How Should We Die?

koan
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How Should We Die?

Post by koan »

Looks like considerations of euthanasia laws are coming back in style

Margaret Forster, in her compelling book Precious Lives discusses two deaths. One was a beloved sister-in-law, dying of cancer, with morphine enough to end her life had she wished, but she didn't and clung on to the last painful moment.

When it came to Margaret Forster's father, a robust, stalwart, highly independent man who had declined over the years to a miserable fragment of himself, she finished the book by saying that history would find it odd that we let him fade away in such a manner - the last words of the book are: "It is odd. It is wrong."


This article discusses reasons to rethink allowing people to choose how... and when they will die.
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Fibonacci
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How Should We Die?

Post by Fibonacci »

Death should be unexpected.... Knowing how and when is bad enough, but having a say in it seems like suicide.



Just my opinion....
The poolhall's a great equalizer. In the poolhall, nobody cares how old you are, how young you are, what color your skin is or how much money you've got in your pocket... It's about how you move. I remember this kid once who could move around a pool table like nobody had ever seen. Hour after hour, rack after rack, his shots just went in. The cue was part of his arm and the balls had eyes. And the thing that made him so good was... He thought he could never miss. I know, 'cause that kid was me.
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Lon
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How Should We Die?

Post by Lon »

It would be nice to die happy and content. Think that is possible?
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flopstock
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Post by flopstock »

In an embarrassing position I hope...:D
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Victoria
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Post by Victoria »

We have legal euthanasia here. Its very controled among other things the patient must be terminal, they must be of sound mind and not suffering depression (hard considering) all medical options must be exhausted, two independent doctors must agree.

I have know of a couple of people who have chosen this route and it was a dignified death one without unnecessary suffering as is all too often the case.

I watched my father in law drown in the fluid that built up in his lungs (emphysema)

he was terminal but UK doctors just said there was nothing they could do for him and wouldn't even admit him to hospital. So he sat and rotted away in a chair unable to lay down because then he couldn't breath, in the final stages having to make a choice, breath or eat he couldn't do both.

When he eventually died he weighed less than a small child. His was cruel and unnecessary suffering.

I believe that their are times when it is right to help a person end the suffering. I would hope that in the event of an illness such as my FiL had I would be brave enough to take that option.

This is my personal opinion I represent no group, church, or person except myself and have no wish to impose my belief on anyone.

Of course this opinion clashes with some religious beliefs and those people have the right to their opinion, just as long as they remember their opinion is only theirs they do not speak for everyone.
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Bryn Mawr
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How Should We Die?

Post by Bryn Mawr »

If it is the wish of the patient for good reason and not the result of mental illness then yes, it should be an option.

A lingering death, lacking dignity and quality of life, is not humane.
Pinky
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Post by Pinky »

Victoria;955547 wrote: We have legal euthanasia here. Its very controled among other things the patient must be terminal, they must be of sound mind and not suffering depression (hard considering) all medical options must be exhausted, two independent doctors must agree.

I have know of a couple of people who have chosen this route and it was a dignified death one without unnecessary suffering as is all too often the case.

I watched my father in law drown in the fluid that built up in his lungs (emphysema)

he was terminal but UK doctors just said there was nothing they could do for him and wouldn't even admit him to hospital. So he sat and rotted away in a chair unable to lay down because then he couldn't breath, in the final stages having to make a choice, breath or eat he couldn't do both.

When he eventually died he weighed less than a small child. His was cruel and unnecessary suffering.

I believe that their are times when it is right to help a person end the suffering. I would hope that in the event of an illness such as my FiL had I would be brave enough to take that option.

This is my personal opinion I represent no group, church, or person except myself and have no wish to impose my belief on anyone.

Of course this opinion clashes with some religious beliefs and those people have the right to their opinion, just as long as they remember their opinion is only theirs they do not speak for everyone.



My Oma died in the same way...drowned in her own lungs. She actually asked my dad to put her out of her misery, but of course he couldn't. He's slowly going the same way and he openly admits that if he gets to the point where it's that bad, he'll do it himself. It's horrible, I know, but I know where he's coming from. I think I'd feel the same way.
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Carolly
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Post by Carolly »

I can still hear my mother screaming in pain the day after she came out of hospital .....they gave her 6 months......the screams told me otherwise.My other half was with her and I remember thinking.....I hope he dont smother her out of kindness knowing he would have to live with himself afterwards.He didn't and when at last I managed to get a Hospice Doctor here he knew she was indeed dying and the screams stopped and she was gone.......nobody should ever die in such pain and we should be given the choice to end it if we wish.Its our life and our dignity is so important to each and every one of us and yet so many lose theirs in there last days and thats not what anybody should be allowed to encounter nor such pain.
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Accountable
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Post by Accountable »

Victoria;955547 wrote: We have legal euthanasia here. Its very controled among other things the patient must be terminal, they must be of sound mind and not suffering depression (hard considering) all medical options must be exhausted, two independent doctors must agree.



Bryn Mawr;956368 wrote: If it is the wish of the patient for good reason and not the result of mental illness then yes, it should be an option.



A lingering death, lacking dignity and quality of life, is not humane.
Why must two doctors agree?? It's the person's life, unless they have been declared incompetent. If they want to commit suicide, they should do it and be done. I don't see why physical illness needs to be in the equation at all.
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Kathy Ellen
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Post by Kathy Ellen »

Pinky;956384 wrote: My Oma died in the same way...drowned in her own lungs. She actually asked my dad to put her out of her misery, but of course he couldn't. He's slowly going the same way and he openly admits that if he gets to the point where it's that bad, he'll do it himself. It's horrible, I know, but I know where he's coming from. I think I'd feel the same way.



I agree with your Dad Pinky.....I'd like to die quickly and peacefully with dignity...don't want to linger on and upset my family.
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Kathy Ellen
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Post by Kathy Ellen »

Carolly;956399 wrote: I can still hear my mother screaming in pain the day after she came out of hospital .....they gave her 6 months......the screams told me otherwise.My other half was with her and I remember thinking.....I hope he dont smother her out of kindness knowing he would have to live with himself afterwards.He didn't and when at last I managed to get a Hospice Doctor here he knew she was indeed dying and the screams stopped and she was gone.......nobody should ever die in such pain and we should be given the choice to end it if we wish.Its our life and our dignity is so important to each and every one of us and yet so many lose theirs in there last days and thats not what anybody should be allowed to encounter nor such pain.



Awww, I'm so sorry Carol....that's awful:-4
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Carolly
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Post by Carolly »

Kathy Ellen;956403 wrote: Awww, I'm so sorry Carol....that's awful:-4
The thing was I collected her from the London Hospital close to where she lived and brought her here....my birthday it was....I called an ambulance at one point but she refused to go back into hospital.The thing was Kathy although she was only here for less then 24 hours because she died in this parish she was allowed to be buried here.Her body is buried now in the village ...over looking the sheep and fields and I can sit there peacefully and "talk" to her....if she had gone back to a hospital in a town she would not have been able to be buried there.....She suffered big time like so many do and that is why so many say that they are not afraid of dying but afraid of how.We are dictated to all our lives one way or the other and even in those last moments that still applies....one day it will change and I just pray that I live long enough to be given that choice if ever my body has to encounter such pain through a terminal illness.
Women are bitchy and predictable ...men are not and that's the key to knowing the truth.
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Odie
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Post by Odie »

my mother has altzeimers, she is almost at a vegetable state, she doesn't know us, she does not respond to much anymore, she eats well, she has no quality of life, but she is not in pain.......................so they say?



but I would never have her euthanised.

Its not my decision and who am I to do this to my mother?

Could you imagine the guilt, the what ifs?.................
Life is just to short for drama.
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Accountable
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Post by Accountable »

Odie;956557 wrote: my mother has altzeimers, she is almost at a vegetable state, she doesn't know us, she does not respond to much anymore, she eats well, she has no quality of life, but she is not in pain.......................so they say?







but I would never have her euthanised.



Its not my decision and who am I to do this to my mother?



Could you imagine the guilt, the what ifs?.................

I think it's probably more than I can imagine. :yh_flower
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Odie
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Post by Odie »

Accountable;956565 wrote: I think it's probably more than I can imagine. :yh_flower



I could just not live with the guilt either.
Life is just to short for drama.
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Sheryl
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Post by Sheryl »

I think that when a person is diagnosed with a terminal disease they should have the option to ask to be euthanized when they reach a certain point. I watched my grandma die of cancer, in the end she was in so much pain. She was also maxed out on the pain pills, so there was nothing they could do. She had to suffer in pain till she finally died.
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Bryn Mawr
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Post by Bryn Mawr »

Accountable;956400 wrote: Why must two doctors agree?? It's the person's life, unless they have been declared incompetent. If they want to commit suicide, they should do it and be done. I don't see why physical illness needs to be in the equation at all.



Whilst I didn't suggest either I can suggest reasons for both.

Victoria's description was of the Dutch Euthanasia rules, not of an individual committing suicide.

In order to prevent cases like that of Dr Harold Shipman, or the accusation of such by the family of the deceased, you would need a second doctor to act as witness.

If a person wishes to commit suicide when there is no physical illness then it is assumed that there is mental illness and he is thus declared incompetent.
Dewey2Me1MoThyme
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Post by Dewey2Me1MoThyme »

I totally agree with accountable on this one. If one is unhappy with their life and wants to end it, they should be able to dew so with dignity.

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