Near death experience

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caesar777
Posts: 150
Joined: Sun Dec 10, 2006 12:14 pm

Near death experience

Post by caesar777 »

Sorry if this is an old topic, but I can't find any threads on here relating to the subject.

Have any of you, or do any of you know someone who has had a near death experience?

What do you remember of it, if anything. I'm just as interested if you nearly died and had no "vision" as I am if you had the classic floating above your body and tunnel leading to a light.

If any body has any stories on this subject I would love to hear them.
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jennyswan
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Joined: Tue Oct 18, 2005 1:33 pm

Near death experience

Post by jennyswan »

caesar777;493208 wrote: Sorry if this is an old topic, but I can't find any threads on here relating to the subject.

Have any of you, or do any of you know someone who has had a near death experience?

What do you remember of it, if anything. I'm just as interested if you nearly died and had no "vision" as I am if you had the classic floating above your body and tunnel leading to a light.

If any body has any stories on this subject I would love to hear them.


I didn't myself but a friend of mine did. She's nearly 60 now but about 15 years ago she was very ill and 'died' in the hospital for a few minutes.

She had a very positive experience and it gave her great comfort. :-6
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Uncle Kram
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Near death experience

Post by Uncle Kram »

Luckily I've never had a near-death experience, but I have come close to death on 5 seperate occasions. The closest shave was earlier this year. I wouldn't have known a thing about it. I was unaffected by the others but that one played on my mind for a long time and I still think about it quite often.


THE MAN WITH THE GOLDEN PUN
K.Snyder
Posts: 10253
Joined: Thu Mar 24, 2005 2:05 pm

Near death experience

Post by K.Snyder »

I didn't have a "vision" or anything of that nature...

mostly, it was just "da#*, how did I not die in that car?" about a million times after the event...

I was in a car that flipped while taking down a telephone pole, ending up five feet from a shallow creek under live wires upside down...

Ok, here we go again, "how did I not die in that da#* car?" :wah: see.

It was definitely a crazy experience...
RedGlitter
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Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2005 3:51 am

Near death experience

Post by RedGlitter »

My mother, after having surgery from lung cancer, contracted Morganelli virus and was very near death before they recognized the virus. There was one night in particular I remember because she was close and I was staying with her in the hospital room. I kept seeing black shapes and shadows darting around her bed. I brushed it off as lack of sleep/nerves and watched her throughout the night. The next morning she was alert and the medicine had already taken effect. I asked her what she remembered of the prior night and she had no knowledge of anything except that she had seen her sister and her mother beckoning to her. Then she said when she started to go to them, they waved their hands at her, waving her back, saying "It's not your time, it's not your time!" My mom lived for almost eight more years before getting cancer again and leaving us this June. I wonder now who came for her in the end. :yh_flower
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Rapunzel
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Near death experience

Post by Rapunzel »

Uncle Kram;493378 wrote: Luckily I've never had a near-death experience, but I have come close to death on 5 seperate occasions. The closest shave was earlier this year. I wouldn't have known a thing about it. I was unaffected by the others but that one played on my mind for a long time and I still think about it quite often.


Can you tell us what happened? :-3

If it's not imposing too much? :o

Red, I'm sure you're mum's mother and sister were waiting for her with open arms and warm hugs. :yh_hugs

I used to worry about who would meet me, but a very dear and beloved aunt (whom I always used to wish was my real mother) died last year. I miss her so much but take comfort knowing that she'll be there to meet me one day.
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Rapunzel
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Near death experience

Post by Rapunzel »

I don't know if this is really relevant or not, but when my daughter was 18 months old she had an acute asthma attack and within 12 hours was on a life support machine fighting for her life. The doctors told us the attack was too severe and she wouldn't last the night. We sat by her bed all night and through the window of the ICU we could see a firework display in a nearby London park. We couldn't hear it but could clearly see the firework bursts in the sky outside.

My daughter doesn't remember being in hospital, but fireworks now frighten the life out of her and often scare her to tears. :-1
K.Snyder
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Near death experience

Post by K.Snyder »

Rapunzel;493411 wrote:

My daughter doesn't remember being in hospital, but fireworks now frighten the life out of her and often scare her to tears. :-1


A most worthy sacrifice indeed.
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Galbally
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Near death experience

Post by Galbally »

I have never had one myself, but I have heard enough from real people to know that many people definetly have genuine experiences like the ones mentioned here.

I don't know what actually happens in these cases or what the implications are (if any) but its certainly a fascinating subject on many levels. I have had some nasty accidents, I wrote off a car, had a gun pulled on me in Germany, fell out of a tree, and almost died from a severe allergic reaction to aspirin, but I never experienced anything except an odd detachment from everything and a complete lack of fear. I think its because if I did have such an experience it was when I was born, as apparently I was a caesarian section and the umbilical cord cut of my air suppy and I was clinically dead for about 10 seconds following birth, (it may explain a lot), some have since that time related their disappointment that I decided to stick around, though I personally have never regretted it! :) :sneaky:
"We are never so happy, never so unhappy, as we imagine"



Le Rochefoucauld.



"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."



My dad 1986.
RedGlitter
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Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2005 3:51 am

Near death experience

Post by RedGlitter »

:) I can't imagine anybody regretting that you're around Galbally. You're charming, intelligent, witty and great fun for starters. I'm sure you're even better in person!
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CARLA
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Near death experience

Post by CARLA »

KS your one lucky man, there were several time you could have died that day someone was watching over you..:-6
ALOHA!!

MOTTO TO LIVE BY:

"Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, chocolate in one hand, champagne in the other, body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming.

WOO HOO!!, what a ride!!!"

alobar51
Posts: 142
Joined: Thu Apr 07, 2005 10:49 am

Near death experience

Post by alobar51 »

caesar777;493208 wrote: Sorry if this is an old topic, but I can't find any threads on here relating to the subject.

Have any of you, or do any of you know someone who has had a near death experience?

What do you remember of it, if anything. I'm just as interested if you nearly died and had no "vision" as I am if you had the classic floating above your body and tunnel leading to a light.

If any body has any stories on this subject I would love to hear them.


When I was 16 I took 440 volts. It threw me clear before it had enough time to do me in. The entire incident took 1-2 seconds. My co-workers caught me by the legs.

I was aware of what was happening. The brain does accelerate, at least mine did. It wasn't my life flashing before my eyes, but there was time to reflect. My thought was of how disappointed my parents will be to learn of my death, but I remember not being terribly upset. Not happy or sad, more matter of fact.

The following year I read Ambrose Bierce's Occurrence at Owl Creek Bridge, and was impressed with how accurately he portrayed that moment.
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retepsnikrep
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Near death experience

Post by retepsnikrep »

Now I know this is a long post but it directly answers the initial question posed. I did write it a while back now as you will see.

Half Marathon Man.

At Aylsham, on May 2nd 1982, I watched the Holt Marathon runners pass, en route to Norwich. The half marathon runners finishing in Aylsham Market Square. It had an effect on me, in short, I decided to do it myself.

My neighbour was already training, he agreed to take me. Kitted up, on a June evening, off we jogged. At the village pond, some 150 yards out, I advised him I was completely exhausted and incapable of further movement. 'Perfectly normal.' he said, 'Carry on.' So I did, and I could. That was the first of many runs.

Each practice route had a name. 'Old Church', 2.2 miles. This was generally done on a Friday Night. 'Stratton Strawless.' 4.2 miles. 'The Mayton Loop.' 6.0 miles. And the longest, Skeyton Church, 11.2 miles.

I ran three times a week, normally with my neighbour, but sometimes alone, and a few times, cycle paced. I also ran with my neighbours friend, a stronger runner, he could, and did, run backwards as well as I could go forwards. I stopped running with him.

All these practice runs were hard, sometimes terrible, often worst when I felt particularly fit before starting. I used the 'Rhythmn.' method of running, swinging the momentum of one stride into the next, loose arms, rolling the shoulders. This produced a shuffling gait of barely 6 miles an hour. But I could now keep going, and I enjoyed it, despite the discomfort.

Distance running is daunting in prospect, wearying in execution, but marvellous on completion.

Determination that I would complete this coming half marathon kept me at this training routine. I will give no details of the cycle-pacing, when June would ride past, at speed, holding out a beaker of orange. Nor will I tell you what I called the cow she pointed out to me, ten miles out, on a hot day.

Half-marathon morning at Earlham Park, with the hot air balloons rising, and runners preparing, was alive with colour and movement. Everyone else looked faster than I, some even running round the field to warm up. At 11.0am we were all in a huge bunch, the gun fired and off we streamed. Me and Mike Tagg.

Point one. I was determined to finish. Point two. I was not going to walk. Point three. I was a fool.

It was hot, very. And humid, very. I went too fast for the first mile or so. Seeing what I thought to be all the runners leave me behind I tried to keep up with them. This was not a sound tactic. At the first drinks table, as I ran past, I knocked over six beakers of orange juice. So I didn't drink. At the next drinks stop I knocked the drink from someones hand. So I didn't drink. At the next drinks stop, I stopped, picked up a beaker full of water, ran on and tipped most of it down my vest. I did clutch sponges of water at some stops, and squeezed them on me and sucked them, they tasted horrible. But I should have had more drink.

In Bluebell Road I felt very weak, but was still running, I wondered if I should stop and walk, but I decided not to. I took no further decisions as I remember no more.

I finished the course on Auto-pilot, and woke up in hospital at 7.0pm.

Thankyou to friend and colleagues who cheered me on the route. Why did I run? and keep running? Why did 1500 people run? not all athletes, many middle aged sedentary men like me. Perhaps the reason is instinct. Prinitive man either ran after his food, or away from animals to which he was food. Our immediate forebears also had their huge physical tasks, just for survival. A navvy moving ten tons a day. A miner 12 hours at the coal face. Evolution takes tens of thousands of years. Have we adjusted to our sedentary life after 50?. I was running away from a sabre-toothe tiger. It nearly got me!

To continue :-

I ran up Bluebell Road, towards Earlham Road..............

I woke up in the middle of the night, in my bed at home. Wider awake than normal, as if alerted by a sudden noise. I assessed my position in bed, I don't know why. I lay flat on my back, arms at my side, palms upwards, legs slightly apart. I lay thinking of nothing but with a realisation that something was wrong.

I could not move. I did not need to try. I knew I couldn't. I don't mean lift an arm or leg. I could not twitch a muscle. I at once decided I was suffering a heart attck and was dying. I was in no doubt. I first thought, if I could speak, I would say to June, 'Kill me'. 'Get all our aspirins and water and do it.' I had decided on the instant, that as I was in the process, I didn't want a botched job. I would have preferred to die than be quite physically or mentally crippled. Now, I thought, I can't speak to June, or anyone else again. I wished I had spoken to her at some time and said that if ever I became very brain damaged or similarly invalid I would prefer not to live. But I had never said it. I then decided it didn't matter as I would probably die anyway.

My next thoughts were that, though I am dying, I am conscious, to myself at least. So I will consider carefully the process of dying, to be an interested observer, as it were. I next thought how terrible it would be for June to wake up to find me dead beside her, or to be woken in the night by my body growing cold.

I was angry, if I hadn't taken that last run I would wake in the morning and all would be normal. But the clock cannot be put back, I saw myself as a stupid man, but resignedly, it was done, I was going, can't un-run the one that killed me.

I was cross, as I now knew dying was easy, how nice to do it at 83, not 43. Again and again I thought, how silly to run to death. To bike, to run a little would have been fine. I began, after some time, say 5 minutes, to stop thinking so clearly and coolly. Confusion started in my brain, but my thinking brain seemed to recede again and remain lucid. This point is central to my feelings. At all times I retained a nucleus or spark that was me, but the rest of my normal intellect was not controlled by me. Noises filled my head, not identifiable. Like banging giant anvils, but not quite. Like a Black and Decker saw, but not like it. Something a bit like barking. Then sensations, and these the strangest. All over, outside and inside the body, and organs. Coldness, piercing, fluttering. This was not painful but I thought dying takes a long time. I wanted a black curtain to fall and end these noises and sensations.

It seemed to me that the noise and feelings went on for many hours, and I was looking and looking for me just to stop. Among this hullaballoo, I only seemed to have a small bit of 'me' remaining. I tested it, I knew the first word of what I believed I was suffering to be 'heart', but I could not think of 'attack', but I did, with some satisfaction, after a long time, say in my brain, 'Heart Attack'. Then the same test with 'Skeyton', which again eventually came. I thought, in flashes, of people. In no sense that they or I would be sorry. They were just brief thoughts of particular friends. I thought of Terry Moore, another friend, and his advice of don't run. I thought, he was quite right and I was wrong. But I shan't be able to tell him.

I was still in the midst of the noise and a feeling of cold hands through my brain led me to believe that the blackness would now come, but it did not. I thought, is my death a waste? No, a baby will be born the second you die, you make no difference. I was not afraid that I was dying, there was no sensation of courage or endurance, or misery, so no fear. I don't suppose we fear being born either.

My sensations began to take a different turn, literally. I seemed to move, and balance, on parts of my body, with difficulty. Then even stranger postures, though whatever was thinking of them with remained still.

These movements were combined with the sounds and sensations but I still felt no pain, however painful they seemed to be. I began to think I was dead and would remain whirling for ever. But I had always thought dead people were no more, no senses, no feeling, no where, and I thought so still.

Well, I decided, definitely my heart attack has starved my brain of blood, and I was alive, but my brain was dead, except the bit I was now using. I could not communicate with anyone with this vestige of brain, but I was convinced that in this nucleus I was as sane as ever. I decided I was now lolling in a corner in a mental institution, as completely useless a body as they had ever seen. I had myself seen such people in the past, but now I knew they still had their sanity, it was just locked in. I still tumbled, more madness, I decided that this was my fate, I would be permanently like this, and accepted it and grew used to it.

The 'Asylum' phase continued for a long time. I then heard among the other sound effects, which had always continued, 'Peter.' ....'Peter.'

Yes, they've come to see me, but I cannot communicate anything, not a vestige of a chance..........Then lights, bright, deep, as if shining up my neck. Then I believe I am wearing a greyhound's muzzle. This muzzle presses hard into my face. I twist on my side, feeling terrible cramps in my stomach, retch as never before. I see the muzzle moved away, see light, see a tanned hand, a blue dress, white coats. 'What day is it Mr Perkins?' 'Do you know where you are?'

I cannot say that I then felt relief, or joy, that I was spared and not dying at all. I just lay there aware only that I was living and may well continue to do so.

This recovery from the unconscious state was at about 7.0pm on Sunday, so 5 hours had elapsed from my collapse, not a much longer time as I had believed.

The treatment continued. I lay naked, before a large fan. I was watered all over, the water evaporated, I was watered again, and again. This continued until my temperature was reduced, I think at around midnight. I then regained my strength and was allowed to come home on Tuesday evening.

As I recovered, and as I am now nearly fully recovered, I am thankful that I am alive. If it was death that touched me, it held no terrors. But life is good and I hope to enjoy a lot more of it, and perhaps appreciate living a little more than I did before.

Peter Perkins

Sept 1982 :o
lady cop
Posts: 14744
Joined: Wed Nov 24, 2004 1:00 pm

Near death experience

Post by lady cop »

i had a heart attack 2 years ago this week. i lay in the ER and watched the monitor, i knew exactly what it all meant. the cardiologist took me right into OR. kept me awake while he did his surgery. i spent the time joking with him. we're still good buddies. i did nearly die. but i didn't see anything except thoughts of my kids and my lover.
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Galbally
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Joined: Tue Oct 25, 2005 5:26 pm

Near death experience

Post by Galbally »

retepsnikrep;493731 wrote: Now I know this is a long post but it directly answers the initial question posed. I did write it a while back now as you will see.

Half Marathon Man.

At Aylsham, on May 2nd 1982, I watched the Holt Marathon runners pass, en route to Norwich. The half marathon runners finishing in Aylsham Market Square. It had an effect on me, in short, I decided to do it myself.

My neighbour was already training, he agreed to take me. Kitted up, on a June evening, off we jogged. At the village pond, some 150 yards out, I advised him I was completely exhausted and incapable of further movement. 'Perfectly normal.' he said, 'Carry on.' So I did, and I could. That was the first of many runs.

Each practice route had a name. 'Old Church', 2.2 miles. This was generally done on a Friday Night. 'Stratton Strawless.' 4.2 miles. 'The Mayton Loop.' 6.0 miles. And the longest, Skeyton Church, 11.2 miles.

I ran three times a week, normally with my neighbour, but sometimes alone, and a few times, cycle paced. I also ran with my neighbours friend, a stronger runner, he could, and did, run backwards as well as I could go forwards. I stopped running with him.

All these practice runs were hard, sometimes terrible, often worst when I felt particularly fit before starting. I used the 'Rhythmn.' method of running, swinging the momentum of one stride into the next, loose arms, rolling the shoulders. This produced a shuffling gait of barely 6 miles an hour. But I could now keep going, and I enjoyed it, despite the discomfort.

Distance running is daunting in prospect, wearying in execution, but marvellous on completion.

Determination that I would complete this coming half marathon kept me at this training routine. I will give no details of the cycle-pacing, when June would ride past, at speed, holding out a beaker of orange. Nor will I tell you what I called the cow she pointed out to me, ten miles out, on a hot day.

Half-marathon morning at Earlham Park, with the hot air balloons rising, and runners preparing, was alive with colour and movement. Everyone else looked faster than I, some even running round the field to warm up. At 11.0am we were all in a huge bunch, the gun fired and off we streamed. Me and Mike Tagg.

Point one. I was determined to finish. Point two. I was not going to walk. Point three. I was a fool.

It was hot, very. And humid, very. I went too fast for the first mile or so. Seeing what I thought to be all the runners leave me behind I tried to keep up with them. This was not a sound tactic. At the first drinks table, as I ran past, I knocked over six beakers of orange juice. So I didn't drink. At the next drinks stop I knocked the drink from someones hand. So I didn't drink. At the next drinks stop, I stopped, picked up a beaker full of water, ran on and tipped most of it down my vest. I did clutch sponges of water at some stops, and squeezed them on me and sucked them, they tasted horrible. But I should have had more drink.

In Bluebell Road I felt very weak, but was still running, I wondered if I should stop and walk, but I decided not to. I took no further decisions as I remember no more.

I finished the course on Auto-pilot, and woke up in hospital at 7.0pm.

Thankyou to friend and colleagues who cheered me on the route. Why did I run? and keep running? Why did 1500 people run? not all athletes, many middle aged sedentary men like me. Perhaps the reason is instinct. Prinitive man either ran after his food, or away from animals to which he was food. Our immediate forebears also had their huge physical tasks, just for survival. A navvy moving ten tons a day. A miner 12 hours at the coal face. Evolution takes tens of thousands of years. Have we adjusted to our sedentary life after 50?. I was running away from a sabre-toothe tiger. It nearly got me!

To continue :-

I ran up Bluebell Road, towards Earlham Road..............

I woke up in the middle of the night, in my bed at home. Wider awake than normal, as if alerted by a sudden noise. I assessed my position in bed, I don't know why. I lay flat on my back, arms at my side, palms upwards, legs slightly apart. I lay thinking of nothing but with a realisation that something was wrong.

I could not move. I did not need to try. I knew I couldn't. I don't mean lift an arm or leg. I could not twitch a muscle. I at once decided I was suffering a heart attck and was dying. I was in no doubt. I first thought, if I could speak, I would say to June, 'Kill me'. 'Get all our aspirins and water and do it.' I had decided on the instant, that as I was in the process, I didn't want a botched job. I would have preferred to die than be quite physically or mentally crippled. Now, I thought, I can't speak to June, or anyone else again. I wished I had spoken to her at some time and said that if ever I became very brain damaged or similarly invalid I would prefer not to live. But I had never said it. I then decided it didn't matter as I would probably die anyway.

My next thoughts were that, though I am dying, I am conscious, to myself at least. So I will consider carefully the process of dying, to be an interested observer, as it were. I next thought how terrible it would be for June to wake up to find me dead beside her, or to be woken in the night by my body growing cold.

I was angry, if I hadn't taken that last run I would wake in the morning and all would be normal. But the clock cannot be put back, I saw myself as a stupid man, but resignedly, it was done, I was going, can't un-run the one that killed me.

I was cross, as I now knew dying was easy, how nice to do it at 83, not 43. Again and again I thought, how silly to run to death. To bike, to run a little would have been fine. I began, after some time, say 5 minutes, to stop thinking so clearly and coolly. Confusion started in my brain, but my thinking brain seemed to recede again and remain lucid. This point is central to my feelings. At all times I retained a nucleus or spark that was me, but the rest of my normal intellect was not controlled by me. Noises filled my head, not identifiable. Like banging giant anvils, but not quite. Like a Black and Decker saw, but not like it. Something a bit like barking. Then sensations, and these the strangest. All over, outside and inside the body, and organs. Coldness, piercing, fluttering. This was not painful but I thought dying takes a long time. I wanted a black curtain to fall and end these noises and sensations.

It seemed to me that the noise and feelings went on for many hours, and I was looking and looking for me just to stop. Among this hullaballoo, I only seemed to have a small bit of 'me' remaining. I tested it, I knew the first word of what I believed I was suffering to be 'heart', but I could not think of 'attack', but I did, with some satisfaction, after a long time, say in my brain, 'Heart Attack'. Then the same test with 'Skeyton', which again eventually came. I thought, in flashes, of people. In no sense that they or I would be sorry. They were just brief thoughts of particular friends. I thought of Terry Moore, another friend, and his advice of don't run. I thought, he was quite right and I was wrong. But I shan't be able to tell him.

I was still in the midst of the noise and a feeling of cold hands through my brain led me to believe that the blackness would now come, but it did not. I thought, is my death a waste? No, a baby will be born the second you die, you make no difference. I was not afraid that I was dying, there was no sensation of courage or endurance, or misery, so no fear. I don't suppose we fear being born either.

My sensations began to take a different turn, literally. I seemed to move, and balance, on parts of my body, with difficulty. Then even stranger postures, though whatever was thinking of them with remained still.

These movements were combined with the sounds and sensations but I still felt no pain, however painful they seemed to be. I began to think I was dead and would remain whirling for ever. But I had always thought dead people were no more, no senses, no feeling, no where, and I thought so still.

Well, I decided, definitely my heart attack has starved my brain of blood, and I was alive, but my brain was dead, except the bit I was now using. I could not communicate with anyone with this vestige of brain, but I was convinced that in this nucleus I was as sane as ever. I decided I was now lolling in a corner in a mental institution, as completely useless a body as they had ever seen. I had myself seen such people in the past, but now I knew they still had their sanity, it was just locked in. I still tumbled, more madness, I decided that this was my fate, I would be permanently like this, and accepted it and grew used to it.

The 'Asylum' phase continued for a long time. I then heard among the other sound effects, which had always continued, 'Peter.' ....'Peter.'

Yes, they've come to see me, but I cannot communicate anything, not a vestige of a chance..........Then lights, bright, deep, as if shining up my neck. Then I believe I am wearing a greyhound's muzzle. This muzzle presses hard into my face. I twist on my side, feeling terrible cramps in my stomach, retch as never before. I see the muzzle moved away, see light, see a tanned hand, a blue dress, white coats. 'What day is it Mr Perkins?' 'Do you know where you are?'

I cannot say that I then felt relief, or joy, that I was spared and not dying at all. I just lay there aware only that I was living and may well continue to do so.

This recovery from the unconscious state was at about 7.0pm on Sunday, so 5 hours had elapsed from my collapse, not a much longer time as I had believed.

The treatment continued. I lay naked, before a large fan. I was watered all over, the water evaporated, I was watered again, and again. This continued until my temperature was reduced, I think at around midnight. I then regained my strength and was allowed to come home on Tuesday evening.

As I recovered, and as I am now nearly fully recovered, I am thankful that I am alive. If it was death that touched me, it held no terrors. But life is good and I hope to enjoy a lot more of it, and perhaps appreciate living a little more than I did before.

Peter Perkins

Sept 1982 :o


Great post, thanks for that red, very interesting.
"We are never so happy, never so unhappy, as we imagine"



Le Rochefoucauld.



"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."



My dad 1986.
User avatar
Galbally
Posts: 9755
Joined: Tue Oct 25, 2005 5:26 pm

Near death experience

Post by Galbally »

lady cop;493737 wrote: i had a heart attack 2 years ago this week. i lay in the ER and watched the monitor, i knew exactly what it all meant. the cardiologist took me right into OR. kept me awake while he did his surgery. i spent the time joking with him. we're still good buddies. i did nearly die. but i didn't see anything except thoughts of my kids and my lover.


My closest, like I said, was New Year's day 1999. I had a terrible headache from red wine the night before, so I took 2 ibuprofen in the morning as I knew I was allergic to aspirin. I had never tried ibuprofen for years as I tend to avoid medicines unless I am really, really ill.

It was a bad move as I turned out to be more allergic to Ibuprofen than I am to aspirin.

Anyway the long and short of it was that I had to be rushed into a hospital in Dublin and given adrenaline and a ton of anti-H drugs. I remember that at one point as I was being taken to the hospital I started to black out and my vision became "tunneled", I could only see a little part of normality and the rest was black like looking down a tube, my breathing was very difficult and I could not think. Then I remembered being very calm, and immediately been able to think clearly though everything was kinda getting worse with my body. I just remember thinking, "oh bugger, this does not look good for you buddy, you may be dying you know", I couldn't really hear or see anything except random sounds and colours then, I didn't feel any emotion, except a mild sense of "flippin hell, this ain't so bad if this is dying", and then "I wonder what happens next then?".



I don't really remember anything much more until I came to with a drip in my arm in A&E in the hospital. Unfortunately the nurses on call were actually the same nurses who I had entertained the night before in the party with my drunken buffoonery by a typical co-incidence, so I was dead embarrassed. After about an hour I was actually as right as rain as allergic reactions tend to be swift and violent and if treated go away as quickly as they come. I tell you what though, it was flipping great to walk out of the hospital and back into the city! :)
"We are never so happy, never so unhappy, as we imagine"



Le Rochefoucauld.



"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."



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Post by lady cop »

what was really funny was that my LT. had been notified by the ambulance guys, and he called me on the phone while i was in surgery and they put the call through!
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Post by EmersonBashier »

I personally have not had a near death experience but I became interested in the subject when a friend of mine told me about a SELF-HELP book, a GUIDE FOR SUCCESSFUL LIVING written by a woman who had undergone the whole experience. She was actually placed in the hospital morgue covered with a sheet where she stayed indefinitely.

In her book, she describes everything in great detail. She tells of her going through the tunnel and being met by a beautiful celestial angelic-like being who told her she had to return but she was going to be given information to take back with her to put in a book. It was to eliminate superstition, dogma and fear. It is one of the most fantastic books I have ever read. I became so enlightened from the information she provided that it has made me an entirely different person as a result.

She has begun a web site where she answers questions for those who need to know more or some explanations.

The web site is "Neardeathandback@groups.aol.com. The publisher has a web site for her book, ALifeAfterDeathExperienceBook.com.

I am not promoting anything. I just want you to know what help she provided for me and what valuable information I learned from a person who has been there and done that.
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Post by nvalleyvee »

Been there ...done that....I've seen my animals and my family in that place. I have seen my grrrr animals many more times than my own family........DUH...I know why.......animals are so much more coodoos than people. I still feel SOME people in my family..........I feel other people better.
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Post by spot »

This is an ambitious experiment to test out of body claims. We'll have to wait four years for a paper on the results but I'm looking forward to reading it.Doctors at 25 UK and US hospitals will study 1,500 survivors to see if people with no heartbeat or brain activity can have "out of body" experiences. Some people report seeing a tunnel or bright light, others recall looking down from the ceiling at medical staff.

The study, due to take three years and co-ordinated by Southampton University, will include placing on shelves images that could only be seen from above. To test this, the researchers have set up special shelving in resuscitation areas. The shelves hold pictures - but they're visible only from the ceiling. Before they get started, assume for a moment a failure of near-death patients who report out-of-body experiences in these rooms to accurately report on the photos put out for them. Can anyone suggest a reason why they'd not be able to report what would have been visible, if that turns out to be what happens, other than that the out-of-body experience is hallucinatory?

If anyone can think of a reason then the experiment's badly designed.
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Post by recovering conservative »

Before I believe in studies from near-death survivors that they have had real conscious experiences outside of their physical bodies, I'd like a proponent to explain what sort of agent allows them to see with the exact same colour spectrum that is provided by our eyes and interpreted for us by the visual cortex area of the brain! It's one thing to think that our consciousness is produced by an immaterial soul trapped inside our bodies until we die, but why would the "soul" see the same visual images that we see by means of our physical visual system? Why couldn't the soul see ultraviolet or infrared light, or why wouldn't it be able to see through the walls of a room by means of radio waves or some other high frequency electromagnetic radiation?

A more plausible explanation would be that the experience is a sensory illusion since people who are not near death and experience a sensation of floating out of the body, can have that experience artificially induced:

Swissinfo.ch

September 18, 2002

Scientists trigger out-of-body experience

Swiss scientists think they have pinpointed the area of the brain where out-of-body experiences are triggered.....................Blanke and his team produced the phenomenon by stimulating an area in the right cortex of the brain called the angular gyrus that is involved in spatial cognition.

The scientists suspect that the angular gyrus matches up visual information, how the body is seen, and touch and balance sensations that create the mind's representation of the body.

They believe an out-of-body experience may occur when the two do not link up

In other words, we don't have a default sense of embodiment, but instead that area of our brain - the right angular gyrus - is an area that takes information from our visual and touch senses, and acts like a sort of homing device since it has to continuously create body maps to inform us that our conscious self is located inside our heads, which has arms and legs and these features separate us from the inanimate objects inside the hospital room and the doctors and nurses who might be there with us.

Olaf Blanke's study showed that all it takes is a mild electric shock to this body-mapping center of the brain, and we don't know where our consciousness is located. We are then free to create visual maps that match a feeling of floating above our bodies or around the room.

With that in mind, why should we assume that an out of body experience reported by someone who is near death is something totally different? Before NDE's can assume to be mental events that are separate from brain function, someone will have to prove that the brain is not sufficiently active to generate experiences. In the NDE testimonials, all of the people survived the experience; so that means the brain did not go entirely without oxygen for very long or they would have died or had permanent brain damage and been unable to report anything afterwards! If the brain is getting enough oxygen to function. it could be enough to experience dream-like hallucinations or out-of-body experiences, even if they were unconscious at the time.

And the NDE believers assume that the memories of the near death experience reported afterward all occured while they were unconscious. But everyone who has had the experience of recovering from a general anesthetic after an accident or a major operation, knows that you just don't snap right out of it like they do in the movies -- it takes hours to slowly regain consciousness; but the people who describe near death experiences afterward could be combining memories from thoughts, perceptions, hallucinations and illusions together while going through the process of recovery

If the study by Dr. Sam Parnia is legitimate, and there is no possible way for fraud to be committed by hospital staff who might be able to see the pictures on the shelf, then all of the reports will come back negative, and we'll likely never hear about this study again. But doing a little searching about Sam Parnia, it appears that this doctor is not an unbiased researcher, but is instead a true believer who is just looking for proof to confirm his pre-existing beliefs. In a 2001 interview said:

“When you damage the brain or lose some of the aspects of mind or personality, that doesn’t necessarily mean the mind is being produced by the brain. All it shows is that the apparatus is damaged,” Parnia said, adding that further research might reveal the existence of a soul.
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Post by Oscar Namechange »

I saw a documentry once a few years ago. I can't remember what it was or what it was called. Anyway, this hospital in America put small objects very high up on ledges in an operating theatre. Over a study of so many years, they actuall had patients who 'died' in surgery claiming they had floated above the operating table before being brought back to life. All of them named the objests near the ceiling that they could not have seen from where they lay.

That spooked me.
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Post by recovering conservative »

oscar;1043627 wrote: I saw a documentry once a few years ago. I can't remember what it was or what it was called. Anyway, this hospital in America put small objects very high up on ledges in an operating theatre. Over a study of so many years, they actuall had patients who 'died' in surgery claiming they had floated above the operating table before being brought back to life. All of them named the objests near the ceiling that they could not have seen from where they lay.

That spooked me.


I'm not sure, but just like with the shows about UFO's and ghost stories, there is a continuous stream of stories about people who came back from the dead -- but they are always based on testimonials and can't be proven or disproven. This study mentioned previously by a Dr. Sam Parnia, is supposed to be an attempt to conduct a controlled study that would not be subject to cheating or fraud; and Parnia may be legitimate, but I am a little dubious about the fact that he is already a believer. And there are so many groups in hospitals in the U.S. and England that will be involved in the study, I wonder how they will ensure that all of the test sites are carefully controlled to eliminate the chance of fraud.
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Post by wildhorses »

spot;986945 wrote: This is an ambitious experiment to test out of body claims. We'll have to wait four years for a paper on the results but I'm looking forward to reading it.Doctors at 25 UK and US hospitals will study 1,500 survivors to see if people with no heartbeat or brain activity can have "out of body" experiences. Some people report seeing a tunnel or bright light, others recall looking down from the ceiling at medical staff.

The study, due to take three years and co-ordinated by Southampton University, will include placing on shelves images that could only be seen from above. To test this, the researchers have set up special shelving in resuscitation areas. The shelves hold pictures - but they're visible only from the ceiling. Before they get started, assume for a moment a failure of near-death patients who report out-of-body experiences in these rooms to accurately report on the photos put out for them. Can anyone suggest a reason why they'd not be able to report what would have been visible, if that turns out to be what happens, other than that the out-of-body experience is hallucinatory?



If anyone can think of a reason then the experiment's badly designed.


Maybe their out of body experience would not include "floating to the ceiling". Maybe they would be standing next to the bed. The experiment is being fashioned after reports of some people saying they were "floating"....but others may not have the same experience. They should still put the pictures up on the shelf. But they should also plant other items. Maybe the pillow case could have some unusual pattern. They would be unconcious so if they knew the pattern then that would be something.
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Post by K.Snyder »

spot;986945 wrote: Can anyone suggest a reason why they'd not be able to report what would have been visible, if that turns out to be what happens, other than that the out-of-body experience is hallucinatory?


Yes...They'd be sedated, and upon anyone being able to see objects during any operating procedure that vehemently requires a person be sedated I'd question the hospital in question and look for legal consultation given my right.
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Post by spot »

K.Snyder;1044451 wrote: Yes...They'd be sedated, and upon anyone being able to see objects during any operating procedure that vehemently requires a person be sedated I'd question the hospital in question and look for legal consultation given my right.


If it were a matter of seeing with their body then I'd agree with you. The matter being investigated is seeing from the ceiling, presumably anaesthetic has no effect one way or the other on whether a person can achieve that.
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Post by K.Snyder »

spot;1044524 wrote: If it were a matter of seeing with their body then I'd agree with you. The matter being investigated is seeing from the ceiling, presumably anaesthetic has no effect one way or the other on whether a person can achieve that.


What's left is understanding the human being's ability not only to percieve but their ability to imagine. Which renders the entire concept relative based on the imaginations of those who retain their right to express their personal experiences ultimately rendering any foreign embodiment subtract of partial judgment.

I'd once had a dream that I was chasing some evil person through a movie theater and, upon leaping over a four feet pit entrenched into the floor of the structure, I then ultimately met face to face with this evil being from which I was going to kick the sh*t out of him, but at that point he sicked his cheetah on me...

:thinking:...I don't know what happened after that point because I woke up...:confused:...



:confused:

:confused:

:confused:...

*Shrugs*...
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Post by spot »

That's why they're leaving out the stuff that can't be seen from anywhere but the ceiling.

To discover whether the subjective effect is experimentally real or not.
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Post by K.Snyder »

spot;1044570 wrote: That's why they're leaving out the stuff that can't be seen from anywhere but the ceiling.

To discover whether the subjective effect is experimentally real or not.


I'm curious as to whether or not the testimonies by those that "have experienced an out of body experience" is considered a form of some type of "psychic phenomenon" or if such is considered a different element altogether...

I'm also interested in the percentages of peoples having been deemed psychic in relation to the amount of experiments conducted at the same time to whom conducted them...:yh_wink...

I find the events of both having been considered "proof" of it's existence based solely on the fact that such instances can be proven to be coincidence based on simple mathematics...
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Post by spot »

Considered by whom? By people with an expectation for the paranormal, in general yes. By people who have no experience of the paranormal, in general no.

That's why the study has been funded. To provide evidence one way or the other. When you say "in relation to the amount of experiments" I'm unaware of any. That's why this experiment's interesting - a team is finally experimenting to get an answer to the question. The design of the experiment removes any reasonable possibility of coincidence.
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Post by K.Snyder »

spot;1044763 wrote: Considered by whom? By people with an expectation for the paranormal, in general yes. By people who have no experience of the paranormal, in general no.

That's why the study has been funded. To provide evidence one way or the other. When you say "in relation to the amount of experiments" I'm unaware of any. That's why this experiment's interesting - a team is finally experimenting to get an answer to the question. The design of the experiment removes any reasonable possibility of coincidence.


What defines their ability to "render" the conclusions of the experiment unquestionable?...

I know plenty of people who splash paint on a canvas and call it "art" but alot seem to beg to differ...

What in your mind proves that "...people with an expectation for the paranormal..." are "..., in general yes." qualified to, again, "render the conclusions of the experiment unquestionable"?...

I'll tell you who.

Not these people.

Waste of money. Even in the article the alternative report of "others recall looking down from the ceiling at medical staff" is "people report seeing a tunnel or bright light"...I'm not even interested in the paranormal and have heard people say the latter more so than the former...

Not only do you have people with the inability to explain the human imagination but you have people conducting experiments that will ultimately fail to bring about a full conclusion so as to eliminate all doubt...

What I want to know is, is who's paying these people (AKA: getting conned) to do this?
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Post by spot »

You don't recognize that if someone reports accurately what can be seen from the ceiling, if they've no way of discovering it other than their point of view having at some stage been there, then the result is a paranormal event?

How else would you explain it, if that's what the experiment reports?

If, as seems more likely, the experiment reports no such results, that's a nail in the coffin of these people who say it happens.
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Post by spot »

K.Snyder;1044768 wrote: What I want to know is, is who's paying these people (AKA: getting conned) to do this?


I'll go and find out.

There's a recent article in Time magazine about the project.
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Post by spot »

Here it is:

funded by the UK Resuscitation Council, the Horizon Research Foundation, and the Nour Foundation in the United States.

Abertawe Bro Morgannwg University NHS Trust News - Morriston expertise to aid world study
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Post by K.Snyder »

spot;1044772 wrote: I'll go and find out.

There's a recent article in Time magazine about the project.


Yet paradoxically, 10% or 20% of people who are then brought back to life from that period, which may be a few minutes or over an hour, will report having consciousness. So the key thing here is, Are these real, or is it some sort of illusion? So the only way to tell is to have pictures only visible from the ceiling and nowhere else, because they claim they can see everything from the ceiling. I'm sorry but 1,500 patients will most assuredly not be pragmatic in conjunction with "10% or 20% of people who are then brought back to life from that period, ...[...]..., will report having consciousness" from an overall perspective not to mention "Some people report seeing a tunnel or bright light"...



People commonly perceive death as being a moment — you're either dead or you're alive. And that's a social definition we have. But the clinical definition we use is when the heart stops beating, the lungs stop working, and as a consequence the brain itself stops working. What's left is to be able to distinguish the definitions of "death" both from a clinical point of view and "death" from a biological point of view...



Nowadays, we have technology that's improved so that we can bring people back to life. In fact, there are drugs being developed right now — who knows if they'll ever make it to the market — that may actually slow down the process of brain-cell injury and death. Imagine you fast-forward to 10 years down the line; and you've given a patient, whose heart has just stopped, this amazing drug; and actually what it does is, it slows everything down so that the things that would've happened over an hour, now happen over two days. As medicine progresses, we will end up with lots and lots of ethical questions. Now this is what I'm interested in.

"Two days" is a bit of a stretch though I think...But hey I'm not a scientist...Give scientists all of the credit people doctors for the most part are the ones that disperse the medicines they don't primarily make them...



So it's not a moment; it's a process that actually begins when the heart stops and culminates in the complete loss of the body, the decompositions of all the cells. This is my idea of "death"...

So far I haven't seen anything convincing me that the experiment holds any real promise...

I think people are making a little money off of dreams...:thinking:...

http://www.time.com/time/health/article ... ml?cnn=yes
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Post by K.Snyder »

spot;1044774 wrote: Here it is:

funded by the UK Resuscitation Council, the Horizon Research Foundation, and the Nour Foundation in the United States.

Abertawe Bro Morgannwg University NHS Trust News - Morriston expertise to aid world study


:yh_rotfl...

What happens when they get reports of out of body experiences that just walked around on the floor as opposed to flew over the shelves?...

"What's next doctor?"...

*Shrugs* -- "Iuknow" "Hand me the fn scalpel"

:yh_rotfl...

What happens when people fly over the shelves but claim they only had tunnel vision?...

:yh_rotfl...

"Well,..we'll put a big red horn on the patient and if it squeaks we'll know!!!!!!!"...

:yh_rotfl...
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Post by K.Snyder »

spot;1044771 wrote: You don't recognize that if someone reports accurately what can be seen from the ceiling, if they've no way of discovering it other than their point of view having at some stage been there, then the result is a paranormal event?

How else would you explain it, if that's what the experiment reports?

If, as seems more likely, the experiment reports no such results, that's a nail in the coffin of these people who say it happens.


Well I would agree to the extent from which is considered to be an "accurate report"...

Are we accepting just shades and shapes or do we expect people to be able to count the moles on Rodney Dangerfield's face!!!!!!...

If the former is the case how many people need to "report accurately" before we rule out coincidence?...

In any case, I'm speaking more or less in the fact that anything above a complexity rating of 6 from a scale of 1 - 10 will not be "accurately reported"...

Dreams and imaginations are just that, dreams and imaginations. If the study proves "out of body experiences" to the point of paranormality I will personally apologize for making light of the situation. Will be waiting a long time.
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Post by spot »

I'm quite interested in reading their findings as they progress. I've very little idea of what reason people would have for inventing experiences they didn't have when they flatline, certainly not as many as one in ten to one in five of them. Why would they make things up? And assuming the study for the first time produces medical measurements to compare with the timelines they report, it will be the first time such information's been available.

The hidden features visible from the ceiling are just icing on the cake - some people say that was their perspective while flatlined, it's a perfect way to t33est the objective truth of the reported experience.
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Post by K.Snyder »

spot;1044784 wrote: I'm quite interested in reading their findings as they progress. I've very little idea of what reason people would have for inventing experiences they didn't have when they flatline, certainly not as many as one in ten to one in five of them. Why would they make things up? And assuming the study for the first time produces medical measurements to compare with the timelines they report, it will be the first time such information's been available.

The hidden features visible from the ceiling are just icing on the cake - some people say that was their perspective while flatlined, it's a perfect way to t33est the objective truth of the reported experience.


People are able to imagine themselves being in the 3rd person...The sedation acts as a confusing element eliminating their ability to distinguish their imagination from their recognition of reality.

I'm sitting here right now imagining being over medical staff performing a procedure on me...I see a male doctor to the bottom middle right of a row of 4 lined horizontally with a blue surgeons cap and a doctor to his left...

I see a white box to mine and his right...Some sort of machine...

There are eight doctors all together...I cannot make out the gender or shape of them all to complex detail but I know there are women present...Wait yes there is a woman to his left...I'm not looking at any shelves because I have tunnel vision.

There you have it...An "out of body experience" and I'm not even on drugs...I'm wondering what the details would be like after having been sedated...

There's a very fine line between "reality" and "imagination"...
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Post by K.Snyder »

K.Snyder;1044785 wrote: People are able to imagine themselves being in the 3rd person...The sedation acts as a confusing element eliminating their ability to distinguish their imagination from their recognition of reality.

I'm sitting here right now imagining being over medical staff performing a procedure on me...I see a male doctor to the bottom middle right of a row of 4 lined horizontally with a blue surgeons cap and a doctor to his left...

I see a white box to mine and his right...Some sort of machine...

There are eight doctors all together...I cannot make out the gender or shape pf them all to complex detail but I know there are women present...Wait yes there is a woman to his left...I'm not looking at any shelves because I have tunnel vision.

There you have it...An "out of body experience" and I'm not even on drugs...I'm wondering what the details would be like after having been sedated...

There's a very fine line between "reality" and "imagination"...


Wait no, that was just an episode of ER...:yh_rotfl...

:thinking:...
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Post by spot »

Can we agree firstly that valid experimental results on the process of death will come out of the study, and that when it's published we'll have clearer reasons to either mock the reports as you're doing or to finally give them credence?
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Post by K.Snyder »

spot;1044788 wrote: Can we agree firstly that valid experimental results on the process of death will come out of the study, and that when it's published we'll have clearer reasons to either mock the reports as you're doing or to finally give them credence?


I personally can upon seeing what the objects are to be placed on the shelves and of course if anyone describes those objects to greater detail having been eliminated of coincidence.

But for the sake of human intrigue I won't mock it any more...

I'll just end in saying I think it's a waste of time.

If I'm proved wrong by my own standard of question then I will sincerely apologize on behalf of all that I've mocked.
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Post by spot »

Ignoring anything to do with reports of near-death experiences which is just one aspect of the study, do you not think that the valid experimental results on the process of death are themselves worth recording and publishing? That's the majority of what's being done with the funding.
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Post by K.Snyder »

spot;1044790 wrote: Ignoring anything to do with reports of near-death experiences which is just one aspect of the study, do you not think that the valid experimental results on the process of death are themselves worth recording and publishing? That's the majority of what's being done with the funding.


Absolutely.

I'm interested in

Nowadays, we have technology that's improved so that we can bring people back to life. In fact, there are drugs being developed right now — who knows if they'll ever make it to the market — that may actually slow down the process of brain-cell injury and death. Imagine you fast-forward to 10 years down the line; and you've given a patient, whose heart has just stopped, this amazing drug; and actually what it does is, it slows everything down so that the things that would've happened over an hour, now happen over two days. As medicine progresses, we will end up with lots and lots of ethical questions. http://www.time.com/time/health/article ... ml?cnn=yes

...Again,..""Two days" is a bit of a stretch though I think...But hey I'm not a scientist...Give scientists all of the credit people doctors for the most part are the ones that disperse the medicines they don't primarily make them"...
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Post by K.Snyder »

I've searched near, far, up and down but I cannot find the test results of Sam Parnias study!

Perhaps one knows why this study has dropped off the Google map.
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Post by Bryn Mawr »

K.Snyder;1259950 wrote: I've searched near, far, up and down but I cannot find the test results of Sam Parnias study!

Perhaps one knows why this study has dropped off the Google map.


Try Article: Near Death Experiences
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Post by K.Snyder »

Bryn Mawr;1261433 wrote: Try Article: Near Death Experiences


It seems Mr. Parnia likes to say alot about research but nothing about his results.

I'm interested in the results he's getting aside from a mere percentage of people claiming to have out of body experiences.

But I've went back and reread that the experiment is "supposed to take 3 years" and this was in 2008 so my apology.

The study, due to take three years and co-ordinated by Southampton University, will include placing on shelves images that could only be seen from above. BBC NEWS | Health | Study into near-death experiences

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