Autism - What is it?

Discuss Mental Health topics & issues.
Ahso!
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Autism - What is it?

Post by Ahso! »

Its a question that has been at the forefront of many discussions lately, or perhaps thats just in my head. Its very possible, you know.

I've been doing much research into this and have found a wide array of opinions on the subject from vaccines to mercury contamination in fish to any other number of environmental concerns. Depending on which view you decide to take on it, its an interesting subject to entertain.

Its been said that only thirty years ago in the U.S. autistic births were only one in ten thousand, today its one in one hundred fifty. In the UK its said to be as high as one in every fifty, and Japan is even said to be lower. What a phenomena. Thats breath taking when you consider those numbers.

Is it that we are simply identifying more now? Thats probably some of it. Are we just more acutely aware of it? Perhaps. Are we rushing toward our demise from a decaying environment? thats scary to think about. Are we hating each other to the point that we are alienating our offspring and causing stressful changes physiologically? Interesting idea. Does it all boil down to sex as perhaps Freud might say? Only your psychoanalyst could know for sure.

What is this thing happening to our species at such an alarming rate? Do you have any idea's or thoughts. In this subject, all idea's are welcome and considered.

Personally, I believe its evolution through natural selection. And if thats so, then we are privileged as a people to be alive at this moment in history. Think about it, even if this has been happening slowly over say thousands or even tens of thousands of years, we are the generation that is conscious of its existence and are witnessing evolutionary change take place.

Regardless if you are autistic or non-autistic, you have to be mesmerized by what is occurring before our eyes.

ARC (autism research center) located in Cambridge University and headed by one Simon Baron Cohen has done some remarkable research on the matter of autism and its sub-categories. I recommend anyone who may find themselves bored for an afternoon to take a gander at their website.

Whats interesting is that was has been discovered in the family history of many of these autistic people is the presence of engineers or at least people with the IQ of that of engineers.

Its suggested that females are choosing less aggressive geeky type men as their mating partners, and the females are what is referred to as systemizers. When these two breed if you will, the resulting offspring is very often a child with autistic qualities.

Think of the ramifications of this. Wow!

This post is getting long so I'll stop here. What are your thoughts? What have you heard? Who do you know with autistic tendencies? I suggest its more than you may realize. In fact it could be you.
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Post by kayleneaussie »

My eldest daughter has Aspergers and she has 4 children 2 who are autistic....

Its an interesting subject....we had no family history, but then again did we:thinking:
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Post by Ahso! »

kayleneaussie;1261907 wrote: My eldest daughter has Aspergers and she has 4 children 2 who are autistic....

Its an interesting subject....we had no family history, but then again did we:thinking:Yes, it seems to be genetic. I firmly believe my father had Asperger's and I believe all my siblings are autistic to varying degrees. My father was born in 1911, so much of what is commonly thought today would not apply to him, not to mention that most likely others down his lineage were autistic. And so on.
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Post by mrsK »

Hello:-6:-6

I work with children who have autism.

I myself have a few traits as well.

I didn't realise what it was till this year.I have been doing a lot of autism courses & thinking to myself,that is me .They are talking about me;):yh_rotfl

To be perfectly honest everyone has them some just a bit more than others.

Good to see you back:D
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Post by Ahso! »

mrsK;1261939 wrote: Hello:-6:-6

I work with children who have autism.

I myself have a few traits as well.

I didn't realise what it was till this year.I have been doing a lot of autism courses & thinking to myself,that is me .They are talking about me;):yh_rotfl

To be perfectly honest everyone has them some just a bit more than others.

Good to see you back:DThat is such a common story, MrsK. Both my son, who has been working with autistic people for about 4 years now says the same thing. My daughter Sarah who is to be married this coming Saturday received her masters in clinical psychology and now counsels families of autistic children, prior to that she work at the same place as her brother. Ironically, its her that is most affected by the Asperger syndrome that has been apparently present in my family for some generations at least. Her and I seem to be fairly equal in that regard.
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Post by Ahso! »

this is an informal little test which is interesting. It doesn't diagnose you with anything, but it does give one the idea as to how they scored in comparison to both diagnosed with and without autism. I scored a 37. Whats your score. My wife scored a 16.
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Post by buttercup »

Tests tend to bore me half way through but i got there ;)

17
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Post by Betty Boop »

Robert J;1262089 wrote: this is an informal little test which is interesting. It doesn't diagnose you with anything, but it does give one the idea as to how they scored in comparison to both diagnosed with and without autism. I scored a 37. Whats your score. My wife scored a 16.


I scored a 9.

Will have to see if I can get my son to take that test.
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Post by YZGI »

15 here.
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Post by mrsK »

21 here.

I knew it would be high:-6
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Post by YZGI »

mrsK;1262218 wrote: 21 here.

I knew it would be high:-6
So did we...:yh_rotfl
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Post by Ahso! »

YZGI;1262237 wrote: So did we...:yh_rotflWhat are you talking about? You probably transposed your score.
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Post by CARLA »

I got a 10. :-3
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Post by kayleneaussie »

I got a 16....
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Post by Mustang »

10 for me.
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Post by shelbell »

I got a 24...what does that mean?
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Post by Ahso! »

shelbell;1262298 wrote: I got a 24...what does that mean?Not a whole lot really. It is just comparing your answers to that of autistic people and non-autistic people and telling you where your answers fall. I think there are many telling things in it and one is that mostly all of us as a population have a wide range of peculiarities.

Most of us are of the impression that we are mostly all alike and some of us are lazy, stupid, smarter,dumber and so on. What this test reveals is thats simply not the case.

When I meet new people in a social setting its difficult for me to focus and relax and I will not remember your name but if I was to overhear you give out your phone number theres a very good chance I will connect you with it instead of your name. That doesn't make ne anything except different than you you unless you have that same tendency.

Its like the same reason some people are mechanically inclined and others are artistically so.

There are other things also involved, but its only illuminating those of us that focus on certain things and have different thought patterns.

In a sense, it turns many of our preconceptions inside out.
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Post by shelbell »

I may have to check out what you were referring to, it sounds interesting, but I will definitely need more time and especially more concentration.
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Post by mrsK »

YZGI;1262237 wrote: So did we...:yh_rotfl


:yh_rotfl Yep I am pleased you picked up on it:yh_rotfl
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Post by YZGI »

mrsK;1262339 wrote: :yh_rotfl Yep I am pleased you picked up on it:yh_rotfl
Whew, I hoped I didn't offend.:-6
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Post by YZGI »

Robert J;1262240 wrote: What are you talking about? You probably transposed your score.
Yeah, us 51's are known to do that.:D
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Post by Clodhopper »

I couldn't be bothered to add up my score. What does that make me? :-3

Like a lot of human behaviours most of us have traits which taken to a more extreme level, could be Autistic. They're not always bad, either - extreme concentration might be an example of that.

I don't know what Autism is. I read a bit about it on a psychology course and I'm not sure anyone does. I've got a few personal ideas, along the lines of someone who's brain is programmed slightly differently. Usually the social consequences and or other "abnormalities" mean the person is effectively mentally disabled by the criteria of a modern society. Sometimes we get idiot savants. But other times Autistic traits aid genius.

It's the inability to empathise that is the most difficult aspect, I think.
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Post by Ahso! »

Clodhopper;1262401 wrote: I couldn't be bothered to add up my score. What does that make me? :-3

Like a lot of human behaviours most of us have traits which taken to a more extreme level, could be Autistic. They're not always bad, either - extreme concentration might be an example of that.

I don't know what Autism is. I read a bit about it on a psychology course and I'm not sure anyone does. I've got a few personal ideas, along the lines of someone who's brain is programmed slightly differently. Usually the social consequences and or other "abnormalities" mean the person is effectively mentally disabled by the criteria of a modern society. Sometimes we get idiot savants. But other times Autistic traits aid genius.

It's the inability to empathise that is the most difficult aspect, I think.Wasn't there a button to press for the score to appear?
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Post by Ahso! »

YZGI;1262395 wrote: Yeah, us 51's are known to do that.:Dthat's right, buddy, you better back down. I've dealt with you 51's before, in fact i ran into a few of them the other night in a parking lot. Yeah, they tried giving me a hard time, but by the time I got through with them, they were left quaking in their boots feeling like mere single digits.
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Post by Clodhopper »

Robert J;1262431 wrote: Wasn't there a button to press for the score to appear?


I think that makes the answer to my question, "Dumb." :wah:

My score wouldn't mean much anyway. I recognise the symptoms and can answer accordingly.
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Post by Ahso! »

Clodhopper;1262401 wrote: Like a lot of human behaviours most of us have traits which taken to a more extreme level, could be Autistic. They're not always bad, either - extreme concentration might be an example of that.

I don't know what Autism is. I read a bit about it on a psychology course and I'm not sure anyone does. I've got a few personal ideas, along the lines of someone who's brain is programmed slightly differently. Usually the social consequences and or other "abnormalities" mean the person is effectively mentally disabled by the criteria of a modern society. Sometimes we get idiot savants. But other times Autistic traits aid genius.What I notice about the concentrating or focusing is it often turns into a right/wrong dilemma because autistics don't care about that stuff but its required by society so they believe they have to adopt a position. We then go out and constantly argue the right/wrong issues to find meaning in them and theres a constant analysis going on in our heads because it just doesn't sit well with us. Thats where the frustration is for me at times. Its rare that my mind is quiet, in fact, I don't think it ever is, but through out the years I've learned to ignore the activity. Its like tinnitus, which I've had since childhood, the ringing and other sounds are always there but sometimes I tune them out. I've been curious to know if tinnitus and autism is related.

Clodhopper;1262401 wrote: It's the inability to empathise that is the most difficult aspect, I think.Empathy is a real interesting thing. On a basic level we don't realize we don't empathize because we never have, so its not frustrating until situations arise in our personal lives like when a person close to you cries for what seems illogical reasons, a kind of Mr. Spock posture. When say my wife cries because she can't get the house ready for visitors, I stand there and look at her and say "why are you crying, it won't get you anywhere" and if I can force myself to try to console her I get into analyzing the situation rather than listening and understanding, I have a real hard time with that, always have.

When i was a salesman, I had to attend seminars and such that tried to teach us how to empathize. Of course that was easier because it was scripted to a degree. Putting yourself in someone elses frame of reference meant finding their hot button. That I could do because it permitted me to do analyzing all day long as a job, so it was not only fun, but I found I was really good at it. I was one hell of a salesman. Its when I moved into management that I became miserable, then i would get into arguments with my superiors and was constantly told by subordinates that I talked down to people, which sounded to me like my wife because that was her main complaint about me. My kids endured me better most of the time. But friendships didn't last long. When it came to friends that would get fed up with me I interpreted that as they can't take non trivia and real truth analysis. So I never knew I lacked empathy because I had never experienced it apparently. You can't realize you're lacking a part if the part was never in your structure. However, being on the other side of the issue, I certainly felt that others could not understand me. While a child, adults would constantly tell me I needed to smile more, but many could see I was in constant thought.
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Post by yaaarrrgg »

Robert J;1262089 wrote: this is an informal little test which is interesting. It doesn't diagnose you with anything, but it does give one the idea as to how they scored in comparison to both diagnosed with and without autism. I shttp://www.forumgarden.com/forums/images/edito ... h.gifcored a 37. Whats your score. My wife scored a 16.


Hey RJ ... Interesting thread! I took the test scored a 34.
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Post by Ahso! »

yaaarrrgg;1263189 wrote: Hey RJ ... Interesting thread! I took the test scored a 34.Hi Keven, its great to see you...we are a lot alike, aren't we? Well I'm in good company.
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Post by farmer giles »

17 but i got bored and just ticked any box :-3:-3
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Post by Peg »

I scored 22.
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Post by Ahso! »

Peg;1263220 wrote: I scored 22.want to rethink the canning thing now, Peg?
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Post by spot »

Robert J;1261900 wrote: Who do you know with autistic tendencies? I suggest its more than you may realize. In fact it could be you.


I'm the most personable chap on the planet and the least likely to be diagnosed as even slightly affected that way. Given which, the test you put up must have alternative explanations.

Agree: 2,4,6,7,12,13,16,19,20,21,22,23,26,33,35,39,41,42,43,45,46: 1 point

Disagree: 1,8,10,11,14,15,17,24,25,27,28,29,31,32,34,36,37,38,40,44,47,49,50: 1 point

Score: 44
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Post by Ahso! »

spot;1263242 wrote: I'm the most personable chap on the planet and the least likely to be diagnosed as even slightly affected that way. Given which, the test you put up must have alternative explanations.

Agree: 2,4,6,7,12,13,16,19,20,21,22,23,26,33,35,39,41,42,43,45,46: 1 point

Disagree: 1,8,10,11,14,15,17,24,25,27,28,29,31,32,34,36,37,38,40,44,47,49,50: 1 point

Score: 44I don't know what to say, Spot. But as I pointed out in another post, its not a diagnosis, but only the fact that at one end of the spectrum of the score is how non-diagnosed people answered the question and on the other how diagnosed people had and where your answers fall within that spectrum.

The guy who wrote up that test is the same one that runs ARC at Cambridge and is considered by many to be the lead authority on the subject.

Knowing you, I'm certain that if there is an alternate explanation you'll find it.

BTW, I'm a very personable person too as was my father. The question for me is why do i become so personable when I do.
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Post by spot »

Robert J;1263258 wrote: at one end of the spectrum of the score is how non-diagnosed people answered the question and on the other how diagnosed people had and where your answers fall within that spectrum. I don't actually believe that can be accurate, I'd be interested to know where you got the idea from. I can easily see that high scores are where autistic people consistently score. I have trouble with low scores being where non-autistic people consistently score, I suspect non-autistic people can score either low or middling or high depending on quite a range of circumstances.

The trouble comes when "autistic people consistently score high" becomes "I now have a test for autism" instead of merely "I now have a way of confirming autism", and the test eventually becomes a muddy technique for diagnosis. That's how conditions spread from being an initial rarity to eventually including 10% of the population. ADD is one that springs immediately to mind, and the consequent flood of Ritalin through the US child population. Dyslexia's another.

And no, there's not a snowball's chance in hell that I'm autistic, nor that I ever have been.
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Post by Ahso! »

spot;1263278 wrote: I don't actually believe that can be accurate, I'd be interested to know where you got the idea from. I can easily see that high scores are where autistic people consistently score. I have trouble with low scores being where non-autistic people consistently score, I suspect non-autistic people can score either low or middling or high depending on quite a range of circumstances.

The trouble comes when "autistic people consistently score high" becomes "I now have a test for autism" instead of merely "I now have a way of confirming autism", and the test eventually becomes a muddy technique for diagnosis. That's how conditions spread from being an initial rarity to eventually including 10% of the population. ADD is one that springs immediately to mind, and the consequent flood of Ritalin through the US child population. Dyslexia's another.

And no, there's not a snowball's chance in hell that I'm autistic, nor that I ever have been.Perhaps I'm not representing my thoughts clearly. I'm not nor is this test saying you are autistic, although I personally believe we all have a bit of autistic qualities. I'd have to refer you to ARC for more information on that test as it was designed by them. Also Here is more of the Wired interview along with some good questions and answers with Simon Baron-Cohen.

From my perspective, I don't believe any of this is really a disorder or disease or even a syndrome actually, those are only categories we use to communicate with one another. As i said in the OP, I believe its simply nature. We are simply a slightly different variation of a single species. This is a pretty interesting site for that subject, though mind you I didn't go to different sites and become influenced, I had inclinations and then found some supporting info from people that had similar idea's as I.

BTW - the low scoring people in the control group of the test were not necessarily non-autistic, but instead not diagnosed as having strong autistic tendencies to be formally labeled as such, however, it seems to me that doesn't mean they don't share some attributes of autism.

As for ADD and ADHD and bi-polar, I don't think any of them are diseases or disorders, but again are merely small variations in human beings. But the pharmaceutical industry is going to find reasons to manufacture and market their products, and thats too bad, though some drugs are necessary for extreme cases where people may be dangerous to others.
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Post by spot »

There are two distinct separate entities, whether you're talking about autism or ADD or dyslexia. There's the initial exactly specified condition, which in each case is vanishingly rare and extremely distinctive and obviously a pathological state caused by damage which, one hopes, might eventually be studied sufficiently well to lead to repair and correction. On the other hand there's the broadened use of the term which stems from drug companies cashing in and lay people using words generically (I've no idea which happens first, out of those two). "I personally believe we all have a bit of autistic qualities" is an example of societal broadening. I'd suggest that in any sensible medical use of the word it's a meaningless destruction of what would otherwise be a perfectly good medical observation.

Some scientist or other, in the course of seeing a lot of patients and reading lots of case histories, distinguishes a pattern which leads to isolating an extremely distinctive illness. He lists the symptoms common to all of the patients he includes in that group. Depending on whether his peers agree that the group he describes has something wrong which has a common cause, maybe that category of patients ends up with a new shorthand label (like autistic). Once it's described and agreed that way it can be researched. The instances which spring to mind that haven't been diluted by application to all and sundry are the chromosomal abnormalities which result in very distinctive physical change like those listed on the table at Chromosome abnormality - very few people would say "I personally believe we all have a bit of Downs Syndrome". And yet that's an exact equivalent of what you're claiming for autism, and what others do with ADD or Dyslexia.

It's egged on by drug companies marketing anodynes (like Ritalin, effective though it is for some purposes) and trying by hook or by crook to include as large a proportion of the population in its catchment area in order to maximise its profit. They have influence on the peer-accepted definition of the illness which gets used in clinics and surgeries. At that level, "autism" is snake oil. At the level where it was originally recognised as a collective set of symptoms covering a specific group of people it was an invitation to research. I don't see how anyone who's watched a TV documentary on - may I call it full-blown autism? - can think that it has anything to do with the common societal use of the word which this thread seems to be employing.
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Post by Ahso! »

spot;1263282 wrote: There are two distinct separate entities, whether you're talking about autism or ADD or dyslexia. There's the initial exactly specified condition, which in each case is vanishingly rare and extremely distinctive and obviously a pathological state caused by damage which, one hopes, might eventually be studied sufficiently well to lead to repair and correction. On the other hand there's the broadened use of the term which stems from drug companies cashing in and lay people using words generically (I've no idea which happens first, out of those two). "I personally believe we all have a bit of autistic qualities" is an example of societal broadening. I'd suggest that in any sensible medical use of the word it's a meaningless destruction of what would otherwise be a perfectly good medical observation.

Some scientist or other, in the course of seeing a lot of patients and reading lots of case histories, distinguishes a pattern which leads to isolating an extremely distinctive illness. He lists the symptoms common to all of the patients he includes in that group. Depending on whether his peers agree that the group he describes has something wrong which has a common cause, maybe that category of patients ends up with a new shorthand name (like autistic). Once it's described and agreed that way it can be researched. The instances which spring to mind that haven't been diluted by application to all and sundry are the chromosomal abnormalities which result in very distinctive physical change like those listed on the table at Chromosome abnormality - very few people would say "I personally believe we all have a bit of Downs Syndrome". And yet that's an exact equivalent of what you're claiming for autism, and what others do with ADD or Dyslexia.

It's egged on by drug companies marketing anodynes (like Ritalin, effective though it is for some purposes) and trying by hook or by crook to include as large a proportion of the population in its catchment area in order to maximise its profit. They have influence on the peer-accepted definition of the illness which gets used in clinics and surgeries. At that level, "autism" is snake oil. At the level where it was originally recognised as a collective set of symptoms covering a specific group of people it was an invitation to research. I don't see how anyone who's watched a TV documentary on - may I call it full-blown autism? - can think that it has anything to do with the common societal use of the word which this thread seems to be employing.I understand exactly what you are saying, but my point here is to have a conversation which takes these issues out of the "abnormalities" category all together. That from your example is the only realistic way of muting the affects of marketing of the pharmaceutical industry. As long as the conversation is exclusive to medical and pharmaceutical industries where doctors communicate one-on-one with their patients, its a done deal for capitalistic entities.

I think my previous post already contains anything more I can say here. You and I are using different values on the subject. Mine is that its nothing to be fearful of or be cured of, while I think I see you saying that yes, its a disorder but on a much smaller scale than I've suggested.

I'm going to trust my instincts and what I've learned here as my outlook, no matter how difficult for others to understand, does not attempt to isolate others, instead it opens up a realm of possibly seeing that we have nothing to fear from one another's differences. Theres nothing to be fixed here because there are no abnormalities, only extreme examples of variations of a species which may or may not require attention.

All that said, I understand that this is a public forum and the owners may have the same fears as you've expressed. It's their choice to do with this thread as they will. I believe it to be not only harmless, but edifying.
“Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities,”

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I have only one thing to do and that's

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Clodhopper
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Autism - What is it?

Post by Clodhopper »

What I notice about the concentrating or focusing is it often turns into a right/wrong dilemma because autistics don't care about that stuff but its required by society so they believe they have to adopt a position. We then go out and constantly argue the right/wrong issues to find meaning in them and theres a constant analysis going on in our heads because it just doesn't sit well with us. Thats where the frustration is for me at times. Its rare that my mind is quiet, in fact, I don't think it ever is, but through out the years I've learned to ignore the activity. Its like tinnitus, which I've had since childhood, the ringing and other sounds are always there but sometimes I tune them out. I've been curious to know if tinnitus and autism is related.


Tinnitus and Autism have not been linked that I am aware of. However, you know a lot more about the issue than I do, so I suspect you'd be more likely to know about this than me. It seems to me that you also tentatively link Autism with sociopathy ("it often turns into a right/wrong dilemma because autistics don't care about that stuff") and pattern recognition ("theres a constant analysis going on in our heads") which are aspects of standard brain functionality. Most of us have stuff we don't care about. It's just that it tends to be different stuff.

Empathy is a real interesting thing. On a basic level we don't realize we don't empathize because we never have, so its not frustrating until situations arise in our personal lives like when a person close to you cries for what seems illogical reasons, a kind of Mr. Spock posture. When say my wife cries because she can't get the house ready for visitors, I stand there and look at her and say "why are you crying, it won't get you anywhere" and if I can force myself to try to console her I get into analyzing the situation rather than listening and understanding, I have a real hard time with that, always have.


That's a difficult situation. But men are more prone to analyze in these situations than to sympathise, and in crisis moments such as you describe women generally want sympathy not solutions. It's certainly one I had to learn.

When i was a salesman, I had to attend seminars and such that tried to teach us how to empathize. Of course that was easier because it was scripted to a degree. Putting yourself in someone elses frame of reference meant finding their hot button. That I could do because it permitted me to do analyzing all day long as a job, so it was not only fun, but I found I was really good at it. I was one hell of a salesman. Its when I moved into management that I became miserable, then i would get into arguments with my superiors and was constantly told by subordinates that I talked down to people, which sounded to me like my wife because that was her main complaint about me. My kids endured me better most of the time. But friendships didn't last long. When it came to friends that would get fed up with me I interpreted that as they can't take non trivia and real truth analysis. So I never knew I lacked empathy because I had never experienced it apparently. You can't realize you're lacking a part if the part was never in your structure. However, being on the other side of the issue, I certainly felt that others could not understand me. While a child, adults would constantly tell me I needed to smile more, but many could see I was in constant thought.


Sounds to me just as much that you need an "off" switch! Have you ever tried lying back and looking up into a deep blue sky and when any thought comes along just letting it drift off again? Or is that something you simply cannot do? I can see why you were a good salesman, though - everything you did would have had the full intensity of your personality behind it. Very effective.

In practical terms, it seems to me when your wife cries in the sort of circumstances you described, you should see it as a cue to show her you care about her. Hugs are good. Dealing with the situation comes after that. But you probably already know this. My apologies if my ruminations are simply stating the bleedin' obvious!
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Ahso!
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Autism - What is it?

Post by Ahso! »

Thanks, CH, your input is greatly appreciated. As I said, had I become aware of myself earlier in life, I would be further along as a socially adjusted member of society, though there are also wonderful characteristics of my makeup, just as it is for everyone. Environments such as FG gives me the opportunity to observe those natural ingredients in folks such as yourself and others here. I'm learning skills from many of you. Clodhopper;1263659 wrote: It seems to me that you also tentatively link Autism with sociopathy ("it often turns into a right/wrong dilemma because autistics don't care about that stuff")I should probably point out that what may be a better explanation is that I don't recognize boundaries easily and often offend other peoples sense of right and wrong. To me right and wrong is a non-issue. Its what is referred to as mindblindness Clodhopper;1263659 wrote: and pattern recognition ("theres a constant analysis going on in our heads") which are aspects of standard brain functionality. Most of us have stuff we don't care about. It's just that it tends to be different stuff. Actually, I think these are two different things, at least for me, then again, this is all new for me, I must continually go back to my younger years in order to look for me before I made adjustments on the go. I actually accelerate at pattern recognition but faii miserably at facial recognition of others feeling and thoughts.

As for pattern recognition, I've taken 3 IQ tests recently and scored above average. When I was young, teachers would tell me I had a high IQ and they could not understand why I behaved as I did in school. There were time when I did focus and was told that my work was at a much higher level than others in my grade. My problem with school was that I felt totally different than what i thought I was observing in other kids. Eventually, when I advanced with straight F's and Unsatisfactory attitude marks in everything except math and music to junior high school, I began to use drugs and alcohol before classes began in order to deal with my discomfort, where i just wanted out. Even though I probably attended school nearly everyday high, I still did well in math skills averaging a 92%, music I just got lost in and science was intriguing but too lengthy for my attention and that was probably due to being stoned all the time. I received a 'D' in science. I think I would have done well in science and language had I possessed the necessary skills to adjust to the learning atmosphere school required. I love language now and am so envious of those of you who exercise command of it.

I finally dropped out of school when i turned 17 and almost immediately joined the Navy...What a mistake that was, after about a week, all I wanted was out, out, out. I kept a calendar in my wallet and nearly every time I sat on a toilet I would take out the calendar and literally count either the months or weeks remaining on my enlistment, depending of course on how much time I estimated was required for each session. Friends would often harass me for sitting to urinate, but i had to do my count whenever I had the opportunity to use the toilet.



Clodhopper;1263659 wrote: That's a difficult situation. But men are more prone to analyze in these situations than to sympathise, and in crisis moments such as you describe women generally want sympathy not solutions. It's certainly one I had to learn.Thanks!:)



Clodhopper;1263659 wrote: Sounds to me just as much that you need an "off" switch! Have you ever tried lying back and looking up into a deep blue sky and when any thought comes along just letting it drift off again? Or is that something you simply cannot do? I've often tried doing that but it has always been ineffective for me, though I can do that in order to try to work out a situation in my mind, but never to let thought drift off or melt away. I've also tried meditation with no success. Clodhopper;1263659 wrote: I can see why you were a good salesman, though - everything you did would have had the full intensity of your personality behind it. Very effective. Excellent description.

Clodhopper;1263659 wrote: In practical terms, it seems to me when your wife cries in the sort of circumstances you described, you should see it as a cue to show her you care about her. Hugs are good. Dealing with the situation comes after that. But you probably already know this. My apologies if my ruminations are simply stating the bleedin' obvious!Thats good advice and have been advised of it many many times by loved ones and a marriage counselor when I afforded one a few hours of my time. She was great but the minute I thought I had found my answer, I ceased attending. Of course I found my answer out of a book I was reading independent of the counseling sessions. My wife continued going and benefited from the visits......My poor wife. Shes so dedicated to me. I have no idea how or why, but I'm grateful.
“Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities,”

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YZGI
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Autism - What is it?

Post by YZGI »

spot;1263242 wrote: I'm the most personable chap on the planet and the least likely to be diagnosed as even slightly affected that way. Given which, the test you put up must have alternative explanations.



Agree: 2,4,6,7,12,13,16,19,20,21,22,23,26,33,35,39,41,42,43,45,46: 1 point

Disagree: 1,8,10,11,14,15,17,24,25,27,28,29,31,32,34,36,37,38,40,44,47,49,50: 1 point

Score: 44
I suspect it was that question about providing links to prove posts on FG is the one that put you over the top.:D
fuzzywuzzy
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Autism - What is it?

Post by fuzzywuzzy »

Scored very low but my husband would have scored extremely high.......he has aspergers spectrum though don't ask him about it because he'd deny it.
Ahso!
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Autism - What is it?

Post by Ahso! »

Following are tthree wonderful talks from UCTV.tv. I'm putting them up for those who may be interested in learning more about Autism and Asperger (Asperger is on the autism spectrum). If you have a loved one which you know or think fits the profile or if you suspect you yourself may fit the profile then watching is highly recommended.

Science is beginning to identify genes associated with Autism. It's very interesting.

What Causes Autism? Two Short Stories - UCTV - University of California Television

http://www.uctv.tv/search-details.aspx?showID=17657

Where Are We With the Autisms? - UCTV - University of California Television
“Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities,”

Voltaire



I have only one thing to do and that's

Be the wave that I am and then

Sink back into the ocean

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Autism - What is it?

Post by Elvira »

Really interesting stuff to think about. I've just bought a book by Simon Baren-Cohen, (who devised this test) and the test is within the book.

I scored 12, which is pretty much where I thought it would be. I consider myself to be pretty intuitive when it comes to the feelings of others etc. (puts trumpet back in velvet lined case) Interestingly my Father has Aspergers, and my Sister definitely demonstrates many of the characteristics.

Am wondering if anyone has considerd whether or not the fact we know what the test is for, and have probably already reached some conclusions, could count as a confounding variable? (biases our responses?) If so, how could this be overcome in a research situation?
Ahso!
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Autism - What is it?

Post by Ahso! »

Elvira;1271068 wrote: Really interesting stuff to think about. I've just bought a book by Simon Baren-Cohen, (who devised this test) and the test is within the book.

I scored 12, which is pretty much where I thought it would be. I consider myself to be pretty intuitive when it comes to the feelings of others etc. (puts trumpet back in velvet lined case) Interestingly my Father has Aspergers, and my Sister definitely demonstrates many of the characteristics.

Am wondering if anyone has considerd whether or not the fact we know what the test is for, and have probably already reached some conclusions, could count as a confounding variable? (biases our responses?) If so, how could this be overcome in a research situation?I don;t understand your question. But for another more comprehensive test look here.

Aspie-quiz
“Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities,”

Voltaire



I have only one thing to do and that's

Be the wave that I am and then

Sink back into the ocean

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Elvira
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Autism - What is it?

Post by Elvira »

Ahso!;1271069 wrote: I don;t understand your question. [/url]


Must be my phrasing, sorry.....

So in the creation of any 'norming' group (or control group) we need to eliminate any confounding variables....elements that can bias the results of the research/test.

It's sometimes found that if the participants (we can't call them subjects anymore) know what they're being tested for, they manipulate their behaviour or answers, thus biasing the results. Therefore, the knowledge of the purpose of the test would be the confounding variable..... I guess I wonderd if there was a way around this. However with further consideration, I imagine that if there was a way to eliminate this for sure, Dr SBC will have done this - he's a bit of a whizz, yknow.. :)
Gazaman12
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Autism - What is it?

Post by Gazaman12 »

fuzzywuzzy;1267596 wrote: Scored very low but my husband would have scored extremely high.......he has aspergers spectrum though don't ask him about it because he'd deny it.


Your post is so great !

I got a lot of new and necessary from it

Thanks
yaaarrrgg
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Autism - What is it?

Post by yaaarrrgg »

I ran across this article... looks like the view of autism is changing. I guess when their money involved, people like it more. :)

Autism seen as asset, not liability, in some jobs - Mental health- msnbc.com
Ahso!
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Autism - What is it?

Post by Ahso! »

yaaarrrgg;1271645 wrote: I ran across this article... looks like the view of autism is changing. I guess when their money involved, people like it more. :)

Autism seen as asset, not liability, in some jobs - Mental health- msnbc.comPretty smart. Many autistic/aspie people are excellent marketers. Its because we understand people intuitively very well and we do like people. It would not surprise me one bit to find out that many people who are or have been involved in jobs that require specific focus and attention are undiagnosed aspies.

My son, who was the first one to recommend I consider the possibility that I may be aspie asked me the other day if I would consider managing his band. When we talked about it he said he thought, and I agreed, that if I did focus on it like I have on so many other things through out my life, that he felt confident that the band would do well.

The problem for me is that if I don't feel passionate about what the thing is, It doesn't happen. It's like I can't really choose what to do with it and sometimes the passion doesn't last that long. For instance, look what I did with buying those domain names, it hasn't gone anywhere, and I don't know if it ever will.
“Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities,”

Voltaire



I have only one thing to do and that's

Be the wave that I am and then

Sink back into the ocean

Fiona Apple
yaaarrrgg
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Autism - What is it?

Post by yaaarrrgg »

I can see you doing a great job managing. That's a good idea.
Ahso!
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Autism - What is it?

Post by Ahso! »

yaaarrrgg;1271726 wrote: I can see you doing a great job managing. That's a good idea.I'd agree if it were my younger day's. I still enjoy music and I of course love my son to death, but music no longer has that specialness to me, i doubt I could be enthusiastic about it like I once was.

Thanks for the compliment. I do give him idea's and share my marketing and sales experience with him. the problem with his band is that for as good as they are at writing and playing catchy tunes, the only one really interested in pushing them is him. The rest seem to lack the enthusiasm needed. I think thats because they are all in their twenties now and a couple or three are playing around with chemicals.
“Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities,”

Voltaire



I have only one thing to do and that's

Be the wave that I am and then

Sink back into the ocean

Fiona Apple

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