Defination of Life

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anastrophe
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Defination of Life

Post by anastrophe »

what it all boils down to is that crucial word - 'believe'.

it is impossible to *know* when life begins. we can come to a great many positions on when those who are already among the living believe that life begins, but no science, no religion, will ever be able to say definitively when human life begins. certainly, they can say so within the limits of their beliefs. but until we can define the human soul (we never will), we'll never define when life begins.



in my opinion, naturally.
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john8pies
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Defination of Life

Post by john8pies »

I generally speaking agree with anostrophe, with the proviso that , until a baby is actually `born` it isn`t really a baby is it? i mean, it isn`t fully formed? Just wondered
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Lon
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Defination of Life

Post by Lon »

Jiperly wrote: At its core, this issue is simply about when does life begin- is the fetus indeed a living human being, or a unconcious alligamation of cells no more human than a houseplant?



Points of Interest



Heart Beat begins 3 weeks after conception



Brainwaves start 6 weeks after conception



On weither Fetus's can feel pain

~~Some doctors believe they feel pain at 7 weeks, when the pain receivers develop in the fetus- 59% of abortions are done before this point

~~the Majority believe it is when the pain receivers make the connections brains- this is not done until 26 weeks after conception- less than 1% of Abortions are done after this point



Coinciousness is also believed to start at 26 weeks







So, when do you believe life begins?





EDIT: Fixing a typo....
In my opinion, life begins when one can interact with one's suroundings as well as other's.
Jives
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Defination of Life

Post by Jives »

It's all a moot point...what really matters is will the life be:

1. Wanted.

2. Cared for.

If the baby is not wanted or the mother is unable to care for it, abort. There are 6 billion people on the planet already, we don't need another poor, neglected, destitute waif. :(
All the world's a stage and the men and women merely players...Shakespeare
David813
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Defination of Life

Post by David813 »

Lon wrote: In my opinion, life begins when one can interact with one's suroundings as well as other's.I agree with you Lon. You can't have rights until you're born.
"Should any political party attempt to abolish social security, unemployment insurance, and eliminate labor laws and farm programs, you would not hear of that party again in our political history. There is a tiny splinter group that believes you can do these things. Among them are a few Texas millionaires, or businessman from other areas. Their number is negligible and they are stupid." [font=Arial Narrow][/font]

President Dwight D. Eisenhower Nov. 08, 1954
ggmuze
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Defination of Life

Post by ggmuze »

While the fetus is in the whomb it can not sustain itself. All functions of the organs are fed by the mother. The fetus does and can NOT exist on its own without the mother, or in an extreme case a machine of some sort.

The emotional connection a mother may have with the potential life inside of them is not a valid marker for whether it is actually "alive." And this is precisely what we are dealing with: the fetus has the POTENTIAL to live, but that does not gaurantee, nor can any other human on the planet gaurantee, that a living being will come to fruition out of the fetus hooked up to his/her mother.
Jives
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Defination of Life

Post by Jives »

Who cares? If this were 2,000 BC, we'd need every single human being we could get our hands on, but since the population of the planet is at 7 billion and rising....

stop all the pregnancies, any way you can!

I laugh at abortion arguments because within a century or two, when the seas are dead, and the land is dead, and the population rises out of all control to hundreds of billions, no one will even care that people once thought abortion was wrong. We'll feed the population with the processed bodies of the dead and the price of a human life will be measured in pennies.

Don't believe me? Go ask the Chinese.:wah:
All the world's a stage and the men and women merely players...Shakespeare
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vitaeb
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Defination of Life

Post by vitaeb »

There's no question in my mind of when life begins. The sperm is alive. The egg is alive. The embryo is alive. The fetus is alive. All of life is alive. Even the grass and the rocks are alive.

I think it is the question of consciousness that ought to be examined. When does consciousness begin? Now here is another slippery slope. I'm betting no two responses will be alike. There are some who declare that every cell in your body demonstrates consciousness. If so -- and I feel it is so -- then what becomes of that consciousness when a fetus is aborted? Perhaps consciousness moves from locale to locale the way atoms do. I am told by science that we release atoms and take in atoms with every out-and-in breath. We are given to believe that our bodies are replaced by these new atoms, organ by organ. Something like five months of breathing causes our stomachs to be totally replaced with new atoms.

And since the number of atoms in the universe neither increases nor diminishes, some of my atoms are in your body. Hitler's atoms are scattered among us all no doubt. As is Gandhi's.

I believe the issue of abortion can only be sensibly discussed in terms of actuality. When a woman becomes pregnant, then her precise circumstances -- physical, emotional, economical, and in terms of family support, religious or spiritual support, or any kind of support -- all these factors will determine her course of action.

We -- particularly us men -- can sit and talk about this issue till we're blue in the face. We will only be talking abstractions. In other words, we wil not be discussing anything that is actual. The world of theoretics can get mighty heady. And mean. And cruel. Theoretical speculation can easily lead to awkward imperatives.

One man's view :yh_peace
Best wishes and Latcho Drom

Vitae Bergman

http://www.vitaebergman.com
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Accountable
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Defination of Life

Post by Accountable »

I'm bumping this again just because it deserves to be bumped.



life begins at conception. Even single-cell organisms are scientifically alive. There is no debate about when life begins. Period. (full stop for old-worlders)



The question is citizenship. When do rights begin? I thought the US Constitution stated that citizenship begins at birth. It, in fact, does not directly define citizenship. It only states that only a "natural born citizen" may be President. God help us when (not if) sombody tries to say en vitro is not natural, so those people can't be Pres.



Therefore, I presume that US citizenship is for each State to define. A pregnant woman is unarguably a citizen somewhere. The fetus, arguably, is not. I suppose that when they come head to head, a citizen's rights outweigh the rights of a non-citizen.



I'll just stop here and jump back in if there's interest. :-6
Jives
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Defination of Life

Post by Jives »

Life may begin at conception, but sentience doesn't.;)
All the world's a stage and the men and women merely players...Shakespeare
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chonsigirl
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Defination of Life

Post by chonsigirl »

It depends upon your belief dear Jives, whether sentience begins at conception or birth. I believe at conception. Everyone has seen the pic of the baby in the womb, sucking their thumb, is it just reflexive nothing, or a living being finding comfort while awaiting their birth into the world? Since I have 4 children and consciously chose to have them while pregnant and not abort them, the young ones before birth have already developed personality that the mother knows-feeling it physically from time to time, and ewthin the bonding of their souls for this period of time.
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Accountable
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Defination of Life

Post by Accountable »

Jives wrote: Life may begin at conception, but sentience doesn't.;)
With some I've met, maybe not even then ;) but what about citizenship?

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