US Downgraded From Full Democracy to Flawed Democracy

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Fri Jan 27, 2017 8:06 am

Not because of Trump. It's been headed that way for decades.

While this is in actuality an embarrassment (especially since America touts itself as the number one democracy in the world), there's a certain note of comfort that we're in the same class as Japan, only behind it and tied with Italy.

The United Sates was downgraded from "full democracy" to "flawed democracy" in the 2016 Democracy Index, which cites declining trust in the government as the cause of its new rating.

The report is the Economist Intelligence Unit's ninth annual Democracy Index, which looks at the state of governments across the world. In 2016, the number of "full democracies" dropped from 20 to 19.

The United States' downgrade puts it at 21 in the international rankings, below Japan and tied with Italy.

US no longer considered 'full democracy,' group says | TheHill

Post by **LarsMac** » Fri Jan 27, 2017 8:28 am

US has never been a "Full Democracy"

And it's been flawed for a long time.

However, it has been, until recently a fairly functional republic.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Fri Jan 27, 2017 12:08 pm

LarsMac;1505926 wrote: US has never been a "Full Democracy"

And it's been flawed for a long time.

However, it has been, until recently a fairly functional republic.

That's a quite literal reading.

Post by **LarsMac** » Fri Jan 27, 2017 12:24 pm

Ahso!;1505930 wrote: That's a quite literal reading.

Reading of what?

The article you linked to?

Didn't read it. They want me to register, agree to their terms, and log in to read their white paper, which presumes there is such a thing as a Full Democracy, and the the US has been one for some unspecified period of time.

My comment was completely independent of whatever that whitepaper may have to say.

By definition, I would presume that a "Full Democracy" would entail an active participation in the process of governing, or selecting representatives to do so, by a significant majority of the citizens of the nation. Statistics indicate that that has not been the case since at least the beginning the 20th Century.

And the current president is not at all unique in being elected by a minority of the qualified electorate.

So, perhaps we could try to figure out exactly when we actually qualified for the designation of a Full Democracy to begin with?

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Fri Jan 27, 2017 12:44 pm

My point is that the contents of the thread are within the context of the article, which is based on the white paper. I went ahead and signed up to read the paper before posting the thread. I understand if anyone else might be hesitant to do what I did.

This is the wiki article on The Democracy Index and how its conclusions are achieved in case anyone might be interested. The wiki article also offers much of the pertinent information located in the white paper.

Classification definitions[edit]

Full democracies are nations where civil liberties and basic political freedoms are not only respected, but also reinforced by a political culture conducive to the thriving of democratic principles. These nations have a valid system of governmental checks and balances, independent judiciary whose decisions are enforced, governments which function adequately, and media which is diverse and independent. These nations have only limited problems in democratic functioning.[6]

Flawed democracies are nations where elections are fair and free and basic civil liberties are honored but may have issues (e.g. media freedom infringement). Nonetheless, these nations have significant faults in other democratic aspects, including underdeveloped political culture, low levels of participation in politics, and issues in the functioning of governance.[6]

Hybrid regimes are nations where consequential irregularities exist in elections regularly preventing them from being fair and free. These nations commonly have governments which apply pressure on political opponents, non independent judiciaries, widespread corruption, harassment and pressure placed on the media, anemic rule of law, and more pronounced faults than flawed democracies in the realms of underdeveloped political culture, low levels of participation in politics, and issues in the functioning of governance.[6]

Authoritarian regimes are nations where political pluralism has vanished or is extremely limited. These nations are often absolute dictatorships, may have some conventional institutions of democracy- but with meager significance, infringements and abuses of civil liberties are commonplace, elections- if they take place- are not fair and free, the media is often state-owned or controlled by groups associated with the ruling regime, the judiciary is not independent, and the presence of omnipresent censorship and suppression of governmental criticism.[6]

Bruv · Post by **Bruv** » Fri Jan 27, 2017 1:19 pm

I think THIS is the white paper and HERE is the frightening map of the free world.

Funny times we live in.

magentaflame · Post by **magentaflame** » Fri Jan 27, 2017 1:26 pm

hmmph...... I wish they didn't publish this information.

Post by **LarsMac** » Fri Jan 27, 2017 2:23 pm

Ahso!;1505932 wrote: My point is that the contents of the thread are within the context of the article, which is based on the white paper. I went ahead and signed up to read the paper before posting the thread. I understand if anyone else might be hesitant to do what I did.

This is the wiki article on The Democracy Index and how its conclusions are achieved in case anyone might be interested. The wiki article also offers much of the pertinent information located in the white paper.

Thank you.

Well, then. I stand by my first post. Though there is a possibility that "never" may be a stretch.

Of course, Democracy by its very nature is a bit flawed.

Unfortunately, the US may well slip rapidly down the scale if things continue they way they have been going the last week or so.

gmc · Post by **gmc** » Sat Jan 28, 2017 2:36 pm

Actrually i don't think americans will sit back and let it happen. Extreme Right wing or left wing or extreme governments only last as long as it takes the majority of citizens to get pissed off enogh to throw them out. All that keeps them in power is ouitside forces that they can blame and use to justuify their extremes. Fior trumop toi last or get relected an awfe=ul lot of americans will need to sit back and do nothing.

magentaflame · Post by **magentaflame** » Sat Jan 28, 2017 8:57 pm

Woohoo!!!!! Australia wins with 98%

But in saying that if what we have is full democracy, then I"d hate to see the others.

Post by **LarsMac** » Sat Jan 28, 2017 9:09 pm

I am encouraged by some of the reactions to several of the Executive actions.

A Federal Court just blocked the "Muslim Ban" from interrupting the trips of a number of legal Residents. It will be interesting to see how all of this plays out.

I think he is testing the waters to see how many people are really paying attention.

I do hope that he comes to his senses, soon.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Sun Jan 29, 2017 6:05 am

I'm not certain Trump minds the judicial interruption in reality - he needs put on a show for his supporters. My guess would be that in his mind Trump needs to hold on to his small, yet very active and engaged supporters until his decisions begin to have a positive effect on how the government is run. His supporters are the key in dragging whatever republican lawmakers are weak-kneed along before the infatuation wears off - which it will, and is what less nervous republicans are waiting for.

Post by **LarsMac** » Sun Jan 29, 2017 8:48 am

Ahso!;1506021 wrote: I'm not certain Trump minds the judicial interruption in reality - he needs put on a show for his supporters. My guess would be that in his mind Trump needs to hold on to his small, yet very active and engaged supporters until his decisions begin to have a positive effect on how the government is run. His supporters are the key in dragging whatever republican lawmakers are weak-kneed along before the infatuation wears off - which it will, and is what less nervous republicans are waiting for.

He kinda reminds me of the the old story about the young boy at the circus entertaining himself with poking a circus bear in a cage with a stick, and giggling with delight every time the bear roars in frustration.

Bruv · Post by **Bruv** » Sun Jan 29, 2017 10:49 am

It would seem the British don't want the man to be allowed a State Visit and have to shake our Queens hand with the same hand he has been grabbing lady parts,allegedly.

Trump State visit Petition

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Mon Jan 30, 2017 8:32 am

It looks like Trump is kissing up to the neocons by leaving Saudia Arabia off his ban list. Is he negotiating something behind the scenes? I've read where he's beginning to try and make amends here and there.

If so, there goes the revolution.

Post by **LarsMac** » Mon Jan 30, 2017 8:42 am

Ahso!;1506021 wrote: I'm not certain Trump minds the judicial interruption in reality - he needs put on a show for his supporters. My guess would be that in his mind Trump needs to hold on to his small, yet very active and engaged supporters until his decisions begin to have a positive effect on how the government is run. His supporters are the key in dragging whatever republican lawmakers are weak-kneed along before the infatuation wears off - which it will, and is what less nervous republicans are waiting for.

I've heard from several of his supporters. It is frightening. They completely overlook the details, of his mess and simply hang on to "A politician that keeps his promises."

I ask for details on exactly what promises he has kept, and the point to the wall. "He's gonna build the wall."

"Who's going to pay for it?" I ask.

"Oh, he says that Mexico will pay."

Sheeeesh!

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Mon Jan 30, 2017 11:43 am

That there is some huge and used hands lady liberty has. Not very attractive to the average male. But I do like the avatar.

Post by **LarsMac** » Mon Jan 30, 2017 11:56 am

Ahso!;1506080 wrote: That there is some huge and used hands lady liberty has. Not very attractive to the average male. But I do like the avatar.

Lady Liberty has had to work hard all her life. No trophy wife with lithe hands and decorated nails is she.

Bruv · Post by **Bruv** » Mon Jan 30, 2017 1:12 pm

I get the impression he is loving the fuss he's causing.

Trump's crying Schumer put down is a classic bully boy response, his macho followers will love it.

Clodhopper · Post by **Clodhopper** » Mon Jan 30, 2017 3:18 pm

far right brexiters have now started a pro trump petition. And yes, I think you are right about the bully boy. Even knowing it is true it is hard to believe such a spoiled child is in the White House.

I do wonder how long this energy will last. I don't have the impression he enjoys working out details but he does enjoy headlines, so I expect him to go on with big pen strokes and maximum noise. But anything else? Not so sure. He'll be making sure his businesses prosper, at a guess.

Post by **LarsMac** » Mon Jan 30, 2017 3:43 pm

Are we ready, yet, to begin imagining what the new Axis will do with us all?

Clodhopper · Post by **Clodhopper** » Mon Jan 30, 2017 5:27 pm

We are most likely headed for a low tax low service future. Corporation tax is one of the mainstays of government spending and will has already been cut to 20% and almost certainly will drop further. You have to generate a lot of new business to increase tax receipts and with likely worse access to our biggest market this isn't probable. With an NHS already groaning with overstretch brexit is likely the death blow. Until we know the terms of brexit it's hard to be very precise, but I can honestly not see anything much good coming from it for ordinary people and can see many opportunities for big business in the privatisation of the NHS.

That's assuming things go well. If they don't, I prefer not to post about it. Yet.