Politics is Reason, Free from Passion

Aphra Behn · Post by **Aphra Behn** » Tue Oct 10, 2006 9:27 pm

It seems to me, from the evidence I have seen, that many people who continue to defend the President continue to base their opinions strictly on feelings and emotions, rather than pure substance and reason. Most people have heard the saying, "right makes might." Believing that this is true, and hoping that most intelligent, reasonable people would agree as well, one must ask the question as to why the current President of The United States' reputation, as well as entire administration and Republican party, has been beaten down, weakened, and now stands on the threshold of virtual decimation in the next election. Where is the President's might? Just how much has he done right? Can anyone truly and reasonably give an answer as to why a self-proclaimed man of doing-what-is-right has contaminated his own political party to the point of self-destruction, through his own weakness, made visible due to a string of incorrect decision making? Feel free to reply in any way, but I am most interested in those that can give a logical, reasonable answer to these questions, with some evidence to back it up.

Accountable · Post by **Accountable** » Wed Oct 11, 2006 3:35 am

Welcome, Aphra Behn. Not a lot of Bush support here, though you'll find the full political spectrum, including strong conservative and US Republican thought.

Bush has painted his party in a corner, not only with the wars, but by failing to groom someone to pass the baton to. This should be a great time for a more minor party to create some inroads. No way they'll take the Presidency, but maybe set the stage for a future challenge.

Do you have someone in mind for this election, Behn?

zinkyusa · Post by **zinkyusa** » Wed Oct 11, 2006 5:50 am

I don't believe might ever makes right, nor do I believe in my country right or wrong. Bush made a serious error in invading Iraq and our country is paying the price.. The only thing might does is sometimes allow you to impose your will on others, something the US is supposed to stand against..The Republican party will pay the price in November and possibly again in two years IMO.

Aphra Behn · Post by **Aphra Behn** » Wed Oct 11, 2006 8:23 am

zinkyusa wrote: I don't believe might ever makes right, nor do I believe in my country right or wrong. Bush made a serious error in invading Iraq and our country is paying the price.. The only thing might does is sometimes allow you to impose your will on others, something the US is supposed to stand against..The Republican party will pay the price in November and possibly again in two years IMO.

You are correct zinky, might DOES NOT make right; however, right does make might. To say otherwise is to say there is no power in knowledge and no strength in truth. Doing the right thing should always be a source of power and goodness, and I firmly believe that, along with many others. Lincoln, as well as others, have used this statement before to stress the idea that there is always power and reward in doing the right thing.

Aphra Behn · Post by **Aphra Behn** » Wed Oct 11, 2006 8:26 am

flopstock wrote: Love to help you out here, but I don't believe 'right makes might' is a true statement.

And to be perfectly frank with you, while 'hoping that most intelligent, reasonable people would agree as well' might tempt the less intelligent to agree with it, simply to be included among the 'reasonable and intelligent'... the true smartie pants here would never fall for such a blatant ruse..

Now.. Is Bush an idiot? you bet.. he is a politician after all.

That does not mean that he is not attempting to do what he feels to be right. It could simply mean that he is wrong about what he thinks is right...:wah:

Next question..

Doing what is right or wrong is defined by the Americans for whom the President works.

Aphra Behn · Post by **Aphra Behn** » Wed Oct 11, 2006 8:32 am

Accountable wrote: Do you have someone in mind for this election, Behn?

The trend of Hollywood actors and actresses running for office doesn't sound half bad, at this point in the game. :-5

LilacDragon · Post by **LilacDragon** » Wed Oct 11, 2006 9:01 am

My 8 year old son and I had a conversation about this just the other day. We were discussing what he wanted to do when he grows up. Of course, at his age, the possibility of being President is something he would consider.

We - he and I - think that the most important part of being President is to remember that the American people are his boss and part of the job is looking out for the people. ALL of the people, not just the rich and influential. Not just the religious right.

At this point - I think that all politicians need to be taken out and shot. Just stop trying to figure out who is a good guy and who is a bad guy and start with a fresh bunch.

I am not a channel surfer so I end up sitting through all of the political commercials at election time. This year I just want to blow up the television! I swear there is only one candidate that I have seen that has a commercial that tells something of what THEY accomplished in their last term.

There is a race for Governor here this year and I swear - every single commercial that the two candidates have put out is a litany of how awful the other person is. What makes it really bad is that one of the candidates is from the other side of the state, so I have no idea who he is or what he has done.

Aaaaccckkkk.

Accountable · Post by **Accountable** » Wed Oct 11, 2006 4:14 pm

flopstock wrote: Once again, wrong.

All that Americans can do is attempt to elect someone that they feel can best represent them. Unfortunately that person is never likely to enter politics to begin with, so we are left to chose from among those who could not get or sustain regular day jobs. :wah: Oh!! SNAP!

Aphra Behn · Post by **Aphra Behn** » Wed Oct 11, 2006 5:28 pm

flopstock wrote: I don't believe 'right makes might' is a true statement.

flopstock wrote: Mistakes can be made..errors in judgement, personal perspectives factored in..and clouding issues. It actually is expected.

I’m still trying to get over the fact that we’ve found someone who doesn’t believe that doing the right thing brings to oneself a source of power and strength; nevertheless, you have maintained in your reasoning that the President is not wrong because he is simply doing what he believes to be the right thing. That is convoluted logic. Do we say a murderer has done the right thing, simply because he believes he has done the right thing? That is the logical equivalent of slashing the throats of an innocent family to save one’s own, and many an innocent Iraqi family has been killed in the course of this war, along with our American fighters. It never ceases to amaze me how we disregard the deaths of innocent families, as long as they are not American. The newest results just came out today (10/11/06) for Iraqis killed since the war began. Deaths are now estimated to be well over 600,000. This is after the President told us that Iraqi deaths were around 30,000. I suppose you also believe that the President isn’t a liar, either. How could he know what the actual numbers are? After all, he is only the President. If you believe that these are “errors in judgment,” then you are truly disillusioned. The President has the knowledge and intelligence to make educated decisions. He just chooses to do things in a way that, he believes, shows him to be a man of power. Ironically, this is the wrong direction to take, thereby weakening his reputation in the eyes of the American people. In the meantime, instead of searching for the truth while people die, you sit before your computer being more concerned with being “the last one standing.” In a physical contest, that may decide a winner, but be assured that in a search for the truth, he who gets the last word very well may be committing intellectual suicide.

Aphra Behn · Post by **Aphra Behn** » Wed Oct 11, 2006 6:57 pm

flopstock wrote: I just generally can't be bothered arguing with folks that don't have enough faith and belief in their argument to be forthright with it.

This is the classic excuse for getting out of an argument that one can not win. I have no hidden agenda. My agenda is clear for all to see, as you have proven. Thank you.

By the way, my name isn't sweet pea.

nvalleyvee · Post by **nvalleyvee** » Wed Oct 11, 2006 10:33 pm

I am a fully invested person in the gas and oil industry..........I made LOTS of money from it....

I don't give a flying for the general public and give a crap for what I am earning. I am going to be able to retire at 53 years old.

Can any of you say you would NOT like to do that?

So attack me for my good investments.

Wolverine · Post by **Wolverine** » Wed Oct 11, 2006 11:15 pm

flopstock wrote:

Or worse, can't recognize a Nickelback lyric and know what it means...:rolleyes:

Better luck next time.
God, I love you.

Accountable · Post by **Accountable** » Thu Oct 12, 2006 4:07 am

That it!

I'm quitting my job! I miss all the good stuff.

I wanna be just like Floppy when I grow up. Note that I said like Floppy, not that I wanna BE Floppy. Being floppy would be bad, very bad.

zinkyusa · Post by **zinkyusa** » Thu Oct 12, 2006 5:24 am

The main flaw with argument right makes might is that the term right is subjective..There is no right in reality, your belief that you are right may give you some power to do something but that still does not mean that you are right..Bush certainly believes he was right in invading Iraq and his convictions carried a lot of might..I believe that he was wrong so what? If the point of your statement is that believing you are right gives you some power then I agree..Hitler in his mind thought everything he did was right no doubt.