Lest We Forget: - The Lessons Of History

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Post by Smaug »

History has a nasty habit of repeating itself.



Let's hope we don't need telling twice....
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Post by Smaug »

Rest in peace all you poor innocent millions.

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Post by G#Gill »

Smaug;1485772 wrote: History has a nasty habit of repeating itself.



Let's hope we don't need telling twice....


A very thought provoking video. There are some people who think that re-showing film/videos of the horrors of WWII could stir up a continued hatred for a particular nation. It is a fact that time can dull the memory, so I believe that film/videos should be re-shown like this in order to remind people not to travel this same path of horror.
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Post by Smaug »

G#Gill;1485797 wrote: A very thought provoking video. There are some people who think that re-showing film/videos of the horrors of WWII could stir up a continued hatred for a particular nation. It is a fact that time can dull the memory, so I believe that film/videos should be re-shown like this in order to remind people not to travel this same path of horror.


I blame US/UK foreign policy for most of our current problems. We have caused power vacuums in various Middle Eastern countries with 'regime change', which has allowed and encouraged groups such as ISIS to flourish, which, in turn, has displaced masses of people who are heading for 'pastures new'; Europe, in most cases. This, in turn, is providing much fuel for the fire to the far-right groups here in Europe.

Combine this with financial hardship, and a lack of work; classic 'domino effect'.

Greece is a prime example, though there are many other EU nations with a growing fascist threat!

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Post by G#Gill »

This looks so like how the Nazis started up under Hitler in Germany before WWII. What a frightening thought ! With ISIS on the one hand and Neo Nazis growing rapidly on the other and not missing out al qaeda either. Where will it all end ?

Seems that the Greek "Golden Dawn" (Neo Nazis) are racist and want to rid Greece of ALL immigrants, so perhaps there's our answer ............ cause ISIS to raid Greece. I think that would be very interesting !
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Post by Smaug »

It is indeed alarming. I blame 90% of this scenario on inept, short-sighted, greedy, grasping, naive, arrogant, hypocritical politicians and bankers, aided and abetted by industrialists with vested interests. These idiots will be the death of us at this rate. They don't care about that, though. They can always disappear somewhere nice with their ill-gotten gains/fat pension pots, leaving us 'lesser mortals' to 'foot the bill'.

The perfect embodiment of the 'screw you Jack, I'm OK' attitude. And we just let it happen....Our forefathers will be turning in their graves!! Time to hold these 'elite' fatcats to account, IMO.
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Post by Bruv »

I have lurked quietly on Stormfront for some time now, you might like to also Smaug, it is both worrying and enlightening, some of their arguments are well thought out and verging on reasonable if taken in isolation. The majority following behind are thick as excreta with hairy palms and calloused knuckles from dragging on the ground
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Post by Smaug »

Bruv;1485908 wrote: I have lurked quietly on Stormfront for some time now, you might like to also Smaug, it is both worrying and enlightening, some of their arguments are well thought out and verging on reasonable if taken in isolation. The majority following behind are thick as excreta with hairy palms and calloused knuckles from dragging on the ground


Stormfront? Are they right or left wing? I'll go look-see....
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Post by Bruv »

Smaug;1485913 wrote: Stormfront? Are they right or left wing? I'll go look-see....


As far right as you can get, and some more.
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Post by Smaug »

Bruv;1485915 wrote: As far right as you can get, and some more.


Definitely 'not my cup of tea', Bruv! I can see why folk are turning to such far-right groups, though, as they feel disenfranchised by serial governments of whatever political leaning. The trouble is that governments ignore people, Bruv, and they can no longer afford to do so if they want to keep the fascists out of power. When enough people get behind an idea, the government either listens to the people, or is trampled underfoot in one way or another.

If people can't FIND a way, they'll MAKE a way!
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Post by Bruv »

It is not my cup of tea either, but it's only right we keep an eye on them.
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Post by Smaug »

Bruv;1485923 wrote: It is not my cup of tea either, but it's only right we keep an eye on them.


True, Bruv. I lay the blame squarely on Westminster in general for the state we're in now, at home and abroad. If I was running this country, I'd have told America were to stick it's illegal war!

I'd have also told Europe where to stick it' free-movement (Shengen)! As Einstein stated; "For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction". Or, in the case of MASS immigration, BACKLASH! None of us were consulted on ANY of these major changes; how naive of governments to think " it'll be OK, the people will accept it". As is clearly demonstrated, there are rumblings of discontent.

If these rumblings are ignored, an eruption could be next, I fear.
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Post by Smaug »

It's also happening here....

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Post by Bruv »

Islamophobic crime in London 'up by 70%'



Germany is once again in the midst of massive anti-immigration rallies, which are often met with counter-marches, dividing the country in two
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Post by FourPart »

When the circumstances start to repeat themselves, needless to say, the subsequent outcomes also begin to repeat themselves.
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Post by Smaug »

FourPart;1485958 wrote: When the circumstances start to repeat themselves, needless to say, the subsequent outcomes also begin to repeat themselves.


Indeed. There's a Chinese curse which runs:" May you live in interesting times". If one is completely detached, these times are definitely interesting...
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Post by Smaug »

Bruv;1485948 wrote: Islamophobic crime in London 'up by 70%'



Germany is once again in the midst of massive anti-immigration rallies, which are often met with counter-marches, dividing the country in two


A house divided against itself cannot stand. There is trouble ahead for Germany, methinks.And possibly for us, at some stage, alas. If there is another krystallnacht, my guess is that Muslims will be the target this time.
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Post by Smaug »

The nazis are gaining ground here, too...

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Post by LarsMac »

These radicals gain ground because "reasonable people" think that their supporters a just a few nutcases, and the don't take voting seriously. The problem is that these nutcases will come out in droves to support their favorite wingnut, and if you stay home on election day, the wingnuts win.
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Post by Bruv »

LarsMac;1485988 wrote: These radicals gain ground because "reasonable people" think that their supporters a just a few nutcases, and the don't take voting seriously. The problem is that these nutcases will come out in droves to support their favorite wingnut, and if you stay home on election day, the wingnuts win.


I agree partly with you, but the rise of the nutters is a reaction to events. They frame their arguments carefully to gain mass appeal, seducing the electorate with simplistic answers to their insecurities, then they gain momentum as their ideas become accepted as the The Answer.
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Post by FourPart »

The reason they are gaining support is that we are being pushed, and the powers that be who enforce PC are helping by pulling, while General Joe Public is getting sick of it all, and the Extreme Right Wing parties are the only ones who a openly voicing their protest.

As things are there are dozens of these parties, all with identical agendas. If they were all to unite the strength of their following could be quite worrying.

It is not the rise of these Right Wing parties that is the real problem. It's what has caused these Right Wing parties to gain such support in the first place. That is where things must be addressed. When you get weeds growing in your garden, it's no good spraying the leaves. You need to get to the root.

It's no good taking the Ostrich policy & pretending it'll all sort itself out in the fullness of time. It IS sorting itself out - and we're rapidly moving towards being on the losing side.
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Post by Smaug »

FourPart;1486008 wrote: The reason they are gaining support is that we are being pushed, and the powers that be who enforce PC are helping by pulling, while General Joe Public is getting sick of it all, and the Extreme Right Wing parties are the only ones who a openly voicing their protest.

As things are there are dozens of these parties, all with identical agendas. If they were all to unite the strength of their following could be quite worrying.

It is not the rise of these Right Wing parties that is the real problem. It's what has caused these Right Wing parties to gain such support in the first place. That is where things must be addressed. When you get weeds growing in your garden, it's no good spraying the leaves. You need to get to the root.

It's no good taking the Ostrich policy & pretending it'll all sort itself out in the fullness of time. It IS sorting itself out - and we're rapidly moving towards being on the losing side.


That's it in a 'nutshell', FourPart; I couldn't have put it better! High time for a cohesive, united, common-sense policy on 'immigration'. People cease to be refugees when they pass through a safe country in search of 'richer pickings' further afield, IMO. They are then 'economic migrants', to my way of thinking.

Notice how many young men are in this migration; wonder how many of these are radicalized,or will become radicalized in the near future? Governments are playing 'fast-and-loose' with our security as things currently stand, and we'll end up 'picking up the tab'!
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Post by Smaug »

Here's an interesting appraisal.... Time to start heeding the warning signs!



And there's more....
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Post by G#Gill »

There are more and more people moving towards the 'anti Europe' groups. It is noticeable that many people are becoming very agitated and frustrated over the swarming quantities of migrants coming into our small country, and Cameron says that we should allow 20,000 more refugees to gain sanctuary in the UK by 2020 ! Cameron - WE HAVE NO MORE ROOM !!!!! There are not enough houses available at a price that people can afford for our own 'native' inhabitants. There has got to be some sort of common sense displayed about this world problem. Are the Americans giving more help ? The Canadians ? Oh they appear to be too far away from this world problem, and it would cost too much to organise ships to transport thousands of refugees trying to escape from their country's violent wars. Oh dear.

Tonight, on the TV News, somebody said that the situation in the UK has all the 'hall marks' that lead to civil unrest and maybe civil war ! I, personally, do not think this is an exaggeration !
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Post by Betty Boop »

Good lord you've all been listening to the propaganda! Listen to the wording, its dire, it's worded in ways to liken people to insects and we are being invaded by 'swarms' of them. Golly, lets swat them all away!

We are a nation of migrants all throughout history! We went and plundered over seas, we have caused wars and made lives worse all around the world, why shouldn't we welcome those we have displaced with open arms.

People also need to refer to their dictionaries, there is a huge difference between migrants and refugees. There are also different waves of refugees, men first to escape conscription.

Maybe if immigration has to stop then all the Brits living out in Europe should be made to return here for good, what right have we got to swarm all over Europe, British insects invading other peoples territory! How disgusting. :rolleyes:
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Post by Smaug »

For many years now, our political 'elite' have been in the thrall of a dangerously naive complacency in regard to MASS IMMIGRATION. You simply cannot keep inviting this level of immigration into the UK without a backlash occurring! We simply don't have the space for them, not to mention the massive cultural impact this is having here.

You talk about displacement, yet don't seem to consider the displacement that immigration on this scale is having here in the UK. As I stated in a previous post;

People cease to be refugees when they pass through a safe country in search of 'richer pickings' further afield, IMO. They are then 'economic migrants', to my way of thinking.

As for us 'swarming over Europe', I would imagine the impact from emigrating Brits on European nations is negligible, whereas several million people arriving in oursmall island since '2000 is exactly the opposite! I notice that you don't like these masses referred to as 'insects', yet you seem quite content to label our emigrants as 'insects'. This is rather close to a form of 'reverse racism', IMO BB.

And part of the problem.
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Post by FourPart »

A little metaphor...

Britain 2015




Britain 2020




Britain 2025


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Post by Smaug »

FourPart;1486440 wrote: A little metaphor...

Britain 2015




Britain 2020




Britain 2025





That's about right, FourPart!! Thought provoking, and damn funny to boot!:yh_rotfl
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Post by Betty Boop »

Smaug;1486434 wrote: For many years now, our political 'elite' have been in the thrall of a dangerously naive complacency in regard to MASS IMMIGRATION. You simply cannot keep inviting this level of immigration into the UK without a backlash occurring! We simply don't have the space for them, not to mention the massive cultural impact this is having here.

You talk about displacement, yet don't seem to consider the displacement that immigration on this scale is having here in the UK. As I stated in a previous post;

People cease to be refugees when they pass through a safe country in search of 'richer pickings' further afield, IMO. They are then 'economic migrants', to my way of thinking.

As for us 'swarming over Europe', I would imagine the impact from emigrating Brits on European nations is negligible, whereas several million people arriving in oursmall island since '2000 is exactly the opposite! I notice that you don't like these masses referred to as 'insects', yet you seem quite content to label our emigrants as 'insects'. This is rather close to a form of 'reverse racism', IMO BB.

And part of the problem.


It's quite simply called sarcasm :rolleyes: I'll use that more often just so you know.
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Post by Smaug »

Betty Boop;1486460 wrote: It's quite simply called sarcasm :rolleyes: I'll use that more often just so you know.


Fair enough, BB. As for British emigration, I wonder what the actual figure is? I'll see if I can find out....
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Post by FourPart »

Smaug;1486466 wrote: Fair enough, BB. As for British emigration, I wonder what the actual figure is? I'll see if I can find out....
That's another thing being campaigned for - Immigration & Emigration figures to be kept. As I understand it, there is no way of telling what the actual figures are. With Open Door policy, everyone can come & go, and no-one's keeping count. At best, the 'statistics' published are nothing but guesswork.
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Post by Smaug »

I've found some figures on migration versus immigration;

Long-Term International Migration Flows to and from the UK | The Migration Observatory

That's part of the trouble, FourPart. Serial incompetence from govt. record-keeping departments, or deliberate mis-information?
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Post by FourPart »

Note that even there, the word "Estimate" was rife.

Furthermore, there never seems to be any mention of how many of the migrants (in either direction) are of those returning to their country of origin.
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Absolutely. If I was a suspicious man, I would be tempted to ask;"What's the hidden agenda here?"
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G#Gill;1486426 wrote: There are more and more people moving towards the 'anti Europe' groups. It is noticeable that many people are becoming very agitated and frustrated over the swarming quantities of migrants coming into our small country, and Cameron says that we should allow 20,000 more refugees to gain sanctuary in the UK by 2020 ! Cameron - WE HAVE NO MORE ROOM !!!!! There are not enough houses available at a price that people can afford for our own 'native' inhabitants. There has got to be some sort of common sense displayed about this world problem. Are the Americans giving more help ? The Canadians ? Oh they appear to be too far away from this world problem, and it would cost too much to organise ships to transport thousands of refugees trying to escape from their country's violent wars. Oh dear.

Tonight, on the TV News, somebody said that the situation in the UK has all the 'hall marks' that lead to civil unrest and maybe civil war ! I, personally, do not think this is an exaggeration !


Maybe the Americans have been appraised of the folly of encouraging mass-immigration by UK/European events? If so, they are wise to take heed!

They say a wise man learns from his mistakes, but a wiser one learns from someone else's....
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Post by Smaug »

Did Hitler really die with Eva in the Berlin bunker? There is an increasing body of evidence that questions this.....



Obviously, he's dead now, but it's a question that's never been satisfactorily answered.....
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Post by FourPart »




Maybe not quite so unbelievable.
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Yes, I'll have to concede that one to you, FourPart! Most apt!!:yh_rotfl
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Post by Smaug »

Another intriguing clip. With Hitler's stolen money and extensive connections, it's possible he did live out his life in S.America.....

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Post by Smaug »

This must be one of the worst atrocities in history, and history has a nasty habit of repeating itself. The Neo-Nazis are on the rise, and with the pressure that multiculturalism and unchecked mass immigration is putting on many European nations, a modern day equivalent is not impossible, as the world becomes more extreme, coupled with the creeping demise of morals and ethics. I sincerely hope this never happens again, no matter who the victims may be.

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Post by Smaug »

I am appalled by the scale of the Nazi war crimes committed on Hitler's orders by his depraved henchmen. We absolutely had to defeat this evil scourge to prevent this world being plunged into utter darkness.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocaust_victims
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Post by LarsMac »

Frankly, the re-emergence of Polio frightens me a hell of a lot more than the possibility of Nazis returning.
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Post by Smaug »

LarsMac;1488140 wrote: Frankly, the re-emergence of Polio frightens me a hell of a lot more than the possibility of Nazis returning.


Well, you've only got to take a look at Europe to realize that it's a real, and increasing threat. The far-right is gaining ground in many countries-just take a look at the plethora of utube clips from many of the European countries. The reason it doesn't make the 'mainstream' news very often is probably due to government reticence to admit there's a growing problem, not to mention a certain amount of censorship.

Unfortunately, it's not going to go away anytime soon just because the various governments would like it to!
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Post by AnneBoleyn »

Netanyahu Forgets the Lesson of History, allowing his hatred of Palestinians (which I am not judging) to get in the way:

"(CNN)There's no question Adolf Hitler led Nazi Germany when it implemented the "final solution" in an effort to kill all Jews.

But, in a speech this week, Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu suggested it wasn't Hitler's idea.

Rather, he pointed to Jerusalem's then-grand mufti, Haj Amin al-Husseini, who met with the Nazi leader in Germany in the early 1940s.

"Hitler didn't want to exterminate the Jews at the time, he wanted to expel the Jews," Netanyahu said Tuesday at the 37th Zionist Congress, according to a transcript on his website. "And Haj Amin al-Husseini went to Hitler and said, 'If you expel them, they'll all come here.'

"'So what should I do with them?' (Hitler) asked. (Husseini) said, 'Burn them.'"

There's no video or audio, not even a transcript, that can definitively prove Netanyahu's account of the conversation between Hitler and Husseini, who as grand mufti oversaw Muslim sites in Jerusalem. But it quickly spurred criticism in Israel and the Palestinian territories, with some claiming that Netanyahu had effectively absolved Hitler of the Holocaust's most gruesome, deplorable aspect and instead blamed Husseini -- then and now a renowned figure in Palestinian circles -- for the systematic killing of more than 6 million Jews using gas chambers and firing squads."

Netanyahu criticized for Hitler, mufti Holocaust remarks - CNN.com

In his zeal to incite, Netanyahu loses his mind, his memory, his credibility.
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AnneBoleyn;1488154 wrote: Netanyahu Forgets the Lesson of History, allowing his hatred of Palestinians (which I am not judging) to get in the way:

"(CNN)There's no question Adolf Hitler led Nazi Germany when it implemented the "final solution" in an effort to kill all Jews.

But, in a speech this week, Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu suggested it wasn't Hitler's idea.

Rather, he pointed to Jerusalem's then-grand mufti, Haj Amin al-Husseini, who met with the Nazi leader in Germany in the early 1940s.

"Hitler didn't want to exterminate the Jews at the time, he wanted to expel the Jews," Netanyahu said Tuesday at the 37th Zionist Congress, according to a transcript on his website. "And Haj Amin al-Husseini went to Hitler and said, 'If you expel them, they'll all come here.'

"'So what should I do with them?' (Hitler) asked. (Husseini) said, 'Burn them.'"

There's no video or audio, not even a transcript, that can definitively prove Netanyahu's account of the conversation between Hitler and Husseini, who as grand mufti oversaw Muslim sites in Jerusalem. But it quickly spurred criticism in Israel and the Palestinian territories, with some claiming that Netanyahu had effectively absolved Hitler of the Holocaust's most gruesome, deplorable aspect and instead blamed Husseini -- then and now a renowned figure in Palestinian circles -- for the systematic killing of more than 6 million Jews using gas chambers and firing squads."

Netanyahu criticized for Hitler, mufti Holocaust remarks - CNN.com

In his zeal to incite, Netanyahu loses his mind, his memory, his credibility.


B£oody 'ell!!

That's awful! The blame game never loses it's appeal, does it? Maybe it's just as well that it's unverifiable, otherwise it could be like smoking a cigar in a barrel of gunpowder! Hope it remains that way, AB!! (unverifiable)
" To finish first, first you have to finish!" Rick Mears. 4x Winner Indy 500. 3x Indycar National Champion.
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AnneBoleyn
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Lest We Forget: - The Lessons Of History

Post by AnneBoleyn »

Well said, Smaug.
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Smaug
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Post by Smaug »

Thanks, AB. I'm glad you aren't out to 'wind me up', unlike a certain other (Re: Hello Everyone.....)
" To finish first, first you have to finish!" Rick Mears. 4x Winner Indy 500. 3x Indycar National Champion.
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Lest We Forget: - The Lessons Of History

Post by LarsMac »

When it comes, it will not be with swastika banners waving. It will be marching behind a bunch of likable patriots, who are going to make it all right again.

Can you say, "Make [fill in the name] Great again" ?
“All it takes to get elected in twenty-first-century America is a mob of frightened sheep and a wolf with a nice smile,”
― Greg Bear, Darwin's Children
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Smaug
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Post by Smaug »

LarsMac;1488174 wrote: When it comes, it will not be with swastika banners waving. It will be marching behind a bunch of likable patriots, who are going to make it all right again.

Can you say, "Make [fill in the name] Great again" ?


And where do these 'likeable patriots' come from? Could it be ordinary citizens who have, and continue to be, ignored, abused and treated with arrogant disdain by the 'establishment' as a whole? WE will end up reaping the whirlwind THEY have sown!

I don't think it's anything to do with making ( name here) great again, just an inevitable backlash to the above. Still, they don't care if they screw this place up, they've got nice fat property and share portfolios, and a generous pension pot to 'eke out' the rest of their lives.

Not that I'm bitter about the industrial-scale corruption, lies, swindling and double-dealing these 'priviledged', elitist, mercenary scumbags foist upon the populace at large....
" To finish first, first you have to finish!" Rick Mears. 4x Winner Indy 500. 3x Indycar National Champion.
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Lest We Forget: - The Lessons Of History

Post by LarsMac »

Smaug;1488964 wrote: And where do these 'likeable patriots' come from? Could it be ordinary citizens who have, and continue to be, ignored, abused and treated with arrogant disdain by the 'establishment' as a whole? WE will end up reaping the whirlwind THEY have sown!

I don't think it's anything to do with making ( name here) great again, just an inevitable backlash to the above. Still, they don't care if they screw this place up, they've got nice fat property and share portfolios, and a generous pension pot to 'eke out' the rest of their lives.

Not that I'm bitter about the industrial-scale corruption, lies, swindling and double-dealing these 'priviledged', elitist, mercenary scumbags foist upon the populace at large....


Being bitter about the way things are is going to get you nowhere but an early grave. It's been this way for a long time. Go back and read Dickens.

Not much has changed in the last couple of centuries, really.
“All it takes to get elected in twenty-first-century America is a mob of frightened sheep and a wolf with a nice smile,”
― Greg Bear, Darwin's Children

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