"THE DAILY MAIL" 06/09/08
No one can claim that the police were not warned. As Simon Wilson stepped off the plane at Heathrow, senior officers knew they were welcoming one of the most depraved sex offenders Australia has ever known.
The detective who helped put him in jail for killing spinster Joan Randell described him as an uncontrollable freak who should never have been released.
A murderer & serial rapist was deported back to Britain after his release from Jail even though he had spent almost all his life in Australia. Weeks later, Simon Wilson carried out a brutal sex attack on an old age pensioner.
Wison, 50, who emigrated with his family when a toddler, committed a staggering 77 offences in Australia including six rapes & a savage killing.
He was released in January this year after serving 16 years for the murder of spinster Joan Randell & kicked out of the country.
On His return to Britain his case was found not to meet the criteria to put him under any control orders, leaving him free to do whatever or go wherever he pleased.
In April, Wilson attacked a 71 year old woman on her doorstep in central London, slashing her across the face & body as he tried to rape her. She had to be hospitalised for five days & was left so badly injured from the attack that she could lose one of her arms.
Wilson's return is one of a string of recent cases where Australia has sent back British criminals. In 2005, 66 year old Robert Excell returned after spending 37 years in Jail in Australia for a string of child sex offences. Then in March this year prolific paedohile Raymond Horne., 61, was deported from Australia where he had lived for more than 50 years.
Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
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Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
Didn't you used to ship your criminals there? Payback is hell.:rolleyes:
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Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
YZGI;978628 wrote: Didn't you used to ship your criminals there? Payback is hell.:rolleyes:
I put this post up for debate without my opinion to see what people thought. My own opinion is that this is typical of our pathetic government. To be honest, i don't really understand it. I have a friend who emigrated when small with his parents. Now they are gone, he is trying hard to get back to the U.K. but can't because his parents changed their passports when they went. This guy hung on to his from the age of two, now he's back here. He is not alone. He is tech Australian which is why our police could not force him to sign the sex offenders register & moniter him.
Yet, we have the likes of "Abu Hamza" costing ££££'s in jail after repeatedly appealing to the courts against deportation to the U.S.A for links to 9/11.
I hope his elderly victem sue's the arss off our government. Little comfort for her but i hope she brings them to task. If it were my mother, i would be the one in Jail.
I put this post up for debate without my opinion to see what people thought. My own opinion is that this is typical of our pathetic government. To be honest, i don't really understand it. I have a friend who emigrated when small with his parents. Now they are gone, he is trying hard to get back to the U.K. but can't because his parents changed their passports when they went. This guy hung on to his from the age of two, now he's back here. He is not alone. He is tech Australian which is why our police could not force him to sign the sex offenders register & moniter him.
Yet, we have the likes of "Abu Hamza" costing ££££'s in jail after repeatedly appealing to the courts against deportation to the U.S.A for links to 9/11.
I hope his elderly victem sue's the arss off our government. Little comfort for her but i hope she brings them to task. If it were my mother, i would be the one in Jail.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
You'd not call it a policing failure then? You're far too generous.Calling himself Dave Flynn, he rented a £35-a-night room above the Central pub near West Ham's football ground [...] The police and local authorities knew where Wilson was staying but did not have the resources to put him under 24-hour surveillance. Instead, a police liaison officer was instructed to keep tabs on him, most often by telephone.
One female staff member at the Central said the first contact she had with police was a full two months after Wilson arrived. 'A uniformed officer came in and asked whether Dave was behaving himself, whether I had noticed anything strange. I said No. Later I told Dave that the police had turned up and he went mad. I heard him screaming down the phone at his liaison person'.
It seems that it was this 'arm's length' monitoring which allowed Wilson the freedom to attack again.
http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/arti ... article.do
"did not have the resources to put him under 24-hour surveillance"? Lazy incompetents would be a far better description, as usual. I'm sure they didn't have the resources to put him under 24-hour surveillance but what they actually did was nowhere near what good sense dictated they should have done. There's a huge gap between "a police liaison officer was instructed to keep tabs on him, most often by telephone" and 24-hour surveillance. Somewhere in that gap is the good practice which would have been professional.
One female staff member at the Central said the first contact she had with police was a full two months after Wilson arrived. 'A uniformed officer came in and asked whether Dave was behaving himself, whether I had noticed anything strange. I said No. Later I told Dave that the police had turned up and he went mad. I heard him screaming down the phone at his liaison person'.
It seems that it was this 'arm's length' monitoring which allowed Wilson the freedom to attack again.
http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/arti ... article.do
"did not have the resources to put him under 24-hour surveillance"? Lazy incompetents would be a far better description, as usual. I'm sure they didn't have the resources to put him under 24-hour surveillance but what they actually did was nowhere near what good sense dictated they should have done. There's a huge gap between "a police liaison officer was instructed to keep tabs on him, most often by telephone" and 24-hour surveillance. Somewhere in that gap is the good practice which would have been professional.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
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Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
spot;978740 wrote: You'd not call it a policing failure then? You're far too generous.Calling himself Dave Flynn, he rented a £35-a-night room above the Central pub near West Ham's football ground [...] The police and local authorities knew where Wilson was staying but did not have the resources to put him under 24-hour surveillance. Instead, a police liaison officer was instructed to keep tabs on him, most often by telephone.
One female staff member at the Central said the first contact she had with police was a full two months after Wilson arrived. 'A uniformed officer came in and asked whether Dave was behaving himself, whether I had noticed anything strange. I said No. Later I told Dave that the police had turned up and he went mad. I heard him screaming down the phone at his liaison person'.
It seems that it was this 'arm's length' monitoring which allowed Wilson the freedom to attack again.
http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/arti ... article.do
"did not have the resources to put him under 24-hour surveillance"? Lazy incompetents would be a far better description, as usual. I'm sure they didn't have the resources to put him under 24-hour surveillance but what they actually did was nowhere near what good sense dictated they should have done. There's a huge gap between "a police liaison officer was instructed to keep tabs on him, most often by telephone" and 24-hour surveillance. Somewhere in that gap is the good practice which would have been professional. I agree with you Spot. Who ever is to blame, be it the police, at the end of the day, their funding etc comes from government. One will always blame the other. No doubt the poor lady will get a call from Victem support via the police which will make everything all right for her. We live in a pathetic nanny state where the criminal has his "human rights" considered far more than the potential threat of these people. Australia has the balls to kick these people out, why can't we? Because we are too worried that they will sue the police or government for harrassment.
There is another case in "The Sun" where a Schizoprenic who butchered his baby brother at the age of 12 escaped from a charity run psychiatric hospital. He went on to rape a 14 yr old girl twice with a knife. It is said that the hospital allowed him to watch horror & porn movie's. Just before his escape, "Harkin" asked a female member of staff for sex & attacked other members of staff. The hospital waited a full half hour before reporting him missing to police. When they did, they insisted he was no threat. It was the Home Office who approved his transfer from a medium security hospital to the open "Hayes" hospital where he simply walked out.
Disgusting.
One female staff member at the Central said the first contact she had with police was a full two months after Wilson arrived. 'A uniformed officer came in and asked whether Dave was behaving himself, whether I had noticed anything strange. I said No. Later I told Dave that the police had turned up and he went mad. I heard him screaming down the phone at his liaison person'.
It seems that it was this 'arm's length' monitoring which allowed Wilson the freedom to attack again.
http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/arti ... article.do
"did not have the resources to put him under 24-hour surveillance"? Lazy incompetents would be a far better description, as usual. I'm sure they didn't have the resources to put him under 24-hour surveillance but what they actually did was nowhere near what good sense dictated they should have done. There's a huge gap between "a police liaison officer was instructed to keep tabs on him, most often by telephone" and 24-hour surveillance. Somewhere in that gap is the good practice which would have been professional. I agree with you Spot. Who ever is to blame, be it the police, at the end of the day, their funding etc comes from government. One will always blame the other. No doubt the poor lady will get a call from Victem support via the police which will make everything all right for her. We live in a pathetic nanny state where the criminal has his "human rights" considered far more than the potential threat of these people. Australia has the balls to kick these people out, why can't we? Because we are too worried that they will sue the police or government for harrassment.
There is another case in "The Sun" where a Schizoprenic who butchered his baby brother at the age of 12 escaped from a charity run psychiatric hospital. He went on to rape a 14 yr old girl twice with a knife. It is said that the hospital allowed him to watch horror & porn movie's. Just before his escape, "Harkin" asked a female member of staff for sex & attacked other members of staff. The hospital waited a full half hour before reporting him missing to police. When they did, they insisted he was no threat. It was the Home Office who approved his transfer from a medium security hospital to the open "Hayes" hospital where he simply walked out.
Disgusting.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
Disgusting indeed. Locking all convicted criminals and detaining the dangerous insane for as long as they remain a threat to society is a cast-iron solution, you'd have thought. I doubt whether one can blame this Labour Administration for the history in which that policy has been rejected. I can't think of any alternative policy that would be safe for the public.
Meanwhile, the inadequate and tardy rate of detection allows would-be criminals to believe that they can get away with their proposed crimes - and indeed they often can. Policing in the UK is a tragic inept disaster. By all means call for their reform and demand that they improve their performance.
Meanwhile, the inadequate and tardy rate of detection allows would-be criminals to believe that they can get away with their proposed crimes - and indeed they often can. Policing in the UK is a tragic inept disaster. By all means call for their reform and demand that they improve their performance.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
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Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
spot;978856 wrote: Disgusting indeed. Locking all convicted criminals and detaining the dangerous insane for as long as they remain a threat to society is a cast-iron solution, you'd have thought. I doubt whether one can blame this Labour Administration for the history in which that policy has been rejected. I can't think of any alternative policy that would be safe for the public.
Meanwhile, the inadequate and tardy rate of detection allows would-be criminals to believe that they can get away with their proposed crimes - and indeed they often can. Policing in the UK is a tragic inept disaster. By all means call for their reform and demand that they improve their performance. Do you think people such as the two mentioned premeditate these crimes, or are they opportunists? If the later, surely, prison is not the place for them--they need treatment?
Meanwhile, the inadequate and tardy rate of detection allows would-be criminals to believe that they can get away with their proposed crimes - and indeed they often can. Policing in the UK is a tragic inept disaster. By all means call for their reform and demand that they improve their performance. Do you think people such as the two mentioned premeditate these crimes, or are they opportunists? If the later, surely, prison is not the place for them--they need treatment?
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
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Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
fuzzy butt;978949 wrote: That's your law and you have to deal with it. And all he did was live here! He's "Technically" British.
That's too simplicistic a questions . It's a variety of such. That's why there are courts to decide this.
I think you have missed what has actually been said here. If you read all of the post, i said "At least Australia had the balls to kick him out". I don't have to deal with it as i don't have a problem with it. It is actually the British Police & Government that is being critisized, not Australia. What is your problem? You jump at the mere mention of Australia when in fact the country is being praised for doing something that ours won't do.
That's too simplicistic a questions . It's a variety of such. That's why there are courts to decide this.
I think you have missed what has actually been said here. If you read all of the post, i said "At least Australia had the balls to kick him out". I don't have to deal with it as i don't have a problem with it. It is actually the British Police & Government that is being critisized, not Australia. What is your problem? You jump at the mere mention of Australia when in fact the country is being praised for doing something that ours won't do.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
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Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
fuzzy butt;978987 wrote: Oh and we have a few more to send back to you within the next ten years. ENJOY:D
Within ten years the British public will have had their referendum to bring back the death penalty. By all means fuzzy, send them here. As we say here, bring it on!!:sneaky: It begs the question, why are some of the most perverted rapists & murderers living in Australia & not here in the first place? This guy spent 48 of his 50 years in Australia.
Within ten years the British public will have had their referendum to bring back the death penalty. By all means fuzzy, send them here. As we say here, bring it on!!:sneaky: It begs the question, why are some of the most perverted rapists & murderers living in Australia & not here in the first place? This guy spent 48 of his 50 years in Australia.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
I say send them all to the North Pole.
Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
fuzzy butt;979006 wrote: What did the polar bears ever do to deserve that?:wah:
Send them on a never ending boat tour through the icebergs. No people, polar bear, etc. and they can all freeze their a$$'s off forever.
Send them on a never ending boat tour through the icebergs. No people, polar bear, etc. and they can all freeze their a$$'s off forever.
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Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
fuzzy butt;979005 wrote: Because for those that are that way inclined, believe having another country as an outlet is a bonus. They find out very differently though. these people are not usually known for their thinking capacity.
You'll be quite disgusted at the proportion of British men who use this country and others in the Asia region as hunting grounds. They need their "resident" contacts that live within these regions.
The man spent 48 out of 50 years here? So ? He had multiple oportunities to take out citizenship but didn't WHy? Because he needed somewhere to flee to if the need ever arose. Be grateful you got him back in the capacity and way you did . At least he didn't slip through unnoticed.
Please don't insult my intelligence, perverted rapists and murderers live all over the world, including your own country:rolleyes: By the way have you got Garry Glitter back yet? :DDidn't slip through unnoticed??? Are you having a laugh? The man commited 77 offences in Australia. At what point did your authorities realise that this man was a threat? After he murdered some poor old lady? The murder of the lady was so brutal, police claimed he had stamped on her head & face. At least here, even with our pathetic government, the home office would have had him in Broadmoore after about the 5th offence. Even when this guy brutally killed the lady, your authorities let him free within 16 yrs. Comfort for the family & his latest victem no doubt. I started this thread to critisize my own government & police force, not an attack on the Australian Authorities. Since reading your posts, i look at it in a different manner. It now looks like Australia released him early, realising he was likely to kill again & shipped him out. No doubt, if this guy worked during his 48 years in Australia, you would have had the benifit of his taxes.
You'll be quite disgusted at the proportion of British men who use this country and others in the Asia region as hunting grounds. They need their "resident" contacts that live within these regions.
The man spent 48 out of 50 years here? So ? He had multiple oportunities to take out citizenship but didn't WHy? Because he needed somewhere to flee to if the need ever arose. Be grateful you got him back in the capacity and way you did . At least he didn't slip through unnoticed.
Please don't insult my intelligence, perverted rapists and murderers live all over the world, including your own country:rolleyes: By the way have you got Garry Glitter back yet? :DDidn't slip through unnoticed??? Are you having a laugh? The man commited 77 offences in Australia. At what point did your authorities realise that this man was a threat? After he murdered some poor old lady? The murder of the lady was so brutal, police claimed he had stamped on her head & face. At least here, even with our pathetic government, the home office would have had him in Broadmoore after about the 5th offence. Even when this guy brutally killed the lady, your authorities let him free within 16 yrs. Comfort for the family & his latest victem no doubt. I started this thread to critisize my own government & police force, not an attack on the Australian Authorities. Since reading your posts, i look at it in a different manner. It now looks like Australia released him early, realising he was likely to kill again & shipped him out. No doubt, if this guy worked during his 48 years in Australia, you would have had the benifit of his taxes.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
Why can't we just neuter them after a first offence? Jeez, just cutting hands off works in other countries.
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Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
You seem so full of spite & malice fuzzy, Yes, we do have Paul Gadd (Gary Glitter) back. At least with this pervert, he didn't live in Thailand or anywhere else for 48 years. He has never denied being British. He didn't want to return here because he had commited an offence in England, he would have to be put on the sex offenders register & monitered. Your guy lived in Australia for 48 years & commited 77 offences before you put him on a plane. Paul Gadd is a different side of the coin. Our authorities were waiting for the day he was released & had always tried to get him back. Paul Gadd is no doubt a menace to children but let's be fair, he never stamped on an old ladies face, killing her whilst living in Australia.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
oscar;978903 wrote: Do you think people such as the two mentioned premeditate these crimes, or are they opportunists? If the later, surely, prison is not the place for them--they need treatment?
I'm not sure I'd use that distinction to define madness. There's no material benefit to these crimes whether they're premeditated or opportunistic. The only reason they happen is that the offender feels compelled to behave that way. Anyone in that state is obviously a danger to society for as long as they remain at large. I'm doubtful whether any treatment currently exists which would leave them less dangerous than the average unconvicted member of society in which case the only time they could be safely released from preventative detention is when they're too frail to accomplish their desire.
I'm not sure I'd use that distinction to define madness. There's no material benefit to these crimes whether they're premeditated or opportunistic. The only reason they happen is that the offender feels compelled to behave that way. Anyone in that state is obviously a danger to society for as long as they remain at large. I'm doubtful whether any treatment currently exists which would leave them less dangerous than the average unconvicted member of society in which case the only time they could be safely released from preventative detention is when they're too frail to accomplish their desire.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
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Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
Pinky;979767 wrote: Why can't we just neuter them after a first offence? Jeez, just cutting hands off works in other countries. We have another nutter running loose in this country by the name of "Sidney Cook" if i remember correctly. I am sure Spot will know the history of this man & correct me if i'm wrong. Cook was or is a serious danger to children. When he was released from prison, i believe he begged the authorities to castrate him. He admitted that he would probably go on to kill another child. The authorities claimed it would be a breach of his human rights.
We have another nutter running loose in this country by the name of "Sidney Cook" if i remember correctly. I am sure Spot will know the history of this man & correct me if i'm wrong. Cook was or is a serious danger to children. When he was released from prison, i believe he begged the authorities to castrate him. He admitted that he would probably go on to kill another child. The authorities claimed it would be a breach of his human rights.At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
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Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
spot;979782 wrote: I'm not sure I'd use that distinction to define madness. There's no material benefit to these crimes whether they're premeditated or opportunistic. The only reason they happen is that the offender feels compelled to behave that way. Anyone in that state is obviously a danger to society for as long as they remain at large. I'm doubtful whether any treatment currently exists which would leave them less dangerous than the average unconvicted member of society in which case the only time they could be safely released from preventative detention is when they're too frail to accomplish their desire. I agree Spot but does this mean that they are sick as "Sidney Cook" claimed? I remember him saying on his release from prison words to the effect that he was ill & could not control his urges. I believe he begged the authorities for help. I lived a mile down the road in Ferring when Sarah Paine was taken & murdered. I remember the road blockes etc & even had to drive past the site where "Whiting" dumped her body. It is something even people who were not connected to the Paine's will never forget. "Whiting" had snatched & raped a child before. Is he ill or are these people just evil?
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
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Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
qsducks;979000 wrote: I say send them all to the North Pole. very good point. However, in our judicial system, the poor man could sue our government for frostbite as it'd be a breach of his human rights. Gordon Brown, please leave office, preferably today.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
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Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
jimbo;979812 wrote: how about santa's elves would they ot be at risk 
Yes Jimbo, it would breach ELF & safety guide lines:wah:
Yes Jimbo, it would breach ELF & safety guide lines:wah:At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
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Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
oscar;979814 wrote: Yes Jimbo, it would breach ELF & safety guide lines:wah:It would upset the Gnome office as well:wah:
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
oscar;979787 wrote: We have another nutter running loose in this country by the name of "Sidney Cook" if i remember correctly. I am sure Spot will know the history of this man & correct me if i'm wrong. Cook was or is a serious danger to children. When he was released from prison, i believe he begged the authorities to castrate him. He admitted that he would probably go on to kill another child. The authorities claimed it would be a breach of his human rights.
What he did in 1998 when he was released, in order to avoid reoffending, was to ask the police to keep him confined in Yeovil police station where he lived until he was resentenced a year later for other offences from before his first conviction. He's still in jail at the moment. What makes you think he begged the authorities to castrate him? I can't find anything to that effect in the press.
The Independent, April 7, 1998, Health: Can castration cure paedophiles?
No offender has been physically castrated in Britain and permission for such an operation is thought unlikely. Chemical castration, however, can be based on an arrangement between patient and doctor, and just how many men have been treated is not known [...] "Society has an overwhelmingly important interest in keeping our citizens safe from sexual battery, but mandatory chemical castration is a simplistic and ultimately ineffective response to the problems. The complex reasons that impel people to commit sexual battery cannot be eliminated by giving them a shot," says ACLU's Larry Spalding. Some anti-paedophile campaigners favour non reversible physical castration, but doctors opposed to it point out that if chemical castration does not work, neither will surgery, because they are both designed to have the same effect. "If the (hormonal) treatment produces sufficient behaviour change then surgery is clearly unnecessary. If it does not, then castration will not either," writes Professor John Gunn of the Institute of Psychiatry in the British Medical Journal.
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_q ... _n14157110
What he did in 1998 when he was released, in order to avoid reoffending, was to ask the police to keep him confined in Yeovil police station where he lived until he was resentenced a year later for other offences from before his first conviction. He's still in jail at the moment. What makes you think he begged the authorities to castrate him? I can't find anything to that effect in the press.
The Independent, April 7, 1998, Health: Can castration cure paedophiles?
No offender has been physically castrated in Britain and permission for such an operation is thought unlikely. Chemical castration, however, can be based on an arrangement between patient and doctor, and just how many men have been treated is not known [...] "Society has an overwhelmingly important interest in keeping our citizens safe from sexual battery, but mandatory chemical castration is a simplistic and ultimately ineffective response to the problems. The complex reasons that impel people to commit sexual battery cannot be eliminated by giving them a shot," says ACLU's Larry Spalding. Some anti-paedophile campaigners favour non reversible physical castration, but doctors opposed to it point out that if chemical castration does not work, neither will surgery, because they are both designed to have the same effect. "If the (hormonal) treatment produces sufficient behaviour change then surgery is clearly unnecessary. If it does not, then castration will not either," writes Professor John Gunn of the Institute of Psychiatry in the British Medical Journal.
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_q ... _n14157110
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
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Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
spot;979820 wrote: What he did in 1998 when he was released, in order to avoid reoffending, was to ask the police to keep him confined in Yeovil police station where he lived until he was resentenced a year later for other offences from before his first conviction. He's still in jail at the moment. What makes you think he begged the authorities to castrate him? I can't find anything to that effect in the press.
The Independent, April 7, 1998, Health: Can castration cure paedophiles?
No offender has been physically castrated in Britain and permission for such an operation is thought unlikely. Chemical castration, however, can be based on an arrangement between patient and doctor, and just how many men have been treated is not known [...] "Society has an overwhelmingly important interest in keeping our citizens safe from sexual battery, but mandatory chemical castration is a simplistic and ultimately ineffective response to the problems. The complex reasons that impel people to commit sexual battery cannot be eliminated by giving them a shot," says ACLU's Larry Spalding. Some anti-paedophile campaigners favour non reversible physical castration, but doctors opposed to it point out that if chemical castration does not work, neither will surgery, because they are both designed to have the same effect. "If the (hormonal) treatment produces sufficient behaviour change then surgery is clearly unnecessary. If it does not, then castration will not either," writes Professor John Gunn of the Institute of Psychiatry in the British Medical Journal.
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_q ... _n14157110
I did say Spot, that if i was wrong, you would correct me. It was ten years ago now so my memory of him is faded. I do remember something in the paper but it could have been some-one else. I am pleased however, to learn that he is behind bars where he belongs. Thank you for that Spot.
The Independent, April 7, 1998, Health: Can castration cure paedophiles?
No offender has been physically castrated in Britain and permission for such an operation is thought unlikely. Chemical castration, however, can be based on an arrangement between patient and doctor, and just how many men have been treated is not known [...] "Society has an overwhelmingly important interest in keeping our citizens safe from sexual battery, but mandatory chemical castration is a simplistic and ultimately ineffective response to the problems. The complex reasons that impel people to commit sexual battery cannot be eliminated by giving them a shot," says ACLU's Larry Spalding. Some anti-paedophile campaigners favour non reversible physical castration, but doctors opposed to it point out that if chemical castration does not work, neither will surgery, because they are both designed to have the same effect. "If the (hormonal) treatment produces sufficient behaviour change then surgery is clearly unnecessary. If it does not, then castration will not either," writes Professor John Gunn of the Institute of Psychiatry in the British Medical Journal.
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_q ... _n14157110
I did say Spot, that if i was wrong, you would correct me. It was ten years ago now so my memory of him is faded. I do remember something in the paper but it could have been some-one else. I am pleased however, to learn that he is behind bars where he belongs. Thank you for that Spot.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
oscar;979798 wrote: Is he ill or are these people just evil?
I'm sure if their minds were properly balanced it would be impossible for them to act the way they do. Sidney Cooke's a good example of how people end up in his state.DAILY MAIL, April 4, 1998
Cooke, born in rural Gloucestershire, came from a family riddled with incest and abuse, very like that of mass killer Fred West.
The illegitimate son of a farm hand, he was raised by his grandmother, a tyrannical woman, in a one-room house with a bucket for a toilet and a dog chained under the dining table.That's how to make a Sidney Cooke. I'm sure he didn't volunteer for it. I see him as a victim. He didn't choose to be twisted and have his life wrecked. By all means call him evil if that word helps you wash your hands of him but he wouldn't have been if he'd been brought up in a respectable environment.
I'm sure if their minds were properly balanced it would be impossible for them to act the way they do. Sidney Cooke's a good example of how people end up in his state.DAILY MAIL, April 4, 1998
Cooke, born in rural Gloucestershire, came from a family riddled with incest and abuse, very like that of mass killer Fred West.
The illegitimate son of a farm hand, he was raised by his grandmother, a tyrannical woman, in a one-room house with a bucket for a toilet and a dog chained under the dining table.That's how to make a Sidney Cooke. I'm sure he didn't volunteer for it. I see him as a victim. He didn't choose to be twisted and have his life wrecked. By all means call him evil if that word helps you wash your hands of him but he wouldn't have been if he'd been brought up in a respectable environment.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
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Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
spot;979829 wrote: I'm sure if their minds were properly balanced it would be impossible for them to act the way they do. Sidney Cooke's a good example of how people end up in his state.DAILY MAIL, April 4, 1998
Cooke, born in rural Gloucestershire, came from a family riddled with incest and abuse, very like that of mass killer Fred West.
The illegitimate son of a farm hand, he was raised by his grandmother, a tyrannical woman, in a one-room house with a bucket for a toilet and a dog chained under the dining table.That's how to make a Sidney Cooke. I'm sure he didn't volunteer for it. I see him as a victim. He didn't choose to be twisted and have his life wrecked. By all means call him evil if that word helps you wash your hands of him but he wouldn't have been if he'd been brought up in a respectable environment.Again Spot, i agree. I was going to post the question "Do you think these people need pity"? but a little afraid of reaction. I remember seeing Sidney Cooke on television & remember seeing a pathetic old man. I have read a great deal on Fred West but did not know of Cookes history. Having read your post, are you saying that there are early signs with people likely to behave like this later in life, that our authorities could moniter at a far earlier age?
Cooke, born in rural Gloucestershire, came from a family riddled with incest and abuse, very like that of mass killer Fred West.
The illegitimate son of a farm hand, he was raised by his grandmother, a tyrannical woman, in a one-room house with a bucket for a toilet and a dog chained under the dining table.That's how to make a Sidney Cooke. I'm sure he didn't volunteer for it. I see him as a victim. He didn't choose to be twisted and have his life wrecked. By all means call him evil if that word helps you wash your hands of him but he wouldn't have been if he'd been brought up in a respectable environment.Again Spot, i agree. I was going to post the question "Do you think these people need pity"? but a little afraid of reaction. I remember seeing Sidney Cooke on television & remember seeing a pathetic old man. I have read a great deal on Fred West but did not know of Cookes history. Having read your post, are you saying that there are early signs with people likely to behave like this later in life, that our authorities could moniter at a far earlier age?
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
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Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
What became of the Cookes dog?
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
oscar;979843 wrote: Having read your post, are you saying that there are early signs with people likely to behave like this later in life, that our authorities could moniter at a far earlier age?
Given a sufficiently intrusive system of policing the country. I'm all in favour of it. At the same time I'd quite like half the police force to actively monitor the other half to stop them from abusing their increased capability, mind, with prosecutions for all officers who misuse their powers. I'm not so much advocating their increased capability of speedily detecting and prosecuting all offenders, desirable though that would be, as the chance to intervene beforehand and prevent the offences in the first place.
If you have a child being brought up in "a family riddled with incest and abuse" then an adequate police force would put an end to it. I knew a chap years ago whose mother was an enthusiastic coprophiliac who accustomed him to such behaviour and not a day went by in adulthood without his mind dwelling on the past. She completely wrecked his life.
Given a sufficiently intrusive system of policing the country. I'm all in favour of it. At the same time I'd quite like half the police force to actively monitor the other half to stop them from abusing their increased capability, mind, with prosecutions for all officers who misuse their powers. I'm not so much advocating their increased capability of speedily detecting and prosecuting all offenders, desirable though that would be, as the chance to intervene beforehand and prevent the offences in the first place.
If you have a child being brought up in "a family riddled with incest and abuse" then an adequate police force would put an end to it. I knew a chap years ago whose mother was an enthusiastic coprophiliac who accustomed him to such behaviour and not a day went by in adulthood without his mind dwelling on the past. She completely wrecked his life.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
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Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
spot;979852 wrote: Given a sufficiently intrusive system of policing the country. I'm all in favour of it. At the same time I'd quite like half the police force to actively monitor the other half to stop them from abusing their increased capability, mind, with prosecutions for all officers who misuse their powers. I'm not so much advocating their increased capability of speedily detecting and prosecuting all offenders, desirable though that would be, as the chance to intervene beforehand and prevent the offences in the first place.
If you have a child being brought up in "a family riddled with incest and abuse" then an adequate police force would put an end to it. I knew a chap years ago whose mother was an enthusiastic coprophiliac who accustomed him to such behaviour and not a day went by in adulthood without his mind dwelling on the past. She completely wrecked his life. Surely Spot, with the increase of "snooping power" in our government, we have sufficiant welfare services & social workers to spot this kind of thing? I know a fabulous couple have a genuine fall with their toddler. He is actually a police officer. They took the little one to hospital even though it was a non serious bunp to the head & half of the social services were on their case. A ridiculous diversion of power & no common sense.
If you have a child being brought up in "a family riddled with incest and abuse" then an adequate police force would put an end to it. I knew a chap years ago whose mother was an enthusiastic coprophiliac who accustomed him to such behaviour and not a day went by in adulthood without his mind dwelling on the past. She completely wrecked his life. Surely Spot, with the increase of "snooping power" in our government, we have sufficiant welfare services & social workers to spot this kind of thing? I know a fabulous couple have a genuine fall with their toddler. He is actually a police officer. They took the little one to hospital even though it was a non serious bunp to the head & half of the social services were on their case. A ridiculous diversion of power & no common sense.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
oscar;979862 wrote: Surely Spot, with the increase of "snooping power" in our government, we have sufficiant welfare services & social workers to spot this kind of thing? I know a fabulous couple have a genuine fall with their toddler. He is actually a police officer. They took the little one to hospital even though it was a non serious bunp to the head & half of the social services were on their case. A ridiculous diversion of power & no common sense.
What a shame the incompetent jobsworth buggers can't get their act together, isn't it.
What a shame the incompetent jobsworth buggers can't get their act together, isn't it.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
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Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
spot;979911 wrote: What a shame the incompetent jobsworth buggers can't get their act together, isn't it. I sit on the housing commitee Spot. Well i did until i resigned a few weeks ago. I resigned because i have never seen such a waste of resources & manpower. The country is crying out for change & we have to have a four hour meeting about what colour the new leaflets will be. Who gives a ----? Jobsworth in local council do.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
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Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
jimbo;979884 wrote: good very good :wah::wah::wah::wah My husband & i were just sitting here pondering weather all the hype is true & we really were going to get sucked into a man made black hole by "CERN" before midnight. I am a little worried after reading "Angels & Demons" by Dan Brown. Then we saw your post Jimbo. Only you can make me laugh so much in such a serious moment---- You bugger.:wah::wah::wah
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
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Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
spot;979911 wrote: What a shame the incompetent jobsworth buggers can't get their act together, isn't it.
Do you think it right Spot that if these people have spent 48, 50 years in another country since they were 2 yrs old, commited their crimes in another country, that we should take them back to our shores. I'd personally like to see a swop culture. We take one of Australia's for example & we post Abu Hamza back in return??
Do you think it right Spot that if these people have spent 48, 50 years in another country since they were 2 yrs old, commited their crimes in another country, that we should take them back to our shores. I'd personally like to see a swop culture. We take one of Australia's for example & we post Abu Hamza back in return??
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
oscar;980166 wrote: Do you think it right Spot that if these people have spent 48, 50 years in another country since they were 2 yrs old, commited their crimes in another country, that we should take them back to our shores. I'd personally like to see a swop culture. We take one of Australia's for example & we post Abu Hamza back in return??
British citizen - British problem.
But then, British citizen - British jail.
It cannot be argued both ways at the same time.
British citizen - British problem.
But then, British citizen - British jail.
It cannot be argued both ways at the same time.
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Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
Bryn Mawr;980174 wrote: British citizen - British problem.
But then, British citizen - British jail.
It cannot be argued both ways at the same time. True, but let's say this was a law abiding citizen until 16 yrs ago when he murdered Joan Randall & held down a good job? Australia would have had 32 years of this mans taxes in their government. They would happily take that money but the moment they don't know what to do with him any more, they ship him out on a tech. He committed 77 offences for goodness sake. At what point did the Australians find he was undisirable? When, they no longer knew what to do with him. Enter Great Britain. Even Jack Straw would be looking at deportation after 2 or 3 offences. Why did Australia let him commit 77 offences inc 6 rapes on their soil & did nothing until he murdered an old lady? Even our police are not that dim? Oh i don't know though.
But then, British citizen - British jail.
It cannot be argued both ways at the same time. True, but let's say this was a law abiding citizen until 16 yrs ago when he murdered Joan Randall & held down a good job? Australia would have had 32 years of this mans taxes in their government. They would happily take that money but the moment they don't know what to do with him any more, they ship him out on a tech. He committed 77 offences for goodness sake. At what point did the Australians find he was undisirable? When, they no longer knew what to do with him. Enter Great Britain. Even Jack Straw would be looking at deportation after 2 or 3 offences. Why did Australia let him commit 77 offences inc 6 rapes on their soil & did nothing until he murdered an old lady? Even our police are not that dim? Oh i don't know though.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
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Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
oscar;980159 wrote: My husband & i were just sitting here pondering weather all the hype is true & we really were going to get sucked into a man made black hole by "CERN" before midnight. I am a little worried after reading "Angels & Demons" by Dan Brown. Then we saw your post Jimbo. Only you can make me laugh so much in such a serious moment---- You bugger.:wah::wah::wah It's midnight here in blighty & i am not being sucked into a black hole. Is any one else??
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
oscar;980186 wrote: It's midnight here in blighty & i am not being sucked into a black hole. Is any one else??
CERN only ran packets round their rings at idling speeds yesterday, they've not pushed up to high power collisions yet. What they proved is that their pipes were clear of obstructions and had the expected bends at the right places. And that all their magnets worked. Black holes, if any, will be nearer Christmas.
CERN only ran packets round their rings at idling speeds yesterday, they've not pushed up to high power collisions yet. What they proved is that their pipes were clear of obstructions and had the expected bends at the right places. And that all their magnets worked. Black holes, if any, will be nearer Christmas.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
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Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
spot;980377 wrote: CERN only ran packets round their rings at idling speeds yesterday, they've not pushed up to high power collisions yet. What they proved is that their pipes were clear of obstructions and had the expected bends at the right places. And that all their magnets worked. Black holes, if any, will be nearer Christmas. I have not read much about this yet & i don't have alot of spare time to google, but in light of "Dan Brown's" novel, i find it all rather scarey.
Have you read "Angels & Demons" Spot? What did you think of it? I think his research is amazing & i look forward to the film i believe they are shooting as we speak. Do i have this right? CERN are going to send particles of matter in opposite directions to create anti-matter that will re-construct the big bang theory? :-3:-3
Have you read "Angels & Demons" Spot? What did you think of it? I think his research is amazing & i look forward to the film i believe they are shooting as we speak. Do i have this right? CERN are going to send particles of matter in opposite directions to create anti-matter that will re-construct the big bang theory? :-3:-3
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
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Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
fuzzy butt;980475 wrote: You know I've read all your insinuations etc. .......and i just shake my head . You have no idea of the justice system of this country or your own.
Only an idiot would think to use a figure as an arguement , with a personal attack to boot .
I'm allowed to say , under my freedoms , that I have worked and befriended one of his victims and to use them as to make a snide point, or an insinuation about me is well under the belt . Quite frankly you're just a whinging so n so . And you have no idea what you've written, or how it could be read or interpreted to those who actually are victims of sexual abuse and rape .. You want to make a point about convicted criminals but fail to see how that may effect people when it comes up in a search engine . Frankly you're a blight on society and the world and you have no idea outside your own lounge room. I feel sad for you , you are a convicted criminal yourself You yourself joined these ranks by your own choice....what you've written is just sad.
Aren't you lucky to have DNA and other scientific testing in your current little world? does it make you feel safe? Gadd will have a lot more come to him and unfortunetly it will be from your own country ................................don't you feel sad about that? or will you use it or deny it to prove a point on this forum .
I would like to inform others on this forum that you are talking to TWO people not one member on this forum when you reply to ..."Oscar" so if you're confused by the posts this may be why.
Just a couple of idiots that wanted to join the criminal ranks and have to justify their ligitimate cause to seperate themselves from other criminals. And they will use their government as their excuse.
It's simply sad .
As far as slipping into your country unnoticed..........................don't you get it idiot . He got to 78 noticed . he could have got to a lot more than that ..................AAAAAHHHh you're not intelligent I have no time for you, you're just an idiot!
Don't bother sending the message spot . it will just clog up my inbox.!!!!! Just send it straight through to the other area. Your Authorities allowed him to commit 77 offences before doing something about him??? 6 rapes?? That's o.k in your country is it? Finally i understand why these depraved sex offenders live in your country for most of there lives. It must be a push over.
For the record, people in this country may dispise Paul Gadd as he seems to have a problem with sex with under age girls. Our government or police are not stupid enough to let him rack up 77 offences & leave him to get on with it. I may critisize our government & police but good god, compared to yours, it beggers belief. This thread began as a critisism of British Police & government. It is you that is full of spite & malice from the beginning & has turned it in on your own country. "Me thinks the lady doth protest too much".
Only an idiot would think to use a figure as an arguement , with a personal attack to boot .
I'm allowed to say , under my freedoms , that I have worked and befriended one of his victims and to use them as to make a snide point, or an insinuation about me is well under the belt . Quite frankly you're just a whinging so n so . And you have no idea what you've written, or how it could be read or interpreted to those who actually are victims of sexual abuse and rape .. You want to make a point about convicted criminals but fail to see how that may effect people when it comes up in a search engine . Frankly you're a blight on society and the world and you have no idea outside your own lounge room. I feel sad for you , you are a convicted criminal yourself You yourself joined these ranks by your own choice....what you've written is just sad.
Aren't you lucky to have DNA and other scientific testing in your current little world? does it make you feel safe? Gadd will have a lot more come to him and unfortunetly it will be from your own country ................................don't you feel sad about that? or will you use it or deny it to prove a point on this forum .
I would like to inform others on this forum that you are talking to TWO people not one member on this forum when you reply to ..."Oscar" so if you're confused by the posts this may be why.
Just a couple of idiots that wanted to join the criminal ranks and have to justify their ligitimate cause to seperate themselves from other criminals. And they will use their government as their excuse.
It's simply sad .
As far as slipping into your country unnoticed..........................don't you get it idiot . He got to 78 noticed . he could have got to a lot more than that ..................AAAAAHHHh you're not intelligent I have no time for you, you're just an idiot!
Don't bother sending the message spot . it will just clog up my inbox.!!!!! Just send it straight through to the other area. Your Authorities allowed him to commit 77 offences before doing something about him??? 6 rapes?? That's o.k in your country is it? Finally i understand why these depraved sex offenders live in your country for most of there lives. It must be a push over.
For the record, people in this country may dispise Paul Gadd as he seems to have a problem with sex with under age girls. Our government or police are not stupid enough to let him rack up 77 offences & leave him to get on with it. I may critisize our government & police but good god, compared to yours, it beggers belief. This thread began as a critisism of British Police & government. It is you that is full of spite & malice from the beginning & has turned it in on your own country. "Me thinks the lady doth protest too much".
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
oscar;980510 wrote: I have not read much about this yet & i don't have alot of spare time to google, but in light of "Dan Brown's" novel, i find it all rather scarey.
Have you read "Angels & Demons" Spot? What did you think of it? I think his research is amazing & i look forward to the film i believe they are shooting as we speak. Do i have this right? CERN are going to send particles of matter in opposite directions to create anti-matter that will re-construct the big bang theory? :-3:-3
There's no created antimatter anywhere near the Large Hadron Collider, it's just ionized elements being hit against each other. Anything from Hydrogen to Lead (they being Hadrons).
The energy pumped into the LHC beam, though, is impressive. It takes a volume of hydrogen which at normal temperature and pressure is the size of a grain of sand and accelerates it so much that if it hit a wall it would dump the same energy as you'd get from exploding of the order of 100kg of TNT. I find that an astonishing detail.
As far as antimatter goes, if all the antimatter ever created by all the scientists on the planet in all the colliders ever built were put into the same pot, and annihilated by allowing it to touch real matter, the amount of energy released would be enough to run a lightbulb for less than a day[1]. As far as science content goes, Angels & Demons is a pile of dingoes kidneys. As is the notion of the CERN-generated black hole destroying the planet.
What the experiment is doing is creating inside their detector a small area which is as hot as the universe was shortly after the big bang. Two particles hit each other, neither survives, all that's left is a lot of very dense energy which rapidly switches through a cascade of forms of matter as it cools. The detector photographs evidence of what forms of matter show up in the collapse of the energy hotspot. The hope is that a rather heavy one puts in an appearance - the Higgs Boson - which nobody's ever seen so far because it needs more energy in one place to make it than people have had available before. It'll only be visible as a further succession of decay particles but it will have been there by implication if the appropriate fragments are photographed.
[1]: Anything from a half hour to ten hours, depending on who you ask. "The antimatter produced each year at Cern could power a 100 watt light bulb for just 15 minutes" is the BBC version. "If we could assemble all the antimatter we've ever made at CERN and annihilate it with matter, we would have enough energy to light a single electric light bulb for a few minutes" is CERN's.
Have you read "Angels & Demons" Spot? What did you think of it? I think his research is amazing & i look forward to the film i believe they are shooting as we speak. Do i have this right? CERN are going to send particles of matter in opposite directions to create anti-matter that will re-construct the big bang theory? :-3:-3
There's no created antimatter anywhere near the Large Hadron Collider, it's just ionized elements being hit against each other. Anything from Hydrogen to Lead (they being Hadrons).
The energy pumped into the LHC beam, though, is impressive. It takes a volume of hydrogen which at normal temperature and pressure is the size of a grain of sand and accelerates it so much that if it hit a wall it would dump the same energy as you'd get from exploding of the order of 100kg of TNT. I find that an astonishing detail.
As far as antimatter goes, if all the antimatter ever created by all the scientists on the planet in all the colliders ever built were put into the same pot, and annihilated by allowing it to touch real matter, the amount of energy released would be enough to run a lightbulb for less than a day[1]. As far as science content goes, Angels & Demons is a pile of dingoes kidneys. As is the notion of the CERN-generated black hole destroying the planet.
What the experiment is doing is creating inside their detector a small area which is as hot as the universe was shortly after the big bang. Two particles hit each other, neither survives, all that's left is a lot of very dense energy which rapidly switches through a cascade of forms of matter as it cools. The detector photographs evidence of what forms of matter show up in the collapse of the energy hotspot. The hope is that a rather heavy one puts in an appearance - the Higgs Boson - which nobody's ever seen so far because it needs more energy in one place to make it than people have had available before. It'll only be visible as a further succession of decay particles but it will have been there by implication if the appropriate fragments are photographed.
[1]: Anything from a half hour to ten hours, depending on who you ask. "The antimatter produced each year at Cern could power a 100 watt light bulb for just 15 minutes" is the BBC version. "If we could assemble all the antimatter we've ever made at CERN and annihilate it with matter, we would have enough energy to light a single electric light bulb for a few minutes" is CERN's.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
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Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
Thanks for that Spot. I must admit that i don't understand it all. You know how the "Daily Mail" is--YOUR ALL GOING TO DIE type headlines. Will this energy be used for potential power? I respect your opinion of Dan Browns book but is he correct in that this power could be used by terrorists if it got into the wrong hands, or is the whole book complete fiction, dispite his research? I need to know before buying any xmas presents.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
oscar;980572 wrote: Will this energy be used for potential power? I respect your opinion of Dan Browns book but is he correct in that this power could be used by terrorists if it got into the wrong handsThink of a pot of antimatter as a charged battery. Energy's been put in and stored before it can be touched to normal matter and switched back to energy in an explosion. It's a very inefficient wasteful battery, it takes a billion times more energy to create antimatter than you get back in the bang ("The inefficiency of antimatter production is enormous: you get only a tenth of a billion of the invested energy back: CERN"). So, being an illimitable supply of energy for potential power's not an option, it's just a horrifyingly inefficient way that energy could be stored in a small space. It's a fuel to the same extent that a battery's fuel.
The bit about a half gram of antimatter giving an explosion as big as the Hiroshima bomb is true. Problem One: A half gram of antimatter would take CERN two thousand million years to create at their current rate so the idea that you can steal bomb-quantities from CERN is fiction.
Problem Two: The idea that you can shield antimatter from matter in something that could look like a toy balloon is false as well. The only known bottles to hold antimatter are made of very strong electromagnetic fields shaped to spin the contents back inside the confined space if they try to get out. You need magnets the size of rooms to achieve it. There doesn't exist a material that can form a wall between matter and antimatter and keep them apart.
A sixteen year old girl committed suicide yesterday in India because she believed the black hole doom-story she saw on the village TV and drank poison rather than watch her friends die. Frenzied headlines are money soaked in blood.
The bit about a half gram of antimatter giving an explosion as big as the Hiroshima bomb is true. Problem One: A half gram of antimatter would take CERN two thousand million years to create at their current rate so the idea that you can steal bomb-quantities from CERN is fiction.
Problem Two: The idea that you can shield antimatter from matter in something that could look like a toy balloon is false as well. The only known bottles to hold antimatter are made of very strong electromagnetic fields shaped to spin the contents back inside the confined space if they try to get out. You need magnets the size of rooms to achieve it. There doesn't exist a material that can form a wall between matter and antimatter and keep them apart.
A sixteen year old girl committed suicide yesterday in India because she believed the black hole doom-story she saw on the village TV and drank poison rather than watch her friends die. Frenzied headlines are money soaked in blood.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
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Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
spot;980658 wrote: Think of a pot of antimatter as a charged battery. Energy's been put in and stored before it can be touched to normal matter and switched back to energy in an explosion. It's a very inefficient wasteful battery, it takes a billion times more energy to create antimatter than you get back in the bang ("The inefficiency of antimatter production is enormous: you get only a tenth of a billion of the invested energy back: CERN"). So, being an illimitable supply of energy for potential power's not an option, it's just a horrifyingly inefficient way that energy could be stored in a small space. It's a fuel to the same extent that a battery's fuel.
The bit about a half gram of antimatter giving an explosion as big as the Hiroshima bomb is true. Problem One: A half gram of antimatter would take CERN two thousand million years to create at their current rate so the idea that you can steal bomb-quantities from CERN is fiction.
Problem Two: The idea that you can shield antimatter from matter in something that could look like a toy balloon is false as well. The only known bottles to hold antimatter are made of very strong electromagnetic fields shaped to spin the contents back inside the confined space if they try to get out. You need magnets the size of rooms to achieve it. There doesn't exist a material that can form a wall between matter and antimatter and keep them apart.
A sixteen year old girl committed suicide yesterday in India because she believed the black hole doom-story she saw on the village TV and drank poison rather than watch her friends die. Frenzied headlines are money soaked in blood. If it's fuel to the extent of a battery, what is the point of it?? Nuclear Physics is not a strong point with me & i have to admit that i'm trying to understand. If there is really a possibility of black holes nearer xmas, What would be the likely effects? The girl in India is awfull. I take most of the frenzied headlines with a large dose of salt but there is always an element of truth in there somewhere which is worrying.
The bit about a half gram of antimatter giving an explosion as big as the Hiroshima bomb is true. Problem One: A half gram of antimatter would take CERN two thousand million years to create at their current rate so the idea that you can steal bomb-quantities from CERN is fiction.
Problem Two: The idea that you can shield antimatter from matter in something that could look like a toy balloon is false as well. The only known bottles to hold antimatter are made of very strong electromagnetic fields shaped to spin the contents back inside the confined space if they try to get out. You need magnets the size of rooms to achieve it. There doesn't exist a material that can form a wall between matter and antimatter and keep them apart.
A sixteen year old girl committed suicide yesterday in India because she believed the black hole doom-story she saw on the village TV and drank poison rather than watch her friends die. Frenzied headlines are money soaked in blood. If it's fuel to the extent of a battery, what is the point of it?? Nuclear Physics is not a strong point with me & i have to admit that i'm trying to understand. If there is really a possibility of black holes nearer xmas, What would be the likely effects? The girl in India is awfull. I take most of the frenzied headlines with a large dose of salt but there is always an element of truth in there somewhere which is worrying.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Australia Sent This Murdering Rapist Back To Britain. 3 Months Later, He Struck Again
oscar;980750 wrote: If it's fuel to the extent of a battery, what is the point of it?? Nuclear Physics is not a strong point with me & i have to admit that i'm trying to understand. If there is really a possibility of black holes nearer xmas, What would be the likely effects? The girl in India is awfull. I take most of the frenzied headlines with a large dose of salt but there is always an element of truth in there somewhere which is worrying.
The point of making and storing antimatter is that it can release a high density of energy near a detector whenever you want it to. It's like having a microscope capable of looking inside a smaller space than that of an atom. You can't do it with light, that's not energetic enough. You need a very small bundle of energy with a lot more fizz. A matter-antimatter collision has that.
The element of truth in there somewhere about a black hole is that if you put a black hole inside the Earth there's a size limit below which the black hole would evaporate and above which it would grow. It might be billions of tons, it might be a ton, it might be a gram, who knows. What it isn't is a black hole the mass of a few protons. A black hole created by the energies CERN has available is well into the immediate evaporation size and that's assuming it could be made in the first place.
If a black hole small enough not to tear the planet apart by gravitational forces but big enough to be capable of growing inside the Earth were to go into a decaying orbit around the planet and ended up inside it then eventually, at some point, the planet would be completely eaten. Nobody's ever seen or detected any such black hole anywhere in the universe. It's just one of those things where if it happens people will be very unlucky. The good news is that it's not happened to the planet any time in the last four billion years so it's good odds we're not going to have it happen any time soon.
The point of making and storing antimatter is that it can release a high density of energy near a detector whenever you want it to. It's like having a microscope capable of looking inside a smaller space than that of an atom. You can't do it with light, that's not energetic enough. You need a very small bundle of energy with a lot more fizz. A matter-antimatter collision has that.The element of truth in there somewhere about a black hole is that if you put a black hole inside the Earth there's a size limit below which the black hole would evaporate and above which it would grow. It might be billions of tons, it might be a ton, it might be a gram, who knows. What it isn't is a black hole the mass of a few protons. A black hole created by the energies CERN has available is well into the immediate evaporation size and that's assuming it could be made in the first place.
If a black hole small enough not to tear the planet apart by gravitational forces but big enough to be capable of growing inside the Earth were to go into a decaying orbit around the planet and ended up inside it then eventually, at some point, the planet would be completely eaten. Nobody's ever seen or detected any such black hole anywhere in the universe. It's just one of those things where if it happens people will be very unlucky. The good news is that it's not happened to the planet any time in the last four billion years so it's good odds we're not going to have it happen any time soon.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.