Prayer Requests.

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binbag
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Prayer Requests.

Post by binbag »

Infinite light;1374453 wrote:

Binbag:

Can I ask you something? Have you ever known prayer to work? And, if yes, why do you think it works?

I know this is the Christian room, so it would be rude of me to storm in here with my anti-Christian views, ticking people off. Even though I'm very much anti-Christian, I do try to be respectful to Christians. I'm only curious to know on what you base your belief in the "power of prayer."
Apologies for my delay in replying Infinite light.

You've posted a very interesting question, and I must add, I admire your honesty and politeness.

Simply put, I base my belief in prayer from a lifelong experience of using prayer in any given circumstance that requires a prayer request.

I can also tell you, God has "always" answered my prayer requests.... without fail. I've never had a prayer request go unanswered.

Now that's a huge claim, so it must really be up to your good-self whether you wish to accept or consider that utter nonsense.

The power of prayer, as far as I'm concerned, is the greatest free gift a Christians has been given to use, even at a moments notice if required.

I hope that goes some small way in answering your excellent question

My very good wishes to you.

Binbag.
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Infinite light
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Post by Infinite light »

binbag;1374869 wrote: Apologies for my delay in replying Infinite light.

You've posted a very interesting question, and I must add, I admire your honesty and politeness.

Simply put, I base my belief in prayer from a lifelong experience of using prayer in any given circumstance that requires a prayer request.

I can also tell you, God has "always" answered my prayer requests.... without fail. I've never had a prayer request go unanswered.

Now that's a huge claim, so it must really be up to your good-self whether you wish to accept or consider that utter nonsense.

The power of prayer, as far as I'm concerned, is the greatest free gift a Christians has been given to use, even at a moments notice if required.

I hope that goes some small way in answering your excellent question

My very good wishes to you.

Binbag.


Thanks for responding.

But more to the heart of the matter, how do you know God has answered your prayer? How is it that you are so certain the outcome has been determined to some degree by a being called God? that's what I really need to know. Don't get me wrong, you may have a knowledge that I lack, and it's that knowledge that I'd like to acquire. And I might agree, if prayer works, then the power of prayer may truly be the "greatest free gift" for Christians.

Has it been the case that your "lifelong experience" has included stunning reversals? amazing miracles? or events that appear to be supernatural? Further, if that be the case, then please share your reasoning that causes you to conclude that those reversals, miracles, or apparent supernatural events were caused by a supreme being. Is it not possible that the outcome might have been the same, even without prayer? Stated bluntly, could it not have been your overly gracious imagination?
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binbag
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Post by binbag »

Infinite light;1374939 wrote: Thanks for responding.

But more to the heart of the matter, how do you know God has answered your prayer? How is it that you are so certain the outcome has been determined to some degree by a being called God? that's what I really need to know. Don't get me wrong, you may have a knowledge that I lack, and it's that knowledge that I'd like to acquire. And I might agree, if prayer works, then the power of prayer may truly be the "greatest free gift" for Christians.

Has it been the case that your "lifelong experience" has included stunning reversals? amazing miracles? or events that appear to be supernatural? Further, if that be the case, then please share your reasoning that causes you to conclude that those reversals, miracles, or apparent supernatural events were caused by a supreme being. Is it not possible that the outcome might have been the same, even without prayer? Stated bluntly, could it not have been your overly gracious imagination?


Hello Infinite Light,

I hope you can understand this reply, as I was interrupted several times while typing, but I didn't want to delay posting any longer.



I learned never to try and work out or visualize how my prayer request/s is/are going to be handled.

They always were/are answered in an altogether different manner than I ever possibly could have imagined.

When I offer a prayer request to God I leave it in His hands and allow Him to handle it in the manner He thinks fit.

If, however, an opportunity arises that just may be part of resolving the prayer request, then I'll use it in a positive manner.

For all I know, it could be God offering that opportunity to partially help or completely resolve the prayer request myself.

After asking God for advice or help via prayer, I never sit back with my feet up drinking coffee whilst watching television expecting Him to get on with it.

I make sure I'm alert, ready, and willing to use an opportunity I feel may possibly be part of the solution of my request.

I would stress again I never ever try to work out or visualize the manner in which God answers my prayer requests. And He "Always" does answer.

I've never treated answers to prayer requests as imagination, something that was going to happen anyway, or something without any outside intervention or supernatural causes.

Supreme being, yes.....God.

"Is it not possible that the outcome might have been the same, even without prayer?"

Yes indeed, that's very possible on occasions.

Best wishes.
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Infinite light
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Post by Infinite light »

binbag;1375293 wrote:

"Is it not possible that the outcome might have been the same, even without prayer?"

Yes indeed, that's very possible on occasions.

Best wishes.


I snipped this one part from your response because I felt it was the one line that came close to answering my post. So if you can focus on this one spot and let me ask these questions: how do you differentiate between those times when you know God answered your prayers from those times you aren't so sure? What is it about some situations that tell without doubt that God was behind the outcome, while in other situations you know the outcome to have been due to "natural" causes?
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binbag
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Post by binbag »

Hello again Infinite light.

You initially posed the question......

"Is it not possible that the outcome might have been the same, even without prayer?"

I repled....."Yes indeed, that's very possible on occasions."



Now then.

1:

You ask the question....

"How do you differentiate between those times when you know God answered your prayers from those times you aren't so sure?"

I never mentioned I differentiate between those times you mention above.



2:

You ask the question....

What is it about some situations that tell without doubt that God was behind the outcome, while in other situations you know the outcome to have been due to "natural" causes?

I never alluded to the situations you refer to above.

Warmest regards.
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Infinite light
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Post by Infinite light »

binbag,

You had said this in an earlier post: When I offer a prayer request to God I leave it in His hands and allow Him to handle it in the manner He thinks fit.

You said God handles "it," the implication being that there are situations in your life that call for prayer, and that as a result of that prayer, God intervenes on your behalf. I say that because later in the same post you say, "And He "Always" does answer."

So I just wanted to know how you were able to differentiate between those times when God answered your prayers from other times where it is simply old-fashioned happenstance.

That's a fair question, ain't it?
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binbag
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Post by binbag »

Hi.



That's a fair question, ain't it?[end quote]

Yes, you're question is very fair, Infinite light.



What I was pointing out is that my answer.....

"Yes indeed, that's very possible on occasions", was specifically referring to your previous question.....

Is it not possible that the outcome might have been the same, even without prayer?[end quote]

(An avoidance of misunderstandings between any question and the resulting answer, if you will)



So, to answer your latest questions......



1:

You had said this in an earlier post: When I offer a prayer request to God I leave it in His hands and allow Him to handle it in the manner He thinks fit.[end quote]

Yes, that's correct.



2:

You said God handles "it," the implication being that there are situations in your life that call for prayer, and that as a result of that prayer, God intervenes on your behalf.][end quote]

That's correct, except it's not an implication, it's a statement of fact.

3:

I say that because later in the same post you say, "And He "Always" does answer.[end quote]

Yes that's correct, God always answers prayer requests.



4:

So I just wanted to know how you were able to differentiate between those times when God answered your prayers from other times where it is simply old-fashioned happenstance.[end quote]

I'm unaware of any answered prayer that came about "simply by old-fashioned happenstance". If, however, my mind was opened to the fact the answer to any prayer was/or coincided with "old-fashioned happenstance", I would thank God for allowing that "old-fashioned happenstance" to come about.
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Infinite light
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Post by Infinite light »

binbag,

I'm unaware of any answered prayer that came about "simply by old-fashioned happenstance". If, however, my mind was opened to the fact the answer to any prayer was/or coincided with "old-fashioned happenstance" I would thank God for allowing that "old-fashioned happenstance" to come about.

Well, maybe it would be better to praise "old-fashioned happenstance" than to praise God, since without proof of God, happenstance is the more rational choice.
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theia
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Post by theia »

binbag, I'm really loving the honest and open way you are responding to Infinite's questions. How refreshing, and inspiring.
Live the questions now. Perhaps you will then gradually, without noticing it, live along some distant day into the answers...Rainer Maria Rilke
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Post by Infinite light »

theia;1375803 wrote: binbag, I'm really loving the honest and open way you are responding to Infinite's questions. How refreshing, and inspiring.


It may be "honest and open," but it is not rational, in my opinion.

I could make a voodoo doll, pray to it, and claim just as easily that my doll has answered all my prayers. However, if there is nothing to back up my supernatural claims, then I should not be surprised if others reject those claims. If one wants to go around praising God for every little thing--happenstance included--that's their business. But when someone says they know God answers their prayers, I'd like to know why that's any different than my voodoo doll; that is, what do they know in their faith that I fail to know in mine? and if there is no difference, then why not just make voodoo dolls, and save the gas to church?
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theia
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Post by theia »

Infinite light;1375805 wrote: It may be "honest and open," but it is not rational, in my opinion.

I could make a voodoo doll, pray to it, and claim just as easily that my doll has answered all my prayers. However, if there is nothing to back up my supernatural claims, then I should not be surprised if others reject those claims. If one wants to go around praising God for every little thing--happenstance included--that's their business. But when someone says they know God answers their prayers, I'd like to know why that's any different than my voodoo doll; that is, what do they know in their faith that I fail to know in mine? and if there is no difference, then why not just make voodoo dolls, and save the gas to church?


I have moments in my life, inbetween thought, when I'm in awe of whatever it is...I can't explain it, it's not rational but it's beautiful beyond words. And, for me, it's real. Now, whatever I call whatever it is, when I'm in my usual mode, is merely what I call it. And you're right, it could be God, a voodoo doll or anything. But somehow and sometimes I feel a sense of this in something I read, or hear, or see. That's how binbag's post felt to me, and one of your earlier posts too.

I'm not really sure if what I'm saying here makes sense but well...
Live the questions now. Perhaps you will then gradually, without noticing it, live along some distant day into the answers...Rainer Maria Rilke
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Post by Infinite light »

theia;1375807 wrote: I have moments in my life, inbetween thought, when I'm in awe of whatever it is...I can't explain it, it's not rational but it's beautiful beyond words. And, for me, it's real. Now, whatever I call whatever it is, when I'm in my usual mode, is merely what I call it. And you're right, it could be God, a voodoo doll or anything. But somehow and sometimes I feel a sense of this in something I read, or hear, or see. That's how binbag's post felt to me, and one of your earlier posts too.

I'm not really sure if what I'm saying here makes sense but well...


There's nothing wrong with being "in awe." After all, we humans know very little of the universe. But being "awed" by the universe is not proof of God;it only proves our ability to be overwhelmed emotionally. I could be "awed" by all the sin and sickness in the world and conclude that there is no God, since why would a supreme being create such a horribly defective world? Why should the "awe" of a theist be worth any more than an athiest's or agnostic's?
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Post by theia »

Infinite light;1375808 wrote: There's nothing wrong with being "in awe." After all, we humans know very little of the universe. But being "awed" by the universe is not proof of God;it only proves our ability to be overwhelmed emotionally. I could be "awed" by all the sin and sickness in the world and conclude that there is no God, since why would a supreme being create such a horribly defective world? Why should the "awe" of a theist be worth any more than an athiest's or agnostic's?


I'm not trying to prove God, it would be impossible for me to do so, I'm sure. And, for me, those moments are, yes, overwhelming, but overwhelming in an unspeakable way, not in an emotional way because they seem to be beyond thought and emotion. For

me, again, I don't believe that this whatever creates all the sin and sickness in the world because in one of those moments, those things don't exist...they can't because there is no time.
Live the questions now. Perhaps you will then gradually, without noticing it, live along some distant day into the answers...Rainer Maria Rilke
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binbag
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Post by binbag »

theia;1375803 wrote: binbag, I'm really loving the honest and open way you are responding to Infinite's questions. How refreshing, and inspiring.
Thank you for your very kind words theia. I'm truly flattered you should think so.

__________________________________________________


Hi Infinite light.

1:

It may be "honest and open," but it is not rational, in my opinion.[end quote]

That is your personal opinion and nobody is preventing you from having that opinion, you are perfectly free and have the freedom of choice to adopt that opinion, nobody is stopping you.



2:

I could make a voodoo doll, pray to it, and claim just as easily that my doll has answered all my prayers.[end quote]

If you had a mind to make a voodoo doll, pray to it, and claim your doll has answered all your prayers, nobody would prevent you, you have the freedom of choice to do so, nobody would stop you.

Someone may attempt to stop you, but again, you have the freedom of choice to hold on to your particular belief.



3:

If one wants to go around praising God for every little thing--happenstance included--that's their business.[end quote]

Who is going around praising God for every little thing?



4:

But when someone says they know God answers their prayers, I'd like to know why that's any different than my voodoo doll; that is, what do they know in their faith that I fail to know in mine? [end quote]

Your "Voodo Doll" faith and my Christian faith are two subjects you would need to study in order to differentiate both subjects, for yourself.

When it involves Christianity, you must prove all things to yourself.



5:

and if there is no difference, then why not just make voodoo dolls, and save the gas to church?[end quote]

Nobody is preventing you from doing that very thing. Once again, you are perfectly free to do so.

Warmest regards.
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