me.
There are regrets you can live with and regrets you can't. You could probably live with it if yous aw him again and he was horrid to you. But could you live with it if you didn't see him and it became too late?
God will but I won't
God does but I don't
And that's the difference
Between God and me.
There are regrets you can live with and regrets you can't. You could probably live with it if yous aw him again and he was horrid to you. But could you live with it if you didn't see him and it became too late?
is there a time to forgive
Jim I had a very hard childhood as you may know and Im not going to go into it again and bore everybody but one thing I will always be grateful for........making it right with my mother at the end.Now when I think or write about her its with love even though I still remember the bad times that little girl had to go through and then remembering that I am her.She done me alot of favours my mother I guess in many ways and made me the person I am today....ok some may not like me but I know whats inside me and what I do in the RW to help people so guess thats all that is important.You are a good person mate and I know you have had alot of hard times and yet you still most of the time have a "smile on your face" for so many here.Chris didn't like his father....I cant discuss why as its not upto me to tell you but I will tell you this.....he was with him at the end and done everything a good son should do.Also I believe Chris is the man he is today also because of what he went through and swore he would never be like that.Dont live with bad memories all your life Jim as it will just eat away at you and one day you will regret .....for whatever reason......you was not there.Ive made alot of mistakes in my life and thought after.........you silly cow why did you do that........but the one thing I dont regret is being there for my mother at the end of her life and pray that where ever she may be now is full of the love that she could not show or have in this life.
Women are bitchy and predictable ...men are not and that's the key to knowing the truth.
is there a time to forgive
jimbo;944312 wrote: thanks for your thoughts guys , i really dont know what to do i'm still so hurt and angry over the way he treated us but i'm a caring human being and the thought of maybe this old man regretting what he has done does upset meJim do it for you if not for him.....your the one thats going to have to live with themselves....alot of todays mistakes are tomorrows
regretsYou have alot of lost yesterdays Jim dont lose today while you have the chance.
regretsYou have alot of lost yesterdays Jim dont lose today while you have the chance.
Women are bitchy and predictable ...men are not and that's the key to knowing the truth.
is there a time to forgive
It seems that when you saw him last he hadn't changed and was still verbally abusive. Sometimes you just need to walk away...but always forgive Jimbo or it will eat at you forever. Forgiveness doesn't mean forget or trusting that person again, it's all about keeping your own heart free.
is there a time to forgive
My grandfather was also a very violent man. He beat my father and treated him just as badly as your father treated you. My father hated him so much that he got up one night, got dressed and ran away from home. He had enough money on him to get from Ireland to England where his cousin lived. He had to hitch and walk many miles from the ferry to her home and arrived hungry and weary. She fed him, gave him a bed and got him a job. He never went back.
Then one day my grandfather turned up on our doorstep. He told my dad it was his duty to look after him in his old age. My dad took him in and cared for him for 20 years. In that time he terrorised my mother and us children. If you annoyed him or made a peep when any of the many news programmes were on he'd whack you with his walking stick. He paid my mother a pittance for his keep. He had a large biscuit tin he kept under his bed which I once saw opened. It was stuffed full of £20 notes. There must have been thousands in there. His daughters (my dads sisters) would come and visit him occasionally. They treated my mother like a servant, making her run around after them and deploring the way she looked after him, yet they always made excuses as to why they couldn't look after him themselves. After 20 years, when it was obvious he wouldn't have long left, his youngest daughter (who is one of life's spongers) turned up and said she was going to look after 'daddy' now. She got a council flat to care for him in, got benefits for him and seemed to suddenly have a lot of money to spend on herself. Six months later he died and my parents, after 20 years, got nothing in his will. Not that they wanted anything but it would have been nice if he could have acknowledged my dad as a good son, which he was, or just left him some token to remember him by. Instead my dad was treated badly as a child and treated badly when my grandad came to live with us. He made everyone's lives a misery and he didn't give a sh!t about anyone.
My dad adored his mother. He was very close to her. One day, when he was young, he found that the man she loved had left her and married someone else. She married my grandad on the rebound and he made her life hell too. My grandad was a total g!t to everyone, for the whole of his life. When he died he left money for his body to be flown back to Ireland for burial. My dad flew his body home but had him buried in a different cemetary from his mother. He didn't want his mother to have to put up with him being near her any longer. Now my parents have retired to Ireland to live. My dad cares for his mothers grave. He never visits his dads grave.
I think some people are just total g!ts! They always have been and always will be and will never change. Maybe they're just too selfish too. Or too shallow. I think these people will forever hurt and upset you because they simply just don't give a damn about you.
I remember people on Fg once talking about 'what goes around comes around' and Spot replied, saying Actually, that's not true. He asked, how often do people do something mean or cruel or upsetting? And how often do you actually see them get their comeuppance? Sorry for paraphrasing you Spot, but that stuck with me. It's true, I think, that people often don't get what they deserve, good or bad. And likewise I think that if someone has always been horrible to you and you know they will always be horrible, then why upset yourself by feeling obliged to visit them to make your peace and to be nice. Instead you find all the hurts and upsets which you had put behind you, coming back to the fore and after all the trouble you've gone to and all your good intentions you end up angry and fed up and p!ssed off and wishing you'd just never bothered.
Another saying is that Leopards never change their spots. Jimbo, if you feel the need to see your dad and make peace then good for you and I hope all goes really well for you. But from what I know of you, you're a very good man. A lovely friend, a wonderful husband, an adoring father. Although it would be wonderful for your dad to acknowledge the good man you are, you don't need his approval. If you're happier not visiting and if you know visiting him will wind you up and make you upset and angry, then just remember him as he was. Personally I think its better to remember someone like this as the person they were, acknowledge them for her they are and then just leave them alone.
Sorry, I've burbled on for no particular purpose. I suppose I'm just trying to say that you should do what you can live with and if you prefer not to visit and not to stir up old enmities then you shouldn't feel you have to. He made his feelings clear with Chantelle. If he wanted you to visit, he could ask you. I, personally, doubt you'd find him any different and I don't think it will make any difference to how you ultimately view him. Its just my opinion really but I wish you all the very best in whatever you choose to do. :-4
Then one day my grandfather turned up on our doorstep. He told my dad it was his duty to look after him in his old age. My dad took him in and cared for him for 20 years. In that time he terrorised my mother and us children. If you annoyed him or made a peep when any of the many news programmes were on he'd whack you with his walking stick. He paid my mother a pittance for his keep. He had a large biscuit tin he kept under his bed which I once saw opened. It was stuffed full of £20 notes. There must have been thousands in there. His daughters (my dads sisters) would come and visit him occasionally. They treated my mother like a servant, making her run around after them and deploring the way she looked after him, yet they always made excuses as to why they couldn't look after him themselves. After 20 years, when it was obvious he wouldn't have long left, his youngest daughter (who is one of life's spongers) turned up and said she was going to look after 'daddy' now. She got a council flat to care for him in, got benefits for him and seemed to suddenly have a lot of money to spend on herself. Six months later he died and my parents, after 20 years, got nothing in his will. Not that they wanted anything but it would have been nice if he could have acknowledged my dad as a good son, which he was, or just left him some token to remember him by. Instead my dad was treated badly as a child and treated badly when my grandad came to live with us. He made everyone's lives a misery and he didn't give a sh!t about anyone.
My dad adored his mother. He was very close to her. One day, when he was young, he found that the man she loved had left her and married someone else. She married my grandad on the rebound and he made her life hell too. My grandad was a total g!t to everyone, for the whole of his life. When he died he left money for his body to be flown back to Ireland for burial. My dad flew his body home but had him buried in a different cemetary from his mother. He didn't want his mother to have to put up with him being near her any longer. Now my parents have retired to Ireland to live. My dad cares for his mothers grave. He never visits his dads grave.
I think some people are just total g!ts! They always have been and always will be and will never change. Maybe they're just too selfish too. Or too shallow. I think these people will forever hurt and upset you because they simply just don't give a damn about you.
I remember people on Fg once talking about 'what goes around comes around' and Spot replied, saying Actually, that's not true. He asked, how often do people do something mean or cruel or upsetting? And how often do you actually see them get their comeuppance? Sorry for paraphrasing you Spot, but that stuck with me. It's true, I think, that people often don't get what they deserve, good or bad. And likewise I think that if someone has always been horrible to you and you know they will always be horrible, then why upset yourself by feeling obliged to visit them to make your peace and to be nice. Instead you find all the hurts and upsets which you had put behind you, coming back to the fore and after all the trouble you've gone to and all your good intentions you end up angry and fed up and p!ssed off and wishing you'd just never bothered.
Another saying is that Leopards never change their spots. Jimbo, if you feel the need to see your dad and make peace then good for you and I hope all goes really well for you. But from what I know of you, you're a very good man. A lovely friend, a wonderful husband, an adoring father. Although it would be wonderful for your dad to acknowledge the good man you are, you don't need his approval. If you're happier not visiting and if you know visiting him will wind you up and make you upset and angry, then just remember him as he was. Personally I think its better to remember someone like this as the person they were, acknowledge them for her they are and then just leave them alone.
Sorry, I've burbled on for no particular purpose. I suppose I'm just trying to say that you should do what you can live with and if you prefer not to visit and not to stir up old enmities then you shouldn't feel you have to. He made his feelings clear with Chantelle. If he wanted you to visit, he could ask you. I, personally, doubt you'd find him any different and I don't think it will make any difference to how you ultimately view him. Its just my opinion really but I wish you all the very best in whatever you choose to do. :-4
is there a time to forgive
shelbell;944595 wrote: It seems that when you saw him last he hadn't changed and was still verbally abusive. Sometimes you just need to walk away...but always forgive Jimbo or it will eat at you forever. Forgiveness doesn't mean forget or trusting that person again, it's all about keeping your own heart free.
Wow. Shelbell said it all so much better than me. Thanks Shelbell.
Wow. Shelbell said it all so much better than me. Thanks Shelbell.
is there a time to forgive
A friend of mine had a father who was a raving alcoholic, and years of abuse the father ended up on the streets leaving the mother to raise the whole family.
All his life my freind had nothing to do with his father, then he heard his father died.
My friend was so up set and I couldn’t understand why, he said, ‘‘I just lost the father I never had, and all of the ‘what might have been’s’are gone.’’
It is not about you needing to forgive the past, it is about reconciliation for the future, so that you can have peace.
You can only move forward in life, and sometimes, as hard as it can be, you need to let go of the past.
The question is, do you want him in your future, forgetting the past? Because there is no way he can be in you future without forgetting it.
It is a choice.
All his life my freind had nothing to do with his father, then he heard his father died.
My friend was so up set and I couldn’t understand why, he said, ‘‘I just lost the father I never had, and all of the ‘what might have been’s’are gone.’’
It is not about you needing to forgive the past, it is about reconciliation for the future, so that you can have peace.
You can only move forward in life, and sometimes, as hard as it can be, you need to let go of the past.
The question is, do you want him in your future, forgetting the past? Because there is no way he can be in you future without forgetting it.
It is a choice.
is there a time to forgive
I wouldnt have written this reply years ago, but Ive learned and I ve changed. Many humans have a problem with guilt, and with anger.
Its perfectly OK to be angry, and guilt is a waste of time. It is perfectly acceptable to walk away totally from someone who causes you pain. It is not necessary to be vengful, or hateful, or mean. You just walk away.
In light of your fathers behaviors, you would be mentally unhealthy if you wanted to see him.
You wouldnt drink poison, would you?
You wouldnt climb into a cage with a rabid animal....
You have had to struggle very hard to overcome the things he did to you.
Despite his gross mistreatment, you turned into a loving, and caring person... who is compassionate... and have a tremendous sense of humor.
Statistics show, that you could have easily turned out just like him.
But you didnt.
Leave him where he is. Leave him in the past, and continue to look forward, and live your life. You have other people, in your life depending on your strength.
It is your God given right to make the decison to stay far away from anyone who makes you feel bad. We were not meant to spend our lives feeling bad.
The only thing to feel bad about in this situation, is the twisted reality that for some reason your dad was allowed the privledge of being a dad.
If you feel the need to do some good.... go work with kids who have been through what you have. Suffered at the hands of a cruel adult. They would benefit from being with you. You could help them recover.
Its perfectly OK to be angry, and guilt is a waste of time. It is perfectly acceptable to walk away totally from someone who causes you pain. It is not necessary to be vengful, or hateful, or mean. You just walk away.
In light of your fathers behaviors, you would be mentally unhealthy if you wanted to see him.
You wouldnt drink poison, would you?
You wouldnt climb into a cage with a rabid animal....
You have had to struggle very hard to overcome the things he did to you.
Despite his gross mistreatment, you turned into a loving, and caring person... who is compassionate... and have a tremendous sense of humor.
Statistics show, that you could have easily turned out just like him.
But you didnt.
Leave him where he is. Leave him in the past, and continue to look forward, and live your life. You have other people, in your life depending on your strength.
It is your God given right to make the decison to stay far away from anyone who makes you feel bad. We were not meant to spend our lives feeling bad.
The only thing to feel bad about in this situation, is the twisted reality that for some reason your dad was allowed the privledge of being a dad.
If you feel the need to do some good.... go work with kids who have been through what you have. Suffered at the hands of a cruel adult. They would benefit from being with you. You could help them recover.
[FONT=Microsoft Sans Serif][/FONT]
-
Accountable
- Posts: 24818
- Joined: Mon May 30, 2005 8:33 am
is there a time to forgive
I didn't read the rest but couldn't write anything to improve on Weeder's suggestion.
-
suzy_creamcheese
- Posts: 135
- Joined: Sun Apr 13, 2008 1:15 am
is there a time to forgive
some wise words in this thread.
I would keep away from the guy. He sounds like bad news
I would keep away from the guy. He sounds like bad news
-
Trunk Monkey
- Posts: 21928
- Joined: Fri Feb 15, 2008 8:55 am
is there a time to forgive
This is a hard one but I can only say do what you feel is the right thing. I don't hold grudges and forgive but I have a tendency never to forget. Good luck to you.
is there a time to forgive
Jim, there have been so many posts with good advice, some have succinctly said what most of us feel. I think you must do what you feel is best for you and your own immediate family. It was you who went through that trauma, and you did an amazing job to overcome the evilness of that man. If the reason he wants to see you is to say sorry to you, in my opinion it is too late for him, he should have taken the opportunity when you took Chantelle to see him, but he didn't and it is too late now. Have no guilty conscience about it Jim, he doesn't deserve it, and thinking about it I would think he would not have changed his attitude towards you. People who have lived all their lives like that, don't change.
The other thought is, why has he not written to you himself and said sorry to you and asked you, himself, to visit him ?? If he hasn't done that, then that says it all surely.
All the very best to you Jim, and my thoughts are with you, you lovely man XXX
The other thought is, why has he not written to you himself and said sorry to you and asked you, himself, to visit him ?? If he hasn't done that, then that says it all surely.
All the very best to you Jim, and my thoughts are with you, you lovely man XXX
I'm a Saga-lout, growing old disgracefully
-
southern yankee
- Posts: 3906
- Joined: Sat Jul 05, 2008 7:38 pm
is there a time to forgive
My hubby is going through this pain right now. His younger years he was a MEAN DRUNK. he has a 21 year old daughter he has not seen since she was 4. I have tried to get him to write her a letter. But he knows by other family members how she wants nothing to do with him. He just wants to tell her he is so sorry for all the pain he put her and her mother through in those DRINKING DAYS. On her birthday, and other holidays it is very painful for him. He knows it was all his fault. So if your dad feels the same. Give hin a chance to saY HE IS SORRY. He may truly be sorry. But only you can make this choice. I know you may never be able to forget. But forgiving someone will heal you too.
is there a time to forgive
jimbo if ya want to go il take ya
"To be foolish and to recognize that one is foolish, is better than to be foolish and imagine that one is wise."
is there a time to forgive
For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you: But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.
(Matthew 6:14,15)
(Matthew 6:14,15)
is there a time to forgive
jimbo;943941 wrote: my father was a very violent man ,women ,children ,animals he took great pleasure in beating us all , he would starve us ,send us to school in rags ,work us into the ground so our hands bled and beat you with a huge stick if you stopped , i could go on all day about the things he has done but its not about him its about me , chantelle wanted to see him a while back and against my better judgement i took her to see him ,all he did was go on about how much he hates american's and how horrible they are , chantelle has spent most of her life in the states so this was most upsetting for her ,she said i never want to see that evil old man again even though i had warned her what he was like she never imagined that he was that bad
my point is this i have half brohers and sisters much younger than i am and i'm getting a lot of grief about that he is really old and wants to see me but in all honesty i dont ever want to see him again
although i think of myself as a good man and i know i should be able to forgive i just cant its just too painfull am i wrong should i go see him or not
I can honestly see why you don't want to see him after everything he has done...............forgiveness in your case is overrated. The extent of what he did to you will always live on in your mind.
He deserves no forgiveness.................but only you can decide this.
my point is this i have half brohers and sisters much younger than i am and i'm getting a lot of grief about that he is really old and wants to see me but in all honesty i dont ever want to see him again
although i think of myself as a good man and i know i should be able to forgive i just cant its just too painfull am i wrong should i go see him or not
I can honestly see why you don't want to see him after everything he has done...............forgiveness in your case is overrated. The extent of what he did to you will always live on in your mind.
He deserves no forgiveness.................but only you can decide this.
Life is just to short for drama.
is there a time to forgive
From time to time were each reminded what it is to stand alone.
I AM AWESOME MAN
-
southern yankee
- Posts: 3906
- Joined: Sat Jul 05, 2008 7:38 pm
is there a time to forgive
Nomad;959531 wrote: From time to time were each reminded what it is to stand alone. a very true statement:-1
-
WonderWendy3
- Posts: 12412
- Joined: Thu Nov 09, 2006 7:44 am
is there a time to forgive
Rapunzel;944599 wrote: My grandfather was also a very violent man. He beat my father and treated him just as badly as your father treated you. My father hated him so much that he got up one night, got dressed and ran away from home. He had enough money on him to get from Ireland to England where his cousin lived. He had to hitch and walk many miles from the ferry to her home and arrived hungry and weary. She fed him, gave him a bed and got him a job. He never went back.
Then one day my grandfather turned up on our doorstep. He told my dad it was his duty to look after him in his old age. My dad took him in and cared for him for 20 years. In that time he terrorised my mother and us children. If you annoyed him or made a peep when any of the many news programmes were on he'd whack you with his walking stick. He paid my mother a pittance for his keep. He had a large biscuit tin he kept under his bed which I once saw opened. It was stuffed full of £20 notes. There must have been thousands in there. His daughters (my dads sisters) would come and visit him occasionally. They treated my mother like a servant, making her run around after them and deploring the way she looked after him, yet they always made excuses as to why they couldn't look after him themselves. After 20 years, when it was obvious he wouldn't have long left, his youngest daughter (who is one of life's spongers) turned up and said she was going to look after 'daddy' now. She got a council flat to care for him in, got benefits for him and seemed to suddenly have a lot of money to spend on herself. Six months later he died and my parents, after 20 years, got nothing in his will. Not that they wanted anything but it would have been nice if he could have acknowledged my dad as a good son, which he was, or just left him some token to remember him by. Instead my dad was treated badly as a child and treated badly when my grandad came to live with us. He made everyone's lives a misery and he didn't give a sh!t about anyone.
My dad adored his mother. He was very close to her. One day, when he was young, he found that the man she loved had left her and married someone else. She married my grandad on the rebound and he made her life hell too. My grandad was a total g!t to everyone, for the whole of his life. When he died he left money for his body to be flown back to Ireland for burial. My dad flew his body home but had him buried in a different cemetary from his mother. He didn't want his mother to have to put up with him being near her any longer. Now my parents have retired to Ireland to live. My dad cares for his mothers grave. He never visits his dads grave.
I think some people are just total g!ts! They always have been and always will be and will never change. Maybe they're just too selfish too. Or too shallow. I think these people will forever hurt and upset you because they simply just don't give a damn about you.
I remember people on Fg once talking about 'what goes around comes around' and Spot replied, saying Actually, that's not true. He asked, how often do people do something mean or cruel or upsetting? And how often do you actually see them get their comeuppance? Sorry for paraphrasing you Spot, but that stuck with me. It's true, I think, that people often don't get what they deserve, good or bad. And likewise I think that if someone has always been horrible to you and you know they will always be horrible, then why upset yourself by feeling obliged to visit them to make your peace and to be nice. Instead you find all the hurts and upsets which you had put behind you, coming back to the fore and after all the trouble you've gone to and all your good intentions you end up angry and fed up and p!ssed off and wishing you'd just never bothered.
Another saying is that Leopards never change their spots. Jimbo, if you feel the need to see your dad and make peace then good for you and I hope all goes really well for you. But from what I know of you, you're a very good man. A lovely friend, a wonderful husband, an adoring father. Although it would be wonderful for your dad to acknowledge the good man you are, you don't need his approval. If you're happier not visiting and if you know visiting him will wind you up and make you upset and angry, then just remember him as he was. Personally I think its better to remember someone like this as the person they were, acknowledge them for her they are and then just leave them alone.
Sorry, I've burbled on for no particular purpose. I suppose I'm just trying to say that you should do what you can live with and if you prefer not to visit and not to stir up old enmities then you shouldn't feel you have to. He made his feelings clear with Chantelle. If he wanted you to visit, he could ask you. I, personally, doubt you'd find him any different and I don't think it will make any difference to how you ultimately view him. Its just my opinion really but I wish you all the very best in whatever you choose to do. :-4
Wow, awesome post Rapunzel as usual and it made me cry!!!
Jimbo, I'm with the bunch that says to follow your heart..the only thing I have to relate to this is my ex husband had a HORRIBLE mother, and he swore he would NEVER see her again, including her funeral. We stayed away from her for 7 years and then tried to re-unite with her, just to find that she was the same old mean witch he grew up with.....About 6-months to a year after she insulted my ex for the very last time....she died a horrible painful death.
My ex went to her funeral reluctantly and actually ONLY because of his sister who BEGGED him....my ex had major problems with this woman when she was alive and even after she died....he wanted something from her that he never got....unconditional love, and I even told her that while she was living when he wasn't around, but she really never saw herself at fault for anything.
Your dad is who he is....he's not going to change and YOU are the person that needs to have peace in your heart about the way you feel for him. you could go see him and he will probably treat you the same way, or he could treat you differently....bottom line is....follow your heart, make sure you are doing it because of YOU, not him......
big hugs to my sweet friend!!:-4
Then one day my grandfather turned up on our doorstep. He told my dad it was his duty to look after him in his old age. My dad took him in and cared for him for 20 years. In that time he terrorised my mother and us children. If you annoyed him or made a peep when any of the many news programmes were on he'd whack you with his walking stick. He paid my mother a pittance for his keep. He had a large biscuit tin he kept under his bed which I once saw opened. It was stuffed full of £20 notes. There must have been thousands in there. His daughters (my dads sisters) would come and visit him occasionally. They treated my mother like a servant, making her run around after them and deploring the way she looked after him, yet they always made excuses as to why they couldn't look after him themselves. After 20 years, when it was obvious he wouldn't have long left, his youngest daughter (who is one of life's spongers) turned up and said she was going to look after 'daddy' now. She got a council flat to care for him in, got benefits for him and seemed to suddenly have a lot of money to spend on herself. Six months later he died and my parents, after 20 years, got nothing in his will. Not that they wanted anything but it would have been nice if he could have acknowledged my dad as a good son, which he was, or just left him some token to remember him by. Instead my dad was treated badly as a child and treated badly when my grandad came to live with us. He made everyone's lives a misery and he didn't give a sh!t about anyone.
My dad adored his mother. He was very close to her. One day, when he was young, he found that the man she loved had left her and married someone else. She married my grandad on the rebound and he made her life hell too. My grandad was a total g!t to everyone, for the whole of his life. When he died he left money for his body to be flown back to Ireland for burial. My dad flew his body home but had him buried in a different cemetary from his mother. He didn't want his mother to have to put up with him being near her any longer. Now my parents have retired to Ireland to live. My dad cares for his mothers grave. He never visits his dads grave.
I think some people are just total g!ts! They always have been and always will be and will never change. Maybe they're just too selfish too. Or too shallow. I think these people will forever hurt and upset you because they simply just don't give a damn about you.
I remember people on Fg once talking about 'what goes around comes around' and Spot replied, saying Actually, that's not true. He asked, how often do people do something mean or cruel or upsetting? And how often do you actually see them get their comeuppance? Sorry for paraphrasing you Spot, but that stuck with me. It's true, I think, that people often don't get what they deserve, good or bad. And likewise I think that if someone has always been horrible to you and you know they will always be horrible, then why upset yourself by feeling obliged to visit them to make your peace and to be nice. Instead you find all the hurts and upsets which you had put behind you, coming back to the fore and after all the trouble you've gone to and all your good intentions you end up angry and fed up and p!ssed off and wishing you'd just never bothered.
Another saying is that Leopards never change their spots. Jimbo, if you feel the need to see your dad and make peace then good for you and I hope all goes really well for you. But from what I know of you, you're a very good man. A lovely friend, a wonderful husband, an adoring father. Although it would be wonderful for your dad to acknowledge the good man you are, you don't need his approval. If you're happier not visiting and if you know visiting him will wind you up and make you upset and angry, then just remember him as he was. Personally I think its better to remember someone like this as the person they were, acknowledge them for her they are and then just leave them alone.
Sorry, I've burbled on for no particular purpose. I suppose I'm just trying to say that you should do what you can live with and if you prefer not to visit and not to stir up old enmities then you shouldn't feel you have to. He made his feelings clear with Chantelle. If he wanted you to visit, he could ask you. I, personally, doubt you'd find him any different and I don't think it will make any difference to how you ultimately view him. Its just my opinion really but I wish you all the very best in whatever you choose to do. :-4
Wow, awesome post Rapunzel as usual and it made me cry!!!
Jimbo, I'm with the bunch that says to follow your heart..the only thing I have to relate to this is my ex husband had a HORRIBLE mother, and he swore he would NEVER see her again, including her funeral. We stayed away from her for 7 years and then tried to re-unite with her, just to find that she was the same old mean witch he grew up with.....About 6-months to a year after she insulted my ex for the very last time....she died a horrible painful death.
My ex went to her funeral reluctantly and actually ONLY because of his sister who BEGGED him....my ex had major problems with this woman when she was alive and even after she died....he wanted something from her that he never got....unconditional love, and I even told her that while she was living when he wasn't around, but she really never saw herself at fault for anything.
Your dad is who he is....he's not going to change and YOU are the person that needs to have peace in your heart about the way you feel for him. you could go see him and he will probably treat you the same way, or he could treat you differently....bottom line is....follow your heart, make sure you are doing it because of YOU, not him......
big hugs to my sweet friend!!:-4
is there a time to forgive
Jimbo..i am sorry for the childhood you describe..yet i can see you are a remarkable man.kind, honest, compassionate.
The trick to visiting your dad is how would it make YOU feel. Have you let go of the want of a dad that you never had? When you let all those wants and expectations go away then it wont hurt you to see him so much. If you think he could still hurt you would you want to put yourself in that situation? This isnt about making your dad feel better..he lost that right. Make your decisions on you, follow your heart.
The trick to visiting your dad is how would it make YOU feel. Have you let go of the want of a dad that you never had? When you let all those wants and expectations go away then it wont hurt you to see him so much. If you think he could still hurt you would you want to put yourself in that situation? This isnt about making your dad feel better..he lost that right. Make your decisions on you, follow your heart.
-
Accountable
- Posts: 24818
- Joined: Mon May 30, 2005 8:33 am
is there a time to forgive
jimbo;959627 wrote: the thing is guppy i really really tried when i was a young man right up till i was about 30 for us to have some sort of relationship ,he was bad to the bone then and he pretty much is the same now, i'm just so confused i dont know what to do :-5:-5
Then make one visit. No expectations. Think of it like checking bad milk. Sure it's probably spoiled and you'll feel silly for smelling, but at least you'll be sure.
Then make one visit. No expectations. Think of it like checking bad milk. Sure it's probably spoiled and you'll feel silly for smelling, but at least you'll be sure.
is there a time to forgive
jimbo;943941 wrote:
although i think of myself as a good man and i know i should be able to forgive i just cant its just too painfull am i wrong should i go see him or not
I personally don't think anyone should feel obligated to forgive the bad things one has done to another...I think this is where we might confuse upon which we refer to the word "forgive"...
I personally wouldn't forgive the things he's done, but I think it's only right to accept the fact that even people to whom do wicked things are still human beings...
If there's not one ounce of thoughtfulness left or within a person I do not feel they can be forgiven...As for the rest it's being able to forgive the instances that has occurred...And for that I wouldn't expect anyone to be able to forgive the things he's done...
although i think of myself as a good man and i know i should be able to forgive i just cant its just too painfull am i wrong should i go see him or not
I personally don't think anyone should feel obligated to forgive the bad things one has done to another...I think this is where we might confuse upon which we refer to the word "forgive"...
I personally wouldn't forgive the things he's done, but I think it's only right to accept the fact that even people to whom do wicked things are still human beings...
If there's not one ounce of thoughtfulness left or within a person I do not feel they can be forgiven...As for the rest it's being able to forgive the instances that has occurred...And for that I wouldn't expect anyone to be able to forgive the things he's done...