American English Dialects

tabby · Post by **tabby** » Wed Sep 11, 2013 3:39 am

Regional dialects interest me immensely and this was an interesting article to me. According to the two maps, I border between Virginia Piedmont and Southern Coastal in dialect and that's probably true. I think their categories though are far too broad to capture every nuance of speech in this region and I'm speculating that it's true of the country as a whole. Socio-Economics plays a large role in dialect here as much as actual physical location. Yes, I do realize that that is a sort of linguistic profiling (gasp!!) but it's true.

Also, parental influence isn't mentioned in the article and I think that plays a large part in our speech as well. Parents are often not from the regional area in which a child is raised and that's bound to blur some edges in dialect.

If you are not currently living in the area in which you were raised, have you carried your native dialect with you? Or have you adopted the nuances of your current location?

FAST-US-1 Intro to American English Reference File

Snooz · Post by **Snooz** » Wed Sep 11, 2013 6:26 am

I was born and raised in San Diego till I was 20, then lived the next 20 years in Northern California and have spent what feels like 50 years in Northern Utah, and I can't tell any difference in dialect. However some of the people I work with have 'inherited' their parents' southern accents, one born and bred Utahn sounds like he's from Arkansas.

TÃ½r · Post by **TÃ½r** » Wed Sep 11, 2013 7:23 am

tabby;1435919 wrote: If you are not currently living in the area in which you were raised, have you carried your native dialect with you? Or have you adopted the nuances of your current location?I live five miles from where I was born. The only time I sound like a local is when I choose to, which is not often at all. My habitual voice is unaccented, as those who have met me can attest.

Snowfire · Post by **Snowfire** » Wed Sep 11, 2013 7:40 am

TÃ½r;1435924 wrote: I live five miles from where I was born. The only time I sound like a local is when I choose to, which is not often at all. My habitual voice is unaccented, as those who have met me can attest.

I can attest that Tyr attracts the attention of the local peasants with his correct pronunciation and articulation of the English accent. They doff their caps at his eloquent diction

Snooz · Post by **Snooz** » Wed Sep 11, 2013 7:43 am

Do they tug their forelocks too?

Snowfire · Post by **Snowfire** » Wed Sep 11, 2013 7:50 am

SnoozeAgain;1435926 wrote: Do they tug their forelocks too?

Yes. Both of them

TÃ½r · Post by **TÃ½r** » Wed Sep 11, 2013 7:57 am

SnoozeAgain;1435926 wrote: Do they tug their forelocks too?

There is perhaps a misunderstanding of correct behavior underlying your question. The tugging of the forelock has never happened in England in any age between any social classes - I suspect the phrase originates in 19th century comic operas referencing orientals.

The male rural English lower class always had a choice when noticed by his superior or acknowledging the dead. If he had a hat on his head he would take it off. He could, if he chose, lower his eyes while bending his head forward, hat held to his chest if he had a hat. Alternatively he could twist his knuckle against his temple. It is that latter gesture which may have been mistaken for "tugging the forelock".

I have never knuckled my temple to anyone and nor shall I. I have often removed my hat and inflected my head and shall continue to do so. It's polite. I stand when women enter or leave a room too, for the same reason.

Snooz · Post by **Snooz** » Wed Sep 11, 2013 11:43 am

William Collins trained at the Royal Academy and went on to become a popular painter of landscapes and rustic genre scenes. He travelled extensively in Britain and abroad, particularly in Italy, and these journeys are reflected in the subjects of his pictures. He was particularly fond of representing children. Here the combination of his fine technique and the agreeable nature of the subject in this painting appealed to a wide public, connoisseurs and amateurs alike.

This version is a replica of a painting exhibited at the Royal Academy in 1832, and bought by the 6th Duke of Devonshire. John Sheepshanks subsequently commissioned this smaller replica.

So what's the little boy doing in this painting by an artist that specialized in British landscapes and children and bought by a British duke?

Wandrin · Post by **Wandrin** » Wed Sep 11, 2013 12:58 pm

If you are not currently living in the area in which you were raised, have you carried your native dialect with you? Or have you adopted the nuances of your current location?

I moved around a lot as a kid. The differences in the local accents were pretty obvious. I remember a school teacher in North Carolina criticizing the way that I talked because I didn't sound like a local. Then we moved again and a teacher in Maine was doing the same thing. I used the national television news as a model of how I wanted to talk and that quickly became my norm. Then I would chuckle at the local news, where the reporter was warning of stom from the noth.

TÃ½r · Post by **TÃ½r** » Wed Sep 11, 2013 2:06 pm

SnoozeAgain;1435946 wrote: So what's the little boy doing in this painting by an artist that specialized in British landscapes and children and bought by a British duke?

Look at the shadow in the foreground. It shows that the lad's looking upward, effectively into the sun. He's shading his eyes, or at least trying to, so as to see the rider more clearly. The civility is in having opened the gate for the horseman, as the description suggests.

eta: looking again, consider the hat denoted by the shadow. That's a yeoman's hat, not an upper class hat. No gentleman would be seen dead wearing a hat that shape.

tabby · Post by **tabby** » Wed Sep 11, 2013 2:45 pm

The REAL Mason-Dixon line!

Snooz · Post by **Snooz** » Wed Sep 11, 2013 2:55 pm

TÃ½r;1435960 wrote: Look at the shadow in the foreground. It shows that the lad's looking upward, effectively into the sun. He's shading his eyes, or at least trying to, so as to see the rider more clearly. The civility is in having opened the gate for the horseman, as the description suggests.

eta: looking again, consider the hat denoted by the shadow. That's a yeoman's hat, not an upper class hat. No gentleman would be seen dead wearing a hat that shape.

His hand is curled and it's not shading his eyes. Nice try though.

TÃ½r · Post by **TÃ½r** » Wed Sep 11, 2013 3:04 pm

SnoozeAgain;1435986 wrote: His hand is curled and it's not shading his eyes. Nice try though.

I will concede that the expression, to tug one's forelock, has been around since time immemorial - it's used in Piers the Plowman, for example, from around 1400. Possibly back that far it was a gesture, though I suggest it's more likely even then to have been an ironic name of the act of putting one's hand to one's forehead in respect.

I have been to many parts of this kingdom over many years and I have never once seen anyone actually tug their forelock. I doubt anyone else alive has ever seen it done either, other than jokingly.

Snooz · Post by **Snooz** » Wed Sep 11, 2013 3:22 pm

Which is how my comment should have been taken... jokingly. Weirdo.

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Wed Sep 11, 2013 6:27 pm

Tabby, I don't say 'youse'. I do have a real New York accent though. With impeccable grammar!

Wandrin · Post by **Wandrin** » Wed Sep 11, 2013 8:37 pm

AnneBoleyn;1436004 wrote: Tabby, I don't say 'youse'. I do have a real New York accent though. With impeccable grammar!

Is that grammar or gramma?

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Thu Sep 12, 2013 8:56 am

Wandrin;1436007 wrote: Is that grammar or gramma?

:yh_rotfl

Love ya! Youse figure it out!

btw: Coffee is correctly pronounced as Caw-fee. Right?

Wandrin · Post by **Wandrin** » Thu Sep 12, 2013 9:53 am

AnneBoleyn;1436035 wrote:

btw: Coffee is correctly pronounced as Caw-fee. Right?

Unless you venture into Jersey where it is Cooa-fee. Now if you go to Starbucks, it becomes very very complicated....

tabby · Post by **tabby** » Tue Sep 17, 2013 7:36 am

Here's an extremely in-depth look at regional dialects amazingly and painstakingly compiled by a self-described amateur although I'd say he's probably as expert as the next. He's put together an astounding amount of information and some day when I have about 5 months of free time, I may be able to read it in its entirety. The map is shown in larger detail further down the page. It's a busy map but fascinating to anyone interested. He should be proud of his efforts!

American English Dialects

Wandrin · Post by **Wandrin** » Tue Sep 17, 2013 8:16 am

Wow! That took a lot of work to produce.

Post by **Bryn Mawr** » Tue Sep 17, 2013 1:11 pm

tabby;1436232 wrote: Here's an extremely in-depth look at regional dialects amazingly and painstakingly compiled by a self-described amateur although I'd say he's probably as expert as the next. He's put together an astounding amount of information and some day when I have about 5 months of free time, I may be able to read it in its entirety. The map is shown in larger detail further down the page. It's a busy map but fascinating to anyone interested. He should be proud of his efforts!

American English Dialects

As you say, incredible level of detail and thought have gone into creation that map.

tabby · Post by **tabby** » Tue Dec 17, 2013 5:07 am

This survey, conducted by a professor at North Carolina State University, has been completed and the results posted on a map. The questions are on the left side of the page and you can click "Next" to move along smoothly. The map changes colors as appropriate with the legend below and to the left.

The results are an interesting combination of some disparity, some unanimity and from my perspective show that some entire regions suffer from some sort of speech impediment. Poor things, they can't help it.

Dialect Survey Maps

tabby · Post by **tabby** » Mon Feb 10, 2014 10:16 am

:yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl

tabby · Post by **tabby** » Tue Feb 11, 2014 7:37 am

It's "Pick on Boston Week!"