Overpopulation- The Taboo Subject

koan · Post by **koan** » Sun Mar 28, 2010 6:39 pm

â€œOverpopulation is the only problem,â€ said Dr. Charles A. Hall, a systems ecologist. â€œIf we had 100 million people on Earth â€” or better, 10 million â€” no others would be a problem.â€

link

Why would it be taboo? Because reproduction is a human right and because we've decided that living as long as possible is more important than quality of life. One of the scientists in that article, which preposterously tries to state how many people would be an appropriate world population, actually puts the desire to extend life as long as possible hand in hand with the thought that we are at least six times the sustainable population already.

Can't keep a cake when we've got 6.67 billion hands digging into it.

Lon · Post by **Lon** » Sun Mar 28, 2010 7:06 pm

Can you imagine what the world would be like if there had been no BLACK PLAGUE,

INFLUENZA, WW 1, WW 2, ARMENIAN HOLOCAUST, WW 2 HOLOCAUST, EARTHQUAKE DEATHS, ALL NATURAL DISASTER DEATHS, ALL WARS?

At some point, as has happened in the past, a large meteorite will strike earth and decimate our ever growing population. It's inevitable.

Post by **LarsMac** » Sun Mar 28, 2010 7:10 pm

I love this paragraph:

In 1990, just over a hundred years ago, the world population was two billion people. That number reached 6 billion just after the turn of the century. The human population is projected to be double that and reach 12 billion by the year 2100.

koan · Post by **koan** » Sun Mar 28, 2010 8:21 pm

Stephen Hawking presented the necessity of colonizing another planet... as seriously as he once claimed we will reach a point in time/space then start going backwards like rewinding a film. Brilliant man who sometimes makes mistakes.

Expanding to another planet is not a solution. It just buys more time and space for us to continue messing things up.

It astounds me that euthanasia is illegal in a world that can't maintain its current population.

fuzzywuzzy · Post by **fuzzywuzzy** » Sun Mar 28, 2010 8:41 pm

I just looked up the birth death figures of the world. Each site I went to had a different figure. But one thing I noticed was, they count births as resulting in future adulthood. But the majority of births around the world are in third world countries where the majority of babies don't reach the age of five.

Anyway this is interesting ....I'm not sure why but I was drawn to the count on road deaths and suicides to see if it changed whilst looking at it.:p

Worldometers - real time world statistics

koan · Post by **koan** » Sun Mar 28, 2010 8:51 pm

fuzzywuzzy;1300372 wrote:

Worldometers - real time world statistics

That is a very cool site. Great find!

along-for-the-ride · Post by **along-for-the-ride** » Mon Mar 29, 2010 3:02 pm

Lon;1300353 wrote: Can you imagine what the world would be like if there had been no BLACK PLAGUE,

INFLUENZA, WW 1, WW 2, ARMENIAN HOLOCAUST, WW 2 HOLOCAUST, EARTHQUAKE DEATHS, ALL NATURAL DISASTER DEATHS, ALL WARS?

At some point, as has happened in the past, a large meteorite will strike earth and decimate our ever growing population. It's inevitable.

Just makes us appreciate life more.

Are our lives a right....or a precious gift?

Lon · Post by **Lon** » Mon Mar 29, 2010 3:05 pm

along-for-the-ride;1300514 wrote: Just makes us appreciate life more.

Are our lives a right....or a precious gift?

Neither

Amythest · Post by **Amythest** » Mon Mar 29, 2010 5:32 pm

koan;1300366 wrote: Stephen Hawking presented the necessity of colonizing another planet... as seriously as he once claimed we will reach a point in time/space then start going backwards like rewinding a film. Brilliant man who sometimes makes mistakes.

Expanding to another planet is not a solution. It just buys more time and space for us to continue messing things up.

It astounds me that euthanasia is illegal in a world that can't maintain its current population.

It seems the Medical establishment wants to defy Death.

Why try to change, prolong or illiminate something that is part of maintaining balance on this planet?

I also think looking for another planet to populate is more arrogant insanity.

Humans seem to think we can do better than the "Laws of Nature". Our scientists seem bent on altering or making what exists better. There's no respect for nature in the sense that we need to LEAVE IT ALONE sometimes.

koan · Post by **koan** » Mon Mar 29, 2010 5:42 pm

The taboo aspect is the sense that if we were to try and "deal with" the problem, it would involve choosing who lives and dies. There is a genocidal connotation, imo.

We also, reasonably, experience intense grief when we lose someone close to us, so the thought of how many billions would have to be lost to solve the problem creates an emotional and moral dilemma.

G#Gill · Post by **G#Gill** » Mon Mar 29, 2010 6:03 pm

fuzzywuzzy;1300372 wrote: I just looked up the birth death figures of the world. Each site I went to had a different figure. But one thing I noticed was, they count births as resulting in future adulthood. But the majority of births around the world are in third world countries where the majority of babies don't reach the age of five.

Anyway this is interesting ....I'm not sure why but I was drawn to the count on road deaths and suicides to see if it changed whilst looking at it.:p

Worldometers - real time world statistics

Fascinating find, Fuzzy, and very thought provoking.

G#Gill · Post by **G#Gill** » Mon Mar 29, 2010 6:07 pm

koan;1300575 wrote: The taboo aspect is the sense that if we were to try and "deal with" the problem, it would involve choosing who lives and dies. There is a genocidal connotation, imo.

We also, reasonably, experience intense grief when we lose someone close to us, so the thought of how many billions would have to be lost to solve the problem creates an emotional and moral dilemma.

I believe that the first step to be taken is that of birth control, regardless of what religion people are. Common sense has to prevail.

Amythest · Post by **Amythest** » Mon Mar 29, 2010 6:30 pm

I'm actually on the fence about the whole "overpopulation" theory.

Why is it that most of the worlds poor live in areas with high resources? Are they getting the benefits or are the rich corps?

Some say that overpopulation is being sold to the world so the elite can carry out their plans to depopulate, using various means.

Here's one article that outlines this issue.

An Answer to Human Overpopulation ? Answer to Human Overpopulation Facts | Truth-It

koan · Post by **koan** » Mon Mar 29, 2010 6:33 pm

G#Gill;1300588 wrote: I believe that the first step to be taken is that of birth control, regardless of what religion people are. Common sense has to prevail.

China has made progress in that area but they force women to have abortions if they don't comply.

Lon · Post by **Lon** » Mon Mar 29, 2010 6:36 pm

Amythest;1300596 wrote: I'm actually on the fence about the whole "overpopulation" theory.

Why is it that most of the worlds poor live in areas with high resources? Are they getting the benefits or are the rich corps?

Some say that overpopulation is being sold to the world so the elite can carry out their plans to depopulate, using various means.

Here's one article that outlines this issue.

An Answer to Human Overpopulation ? Answer to Human Overpopulation Facts | Truth-It

Seems like you got a real distaste for Rich Corps.

koan · Post by **koan** » Tue Mar 30, 2010 12:13 am

Meant to attach this cartoon to the OP and just remembered :p

Attached files

G#Gill · Post by **G#Gill** » Tue Mar 30, 2010 3:08 am

koan;1300623 wrote: Meant to attach this cartoon to the OP and just remembered :p

Well that's one solution ! :sneaky:

AussiePam · Post by **AussiePam** » Tue Mar 30, 2010 5:15 am

Has anyone else read Anthony Burgess's "The Wanting Seed" - a fine (and completely horrible) dystopian tale which has overpopulation as its theme.

Breeding is considered shameful. Self sterilisation and homosexuality are encouraged. You receive a warm pat on the head if your child dies, and a monetary award to make any grief vanish.

There is a continual war going on from which no-one returns, but the participating governments somehow acquire a good supply of canned meat. But it's not enough. Crops are dying. Livestock are becoming infertile. Cannibalism increases..... Food for thought! :sneaky:

What happens?

I won't give away the ending.

FUBAR · Post by **FUBAR** » Tue Mar 30, 2010 5:26 am

So why is overpopulation a problem? Happens all the time in nature till a natural remedy comes along,we are just waiting for ours to show up. 99% of all the species that ever existed are now gone, eventually the same will happen to us. The planet will still orbit the sun and other species will come along as replacements of the ones now here. And there is the arguement that we are not overpopulated but misuse the resources we have. Used properly without the greed and profit motive showed by industry and government the planet can support many more than there are now. And if you think we will go on forever eventually this system we live in will be destroyed so spreading out to other stars is the only alternative. It is natures way----- expand or die...........:-6:-6

koan · Post by **koan** » Tue Mar 30, 2010 11:12 am

It's a problem for those who are nervous about leaving it up to nature to randomly eliminate the excess. Most societies would like to feel a sense of control over their own survival... whether or not that control is an illusion.

That sounds like a really cheeky novel, Pam

Elements of the film Delicatessen

AussiePam · Post by **AussiePam** » Tue Mar 30, 2010 1:13 pm

koan;1300711 wrote: It's a problem for those who are nervous about leaving it up to nature to randomly eliminate the excess. Most societies would like to feel a sense of control over their own survival... whether or not that control is an illusion.

That sounds like a really cheeky novel, Pam

Elements of the film Delicatessen

Now that's one bleak film, Koan!! Aside: the director re-uses the violin and saw duet in his latest film, Micmacs.

Margaret Atwood's Oryx and Krake and Year of the Flood also deal with overpopulation, and offer a more efficient culling of the human species. There's a third book in the series, not yet out, so I don't know if we get any kind of reprieve from total annihilation.