Right-wing fundamentalists have begun wresting power in Somalia, making television illegal. Two fans watching the (now illegal) World Cup broadcast were murdered by militia after they opened fire on a crowd, killing a young woman and a businessman.
Movies and television are banned unless they fit into the range of religious instruction acceptable to the Islamic regime.
If I haven't said this before, I've made many visits to Africa and have met some lovely Somali people in Kenya. Some of the most beautiful women I've ever seen were Somali. Guess what's on the slate for THEM?
Like their Afghani sisters, they'll be wearing burkhas, forbidden education or employment and thrust back into the 14th century, along with the rest of the country.
Yet another example of why radical Islam is a scourge on the planet!
Radical Islam in Somalia
Radical Islam in Somalia
My candle's burning at both ends, it will not last the night. But ah, my foes, and oh, my friends--It gives a lovely light!--Edna St. Vincent Millay
Radical Islam in Somalia
Not to mention female 'circumcision'. Not a specific directive in islam, but interpretation of the koranic verses are used to justify the practice.
O well know that we are frequently criticized for practicing male circumcision, but there are well proven medical advantages to it and the findings coming out regarding the transmission of the HIV also is worth note, but female genital mutilation?
No way. It is barbaric and hidious as are the results.
No benefits AT ALL, loss of sexual pleasure, and horrific pain when it is carried out, as it usually is, on a pubescent or pre-pubescent girl using a (frequently old) razor blade or even a piece of broken glass. Just to keep the woman "modest" and in reality, in her place.
There is no place for islam in the modern world.
This is well understood by the islamic adherents who, rather than try to bring islam into the modern world (actually and in spite of the BS to the contrary it can’t be done) instead have an agenda to drag the modern world back to the 7th. Century ‘morality’ that existed in tribal and frequently nomadic states and tribes.
I utterly detest islam as it is the very antithesis of decent and moral and evolved civilisation. I pity the people brainwashed into actually wanting its claw like hold over them.
O well know that we are frequently criticized for practicing male circumcision, but there are well proven medical advantages to it and the findings coming out regarding the transmission of the HIV also is worth note, but female genital mutilation?
No way. It is barbaric and hidious as are the results.
No benefits AT ALL, loss of sexual pleasure, and horrific pain when it is carried out, as it usually is, on a pubescent or pre-pubescent girl using a (frequently old) razor blade or even a piece of broken glass. Just to keep the woman "modest" and in reality, in her place.
There is no place for islam in the modern world.
This is well understood by the islamic adherents who, rather than try to bring islam into the modern world (actually and in spite of the BS to the contrary it can’t be done) instead have an agenda to drag the modern world back to the 7th. Century ‘morality’ that existed in tribal and frequently nomadic states and tribes.
I utterly detest islam as it is the very antithesis of decent and moral and evolved civilisation. I pity the people brainwashed into actually wanting its claw like hold over them.
Radical Islam in Somalia
Maybe there's no place for intolerant religon of any kind in the modern world. You can find similar intolerance amongst fundamentalist christians in attitides towards sexual freedom and women or trying to insist creationism be taught in schools as an established fact rather than the myth it is. You get religious terrorists prepared tp blow up abortion clinics and murder those who work there all in the name of their religon.
Any religon that preaches their way and no other has the capacity to produce extremists. Maybe a love of violence and intolerance is a basic flaw of religons that stem from harsh desert environments. You don't have to look very far back in history to find christians every bit as barbaric as present day fundamentalists.
Any religon that preaches their way and no other has the capacity to produce extremists. Maybe a love of violence and intolerance is a basic flaw of religons that stem from harsh desert environments. You don't have to look very far back in history to find christians every bit as barbaric as present day fundamentalists.
Radical Islam in Somalia
I know many muslims who like those of you who are reading this are shocked by the treatment of people under radical beliefs..
they have left countries of their birth for these very reasons..
so please people remember it is the radicals who are behaving this way not peaceful democraric 21st century living muslims..do not tar with the same brush all who have a common word associated with them..
personally lm with lennon on this..."imagine no religion.........only the brotherhood of man"
they have left countries of their birth for these very reasons..
so please people remember it is the radicals who are behaving this way not peaceful democraric 21st century living muslims..do not tar with the same brush all who have a common word associated with them..
personally lm with lennon on this..."imagine no religion.........only the brotherhood of man"
take a bite out of life it's there to be tasted!!
Radical Islam in Somalia
onsekiz wrote: I feel sad about ideas that say "islam is out of modern world".
I'm a muslim. I live in Turkey. I support democracy, human rights.
As venus said, you should not tar all muslims with the same brush.
Osama bin Laden is a muslim. And he has supporters.
But are we in same class? He is one of the people i hate most on earth.
There are bigoted people in all religions. All the muslims are not bigoted. There are millions of democrat muslims on earth.
Islam is not in contradiction with democracy and human rights.
I wanted to give some links but the software says i must have 15 posts before posting links.
Sorry for my poor English.
Welcome, your English is very much better than my Turkish so I hope you persevere
I think that those who hate the Muslims as a general group are the exception and most people will not tolerate that kind of racial bigotry.
One of the problems is mis-information and misunderstanding and only seeing the extremes of behaviour being reported. Getting to know a person or a culture is the best way of coming together – out of ignorance comes distrust and out of distrust comes hated.
I'm a muslim. I live in Turkey. I support democracy, human rights.
As venus said, you should not tar all muslims with the same brush.
Osama bin Laden is a muslim. And he has supporters.
But are we in same class? He is one of the people i hate most on earth.
There are bigoted people in all religions. All the muslims are not bigoted. There are millions of democrat muslims on earth.
Islam is not in contradiction with democracy and human rights.
I wanted to give some links but the software says i must have 15 posts before posting links.
Sorry for my poor English.
Welcome, your English is very much better than my Turkish so I hope you persevere
I think that those who hate the Muslims as a general group are the exception and most people will not tolerate that kind of racial bigotry.
One of the problems is mis-information and misunderstanding and only seeing the extremes of behaviour being reported. Getting to know a person or a culture is the best way of coming together – out of ignorance comes distrust and out of distrust comes hated.
Radical Islam in Somalia
Venus, please read this thread carefully and you'll see that, with one exception, we have all spoken against RADICAL religions. Nobody has painted all of Islam with that same "brush."
Certainly radical Christians exist and perpetuate terrible crimes against health care workers. They also spend considerable resources to deny civil rights to people with same-sex partners.
Much has been done in the past by Christians to eradicate cultures and religions of other groups.....just as radical Mulims are doing today in many parts of the world.
I've been to Turkey and seen that women do have some rights there. Take care--radicals are waiting to take those rights away. You must admit that the greatest danger to human rights in the world today (especially the rights of women) is posed by radical Islamic forces.
Certainly radical Christians exist and perpetuate terrible crimes against health care workers. They also spend considerable resources to deny civil rights to people with same-sex partners.
Much has been done in the past by Christians to eradicate cultures and religions of other groups.....just as radical Mulims are doing today in many parts of the world.
I've been to Turkey and seen that women do have some rights there. Take care--radicals are waiting to take those rights away. You must admit that the greatest danger to human rights in the world today (especially the rights of women) is posed by radical Islamic forces.
My candle's burning at both ends, it will not last the night. But ah, my foes, and oh, my friends--It gives a lovely light!--Edna St. Vincent Millay
Radical Islam in Somalia
While I'm not exactly ready to jump on the no religion band wagon, I am tired of all the radical sects of all the religions that exist today. I've worked with folks whose faith was Islam, and they were nice folks with morals very similiar to mine. I've also met several fellow Christians in my church who'd I'd like to string up due to their narrow mindness toward other folk's beliefs. :rolleyes:
"Girls are crazy! I'm not ever getting married, I can make my own sandwiches!"
my son
my son
Radical Islam in Somalia
amen!
My candle's burning at both ends, it will not last the night. But ah, my foes, and oh, my friends--It gives a lovely light!--Edna St. Vincent Millay
Radical Islam in Somalia
onsekiz wrote: I feel sad about ideas that say "islam is out of modern world".
I'm a muslim. I live in Turkey. I support democracy, human rights.
As venus said, you should not tar all muslims with the same brush.
Osama bin Laden is a muslim. And he has supporters.
But are we in same class? He is one of the people i hate most on earth.
There are bigoted people in all religions. All the muslims are not bigoted. There are millions of democrat muslims on earth.
Islam is not in contradiction with democracy and human rights.
I wanted to give some links but the software says i must have 15 posts before posting links.
Sorry for my poor English.
I think you will be a very welcome addition to this forum. Mustafa Kemal Atatürk is a statesman that can stand with any other on the planet. Wonder what he would think about what is happening now?
I'm a muslim. I live in Turkey. I support democracy, human rights.
As venus said, you should not tar all muslims with the same brush.
Osama bin Laden is a muslim. And he has supporters.
But are we in same class? He is one of the people i hate most on earth.
There are bigoted people in all religions. All the muslims are not bigoted. There are millions of democrat muslims on earth.
Islam is not in contradiction with democracy and human rights.
I wanted to give some links but the software says i must have 15 posts before posting links.
Sorry for my poor English.
I think you will be a very welcome addition to this forum. Mustafa Kemal Atatürk is a statesman that can stand with any other on the planet. Wonder what he would think about what is happening now?
Radical Islam in Somalia
You're very right about Mr. Ataturk! He accomplished amazing things, not the least of which was a modernized language and support for women.
We were charmed when we paid a bellboy to show us the rooms still kept for Ataturk at the famous old Pera Palas hotel in Istanbul. The rooms are as they were when he would occupy them...down to the towels and toilet paper!
We were charmed when we paid a bellboy to show us the rooms still kept for Ataturk at the famous old Pera Palas hotel in Istanbul. The rooms are as they were when he would occupy them...down to the towels and toilet paper!
My candle's burning at both ends, it will not last the night. But ah, my foes, and oh, my friends--It gives a lovely light!--Edna St. Vincent Millay
Radical Islam in Somalia
I stand by absolute assertion that there is no place in the modern world for islam.
It is not simply a religion like any other, it is a repressive regressive philosophy, more a cult than a religion.
At the age of 60 my own view is now that all religion is so much rubbish, it has served its purpose. It is time for humanity to move on.
I live in a nation that has a religion at its foundation. I regret this but accept it as a fact of life. All that a decent religion can do is to provide a social structure to house a moral code.
That it does more especially when it is based on the disjointed and frequently contradictory pronouncements of what I consider to a 7th. century paedophiles terrorist, I find appalling.
.
It is not simply a religion like any other, it is a repressive regressive philosophy, more a cult than a religion.
At the age of 60 my own view is now that all religion is so much rubbish, it has served its purpose. It is time for humanity to move on.
I live in a nation that has a religion at its foundation. I regret this but accept it as a fact of life. All that a decent religion can do is to provide a social structure to house a moral code.
That it does more especially when it is based on the disjointed and frequently contradictory pronouncements of what I consider to a 7th. century paedophiles terrorist, I find appalling.
.
Radical Islam in Somalia
How old was his child bride when he impregnated her?
And is it not in the hadiths that telling lies is the appropriate course of action for dealing with certain contingencies?
And ccould he really not write?
And how about how he dropped the so called Satanic Verses whish had recognised that there WERE other gods?
No, there is a very great deal about the life and times of that man that don't stand close examination, especially by someone who can read Arabic and so not have to rely on translations that so often include 'spin'.
How about the concept of dar ul islam vs dar ul haarb for example?
Don't confuse my contempt and hatred for islam with being a contempt and hatred for Muslim people. It is not. I would be amongst the first to affirm that there are a great many good and decent Muslim people in the world in SPITE of their being saddled with islam.
And is it not in the hadiths that telling lies is the appropriate course of action for dealing with certain contingencies?
And ccould he really not write?
And how about how he dropped the so called Satanic Verses whish had recognised that there WERE other gods?
No, there is a very great deal about the life and times of that man that don't stand close examination, especially by someone who can read Arabic and so not have to rely on translations that so often include 'spin'.
How about the concept of dar ul islam vs dar ul haarb for example?
Don't confuse my contempt and hatred for islam with being a contempt and hatred for Muslim people. It is not. I would be amongst the first to affirm that there are a great many good and decent Muslim people in the world in SPITE of their being saddled with islam.
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Adam Zapple
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Radical Islam in Somalia
Diuretic wrote: Let's rid ourselves of all the superstititions. What a wonderful world we'd have without religion. Imagine a world totally rational, devoid of the irrational notions of religion. I can only hope I suppose.
Yes, then perhaps we can have all countries run by the likes of atheists like Stalin, Pol Pot, Kim Il-sung, ....What a wonderful world......atheistic intolerance is no better than religious intolerance.
Yes, then perhaps we can have all countries run by the likes of atheists like Stalin, Pol Pot, Kim Il-sung, ....What a wonderful world......atheistic intolerance is no better than religious intolerance.
Radical Islam in Somalia
Adam Zapple wrote: Yes, then perhaps we can have all countries run by the likes of atheists like Stalin, Pol Pot, Kim Il-sung, ....What a wonderful world......atheistic intolerance is no better than religious intolerance.
Wloleheartedly agree with you there.
Personally I'm in favour of liberal democracy, Not perfect but it shows signs of surviving the test of time. Biggest problem is keeping religious and political idealogues or anyone else claiming a moral certitude getting control for too long.
Wloleheartedly agree with you there.
Personally I'm in favour of liberal democracy, Not perfect but it shows signs of surviving the test of time. Biggest problem is keeping religious and political idealogues or anyone else claiming a moral certitude getting control for too long.
Radical Islam in Somalia
onsekiz wrote: She was 18 when Muhammad married her. She was engaged with someone else but they did not get married because of religious difference. Muhammed wanted to marry her 10 years after the start of apocalypse. Aisha was born seven years before start of apocalypse.
He could not write or read before the appropriate. In the first appropriate Allah says "read, read with the name of Allah".
I don't believe in Satanic Verses. It's mystic belief. But i don't appreciate what Humeyni did about it. People are free to believe what they want.
There are many good translations of the holy book. You can read at kuran.gen.tr You can choose Muhammed Esed's. Spins are in my opinion intentional things which give a leg up to translators understanding of Islam. You should read the objective ones.
Darul Islam and darul harb are a very long subject i can't tell easly here. But you can use google.
Well, i understand you. You can be against any religion or idea. That does not keep me from respecting you.
I am perfectly ale to read and communicate in Arabic. I am 60 years old and am an Israli Jew. It is natural that I would do.
I have lived cheek by jowl with Muslim people and have a very deep knowledge and understanding of the way that different sects see each other and see the (basically two) lands, the land of 'peace', meaning that which is under the islamic heel, and the land of war meaning much of the rest - a land where war and it's consequences are acceptable. The other 'lands' are transitory states towards being eventually conquered by islam and so don't really count.
No comment on the telling of lies in islam I note?
And the dismissal of the so called Satanic Verses? Very smooth but misses the point.
Also his child bride - not quite as it is written eh?
Or his terrorist approaches in recorded cases of conflict?
Better leave it. I have no wish to offend anyone on a personal level but I utterly and unreservedly condemn islam as a foul cult that has no place in the modern world.
And no, I do not believe in any god and although I don’t disrespect you as a person, I utterly disrespect what you profess to believe in.
He could not write or read before the appropriate. In the first appropriate Allah says "read, read with the name of Allah".
I don't believe in Satanic Verses. It's mystic belief. But i don't appreciate what Humeyni did about it. People are free to believe what they want.
There are many good translations of the holy book. You can read at kuran.gen.tr You can choose Muhammed Esed's. Spins are in my opinion intentional things which give a leg up to translators understanding of Islam. You should read the objective ones.
Darul Islam and darul harb are a very long subject i can't tell easly here. But you can use google.
Well, i understand you. You can be against any religion or idea. That does not keep me from respecting you.
I am perfectly ale to read and communicate in Arabic. I am 60 years old and am an Israli Jew. It is natural that I would do.
I have lived cheek by jowl with Muslim people and have a very deep knowledge and understanding of the way that different sects see each other and see the (basically two) lands, the land of 'peace', meaning that which is under the islamic heel, and the land of war meaning much of the rest - a land where war and it's consequences are acceptable. The other 'lands' are transitory states towards being eventually conquered by islam and so don't really count.
No comment on the telling of lies in islam I note?
And the dismissal of the so called Satanic Verses? Very smooth but misses the point.
Also his child bride - not quite as it is written eh?
Or his terrorist approaches in recorded cases of conflict?
Better leave it. I have no wish to offend anyone on a personal level but I utterly and unreservedly condemn islam as a foul cult that has no place in the modern world.
And no, I do not believe in any god and although I don’t disrespect you as a person, I utterly disrespect what you profess to believe in.
Radical Islam in Somalia
golem wrote: I am perfectly ale to read and communicate in Arabic. I am 60 years old and am an Israli Jew. It is natural that I would do.
I have lived cheek by jowl with Muslim people and have a very deep knowledge and understanding of the way that different sects see each other and see the (basically two) lands, the land of 'peace', meaning that which is under the islamic heel, and the land of war meaning much of the rest - a land where war and it's consequences are acceptable. The other 'lands' are transitory states towards being eventually conquered by islam and so don't really count.
No comment on the telling of lies in islam I note?
And the dismissal of the so called Satanic Verses? Very smooth but misses the point.
Also his child bride - not quite as it is written eh?
Or his terrorist approaches in recorded cases of conflict?
Better leave it. I have no wish to offend anyone on a personal level but I utterly and unreservedly condemn islam as a foul cult that has no place in the modern world.
And no, I do not believe in any god and although I don’t disrespect you as a person, I utterly disrespect what you profess to believe in.
If anyone wrote this kind of rant about Judaeism they'd be condemned from here to eternaty as an anti-semitic bastard of the worst kind.
Why do you think it's OK for you to do so?
It's bigotry of the first order.
I have lived cheek by jowl with Muslim people and have a very deep knowledge and understanding of the way that different sects see each other and see the (basically two) lands, the land of 'peace', meaning that which is under the islamic heel, and the land of war meaning much of the rest - a land where war and it's consequences are acceptable. The other 'lands' are transitory states towards being eventually conquered by islam and so don't really count.
No comment on the telling of lies in islam I note?
And the dismissal of the so called Satanic Verses? Very smooth but misses the point.
Also his child bride - not quite as it is written eh?
Or his terrorist approaches in recorded cases of conflict?
Better leave it. I have no wish to offend anyone on a personal level but I utterly and unreservedly condemn islam as a foul cult that has no place in the modern world.
And no, I do not believe in any god and although I don’t disrespect you as a person, I utterly disrespect what you profess to believe in.
If anyone wrote this kind of rant about Judaeism they'd be condemned from here to eternaty as an anti-semitic bastard of the worst kind.
Why do you think it's OK for you to do so?
It's bigotry of the first order.
Radical Islam in Somalia
Bryn Mawr wrote: If anyone wrote this kind of rant about Judaeism they'd be condemned from here to eternaty as an anti-semitic bastard of the worst kind.
Why do you think it's OK for you to do so?
It's bigotry of the first order.
Point out any error.
Why do you think it's OK for you to do so?
It's bigotry of the first order.
Point out any error.
Radical Islam in Somalia
golem wrote: Point out any error.
Posting it in the first place!
Posting it in the first place!
Radical Islam in Somalia
Bryn Mawr wrote: Posting it in the first place!
So it's the condemnation of islam that you object to?
Tough.
So it's the condemnation of islam that you object to?
Tough.
Radical Islam in Somalia
posted by Bryn Mawr
If anyone wrote this kind of rant about Judaeism they'd be condemned from here to eternaty as an anti-semitic bastard of the worst kind.
Why do you think it's OK for you to do so?
It's bigotry of the first order.
golem wrote: Point out any error.
From the Oxford English Dictionary
bigot
/biggt/
• noun a person who is prejudiced in their views and intolerant of the opinions of others.
 DERIVATIVES bigoted adjective bigotry noun.
 ORIGIN French.
I don't profess to speak for Bryn Mawr but I don't believe she was pointing to any error, rather pointing out that that you have a bigoted viewpoint.
posted by golem
Better leave it. I have no wish to offend anyone on a personal level but I utterly and unreservedly condemn islam as a foul cult that has no place in the modern world.
You're entitled to express your opinion just as anyone else is. You shouldn't take it personally if someone disagrees with you. One of the characteristics of a bigot is that they are incapable of accepting that others may have a different point of view and become incapable of rational discussion resporting to phrases like better leave it.
Why should any of us leave it? After all it's not as though you are that frightening. This is after all a discussion form and IMO one of the main attractions is the facility to talk to others with widely different opinions and attitides than yur own.
If you didn't appreciate that you will encounter others who disagree with you then perhaps the concept of a discussion is one you don't fully appreciate. If you did appreciate it why are you surprised if people disagree with you and more to the point of you don't want to discuss why bother with a discussion forum in the first place.
If you think people are going to be offended by your opinions you are probably mistaken. It is frustrating when you basically state that is my opinion and I am not going to discuss it in case I offend people. You learn most when you talk to people you fundamentally disagree with and who make you think.
Why do you believe what you do? If you can't put a rational case then maybe you should go away and think about it because by definition you have an irrational set of beliefs.
I can't stand bigots but they're like midges, if you kill one thousands turn up for the funeral.
If anyone wrote this kind of rant about Judaeism they'd be condemned from here to eternaty as an anti-semitic bastard of the worst kind.
Why do you think it's OK for you to do so?
It's bigotry of the first order.
golem wrote: Point out any error.
From the Oxford English Dictionary
bigot
/biggt/
• noun a person who is prejudiced in their views and intolerant of the opinions of others.
 DERIVATIVES bigoted adjective bigotry noun.
 ORIGIN French.
I don't profess to speak for Bryn Mawr but I don't believe she was pointing to any error, rather pointing out that that you have a bigoted viewpoint.
posted by golem
Better leave it. I have no wish to offend anyone on a personal level but I utterly and unreservedly condemn islam as a foul cult that has no place in the modern world.
You're entitled to express your opinion just as anyone else is. You shouldn't take it personally if someone disagrees with you. One of the characteristics of a bigot is that they are incapable of accepting that others may have a different point of view and become incapable of rational discussion resporting to phrases like better leave it.
Why should any of us leave it? After all it's not as though you are that frightening. This is after all a discussion form and IMO one of the main attractions is the facility to talk to others with widely different opinions and attitides than yur own.
If you didn't appreciate that you will encounter others who disagree with you then perhaps the concept of a discussion is one you don't fully appreciate. If you did appreciate it why are you surprised if people disagree with you and more to the point of you don't want to discuss why bother with a discussion forum in the first place.
If you think people are going to be offended by your opinions you are probably mistaken. It is frustrating when you basically state that is my opinion and I am not going to discuss it in case I offend people. You learn most when you talk to people you fundamentally disagree with and who make you think.
Why do you believe what you do? If you can't put a rational case then maybe you should go away and think about it because by definition you have an irrational set of beliefs.
I can't stand bigots but they're like midges, if you kill one thousands turn up for the funeral.
Radical Islam in Somalia
gmc wrote: posted by Bryn Mawr
From the Oxford English Dictionary
I don't profess to speak for Bryn Mawr but I don't believe she was pointing to any error, rather pointing out that that you have a bigoted viewpoint.
posted by golem
You're entitled to express your opinion just as anyone else is. You shouldn't take it personally if someone disagrees with you. One of the characteristics of a bigot is that they are incapable of accepting that others may have a different point of view and become incapable of rational discussion resporting to phrases like better leave it.
Why should any of us leave it? After all it's not as though you are that frightening. This is after all a discussion form and IMO one of the main attractions is the facility to talk to others with widely different opinions and attitides than yur own.
If you didn't appreciate that you will encounter others who disagree with you then perhaps the concept of a discussion is one you don't fully appreciate. If you did appreciate it why are you surprised if people disagree with you and more to the point of you don't want to discuss why bother with a discussion forum in the first place.
If you think people are going to be offended by your opinions you are probably mistaken. It is frustrating when you basically state that is my opinion and I am not going to discuss it in case I offend people. You learn most when you talk to people you fundamentally disagree with and who make you think.
Why do you believe what you do? If you can't put a rational case then maybe you should go away and think about it because by definition you have an irrational set of beliefs.
I can't stand bigots but they're like midges, if you kill one thousands turn up for the funeral.
Where does firm and established and irrefutable knowledge end, and bigotry start.
Maybe frequenltly in the mind of the person who lacks the knowledge.
From the Oxford English Dictionary
I don't profess to speak for Bryn Mawr but I don't believe she was pointing to any error, rather pointing out that that you have a bigoted viewpoint.
posted by golem
You're entitled to express your opinion just as anyone else is. You shouldn't take it personally if someone disagrees with you. One of the characteristics of a bigot is that they are incapable of accepting that others may have a different point of view and become incapable of rational discussion resporting to phrases like better leave it.
Why should any of us leave it? After all it's not as though you are that frightening. This is after all a discussion form and IMO one of the main attractions is the facility to talk to others with widely different opinions and attitides than yur own.
If you didn't appreciate that you will encounter others who disagree with you then perhaps the concept of a discussion is one you don't fully appreciate. If you did appreciate it why are you surprised if people disagree with you and more to the point of you don't want to discuss why bother with a discussion forum in the first place.
If you think people are going to be offended by your opinions you are probably mistaken. It is frustrating when you basically state that is my opinion and I am not going to discuss it in case I offend people. You learn most when you talk to people you fundamentally disagree with and who make you think.
Why do you believe what you do? If you can't put a rational case then maybe you should go away and think about it because by definition you have an irrational set of beliefs.
I can't stand bigots but they're like midges, if you kill one thousands turn up for the funeral.
Where does firm and established and irrefutable knowledge end, and bigotry start.
Maybe frequenltly in the mind of the person who lacks the knowledge.
Radical Islam in Somalia
golem wrote: Where does firm and established and irrefutable knowledge end, and bigotry start.
Maybe frequenltly in the mind of the person who lacks the knowledge.
So share your knowledge. Stop trying to be enigmatic or are you trying to claim that what you know is so esoteric that only a few are capable of understanding?
Not so long ago people used to know the earth was flat and that the earth was the centre of the universe. This knowledge was so firm and irrefutable that anyone who thought otherwise was a danger to society.
Maybe frequenltly in the mind of the person who lacks the knowledge.
So share your knowledge. Stop trying to be enigmatic or are you trying to claim that what you know is so esoteric that only a few are capable of understanding?
Not so long ago people used to know the earth was flat and that the earth was the centre of the universe. This knowledge was so firm and irrefutable that anyone who thought otherwise was a danger to society.
Radical Islam in Somalia
gmc wrote: So share your knowledge. Stop trying to be enigmatic or are you trying to claim that what you know is so esoteric that only a few are capable of understanding?
Not so long ago people used to know the earth was flat and that the earth was the centre of the universe. This knowledge was so firm and irrefutable that anyone who thought otherwise was a danger to society.
If after all that has been said and done by followers of islam there can be any doubt that it is at heart basically foul then whoever has that doubt needs their heads examined.
As for the understanding of isalm that comes with having lived cheek by jowl with, having been attacked by, having fought against, and os much more, that really is something that most people in the west can only hope to achieve.
It's been said that to really understanbd a man you must first live with him, then fight him. Been there, done that, understand.
Not so long ago people used to know the earth was flat and that the earth was the centre of the universe. This knowledge was so firm and irrefutable that anyone who thought otherwise was a danger to society.
If after all that has been said and done by followers of islam there can be any doubt that it is at heart basically foul then whoever has that doubt needs their heads examined.
As for the understanding of isalm that comes with having lived cheek by jowl with, having been attacked by, having fought against, and os much more, that really is something that most people in the west can only hope to achieve.
It's been said that to really understanbd a man you must first live with him, then fight him. Been there, done that, understand.
Radical Islam in Somalia
golem wrote: If after all that has been said and done by followers of islam there can be any doubt that it is at heart basically foul then whoever has that doubt needs their heads examined.
As for the understanding of isalm that comes with having lived cheek by jowl with, having been attacked by, having fought against, and os much more, that really is something that most people in the west can only hope to achieve.
It's been said that to really understanbd a man you must first live with him, then fight him. Been there, done that, understand.
Western civilisation actually owes a great deal to followers of Islam (for one thing have a look at the numbers on your keyboard) and if you look at all that has been said and done by the followers of Christianity there can be little doubt that it too is at heart basically foul. Perhaps there is something basically foul at the heart of all monotheistic religons. Pagans called the christian god the selfish god because he laid claim to everything and his followers destroyed any who did not believe as they did. Perhaps people in the west should have nothing to do with religons spawned in the deserts of the middle east.
Christians also preach go out and convert the faithful. Numerous times that became slaughter any who haven't converted, religious wars killed millions in europe and were responsible for some of the most vile atrocities all in the name of jesus. Christian fundamentalists of all types, when they got half a chance, behaved appallingly to those not of their faith. Given any leeway there are those who would shove their beliefs down everybody elses throats and use whatever means necessary to get unbelievers to conform everything from banning books that offend and making blasphemy a crime to any extreme you can dream up. Who can doubt the glee that all those who believe in the second coming, armageddon the end of time will feel as their fellow, but misguided men, go to hell.
The people that stuffed your co religonists in to ovens all those years ago perhaps even went to church to thank god it wasn't them being stuffed in an oven and I'm fairly sure they weren't muslim though nowadays they might make common cause with each other. Yes that's right, what is arguably the most appalling atrocity in history was commited by christians. But then again the most influential christian of the time was surprisingly slow to condemn.
Change the word islam for judaism in your posts and you sound like a ranting anti semite, the language is much the same only the target.
I don't have a problem with religious people. I do with religious and political fanatics of whatever kind. Perhaps you have to believe as you do about the followers of Islam to justify what goes on. Are there no innocents or does an accident of birth condemn evryone.
What would you say to someone who was a rabid anti semite? After all you did get the credit for killing JC surely that is enough to condemn judaism for all time.
As for the understanding of isalm that comes with having lived cheek by jowl with, having been attacked by, having fought against, and os much more, that really is something that most people in the west can only hope to achieve.
It's been said that to really understanbd a man you must first live with him, then fight him. Been there, done that, understand.
Western civilisation actually owes a great deal to followers of Islam (for one thing have a look at the numbers on your keyboard) and if you look at all that has been said and done by the followers of Christianity there can be little doubt that it too is at heart basically foul. Perhaps there is something basically foul at the heart of all monotheistic religons. Pagans called the christian god the selfish god because he laid claim to everything and his followers destroyed any who did not believe as they did. Perhaps people in the west should have nothing to do with religons spawned in the deserts of the middle east.
Christians also preach go out and convert the faithful. Numerous times that became slaughter any who haven't converted, religious wars killed millions in europe and were responsible for some of the most vile atrocities all in the name of jesus. Christian fundamentalists of all types, when they got half a chance, behaved appallingly to those not of their faith. Given any leeway there are those who would shove their beliefs down everybody elses throats and use whatever means necessary to get unbelievers to conform everything from banning books that offend and making blasphemy a crime to any extreme you can dream up. Who can doubt the glee that all those who believe in the second coming, armageddon the end of time will feel as their fellow, but misguided men, go to hell.
The people that stuffed your co religonists in to ovens all those years ago perhaps even went to church to thank god it wasn't them being stuffed in an oven and I'm fairly sure they weren't muslim though nowadays they might make common cause with each other. Yes that's right, what is arguably the most appalling atrocity in history was commited by christians. But then again the most influential christian of the time was surprisingly slow to condemn.
Change the word islam for judaism in your posts and you sound like a ranting anti semite, the language is much the same only the target.
I don't have a problem with religious people. I do with religious and political fanatics of whatever kind. Perhaps you have to believe as you do about the followers of Islam to justify what goes on. Are there no innocents or does an accident of birth condemn evryone.
What would you say to someone who was a rabid anti semite? After all you did get the credit for killing JC surely that is enough to condemn judaism for all time.
Radical Islam in Somalia
Western civilisation owes a great deal to people who incidentally happened to be Muslim, there is damm little in islam per se that has been of any use whatsoever.
Radical Islam in Somalia
golem wrote: Western civilisation owes a great deal to people who incidentally happened to be Muslim, there is damm little in islam per se that has been of any use whatsoever.
Arguably you could say that about all religons-they're all as bad as each other. I forget who said it but I think it is a truism that evil men do evil things but it takes religon to convince a good man to do evil things.
Arguably you could say that about all religons-they're all as bad as each other. I forget who said it but I think it is a truism that evil men do evil things but it takes religon to convince a good man to do evil things.
Radical Islam in Somalia
gmc wrote: Arguably you could say that about all religons-they're all as bad as each other. I forget who said it but I think it is a truism that evil men do evil things but it takes religon to convince a good man to do evil things.
Too true - there's been far too much evil done in this world in the name of God and no one religion has a monopoly in that respect.
Too true - there's been far too much evil done in this world in the name of God and no one religion has a monopoly in that respect.