In some countries it was because of a so called miscarriage of justice when an innocent person went to the gallows. Like how often did that happen? Anyway that was then and now some sixty years later DNA testing has made such mistakes pretty unlikely.
Part of Amnesty International’s stated mission is to prevent and end grave abuses of human rights. Hello! So when an earthling is murdered every single right they ever had has been taken from them so why this bias towards the killer as opposed to the victim? By committing such a hideous crime the killer gave up their human rights.
Among the reasons why opponents object to the death penalty are: (i) killing someone is always wrong, and two wrongs can never make a right; (ii) there is in fact no evidence of a deterrent effect;
Well if killing someone is always wrong then why not tell this to the killers? Maybe there is no evidence of a deterrent effect but I doubt if any executed killer is ever gonna murder again!
Why should tax payers the world over pay for killers to live in prison? Young criminals are not afraid of prison cos it’s often better than what they had on the outside. Three square meals a day, TV, gym, computers, and parole … wow nice work if you can get it.
An eye for an eye I say.
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
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jones jones
- Posts: 6601
- Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2008 7:30 am
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
"…I hate how I don’t feel real enough unless people are watching." — Chuck Palahniuk, Invisible Monsters
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
It has no deterrent effect, many murders are committed in extremis, self defence or as crimes of passion rather than premeditated and too many people were executed who were in fact innocent. It's not about the killers rights it's about your right not to be executed for something you didn't do. Same with human rights legislation it's not to protect criminals it's to protect you from the state and arbitrary arrest and imprisonment. Anyone who thinks the police never make a mistake or fix the evidence is an idiot. Anyone who thinks we should just trust them is an even bigger one.
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
"Two wrongs don't make a right" is a bit vague. It's not a question of giving the death penalty to one who's guilty but a question of a system being allowed to put to death someone based merely on a case, which I might add does go both ways. If this argument isn't enough to highlight just how everyone entering a courtroom is presumed guilty until proven innocent I don't know what does.
I'm not very sure how much argument you would get out of people when discussing the death penalty in cases one is divinely guilty of murder per say...
The fact is that it's morally wrong to kill another person without feeling immediately concerned of ones own safety, so why should we have a death penalty inside an orchestrated courtroom?
The death penalty should be allowed to be enforced in instances where the enforcer fears for his/her safety at the time, not in a courtroom where the level of bias is so much against the defendant that I'd rather fear the day I'd be charged than the day I'd have to make a decision to kill someone outside the courtroom.
I'm not very sure how much argument you would get out of people when discussing the death penalty in cases one is divinely guilty of murder per say...
The fact is that it's morally wrong to kill another person without feeling immediately concerned of ones own safety, so why should we have a death penalty inside an orchestrated courtroom?
The death penalty should be allowed to be enforced in instances where the enforcer fears for his/her safety at the time, not in a courtroom where the level of bias is so much against the defendant that I'd rather fear the day I'd be charged than the day I'd have to make a decision to kill someone outside the courtroom.
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
Those hoping to scratch the surface of the topic might like to read the appropriate debate in the House of Lords. I've started it but it may take a few more days before I reach the end.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
I trust you're nor suggesting that people need to read such thing before their opinion is worthy of being aired?
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Oscar Namechange
- Posts: 31842
- Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:26 am
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
spot;1374485 wrote: Those hoping to scratch the surface of the topic might like to read the appropriate debate in the House of Lords. I've started it but it may take a few more days before I reach the end. Why should anyone waste their time with that?
It's a debate, nothing more. It does not apply to the US members who won't give a monkey's what a bunch of British Hooray's have got to say. Why on earth do you Imagine so ?
Why Is It, that with you, no-one can seem to be just able to give an opinion?
Now If you'll excuse me, I am off to Wooton Bassett for the day to do something slightly more meaningful than reading that tosh.
It's a debate, nothing more. It does not apply to the US members who won't give a monkey's what a bunch of British Hooray's have got to say. Why on earth do you Imagine so ?
Why Is It, that with you, no-one can seem to be just able to give an opinion?
Now If you'll excuse me, I am off to Wooton Bassett for the day to do something slightly more meaningful than reading that tosh.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
gmc;1374496 wrote: I trust you're nor suggesting that people need to read such thing before their opinion is worthy of being aired?
I'm suggesting two things. Firstly, that the House of Lords debate will be informative, regardless of where people live, regarding the arguments which answer the thread's title "Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?". Secondly, that I know no better source for those arguments.
I'm suggesting two things. Firstly, that the House of Lords debate will be informative, regardless of where people live, regarding the arguments which answer the thread's title "Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?". Secondly, that I know no better source for those arguments.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
The question is: "Why was the death penalty abolished?" which, it seems to me, has to do with factual history. Spot is endeavoring to answer that question by learning the history. I don't see a problem with that. The question, as posed, has nothing whatsoever to do with opinion, AFAICT. You may not agree with the reasons lawmakers arrived at as to why the death penalty was abolished, but you can't rightly hold a legitimate opinion about the stated question without an understanding of the facts, can you.
“Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities,â€
Voltaire
I have only one thing to do and that's
Be the wave that I am and then
Sink back into the ocean
Fiona Apple
Voltaire
I have only one thing to do and that's
Be the wave that I am and then
Sink back into the ocean
Fiona Apple
-
jones jones
- Posts: 6601
- Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2008 7:30 am
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
Of course ... but John was commenting from a British perspective which is why he referred to The House of Lords. Nothing at all wrong with that.
I think I asked my question incorrectly. I didn't actually want to know why the authorities in any given country decided to abolish the death penalty. Yes I know that is what I asked and that is what it looked like and that is how it was answered ... but I really was asking: "What the hell were they thinking when they abolished the death penalty??
Picture this scene -
Somewhere in Africa where the the vast majority still believe in witchcraft. A businessman is struggling because of the world-wide recession. He pays a visit to the local "sangoma" (shaman, witchdoctor), who throws the bones and then tells him that he has been cursed by some malevolent person.
The sangoma tells the businessman he can brew a "muti" (a potion) for him that will lift the curse and help with "ukuthwala" (accumulation of wealth). The sangoma then recommends certain human body parts as ingredients to be used in brewing the muti. He says the body parts must come from a white girl. So the businessman delegates a gang or hire someone to kill a person and bring the relevant human parts.
Supposing your daughter/grandaughter was abducted and her body was later found on the banks of a river somewhere. Supposing her eyes had been gouged out and her vagina cut away. Supposing she had also been raped.
(Not every Sangoma is like this, but there is a thriving trade in body parts in Africa as we speak.)
And no it didn't happen in my family. But if it ever did, I would execute the people reponsible myself, even if it meant going to prison for the rest of my life.
So if it happened in your family, when the people responsible for such a brutal crime were brought to trial, would you not ask the same question?
I think I asked my question incorrectly. I didn't actually want to know why the authorities in any given country decided to abolish the death penalty. Yes I know that is what I asked and that is what it looked like and that is how it was answered ... but I really was asking: "What the hell were they thinking when they abolished the death penalty??
Picture this scene -
Somewhere in Africa where the the vast majority still believe in witchcraft. A businessman is struggling because of the world-wide recession. He pays a visit to the local "sangoma" (shaman, witchdoctor), who throws the bones and then tells him that he has been cursed by some malevolent person.
The sangoma tells the businessman he can brew a "muti" (a potion) for him that will lift the curse and help with "ukuthwala" (accumulation of wealth). The sangoma then recommends certain human body parts as ingredients to be used in brewing the muti. He says the body parts must come from a white girl. So the businessman delegates a gang or hire someone to kill a person and bring the relevant human parts.
Supposing your daughter/grandaughter was abducted and her body was later found on the banks of a river somewhere. Supposing her eyes had been gouged out and her vagina cut away. Supposing she had also been raped.
(Not every Sangoma is like this, but there is a thriving trade in body parts in Africa as we speak.)
And no it didn't happen in my family. But if it ever did, I would execute the people reponsible myself, even if it meant going to prison for the rest of my life.
So if it happened in your family, when the people responsible for such a brutal crime were brought to trial, would you not ask the same question?
"…I hate how I don’t feel real enough unless people are watching." — Chuck Palahniuk, Invisible Monsters
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
Why not simply start a second thread posing the question as you intended? In the mean time, I suggest permitting this thread to evolve on its own. I personally think this question is a far better one, but that's just me.
“Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities,â€
Voltaire
I have only one thing to do and that's
Be the wave that I am and then
Sink back into the ocean
Fiona Apple
Voltaire
I have only one thing to do and that's
Be the wave that I am and then
Sink back into the ocean
Fiona Apple
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
jones jones;1374510 wrote: I think I asked my question incorrectly. I didn't actually want to know why the authorities in any given country decided to abolish the death penalty. Yes I know that is what I asked and that is what it looked like and that is how it was answered ... but I really was asking: "What the hell were they thinking when they abolished the death penalty??The House of Lords debate answers what they were thinking when they did it too, surely. I can't imagine any other way of finding out other than looking at what they said, or reading a reputable news report of the time, or perhaps a history book.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
spot;1374512 wrote: The House of Lords debate answers what they were thinking when they did it too, surely. I can't imagine any other way of finding out other than looking at what they said, or reading a reputable news report of the time, or perhaps a history book.
from the OP
In some countries it was because of a so called miscarriage of justice when an innocent person went to the gallows. Like how often did that happen? Anyway that was then and now some sixty years later DNA testing has made such mistakes pretty unlikely.
Links please to all the other countries where it was abolished. Actually methinks he was just opening a general discussion or having a wee rant to himself.
from the OP
In some countries it was because of a so called miscarriage of justice when an innocent person went to the gallows. Like how often did that happen? Anyway that was then and now some sixty years later DNA testing has made such mistakes pretty unlikely.
Links please to all the other countries where it was abolished. Actually methinks he was just opening a general discussion or having a wee rant to himself.
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
gmc;1374514 wrote: Links please to all the other countries where it was abolished.The point of choosing this particular debate is, as the Lord Chancellor said, "In all Western Christian democracies, capital punishment is virtually at an end. As your Lordships know, it has been abolished formally in most of the democracies of Western Europe. It has not been formally abolished in Belgium, but there has been no execution for murder since 1863; and it has not formally been abolished in Luxembourg, but there has been no execution for murder since 1822. What, however, is equally significant is the extent to which it is carried out in practice in the very few Western Christian countries where it still exists".
The debate includes the arguments used elsewhere in Europe during the abolition phase. It also makes extensive reference to US practise. Baroness Wooton, for example, noted that "In the United States of America the five States that have the lowest murder rate are the five States that do not use the death penalty. The five States that have the highest murder rate are the five States that do use the death penalty. The inference to be drawn from that, and from the inconclusive figures contained in our own Murder pamphlet, is simply that the incidence of murder is the result of complex social conditions in which the presence or absence of the death penalty plays obviously an insignificant part".
The debate includes the arguments used elsewhere in Europe during the abolition phase. It also makes extensive reference to US practise. Baroness Wooton, for example, noted that "In the United States of America the five States that have the lowest murder rate are the five States that do not use the death penalty. The five States that have the highest murder rate are the five States that do use the death penalty. The inference to be drawn from that, and from the inconclusive figures contained in our own Murder pamphlet, is simply that the incidence of murder is the result of complex social conditions in which the presence or absence of the death penalty plays obviously an insignificant part".
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
jones jones;1374510 wrote: I think I asked my question incorrectly. I didn't actually want to know why the authorities in any given country decided to abolish the death penalty. Yes I know that is what I asked and that is what it looked like and that is how it was answered ... but I really was asking: "What the hell were they thinking when they abolished the death penalty??
Perhaps you blazed right passed my post in your eagerness to tell a story of some mutilated white girl by a tribe of apparent savages that I might add probably makes up of 1% of the world's population(Which tells it's own story but again it's the "blazing past" part we're trying to edit here)
Ah yes, here we are...
jones jones;1374510 wrote: Picture this scene -
Somewhere in Africa where the the vast majority still believe in witchcraft. A businessman is struggling because of the world-wide recession. He pays a visit to the local "sangoma" (shaman, witchdoctor), who throws the bones and then tells him that he has been cursed by some malevolent person.
The sangoma tells the businessman he can brew a "muti" (a potion) for him that will lift the curse and help with "ukuthwala" (accumulation of wealth). The sangoma then recommends certain human body parts as ingredients to be used in brewing the muti. He says the body parts must come from a white girl. So the businessman delegates a gang or hire someone to kill a person and bring the relevant human parts.
Supposing your daughter/grandaughter was abducted and her body was later found on the banks of a river somewhere. Supposing her eyes had been gouged out and her vagina cut away. Supposing she had also been raped.
(Not every Sangoma is like this, but there is a thriving trade in body parts in Africa as we speak.)
And no it didn't happen in my family. But if it ever did, I would execute the people reponsible myself, even if it meant going to prison for the rest of my life.
So if it happened in your family, when the people responsible for such a brutal crime were brought to trial, would you not ask the same question?PROVE IT!
Picture this...
Your next-door neighbor, Ms. Killer(Don't worry about her last name because it's more than irrelevant) only yesterday murdered your entire family...WHAT DO YOU DO? WHAT DO YOU DO?
Run with it...
Perhaps you blazed right passed my post in your eagerness to tell a story of some mutilated white girl by a tribe of apparent savages that I might add probably makes up of 1% of the world's population(Which tells it's own story but again it's the "blazing past" part we're trying to edit here)
Ah yes, here we are...
jones jones;1374510 wrote: Picture this scene -
Somewhere in Africa where the the vast majority still believe in witchcraft. A businessman is struggling because of the world-wide recession. He pays a visit to the local "sangoma" (shaman, witchdoctor), who throws the bones and then tells him that he has been cursed by some malevolent person.
The sangoma tells the businessman he can brew a "muti" (a potion) for him that will lift the curse and help with "ukuthwala" (accumulation of wealth). The sangoma then recommends certain human body parts as ingredients to be used in brewing the muti. He says the body parts must come from a white girl. So the businessman delegates a gang or hire someone to kill a person and bring the relevant human parts.
Supposing your daughter/grandaughter was abducted and her body was later found on the banks of a river somewhere. Supposing her eyes had been gouged out and her vagina cut away. Supposing she had also been raped.
(Not every Sangoma is like this, but there is a thriving trade in body parts in Africa as we speak.)
And no it didn't happen in my family. But if it ever did, I would execute the people reponsible myself, even if it meant going to prison for the rest of my life.
So if it happened in your family, when the people responsible for such a brutal crime were brought to trial, would you not ask the same question?PROVE IT!
Picture this...
Your next-door neighbor, Ms. Killer(Don't worry about her last name because it's more than irrelevant) only yesterday murdered your entire family...WHAT DO YOU DO? WHAT DO YOU DO?
Run with it...
-
jones jones
- Posts: 6601
- Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2008 7:30 am
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
K.Snyder;1374521 wrote: Perhaps you blazed right passed my post in your eagerness to tell a story of some mutilated white girl by a tribe of apparent savages that I might add probably makes up of 1% of the world's population(Which tells it's own story but again it's the "blazing past" part we're trying to edit here)
Ah yes, here we are...
PROVE IT!
Picture this...
Your next-door neighbor, Ms. Killer(Don't worry about her last name because it's more than irrelevant) only yesterday murdered your entire family...WHAT DO YOU DO? WHAT DO YOU DO?
Run with it...
Kevin, Kevin, Kevin ... Tsk, tsk. You are a silly boy.
I know this will put a great dent in your ego, but I "blazed" right past your post simply because I do not find it very stimulating to engage with you. In the main I find your comments sarcastic, childish, inane (lacking sense) and also rather confusing.
You sit in your probably very comfortable home somewhere in Ohio and lable about 75%of Africans as savages. Yes that is the percentage who consult a "Sangoma" on a regular basis.
And "PROVE IT" you shout to me, here in my very modest home on the African continent! I can refer you to any number of "muti" killings that have taken place here.
As for the rest of your reply ... I find it a cross between hyperbole and rhetoric which most likely the meaning thereof, only you will understand.
Take care now and have a very awesome day!
Ah yes, here we are...
PROVE IT!
Picture this...
Your next-door neighbor, Ms. Killer(Don't worry about her last name because it's more than irrelevant) only yesterday murdered your entire family...WHAT DO YOU DO? WHAT DO YOU DO?
Run with it...
Kevin, Kevin, Kevin ... Tsk, tsk. You are a silly boy.
I know this will put a great dent in your ego, but I "blazed" right past your post simply because I do not find it very stimulating to engage with you. In the main I find your comments sarcastic, childish, inane (lacking sense) and also rather confusing.
You sit in your probably very comfortable home somewhere in Ohio and lable about 75%of Africans as savages. Yes that is the percentage who consult a "Sangoma" on a regular basis.
And "PROVE IT" you shout to me, here in my very modest home on the African continent! I can refer you to any number of "muti" killings that have taken place here.
As for the rest of your reply ... I find it a cross between hyperbole and rhetoric which most likely the meaning thereof, only you will understand.
Take care now and have a very awesome day!
"…I hate how I don’t feel real enough unless people are watching." — Chuck Palahniuk, Invisible Monsters
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
I advise people who are going to insist on starting discussions on highly emotional issues to be equipped to handle the emotional fallout from respondents, otherwise the discussion is doomed to deteriorate into what we now see (and saw earlier in this thread). The thread starter needs to step up and remain calm and resist engaging in personal attacks or insults.
The topics are fine, managing them can be difficult, however.
The topics are fine, managing them can be difficult, however.
“Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities,â€
Voltaire
I have only one thing to do and that's
Be the wave that I am and then
Sink back into the ocean
Fiona Apple
Voltaire
I have only one thing to do and that's
Be the wave that I am and then
Sink back into the ocean
Fiona Apple
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
jones jones;1374532 wrote: Kevin, Kevin, Kevin ... Tsk, tsk. You are a silly boy.
I know this will put a great dent in your ego, but I "blazed" right past your post simply because I do not find it very stimulating to engage with you. In the main I find your comments sarcastic, childish, inane (lacking sense) and also rather confusing.
You sit in your probably very comfortable home somewhere in Ohio and lable about 75%of Africans as savages. Yes that is the percentage who consult a "Sangoma" on a regular basis.
And "PROVE IT" you shout to me, here in my very modest home on the African continent! I can refer you to any number of "muti" killings that have taken place here.
As for the rest of your reply ... I find it a cross between hyperbole and rhetoric which most likely the meaning thereof, only you will understand.
Take care now and have a very awesome day!I hadn't asked you to engage with me as I'm entirely uninterested to do nor did I ask you to engage me. I made a distinct observation in which you asked why anyone would abolish the death penalty after having some sort of emotional bout with your ability to be clear in what it is you asked to begin with only for my post to specifically answer the question you initially asked. After having clarified what your true intention is you made it quite clear just how insignificant your logic is.
What is it that your having trouble with in understanding the abolition of the death penalty is a direct answer to "Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?"? regardless whether your question was rhetorical or not? What is the difference between ""What the hell were they thinking when they abolished the death penalty??" and ""Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?"?
While your at it why don't you crawl your way through K.Snyder;1374367 wrote: "Two wrongs don't make a right" is a bit vague. It's not a question of giving the death penalty to one who's guilty but a question of a system being allowed to put to death someone based merely on a case, which I might add does go both ways. If this argument isn't enough to highlight just how everyone entering a courtroom is presumed guilty until proven innocent I don't know what does.
I'm not very sure how much argument you would get out of people when discussing the death penalty in cases one is divinely guilty of murder per say...
The fact is that it's morally wrong to kill another person without feeling immediately concerned of ones own safety, so why should we have a death penalty inside an orchestrated courtroom?
The death penalty should be allowed to be enforced in instances where the enforcer fears for his/her safety at the time, not in a courtroom where the level of bias is so much against the defendant that I'd rather fear the day I'd be charged than the day I'd have to make a decision to kill someone outside the courtroom. and tell me what it is that you find "sarcastic, childish, inane (lacking sense) and also rather confusing"...
It would be appreciated after having been deceived into thinking the creator of the OP was rational enough to hold a sophisticated conversation. Try not to prove me wrong, you can do it
I know this will put a great dent in your ego, but I "blazed" right past your post simply because I do not find it very stimulating to engage with you. In the main I find your comments sarcastic, childish, inane (lacking sense) and also rather confusing.
You sit in your probably very comfortable home somewhere in Ohio and lable about 75%of Africans as savages. Yes that is the percentage who consult a "Sangoma" on a regular basis.
And "PROVE IT" you shout to me, here in my very modest home on the African continent! I can refer you to any number of "muti" killings that have taken place here.
As for the rest of your reply ... I find it a cross between hyperbole and rhetoric which most likely the meaning thereof, only you will understand.
Take care now and have a very awesome day!I hadn't asked you to engage with me as I'm entirely uninterested to do nor did I ask you to engage me. I made a distinct observation in which you asked why anyone would abolish the death penalty after having some sort of emotional bout with your ability to be clear in what it is you asked to begin with only for my post to specifically answer the question you initially asked. After having clarified what your true intention is you made it quite clear just how insignificant your logic is.
What is it that your having trouble with in understanding the abolition of the death penalty is a direct answer to "Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?"? regardless whether your question was rhetorical or not? What is the difference between ""What the hell were they thinking when they abolished the death penalty??" and ""Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?"?
While your at it why don't you crawl your way through K.Snyder;1374367 wrote: "Two wrongs don't make a right" is a bit vague. It's not a question of giving the death penalty to one who's guilty but a question of a system being allowed to put to death someone based merely on a case, which I might add does go both ways. If this argument isn't enough to highlight just how everyone entering a courtroom is presumed guilty until proven innocent I don't know what does.
I'm not very sure how much argument you would get out of people when discussing the death penalty in cases one is divinely guilty of murder per say...
The fact is that it's morally wrong to kill another person without feeling immediately concerned of ones own safety, so why should we have a death penalty inside an orchestrated courtroom?
The death penalty should be allowed to be enforced in instances where the enforcer fears for his/her safety at the time, not in a courtroom where the level of bias is so much against the defendant that I'd rather fear the day I'd be charged than the day I'd have to make a decision to kill someone outside the courtroom. and tell me what it is that you find "sarcastic, childish, inane (lacking sense) and also rather confusing"...
It would be appreciated after having been deceived into thinking the creator of the OP was rational enough to hold a sophisticated conversation. Try not to prove me wrong, you can do it
-
jones jones
- Posts: 6601
- Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2008 7:30 am
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
Ahso!;1374537 wrote: I advise people who are going to insist on starting discussions on highly emotional issues to be equipped to handle the emotional fallout from respondents, otherwise the discussion is doomed to deteriorate into what we now see (and saw earlier in this thread). The thread starter needs to step up and remain calm and resist engaging in personal attacks or insults.
The topics are fine, managing them can be difficult, however.
Boring!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :p
The topics are fine, managing them can be difficult, however.
Boring!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :p
"…I hate how I don’t feel real enough unless people are watching." — Chuck Palahniuk, Invisible Monsters
-
jones jones
- Posts: 6601
- Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2008 7:30 am
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
K.Snyder;1374539 wrote: I hadn't asked you to engage with me as I'm entirely uninterested to do nor did I ask you to engage me. I made a distinct observation in which you asked why anyone would abolish the death penalty after having some sort of emotional bout with your ability to be clear in what it is you asked to begin with only for my post to specifically answer the question you initially asked. After having clarified what your true intention is you made it quite clear just how insignificant your logic is.
What is it that your having trouble with in understanding the abolition of the death penalty is a direct answer to "Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?"? regardless whether your question was rhetorical or not? What is the difference between ""What the hell were they thinking when they abolished the death penalty??" and ""Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?"?
While your at it why don't you crawl your way through and tell me what it is that you find "sarcastic, childish, inane (lacking sense) and also rather confusing"...
It would be appreciated after having been deceived into thinking the creator of the OP was rational enough to hold a sophisticated conversation. Try not to prove me wrong, you can do it
Now this is what I mean Kev old chap, and I quote ....
I hadn't asked you to engage with me as I'm entirely uninterested to do nor did I ask you to engage me. I made a distinct observation in which you asked why anyone would abolish the death penalty after having some sort of emotional bout with your ability to be clear in what it is you asked to begin with only for my post to specifically answer the question you initially asked. After having clarified what your true intention is you made it quite clear just how insignificant your logic is.
And this ...
It would be appreciated after having been deceived into thinking the creator of the OP was rational enough to hold a sophisticated conversation.
Now the above taken directly from your reply is "inane." I haven't an inkling as to what you mean in these two instances.
This I consider sarcastic ... While your at it why don't you crawl your way through ...
While this is all three ... sarcastic, inane and childish ... I hadn't asked you to engage with me as I'm entirely uninterested to do nor did I ask you to engage me.
What is it that your having trouble with in understanding the abolition of the death penalty is a direct answer to "Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?"? regardless whether your question was rhetorical or not? What is the difference between ""What the hell were they thinking when they abolished the death penalty??" and ""Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?"?
While your at it why don't you crawl your way through and tell me what it is that you find "sarcastic, childish, inane (lacking sense) and also rather confusing"...
It would be appreciated after having been deceived into thinking the creator of the OP was rational enough to hold a sophisticated conversation. Try not to prove me wrong, you can do it
Now this is what I mean Kev old chap, and I quote ....
I hadn't asked you to engage with me as I'm entirely uninterested to do nor did I ask you to engage me. I made a distinct observation in which you asked why anyone would abolish the death penalty after having some sort of emotional bout with your ability to be clear in what it is you asked to begin with only for my post to specifically answer the question you initially asked. After having clarified what your true intention is you made it quite clear just how insignificant your logic is.
And this ...
It would be appreciated after having been deceived into thinking the creator of the OP was rational enough to hold a sophisticated conversation.
Now the above taken directly from your reply is "inane." I haven't an inkling as to what you mean in these two instances.
This I consider sarcastic ... While your at it why don't you crawl your way through ...
While this is all three ... sarcastic, inane and childish ... I hadn't asked you to engage with me as I'm entirely uninterested to do nor did I ask you to engage me.
"…I hate how I don’t feel real enough unless people are watching." — Chuck Palahniuk, Invisible Monsters
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
jones jones;1374580 wrote: Now this is what I mean Kev old chap, and I quote ....
I hadn't asked you to engage with me as I'm entirely uninterested to do nor did I ask you to engage me. I made a distinct observation in which you asked why anyone would abolish the death penalty after having some sort of emotional bout with your ability to be clear in what it is you asked to begin with only for my post to specifically answer the question you initially asked. After having clarified what your true intention is you made it quite clear just how insignificant your logic is.
And this ...
It would be appreciated after having been deceived into thinking the creator of the OP was rational enough to hold a sophisticated conversation.
Now the above taken directly from your reply is "inane." I haven't an inkling as to what you mean in these two instances.
This I consider sarcastic ... While your at it why don't you crawl your way through ...
While this is all three ... sarcastic, inane and childish ... I hadn't asked you to engage with me as I'm entirely uninterested to do nor did I ask you to engage me.You're just confused then
Have an awesome night!
I hadn't asked you to engage with me as I'm entirely uninterested to do nor did I ask you to engage me. I made a distinct observation in which you asked why anyone would abolish the death penalty after having some sort of emotional bout with your ability to be clear in what it is you asked to begin with only for my post to specifically answer the question you initially asked. After having clarified what your true intention is you made it quite clear just how insignificant your logic is.
And this ...
It would be appreciated after having been deceived into thinking the creator of the OP was rational enough to hold a sophisticated conversation.
Now the above taken directly from your reply is "inane." I haven't an inkling as to what you mean in these two instances.
This I consider sarcastic ... While your at it why don't you crawl your way through ...
While this is all three ... sarcastic, inane and childish ... I hadn't asked you to engage with me as I'm entirely uninterested to do nor did I ask you to engage me.You're just confused then
Have an awesome night!
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
Hmmmm....and awful lot of engaging going on.:wah:
The Death Penalty has many other sides to it.
Spot's rely of The inference to be drawn from that, and from the inconclusive figures contained in our own Murder pamphlet, is simply that the incidence of murder is the result of complex social conditions in which the presence or absence of the death penalty plays obviously an insignificant part". basically states that the Powers to Be did not see a difference whether their was a death penalty enforced.
Ever stop to think about the other reasons the death penalty may have been dismissed?
Cost is one; due to legal fees and much more it cost more to complete the death penalty then life in prison What about the mistake of putting an innocent person to death not to mention deterrence...does killing one really stop the murder by others.
Not necessary my thoughts....but food for thought.
The Death Penalty has many other sides to it.
Spot's rely of The inference to be drawn from that, and from the inconclusive figures contained in our own Murder pamphlet, is simply that the incidence of murder is the result of complex social conditions in which the presence or absence of the death penalty plays obviously an insignificant part". basically states that the Powers to Be did not see a difference whether their was a death penalty enforced.
Ever stop to think about the other reasons the death penalty may have been dismissed?
Cost is one; due to legal fees and much more it cost more to complete the death penalty then life in prison What about the mistake of putting an innocent person to death not to mention deterrence...does killing one really stop the murder by others.
Not necessary my thoughts....but food for thought.
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
"so called miscarriage of justice"
lol
that's easy to say when it's not you being executed for a crime you didn't commit.
lol
that's easy to say when it's not you being executed for a crime you didn't commit.
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
Ahso!;1374537 wrote: I advise people who are going to insist on starting discussions on highly emotional issues to be equipped to handle the emotional fallout from respondents, otherwise the discussion is doomed to deteriorate into what we now see (and saw earlier in this thread). The thread starter needs to step up and remain calm and resist engaging in personal attacks or insults.
The topics are fine, managing them can be difficult, however.
At least they are taking steps to remove the dummy. If they could also learn not to throw the toys from the pram at the first opportunity that would help as well. Which is what you just said really, but throwing the toys from the pram is such an evocative image don't you think?
The topics are fine, managing them can be difficult, however.
At least they are taking steps to remove the dummy. If they could also learn not to throw the toys from the pram at the first opportunity that would help as well. Which is what you just said really, but throwing the toys from the pram is such an evocative image don't you think?
-
jones jones
- Posts: 6601
- Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2008 7:30 am
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
K.Snyder;1374608 wrote: You're just confused then
Have an awesome night!
Know what Kev? You are absolutely right! :wah:
My night wasn't that awesome though but I guess you can't win 'em all. :-5
Have an awesome night!
Know what Kev? You are absolutely right! :wah:
My night wasn't that awesome though but I guess you can't win 'em all. :-5
"…I hate how I don’t feel real enough unless people are watching." — Chuck Palahniuk, Invisible Monsters
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jones jones
- Posts: 6601
- Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2008 7:30 am
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
gmc;1374621 wrote: At least they are taking steps to remove the dummy. If they could also learn not to throw the toys from the pram at the first opportunity that would help as well. Which is what you just said really, but throwing the toys from the pram is such an evocative image don't you think?
I am quite certain that Ahso & yourself have the best interests of Forum Garden at heart when you make these comments.
However, phrases such as "highly emotional" & "emotional fallout" & "doomed to deteriorate" & "engaging in personal attacks" by the former are simply balderdash, while your own trite reply, tends to give the impression that you believe you are dealing with a kindergarten class. (I know, I know ... I can sense you getting ready to post "Well then stop acting like kids!")
I cannot speak for K. Snyder, but in my own case I consider my interaction with him as good humoured banter and it can by no stretch of the imagination be interpreted as "highly emotional" or as "engaging in personal attacks."
I do not know anything about Kevin other than what is revealed here on these boards so I personally harbor no ill will or malice towards him and I really hope that he feels the same way.
So instead of chiding us as both of you have done, you should be pleased that at least we are making a contribution towards getting some action back on these Boards.
God knows FG needs it.
I am quite certain that Ahso & yourself have the best interests of Forum Garden at heart when you make these comments.
However, phrases such as "highly emotional" & "emotional fallout" & "doomed to deteriorate" & "engaging in personal attacks" by the former are simply balderdash, while your own trite reply, tends to give the impression that you believe you are dealing with a kindergarten class. (I know, I know ... I can sense you getting ready to post "Well then stop acting like kids!")
I cannot speak for K. Snyder, but in my own case I consider my interaction with him as good humoured banter and it can by no stretch of the imagination be interpreted as "highly emotional" or as "engaging in personal attacks."
I do not know anything about Kevin other than what is revealed here on these boards so I personally harbor no ill will or malice towards him and I really hope that he feels the same way.
So instead of chiding us as both of you have done, you should be pleased that at least we are making a contribution towards getting some action back on these Boards.
God knows FG needs it.
"…I hate how I don’t feel real enough unless people are watching." — Chuck Palahniuk, Invisible Monsters
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
I think we're getting somewhere...Let's keep it up...
Let's get back to the thought of murdering people based off of a prosecution's desire to send anyone he/she is pitted against to death row regardless of their own feelings on the case...
Let's get back to the thought of murdering people based off of a prosecution's desire to send anyone he/she is pitted against to death row regardless of their own feelings on the case...
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
The ones that are facing the death penalty and waiting for a stay of execution would be more torture than the actual death, I would think. The death penalty for Ted Bundy seemed appropriate in the fact he did confess to others he had murdered and were not known until his last moment confessions. Also he was proved to be the mass murderer of many young women. If it is proved without doubt these people are guilty and the crime so horrendous, like the Oklahoma City bomber, then it does seem the punishment fits the crime.
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
You find nothing demeaning about causing the death of another person then, Ellie? So long as it's a lawful killing it's no skin off anyone's shoulders?
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
Perhaps it is best to put them down when they prove to be so vicious. It might also be a good idea to find those who bred the vicious ones and put them down too.
“Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities,â€
Voltaire
I have only one thing to do and that's
Be the wave that I am and then
Sink back into the ocean
Fiona Apple
Voltaire
I have only one thing to do and that's
Be the wave that I am and then
Sink back into the ocean
Fiona Apple
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
If you regard some people as people and others as unqualified then you might have a point. If, on the other hand, we're talking about killing people, do you find nothing demeaning about causing the death of another person?
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
spot;1374701 wrote: If you regard some people as people and others as unqualified then you might have a point. If, on the other hand, we're talking about killing people, do you find nothing demeaning about causing the death of another person?Perhaps it's in the genes. For example, we know that the chimp have a tendency to be aggressive and Bonobo to be more playful and loving (in more ways than one).
In the selection process the group must determine who fits and who doesn't. The selection process is already happening in many areas. Perhaps ridding the group of the problem makers is the best moral action to take.
In the selection process the group must determine who fits and who doesn't. The selection process is already happening in many areas. Perhaps ridding the group of the problem makers is the best moral action to take.
“Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities,â€
Voltaire
I have only one thing to do and that's
Be the wave that I am and then
Sink back into the ocean
Fiona Apple
Voltaire
I have only one thing to do and that's
Be the wave that I am and then
Sink back into the ocean
Fiona Apple
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
You appear to have no concept of people, Ahso.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
spot;1374707 wrote: You appear to have no concept of people, Ahso.I don't know what you mean by that. I see people as a species.
“Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities,â€
Voltaire
I have only one thing to do and that's
Be the wave that I am and then
Sink back into the ocean
Fiona Apple
Voltaire
I have only one thing to do and that's
Be the wave that I am and then
Sink back into the ocean
Fiona Apple
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
Ahso!;1374710 wrote: I don't know what you mean by that. I see people as a species.
As do I, and yet you bring other species into the discussion. Do you find nothing demeaning about causing the death of another person?
As do I, and yet you bring other species into the discussion. Do you find nothing demeaning about causing the death of another person?
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
spot;1374696 wrote: You find nothing demeaning about causing the death of another person then, Ellie? So long as it's a lawful killing it's no skin off anyone's shoulders?
No, but then the victims had no choice about dying. It might send a clear message to ones who think killing others doesn't have consequences.
No, but then the victims had no choice about dying. It might send a clear message to ones who think killing others doesn't have consequences.
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
spot;1374715 wrote: As do I, and yet you bring other species into the discussion. Do you find nothing demeaning about causing the death of another person?I don't see a problem with bringing other species into the discussion for the purpose of comparisons. The human species is no more important to anyone other than humans.
Whether or not I find anything demeaning about causing the death of another person is a moral question based on values I'm leaving aside.
Whether or not I find anything demeaning about causing the death of another person is a moral question based on values I'm leaving aside.
“Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities,â€
Voltaire
I have only one thing to do and that's
Be the wave that I am and then
Sink back into the ocean
Fiona Apple
Voltaire
I have only one thing to do and that's
Be the wave that I am and then
Sink back into the ocean
Fiona Apple
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
It's one of several deciding factors as to whether a person would support the death penalty or not, that's why I asked. There are others.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
spot;1374720 wrote: It's one of several deciding factors as to whether a person would support the death penalty or not, that's why I asked. There are others.I agree. I no longer choose at this point of my life to debate within myself the issue of the death penalty as much as view myself and others of my species as any other species is viewed.
Let's face it, we're callous. The debates going on are all purely based on morality, which obviously cannot be comprehended, obeyed or both from a large segment of the population. So my question is: can morality be adopted on a voluntary basis or is it time to give that one up and begin the process of breeding moral humans? That, incidentally, also appears to be the debate going on behind the conscious of nearly everyone I listen to.
Let's face it, we're callous. The debates going on are all purely based on morality, which obviously cannot be comprehended, obeyed or both from a large segment of the population. So my question is: can morality be adopted on a voluntary basis or is it time to give that one up and begin the process of breeding moral humans? That, incidentally, also appears to be the debate going on behind the conscious of nearly everyone I listen to.
“Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities,â€
Voltaire
I have only one thing to do and that's
Be the wave that I am and then
Sink back into the ocean
Fiona Apple
Voltaire
I have only one thing to do and that's
Be the wave that I am and then
Sink back into the ocean
Fiona Apple
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
We currently live with an alternative, it's called Representative Democracy. It involves refusing to allow people to choose their own laws, but instead forcing them to acquiesce in being represented by a volunteer who's pre-selected to have the moral values of one or another political party. The representative then says no to the death penalty on your behalf, regardless of the fact that most of his constituents are baying for it while salivating copiously.
Abandoning this process would involve you in a bloody civil war, by all means give it a try.
Abandoning this process would involve you in a bloody civil war, by all means give it a try.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
You'll find me sitting on the sidelines laughing. I'll wave when the BBC shows up.
“Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities,â€
Voltaire
I have only one thing to do and that's
Be the wave that I am and then
Sink back into the ocean
Fiona Apple
Voltaire
I have only one thing to do and that's
Be the wave that I am and then
Sink back into the ocean
Fiona Apple
-
jones jones
- Posts: 6601
- Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2008 7:30 am
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
Why would it be beneath one's dignity to execute a fiend who had raped, tortured and then murdered and innocent your girl?
Why would it be beneath one's dignity to execute a fiend who raped and killed an 80 year old lady?
Why would it be beneath one's dignity to execute a fiend who murdered a man and then ate his flesh?
On the contrary ... it would be one's duty to execute such a fiend.
Why would it be beneath one's dignity to execute a fiend who raped and killed an 80 year old lady?
Why would it be beneath one's dignity to execute a fiend who murdered a man and then ate his flesh?
On the contrary ... it would be one's duty to execute such a fiend.
"…I hate how I don’t feel real enough unless people are watching." — Chuck Palahniuk, Invisible Monsters
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
You're using "fiend" to avoid using the word "person", JJ. Is this a person we're discussing?
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
-
jones jones
- Posts: 6601
- Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2008 7:30 am
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
spot;1374727 wrote: You're using "fiend" to avoid using the word "person", JJ. Is this a person we're discussing?
It is, but the noun "person" is equated to "human" and I do not consider any earthling capable of such atrocities as a human. Often the word animal is used to describe such fiends, but animals seldom if ever behave in such a manner.
It is, but the noun "person" is equated to "human" and I do not consider any earthling capable of such atrocities as a human. Often the word animal is used to describe such fiends, but animals seldom if ever behave in such a manner.
"…I hate how I don’t feel real enough unless people are watching." — Chuck Palahniuk, Invisible Monsters
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Oscar Namechange
- Posts: 31842
- Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:26 am
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
All the problems associated with the death penalty were down to lack of real evidence and the wrong man being executed. With advancing techniques In DNA and forensics, this In the main can now be avoided. There-fore there Is no debate for the debates prior only debated the subject of wrongly convicted.
Something I do have a problem with TBH In US law ( after watching the marvellous Aphrodite Jones on Discovery Channel ) Is that It appears that In US law, a conviction can be secured on 'All probability' which can Invole circumstantial evidence. In the UK, we have, I believe, 'where there Is any doubt, a verdict of not guilty must be returned.
One of the most Interesting case Aphrodite looked at was the case of Phill Spectre as an example. A conviction It seems was secured by the Jury on 'All probability' but not hard evidence and witness's.
This Is another example of that:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/09/1 ... 63366.html
Something I do have a problem with TBH In US law ( after watching the marvellous Aphrodite Jones on Discovery Channel ) Is that It appears that In US law, a conviction can be secured on 'All probability' which can Invole circumstantial evidence. In the UK, we have, I believe, 'where there Is any doubt, a verdict of not guilty must be returned.
One of the most Interesting case Aphrodite looked at was the case of Phill Spectre as an example. A conviction It seems was secured by the Jury on 'All probability' but not hard evidence and witness's.
This Is another example of that:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/09/1 ... 63366.html
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
oscar;1374730 wrote: All the problems associated with the death penalty were down to lack of real evidence and the wrong man being executed. With advancing techniques In DNA and forensics, this In the main can now be avoided. There-fore there Is no debate for the debates prior only debated the subject of wrongly convicted.
There's a neighbour of mine due to be extradited to South Africa to face trial over allegations that he commissioned the murder of his wife by paying a cab driver to have her killed. In what way is DNA evidence relevant to his case?
There's a neighbour of mine due to be extradited to South Africa to face trial over allegations that he commissioned the murder of his wife by paying a cab driver to have her killed. In what way is DNA evidence relevant to his case?
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
-
jones jones
- Posts: 6601
- Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2008 7:30 am
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
spot;1374732 wrote: There's a neighbour of mine due to be extradited to South Africa to face trial over allegations that he commissioned the murder of his wife by paying a cab driver to have her killed. In what way is DNA evidence relevant to his case?
I do believe that there is a great deal of damning evidence against him. In his case DNA evidence may be irrelevent.
I do believe that there is a great deal of damning evidence against him. In his case DNA evidence may be irrelevent.
"…I hate how I don’t feel real enough unless people are watching." — Chuck Palahniuk, Invisible Monsters
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
jones jones;1374729 wrote: It is, but the noun "person" is equated to "human" and I do not consider any earthling capable of such atrocities as a human. Often the word animal is used to describe such fiends, but animals seldom if ever behave in such a manner.The question is whether or not you could live with yourself after killing another person based off of evidence being presented to you.
Do you believe anything anyone ever tells you? If so then you'd manage to kill off any person being accused before the defense is able to present their case. That's quite alot of trust you place in policing, not everyone agrees and is directly reflected by their distaste for the death penalty.
I don't know why people are so confused into making this a debate about individuals being guilty of a crime before the trial has even begun.
Do you believe anything anyone ever tells you? If so then you'd manage to kill off any person being accused before the defense is able to present their case. That's quite alot of trust you place in policing, not everyone agrees and is directly reflected by their distaste for the death penalty.
I don't know why people are so confused into making this a debate about individuals being guilty of a crime before the trial has even begun.
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jones jones
- Posts: 6601
- Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2008 7:30 am
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
Kev, my point is that when an individual chooses to murder another earthling, they instantly take away every right that person ever possessed. So, why if found guilty after a fair trial, are the murderer's rights so important?
"…I hate how I don’t feel real enough unless people are watching." — Chuck Palahniuk, Invisible Monsters
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
jones jones;1374729 wrote: It is, but the noun "person" is equated to "human" and I do not consider any earthling capable of such atrocities as a human. That sentence is a logical impossibility. If you mean "it is" you can't mean "I do not consider" and vice versa.
Is this a person we're discussing? Or, if you prefer, is this a human being we're discussing? Please don't confuse the issue with "earthling", I have no doubt that word carries overtones what aren't clear to the rest of us.
Is this a person we're discussing? Or, if you prefer, is this a human being we're discussing? Please don't confuse the issue with "earthling", I have no doubt that word carries overtones what aren't clear to the rest of us.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
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jones jones
- Posts: 6601
- Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2008 7:30 am
Why Was The Death Penalty Abolished?
spot;1374736 wrote: That sentence is a logical impossibility. If you mean "it is" you can't mean "I do not consider" and vice versa.
Is this a person we're discussing? Or, if you prefer, is this a human being we're discussing? Please don't confuse the issue with "earthling", I have no doubt that word carries overtones what aren't clear to the rest of us.
Of course its a person we're discussing, only I prefer to call a murderers/rapists and their ilk fiends.
The word "earthling" would surely only carry "overtones" to an alien, so don't you confuse the issue by pretending you don't know what the word means.
Is this a person we're discussing? Or, if you prefer, is this a human being we're discussing? Please don't confuse the issue with "earthling", I have no doubt that word carries overtones what aren't clear to the rest of us.
Of course its a person we're discussing, only I prefer to call a murderers/rapists and their ilk fiends.
The word "earthling" would surely only carry "overtones" to an alien, so don't you confuse the issue by pretending you don't know what the word means.
"…I hate how I don’t feel real enough unless people are watching." — Chuck Palahniuk, Invisible Monsters