So of I point out israel is anti-islamic am I being anti-semitic?
If I suggest that israel is being true to their history and yet again ethnic cleansing the promised land (as god said they could - it's in the bible) so they can have it all for themselves am I being anti-semitic or raising the point that ethnic cleansing even if endorsed by biblical precedent and a belief in god is not acceptable in the 21st century.
I have no doubt that muslims will ethnically cleanse areas where they take over as indeed they are in iraq am i islamophobic for saying I disagree with that action?
He might perhaps have found a better way to make people talk about this but it is not just islam that has religious fundamentalists israel does as well and they are the ones driving israeli policy - it was an israeli that killed the leader that looked set to make peace with the palestinians - they want war just as much as islamic fundamentalists do tragedy is we are all getting sucked in.
If I point out that religious revival in the UK is not something to be welcomed am I paranoid or right?
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Oscar Namechange
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gmc;1462049 wrote: So of I point out israel is anti-islamic am I being anti-semitic?
If I suggest that israel is being true to their history and yet again ethnic cleansing the promised land (as god said they could - it's in the bible) so they can have it all for themselves am I being anti-semitic or raising the point that ethnic cleansing even if endorsed by biblical precedent and a belief in god is not acceptable in the 21st century.
I have no doubt that muslims will ethnically cleanse areas where they take over as indeed they are in iraq am i islamophobic for saying I disagree with that action?
He might perhaps have found a better way to make people talk about this but it is not just islam that has religious fundamentalists israel does as well and they are the ones driving israeli policy - it was an israeli that killed the leader that looked set to make peace with the palestinians - they want war just as much as islamic fundamentalists do tragedy is we are all getting sucked in.
If I point out that religious revival in the UK is not something to be welcomed am I paranoid or right?
You're Invariably right Auld Yin...
Have you seen who's raised from the dead today to have his say?
Paddy ( pass me the bottle ) Ashdown..... he wants us to arm the Kurds.
If I suggest that israel is being true to their history and yet again ethnic cleansing the promised land (as god said they could - it's in the bible) so they can have it all for themselves am I being anti-semitic or raising the point that ethnic cleansing even if endorsed by biblical precedent and a belief in god is not acceptable in the 21st century.
I have no doubt that muslims will ethnically cleanse areas where they take over as indeed they are in iraq am i islamophobic for saying I disagree with that action?
He might perhaps have found a better way to make people talk about this but it is not just islam that has religious fundamentalists israel does as well and they are the ones driving israeli policy - it was an israeli that killed the leader that looked set to make peace with the palestinians - they want war just as much as islamic fundamentalists do tragedy is we are all getting sucked in.
If I point out that religious revival in the UK is not something to be welcomed am I paranoid or right?
You're Invariably right Auld Yin...
Have you seen who's raised from the dead today to have his say?
Paddy ( pass me the bottle ) Ashdown..... he wants us to arm the Kurds.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Baroness Warsi quits
Oscar Namechange;1462054 wrote: You're Invariably right Auld Yin...
Have you seen who's raised from the dead today to have his say?
Paddy ( pass me the bottle ) Ashdown..... he wants us to arm the Kurds.
Actually I think we should but I don't think sending in troops is a good idea. The turks have a powerful military so do saudi arabia and egypt about time they sent in troops since they are going to have to live with the consequences if isis are successful. Might be a good idea to stop arming the insurgents fighting assad as well. Realisticlly othr than terrorist attacks isis is not likely to be military threat to europe what's happening in Ukraine is a bit more serious we might need our troops closer to home.
Have you seen who's raised from the dead today to have his say?
Paddy ( pass me the bottle ) Ashdown..... he wants us to arm the Kurds.
Actually I think we should but I don't think sending in troops is a good idea. The turks have a powerful military so do saudi arabia and egypt about time they sent in troops since they are going to have to live with the consequences if isis are successful. Might be a good idea to stop arming the insurgents fighting assad as well. Realisticlly othr than terrorist attacks isis is not likely to be military threat to europe what's happening in Ukraine is a bit more serious we might need our troops closer to home.
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I don't think we should arm anyone, regardless of the conflict. Haven't we learnt yet that if we choose to arm one side, then Russia & Saudi will arm the other? In the end, the only purpose it serves is for a major chunk thrown away out of our own finances in order to interfere with the issues of someone else.
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Oscar Namechange
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gmc;1462074 wrote: Actually I think we should but I don't think sending in troops is a good idea. The turks have a powerful military so do saudi arabia and egypt about time they sent in troops since they are going to have to live with the consequences if isis are successful. Might be a good idea to stop arming the insurgents fighting assad as well. Realisticlly othr than terrorist attacks isis is not likely to be military threat to europe what's happening in Ukraine is a bit more serious we might need our troops closer to home. I'm against sending In ground forces also. Yet, I actually agree with Ashdown that the Kurds and Yazidis should be given every opportunity to defend themselves or even to use arms If needed to reclaim their kidnapped women and children should they want to risk It.
I think the way to go Is airstrikes on ISIS convoys.
Posted by gmc
'we might need our troops closer to home'
So you are stating that Griffin was right all along when he called for all British troops to be removed from foreign wars? :sneaky::sneaky::sneaky::wah:
I think the way to go Is airstrikes on ISIS convoys.
Posted by gmc
'we might need our troops closer to home'
So you are stating that Griffin was right all along when he called for all British troops to be removed from foreign wars? :sneaky::sneaky::sneaky::wah:
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Baroness Warsi quits
Oscar Namechange;1462185 wrote: So you are stating that Griffin was right all along when he called for all British troops to be removed from foreign wars? :sneaky::sneaky::sneaky::wah:
I'd agree with the action, but I very much doubt if our motives are anywhere near the same.
I'd agree with the action, but I very much doubt if our motives are anywhere near the same.
Baroness Warsi quits
So you are stating that Griffin was right all along when he called for all British troops to be removed from foreign wars?
I think we should top deludiong ourselves we can afford to act as a superpower. We're almost bankrupt they're now talking about spending money on a replacement for trident. we are buiding carriers we can't afford the planes for the army chiefs are saying bluntly we dont have the troopps any more for all the deployments cameron wants to make. There are actually penty of middles eastern countries with large well equipped military let them do their own fighting and a resurgent russia is potentially a more serious problem.
I think we should top deludiong ourselves we can afford to act as a superpower. We're almost bankrupt they're now talking about spending money on a replacement for trident. we are buiding carriers we can't afford the planes for the army chiefs are saying bluntly we dont have the troopps any more for all the deployments cameron wants to make. There are actually penty of middles eastern countries with large well equipped military let them do their own fighting and a resurgent russia is potentially a more serious problem.
Baroness Warsi quits
gmc;1462234 wrote: There are actually penty of middles eastern countries with large well equipped military let them do their own fighting and a resurgent russia is potentially a more serious problem.
I wouldn't be surprised if this is nearer to the truth than many people might want to think. Wouldn't it make more sense for Russia to be the real instigators of the problems in the Middle East, thus getting the West to put all their resources into it, while leaving Russia to quietly rebuild the Soviet Union.
All the talk of CIA involvement to cause the fighting etc. is typical Conspiracy Theorist malarchy when you ask what they would really have to gain. But Russia has plenty to gain by creating a diversion.
I wouldn't be surprised if this is nearer to the truth than many people might want to think. Wouldn't it make more sense for Russia to be the real instigators of the problems in the Middle East, thus getting the West to put all their resources into it, while leaving Russia to quietly rebuild the Soviet Union.
All the talk of CIA involvement to cause the fighting etc. is typical Conspiracy Theorist malarchy when you ask what they would really have to gain. But Russia has plenty to gain by creating a diversion.
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Oscar Namechange
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I predict Russia will have It's own problems with Islamic fanatics.
A 2nd Muslim Imam has just been assassinated In Russia.
A 2nd Muslim Imam has just been assassinated In Russia.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Baroness Warsi quits
Oscar Namechange;1462253 wrote: I predict Russia will have It's own problems with Islamic fanatics.
A 2nd Muslim Imam has just been assassinated In Russia.
Well they already do. Its called Chechnya
A 2nd Muslim Imam has just been assassinated In Russia.
Well they already do. Its called Chechnya
"He has all the virtues I dislike and none of the vices I admire."
Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill
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Oscar Namechange
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Snowfire;1462263 wrote: Well they already do. Its called Chechnya I am very aware of that but thank you for thinking of me and pointing It out just In case I didn't.... :rolleyes::(
I'm talking about this weeks events. It could escalate the situation rapidly.
Deputy Muslim Leader of North Ossetia Shot to Death | News | The Moscow Times
I'm talking about this weeks events. It could escalate the situation rapidly.
Deputy Muslim Leader of North Ossetia Shot to Death | News | The Moscow Times
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Baroness Warsi quits
FourPart;1462236 wrote: I wouldn't be surprised if this is nearer to the truth than many people might want to think. Wouldn't it make more sense for Russia to be the real instigators of the problems in the Middle East, thus getting the West to put all their resources into it, while leaving Russia to quietly rebuild the Soviet Union.
All the talk of CIA involvement to cause the fighting etc. is typical Conspiracy Theorist malarchy when you ask what they would really have to gain. But Russia has plenty to gain by creating a diversion.
I think russia is taking advantage rather than creating anything. They hav serious problems with muslims on their back door. Remember afghanistan? They actually warned the west about islamic fundalism in the eighties.
It was the west not russia that toppled democratic regimes in iraq, iran and tried to do so in eygpt and replaced them with regimes favourable to our oil interests. Russia baked up those statswhich defied the west
IMO this all stems from saudi arabia it's a classic tactic for an absolutists ruler, squash political dissent but you do need an outlet religion is a handy substitute but you do need to control it, They niow have a problem witn the islamic state, what if their leaders declare the saudis are an illegitimate ruler and call for them to b overthrown? Who will the sunni muslims see as the real rulers? If they send in tops it's muslim against muslim. Iran could send troop since shia and unni are already at each others throats but then you would have full scale religious warfare in the middle east.
This is not a big surprise. You might find this of interest note the date
August 27, 1992
The "Green Peril": Creating the Islamic Fundamentalist Threat
With Westernized opposition silenced, the only viable opposition to the royal family tends to be found in religious elements who enjoy relative autonomy in the Saudi system and focus on the discrepancy between the Saudi regime's Islamic pretensions and its ties with America. The numbers of fundamentalists in Saudi Arabia have grown considerably since the Persian Gulf crisis and, according to one observer, "are now estimated to include tens of thousands of younger radical religious leaders, Islamic university teachers and students."(33) Those leaders criticized the arrival of the American troops during the Gulf War and have attacked Saudi support for the Arab-Israeli peace process as well as the political and personal conduct of the Saudi leadership.
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Washington should, therefore, not be surprised if, as the provider of the main mercenary forces for the Saudi regime and its interests in the region, it ends up being the focus of hostility for the opposition groups in Saudi Arabia and the Arab gulf states.
Anyone who thinks this is simple --- well what can you say
All the talk of CIA involvement to cause the fighting etc. is typical Conspiracy Theorist malarchy when you ask what they would really have to gain. But Russia has plenty to gain by creating a diversion.
I think russia is taking advantage rather than creating anything. They hav serious problems with muslims on their back door. Remember afghanistan? They actually warned the west about islamic fundalism in the eighties.
It was the west not russia that toppled democratic regimes in iraq, iran and tried to do so in eygpt and replaced them with regimes favourable to our oil interests. Russia baked up those statswhich defied the west
IMO this all stems from saudi arabia it's a classic tactic for an absolutists ruler, squash political dissent but you do need an outlet religion is a handy substitute but you do need to control it, They niow have a problem witn the islamic state, what if their leaders declare the saudis are an illegitimate ruler and call for them to b overthrown? Who will the sunni muslims see as the real rulers? If they send in tops it's muslim against muslim. Iran could send troop since shia and unni are already at each others throats but then you would have full scale religious warfare in the middle east.
This is not a big surprise. You might find this of interest note the date
August 27, 1992
The "Green Peril": Creating the Islamic Fundamentalist Threat
With Westernized opposition silenced, the only viable opposition to the royal family tends to be found in religious elements who enjoy relative autonomy in the Saudi system and focus on the discrepancy between the Saudi regime's Islamic pretensions and its ties with America. The numbers of fundamentalists in Saudi Arabia have grown considerably since the Persian Gulf crisis and, according to one observer, "are now estimated to include tens of thousands of younger radical religious leaders, Islamic university teachers and students."(33) Those leaders criticized the arrival of the American troops during the Gulf War and have attacked Saudi support for the Arab-Israeli peace process as well as the political and personal conduct of the Saudi leadership.
-------
Washington should, therefore, not be surprised if, as the provider of the main mercenary forces for the Saudi regime and its interests in the region, it ends up being the focus of hostility for the opposition groups in Saudi Arabia and the Arab gulf states.
Anyone who thinks this is simple --- well what can you say
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Oscar Namechange
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:guitarist:guitarist:driving::driving::driving:
George Galloway interviewed by police over Bradford 'Israel-free zone' speech | Politics | The Guardian
George Galloway interviewed by police over Bradford 'Israel-free zone' speech | Politics | The Guardian
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
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Oscar Namechange;1461944 wrote: Oh come off It !!!!
For one, exactly how long do you think It would have been before Nick Griffin was arrested had he said the same In our two tier police state
.
About twelve months wasn't it ?
Mr Griffin and Mr Collett were charged in April 2005 after the BBC showed a secretly-filmed documentary The Secret Agent in 2004.
Oscar Namechange;1462403 wrote:
George Galloway interviewed by police over Bradford 'Israel-free zone' speech | Politics | The Guardian
Poor old George.......getting fast tracked?
For one, exactly how long do you think It would have been before Nick Griffin was arrested had he said the same In our two tier police state
.
About twelve months wasn't it ?
Mr Griffin and Mr Collett were charged in April 2005 after the BBC showed a secretly-filmed documentary The Secret Agent in 2004.
Oscar Namechange;1462403 wrote:
George Galloway interviewed by police over Bradford 'Israel-free zone' speech | Politics | The Guardian
Poor old George.......getting fast tracked?
I thought I knew more than this until I opened my mouth
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Peter Lake
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Bruv;1462406 wrote: About twelve months wasn't it ?
Mr Griffin and Mr Collett were charged in April 2005 after the BBC showed a secretly-filmed documentary The Secret Agent in 2004.
Poor old George.......getting fast tracked?
What's your point here? Griffin and Collett were both found not guilty and were vindicated. Mr Galloway has yet to be charged, even a decision from the crown prosecution service has not been made yet and it's a far cry from guilty as charged.
The power of petitions. An e mail sent to us today.
Manchester
19 Aug 2014 — Last week a spokesman for Galloway stated to the Bradford Telegraph and Argus that - "It's a complete and utter nonsense that people have done an online petition. These people should have more to do with their time. The police have not been in touch with us."
This afternoon I received an email from the Senior Crown Prosecutor's Office acknowledging receipt of the petition correspondence, assuring me that Galloway is indeed under investigation and all emails had been passed to the appropriate prosecutor.
News just in that Galloway has been interviewed by the police.
Can I just say to everyone that signed, all 18,627 of you - thank you. You're amazing. Pour yourself a drink and hug the person next to you. Today, I'm proud to know you. You started to make difference.
Mr Griffin and Mr Collett were charged in April 2005 after the BBC showed a secretly-filmed documentary The Secret Agent in 2004.
Poor old George.......getting fast tracked?
What's your point here? Griffin and Collett were both found not guilty and were vindicated. Mr Galloway has yet to be charged, even a decision from the crown prosecution service has not been made yet and it's a far cry from guilty as charged.
The power of petitions. An e mail sent to us today.
Manchester
19 Aug 2014 — Last week a spokesman for Galloway stated to the Bradford Telegraph and Argus that - "It's a complete and utter nonsense that people have done an online petition. These people should have more to do with their time. The police have not been in touch with us."
This afternoon I received an email from the Senior Crown Prosecutor's Office acknowledging receipt of the petition correspondence, assuring me that Galloway is indeed under investigation and all emails had been passed to the appropriate prosecutor.
News just in that Galloway has been interviewed by the police.
Can I just say to everyone that signed, all 18,627 of you - thank you. You're amazing. Pour yourself a drink and hug the person next to you. Today, I'm proud to know you. You started to make difference.
Baroness Warsi quits
I found interesting in the article that the person who made the complaint was a Muslim leader.
On a slightly different tack, I found this item interesting as well. Perhaps there's hope for us yet...
BBC News - Berlin House of One: The first church-mosque-synagogue?
On a slightly different tack, I found this item interesting as well. Perhaps there's hope for us yet...
BBC News - Berlin House of One: The first church-mosque-synagogue?
Baroness Warsi quits
What's your point here? Griffin and Collett were both found not guilty and were vindicated. Mr Galloway has yet to be charged, even a decision from the crown prosecution service has not been made yet and it's a far cry from guilty as charged
It was Oscar that managed to shoehorn Galloway and and Griffin into a thread about the resignation of Baroness Warsi.......not me.
I was merely responding to the old nationalist stance that 'everybody' is picking on them.
Oscar asked, had it been Griffin rather than Galloway that spoke out.....(The Bradford Jewish carry on) "How long do you think it would it take for him to be arrested ?"
It took over a year before the BBC aired the speech and charges were brought against Griffin and Collet so I 'told it how it was'.
So my comment that Galloway was fast tracked stands..........whatever method was used to bring about the police interest.
And yes they were found "Not guilty" but Vindicated ? Not by anybody that heard the language used.
The talk went along the lines that "They" get given houses for a start their rent their rates, everything paid for, they get 4 grand cheques to go out and buy a car. Isn't it unacceptable to make these people use buses?..............rather than making them struggle on buses or a taxi we'll give them a car.
He goes on to say he doesn't hate them "these people are cockroaches and they are doing what cockroaches do" but they can't help doing it because thats what they do, like cats miaow and dogs bark
For anybody interested in hearing it HERE
It was Oscar that managed to shoehorn Galloway and and Griffin into a thread about the resignation of Baroness Warsi.......not me.
I was merely responding to the old nationalist stance that 'everybody' is picking on them.
Oscar asked, had it been Griffin rather than Galloway that spoke out.....(The Bradford Jewish carry on) "How long do you think it would it take for him to be arrested ?"
It took over a year before the BBC aired the speech and charges were brought against Griffin and Collet so I 'told it how it was'.
So my comment that Galloway was fast tracked stands..........whatever method was used to bring about the police interest.
And yes they were found "Not guilty" but Vindicated ? Not by anybody that heard the language used.
The talk went along the lines that "They" get given houses for a start their rent their rates, everything paid for, they get 4 grand cheques to go out and buy a car. Isn't it unacceptable to make these people use buses?..............rather than making them struggle on buses or a taxi we'll give them a car.
He goes on to say he doesn't hate them "these people are cockroaches and they are doing what cockroaches do" but they can't help doing it because thats what they do, like cats miaow and dogs bark
For anybody interested in hearing it HERE
I thought I knew more than this until I opened my mouth
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Peter Lake
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Baroness Warsi quits
Bruv;1462421 wrote: It was Oscar that managed to shoehorn Galloway and and Griffin into a thread about the resignation of Baroness Warsi.......not me.
I was merely responding to the old nationalist stance that 'everybody' is picking on them.
Oscar asked, had it been Griffin rather than Galloway that spoke out.....(The Bradford Jewish carry on) "How long do you think it would it take for him to be arrested ?"
It took over a year before the BBC aired the speech and charges were brought against Griffin and Collet so I 'told it how it was'.
So my comment that Galloway was fast tracked stands..........whatever method was used to bring about the police interest.
And yes they were found "Not guilty" but Vindicated ? Not by anybody that heard the language used.
The talk went along the lines that "They" get given
For anybody interested in hearing it HERE
Which in a nutshell endorses all Oscar said in her post regarding the party and how the party continue's to evolve with new, younger key figure's wanting change. However odious Mr Griffin can be, it's worlds apart from declaring a national city an Israel free zone, dictating that Israeli tourists and goods are not welcome and instilling fear into Britain's Israeli's. Griffin was cleared as his words were opinion and Galloway's words were a veiled threat.
veiled threat definition | English dictionary for learners | Reverso
There is history and current events around the world of tensions between muslims and jews. Galloway is in possession of a palestinian passport given to him by hamas and he chose Bradford with a high percentage of muslims to do his shouting. It's quite clear what the intention was, to stir up racial hatred between British jews and muslims.
BBC NEWS | Middle East | UK MP given Palestinian passport
Complaints came in regarding Galloway from all sectors of the British public and was not a nationalism driven campaign. As i understand it, once police receive a certain amount of formal complaints, they are duty bound to investigate where as Griffin's case was police driven only.
I was merely responding to the old nationalist stance that 'everybody' is picking on them.
Oscar asked, had it been Griffin rather than Galloway that spoke out.....(The Bradford Jewish carry on) "How long do you think it would it take for him to be arrested ?"
It took over a year before the BBC aired the speech and charges were brought against Griffin and Collet so I 'told it how it was'.
So my comment that Galloway was fast tracked stands..........whatever method was used to bring about the police interest.
And yes they were found "Not guilty" but Vindicated ? Not by anybody that heard the language used.
The talk went along the lines that "They" get given
For anybody interested in hearing it HERE
Which in a nutshell endorses all Oscar said in her post regarding the party and how the party continue's to evolve with new, younger key figure's wanting change. However odious Mr Griffin can be, it's worlds apart from declaring a national city an Israel free zone, dictating that Israeli tourists and goods are not welcome and instilling fear into Britain's Israeli's. Griffin was cleared as his words were opinion and Galloway's words were a veiled threat.
veiled threat definition | English dictionary for learners | Reverso
There is history and current events around the world of tensions between muslims and jews. Galloway is in possession of a palestinian passport given to him by hamas and he chose Bradford with a high percentage of muslims to do his shouting. It's quite clear what the intention was, to stir up racial hatred between British jews and muslims.
BBC NEWS | Middle East | UK MP given Palestinian passport
Complaints came in regarding Galloway from all sectors of the British public and was not a nationalism driven campaign. As i understand it, once police receive a certain amount of formal complaints, they are duty bound to investigate where as Griffin's case was police driven only.
Baroness Warsi quits
If Oscar wants speech writing help, you are the kiddy.
The original point, that was adroitly avoided or evaded or totally ignored,by both of you, is that everybody really gets treated the same in this country, by the Law and by the local authorities when issuing housing and by whoever gives out "4 grand cheques for a car"
The BNP in their newly enlightened form still believe "They" are getting something "We" are not
The exact words from Mr Collet about immigrants being "these people are cockroaches and they are doing what cockroaches do"
The original point, that was adroitly avoided or evaded or totally ignored,by both of you, is that everybody really gets treated the same in this country, by the Law and by the local authorities when issuing housing and by whoever gives out "4 grand cheques for a car"
The BNP in their newly enlightened form still believe "They" are getting something "We" are not
The exact words from Mr Collet about immigrants being "these people are cockroaches and they are doing what cockroaches do"
I thought I knew more than this until I opened my mouth
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Oscar Namechange
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Baroness Warsi quits
Bruv;1462431 wrote: If Oscar wants speech writing help, you are the kiddy.
The original point, that was adroitly avoided or evaded or totally ignored,by both of you, is that everybody really gets treated the same in this country, by the Law and by the local authorities when issuing housing and by whoever gives out "4 grand cheques for a car"
The BNP in their newly enlightened form still believe "They" are getting something "We" are not
The exact words from Mr Collet about immigrants being "these people are cockroaches and they are doing what cockroaches do" Do try to keep up.
Mark Collett has not been In the BNP for the past 4 years... he was a casualty of one of Griffin's purges and has no Influence over today's party what so ever....
In fact....
He allegedly plotted to have Nick Griffin killed.
BNP official Mark Collett questioned over alleged threat to kill Nick Griffin | Politics | theguardian.com
The original point, that was adroitly avoided or evaded or totally ignored,by both of you, is that everybody really gets treated the same in this country, by the Law and by the local authorities when issuing housing and by whoever gives out "4 grand cheques for a car"
The BNP in their newly enlightened form still believe "They" are getting something "We" are not
The exact words from Mr Collet about immigrants being "these people are cockroaches and they are doing what cockroaches do" Do try to keep up.
Mark Collett has not been In the BNP for the past 4 years... he was a casualty of one of Griffin's purges and has no Influence over today's party what so ever....
In fact....
He allegedly plotted to have Nick Griffin killed.
BNP official Mark Collett questioned over alleged threat to kill Nick Griffin | Politics | theguardian.com
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Baroness Warsi quits
Personally I find the whole thing about the BNP repulsive. No matter what you may say I don't really see any difference between them & the NF. I am totally Labour. However, just because I am a Labour supporter doesn't stop me from accepting that each of the other parties - yes even the BNP have some valid points, and there are some in the Labour Manifesto that I disagree with. It's never going to be a case of everything being just so. I imagine even the most devout supporter of the BNP is opposed to some of their policies (at least I hope so).
The main problem I see with the BNP is that it is echoing the rise of Nazi Germany inasmuch as the methodical rousing of hatred amongst certain minority groups is concerned. Although, as we all know, these were primarily Jews, there were other targeted groups such as Jehovahs Witnesses, Homosexuals & Communists - each of which have also been slated by the BNP.
I regret to say that we even had the local rep & candidate of the Southampton BNP as a member of our choir, and he was so extremist that I wanted to punch his lights out whenever I saw him. I suppose his views regarding race weren't that surprising seeing as he had been raised in South Africa, but as well as his spreading racial hatred, he was also vehemently in favour of Public Execution for ALL crimes as an ultimate deterrent.
When you get people like that standing for Government, can a party really have any credibility? Personally I find the Monster Raving Loony Party far more plausible.
The main problem I see with the BNP is that it is echoing the rise of Nazi Germany inasmuch as the methodical rousing of hatred amongst certain minority groups is concerned. Although, as we all know, these were primarily Jews, there were other targeted groups such as Jehovahs Witnesses, Homosexuals & Communists - each of which have also been slated by the BNP.
I regret to say that we even had the local rep & candidate of the Southampton BNP as a member of our choir, and he was so extremist that I wanted to punch his lights out whenever I saw him. I suppose his views regarding race weren't that surprising seeing as he had been raised in South Africa, but as well as his spreading racial hatred, he was also vehemently in favour of Public Execution for ALL crimes as an ultimate deterrent.
When you get people like that standing for Government, can a party really have any credibility? Personally I find the Monster Raving Loony Party far more plausible.
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Oscar Namechange
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Baroness Warsi quits
FourPart;1462447 wrote: Personally I find the whole thing about the BNP repulsive. No matter what you may say I don't really see any difference between them & the NF. I am totally Labour. However, just because I am a Labour supporter doesn't stop me from accepting that each of the other parties - yes even the BNP have some valid points, and there are some in the Labour Manifesto that I disagree with. It's never going to be a case of everything being just so. I imagine even the most devout supporter of the BNP is opposed to some of their policies (at least I hope so).
The main problem I see with the BNP is that it is echoing the rise of Nazi Germany inasmuch as the methodical rousing of hatred amongst certain minority groups is concerned. Although, as we all know, these were primarily Jews, there were other targeted groups such as Jehovahs Witnesses, Homosexuals & Communists - each of which have also been slated by the BNP.
I regret to say that we even had the local rep & candidate of the Southampton BNP as a member of our choir, and he was so extremist that I wanted to punch his lights out whenever I saw him. I suppose his views regarding race weren't that surprising seeing as he had been raised in South Africa, but as well as his spreading racial hatred, he was also vehemently in favour of Public Execution for ALL crimes as an ultimate deterrent.
When you get people like that standing for Government, can a party really have any credibility? Personally I find the Monster Raving Loony Party far more plausible.
MP’s - Is Any Child Safe? Check this list out. * Updated * | No 2 Abuse
Now, by this list, would you state that every member of the Labour Party and the Tory Party are pedophiles?
Of course you wouldn't and neither would I. Such a claim would be libellous and ridiculous.... by the same token, you brand another Party based on one nut job that you met In Southampton.
It cuts both ways.
The main problem I see with the BNP is that it is echoing the rise of Nazi Germany inasmuch as the methodical rousing of hatred amongst certain minority groups is concerned. Although, as we all know, these were primarily Jews, there were other targeted groups such as Jehovahs Witnesses, Homosexuals & Communists - each of which have also been slated by the BNP.
I regret to say that we even had the local rep & candidate of the Southampton BNP as a member of our choir, and he was so extremist that I wanted to punch his lights out whenever I saw him. I suppose his views regarding race weren't that surprising seeing as he had been raised in South Africa, but as well as his spreading racial hatred, he was also vehemently in favour of Public Execution for ALL crimes as an ultimate deterrent.
When you get people like that standing for Government, can a party really have any credibility? Personally I find the Monster Raving Loony Party far more plausible.
MP’s - Is Any Child Safe? Check this list out. * Updated * | No 2 Abuse
Now, by this list, would you state that every member of the Labour Party and the Tory Party are pedophiles?
Of course you wouldn't and neither would I. Such a claim would be libellous and ridiculous.... by the same token, you brand another Party based on one nut job that you met In Southampton.
It cuts both ways.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Baroness Warsi quits
I said that I accept that all the parties have their good & bad points, but it's a matter of weighing each against the other.
I have very strong reservations about any party that puts nutjobs like him up as candidates or even more a matter of concern, those that would seek to maintain an extremist such as Griffin as the figurehead of the party. Everywhere he goes there's thuggery.
You cannot deny, though, that if the question "Which UK Political Party has a primary mandate of racial hatred & ethnic cleansing" were to come up on a TV Quiz Show, there's not many that would need to "Phone a Friend". Just as with the football hooliganism of the 70s & 80s (and perhaps into the 90s) problem clubs attracted more like-minded 'supporters'. The reputation it has built attracts even more like minded thugs to the mob mentality. It's a case of "If the cap fits".
When Muslims start preaching Racial Hatred in their Mosques & Community Centres they, quite rightly, get clamped down on for spreading Racial Hatred, yet the BNP makes it their official policy.
As I've said elsewhere in these forums, no-one can force you what to think, nor should they, but to preach it in order to rouse trouble is a different matter altogether.
I have very strong reservations about any party that puts nutjobs like him up as candidates or even more a matter of concern, those that would seek to maintain an extremist such as Griffin as the figurehead of the party. Everywhere he goes there's thuggery.
You cannot deny, though, that if the question "Which UK Political Party has a primary mandate of racial hatred & ethnic cleansing" were to come up on a TV Quiz Show, there's not many that would need to "Phone a Friend". Just as with the football hooliganism of the 70s & 80s (and perhaps into the 90s) problem clubs attracted more like-minded 'supporters'. The reputation it has built attracts even more like minded thugs to the mob mentality. It's a case of "If the cap fits".
When Muslims start preaching Racial Hatred in their Mosques & Community Centres they, quite rightly, get clamped down on for spreading Racial Hatred, yet the BNP makes it their official policy.
As I've said elsewhere in these forums, no-one can force you what to think, nor should they, but to preach it in order to rouse trouble is a different matter altogether.
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Peter Lake
- Posts: 1031
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Baroness Warsi quits
FourPart;1462454 wrote: I said that I accept that all the parties have their good & bad points, but it's a matter of weighing each against the other.
I have very strong reservations about any party that puts nutjobs like him up as candidates or even more a matter of concern, those that would seek to maintain an extremist such as Griffin as the figurehead of the party. Everywhere he goes there's thuggery.
You cannot deny, though, that if the question "Which UK Political Party has a primary mandate of racial hatred & ethnic cleansing" were to come up on a TV Quiz Show, there's not many that would need to "Phone a Friend". Just as with the football hooliganism of the 70s & 80s (and perhaps into the 90s) problem clubs attracted more like-minded 'supporters'. The reputation it has built attracts even more like minded thugs to the mob mentality. It's a case of "If the cap fits".
When Muslims start preaching Racial Hatred in their Mosques & Community Centres they, quite rightly, get clamped down on for spreading Racial Hatred, yet the BNP makes it their official policy.
As I've said elsewhere in these forums, no-one can force you what to think, nor should they, but to preach it in order to rouse trouble is a different matter altogether.
Ethnic cleansing ????
Preach ????
Where????
You're not confusing the BNP with the EDL are you?
The EDL were formed originally as a street protest party to support British troops and hold street demonstrations.
You will find historically, most arrests at any BNP march are In the main UAF
Police arrest 58 'anti-fascist' supporters at BNP Westminster march | Metro News
On that day, 58 arrests... all UAF, a group found by Labour's Dianne Abbot.
Now... how do you know for sure that when Mosques preach racial hatred they get clamped down on ?
Trust me, I only wish they were.
Revealed: preachers' messages of hate | Media | The Observer
I have very strong reservations about any party that puts nutjobs like him up as candidates or even more a matter of concern, those that would seek to maintain an extremist such as Griffin as the figurehead of the party. Everywhere he goes there's thuggery.
You cannot deny, though, that if the question "Which UK Political Party has a primary mandate of racial hatred & ethnic cleansing" were to come up on a TV Quiz Show, there's not many that would need to "Phone a Friend". Just as with the football hooliganism of the 70s & 80s (and perhaps into the 90s) problem clubs attracted more like-minded 'supporters'. The reputation it has built attracts even more like minded thugs to the mob mentality. It's a case of "If the cap fits".
When Muslims start preaching Racial Hatred in their Mosques & Community Centres they, quite rightly, get clamped down on for spreading Racial Hatred, yet the BNP makes it their official policy.
As I've said elsewhere in these forums, no-one can force you what to think, nor should they, but to preach it in order to rouse trouble is a different matter altogether.
Ethnic cleansing ????
Preach ????
Where????
You're not confusing the BNP with the EDL are you?
The EDL were formed originally as a street protest party to support British troops and hold street demonstrations.
You will find historically, most arrests at any BNP march are In the main UAF
Police arrest 58 'anti-fascist' supporters at BNP Westminster march | Metro News
On that day, 58 arrests... all UAF, a group found by Labour's Dianne Abbot.
Now... how do you know for sure that when Mosques preach racial hatred they get clamped down on ?
Trust me, I only wish they were.
Revealed: preachers' messages of hate | Media | The Observer
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Peter Lake
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That was Oscar's post by the way... err me... for some reason sharing this lap top, I have posted In Peter's name...
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Oscar Namechange
- Posts: 31842
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Baroness Warsi quits
That's better... he went to bed leaving the FG page running and I posted In It. Derrrr. time for bed for me also... Nighty night
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Baroness Warsi quits
Actually it's not just muslims that preach hatred we have christian organisations actively campaigning against homosexuality and any attmpts to teach children to be tolerant of others yet they left aone to do so. I'm ambivalent on the subject but now have homosexual friends and acquaintances and as an adult understand where the prejudice came from live and let live. Most paedophiles are not homosexual. We have religious organistions that actively discriminate against women and campaign to have their right to choose when and if they have children and do their best to prevent access to the kind of information about sexual health that should be part and parcel of everyday life yet they get away with it because those who criticise them ae accused of being anti-religous and rather a discussion about what is best it devolves down to (and I praphrase) you have no right to criticise someone's beliefs or impose yours on other even although that is what I am doing to you.
There are many fundamentalist christians that given half a chance would give islamic ones a run for their money. They certainly did in the past.
Attacks and abuse towards disabled people have gone up thanks to tory (and daily mail) campaigns against those few who play the system people who live in council houses are pilloried as welfare scroungers and wastrels even although the reality is very different. It's subtle but it incucates an atitude of at best disdain.
People mock "liberal" attitudes of tolerance and understanding and lament the lowering of moral standards with single parents no longer being pilloried or openly condemned by society or god forbid same sex couples walking the streets quite openly or that people can get divorced if things don't work out or the spouse turns out to be a violent nutter. Quite frankly I don't like the world they want to live in.
There are many fundamentalist christians that given half a chance would give islamic ones a run for their money. They certainly did in the past.
Attacks and abuse towards disabled people have gone up thanks to tory (and daily mail) campaigns against those few who play the system people who live in council houses are pilloried as welfare scroungers and wastrels even although the reality is very different. It's subtle but it incucates an atitude of at best disdain.
People mock "liberal" attitudes of tolerance and understanding and lament the lowering of moral standards with single parents no longer being pilloried or openly condemned by society or god forbid same sex couples walking the streets quite openly or that people can get divorced if things don't work out or the spouse turns out to be a violent nutter. Quite frankly I don't like the world they want to live in.
Baroness Warsi quits
Oscar Namechange;1462445 wrote: Do try to keep up.
Mark Collett has not been In the BNP for the past 4 years... he was a casualty of one of Griffin's purges and has no Influence over today's party what so ever....
In fact....
My bad, abandoned another 'Bad boy' have they?
More diversionary tactics......but it doesn't really matter, not in the long term.
It is all part of the plan, (that you are a part of as far as I am concerned) to change the tactics but not the aim of the party.
Transcript of Panorama "UNDER THE SKIN" BBC TV
Read it HERE It's old but he sets out the long term plan.
Griffin's words
There's a difference between selling out your ideas and selling your ideas,
and the British National Party isn't about selling out its ideas, which are your ideas too, but we are determined now to sell them, and that means basically to use the saleable words, as I say, freedom, security, identity, democracy. Nobody can criticise them. Nobody can come at you and attack you on those ideas.
They are saleable.
Griffin again
We haven't given up on our principle that mono racial countries.. mono ethnic countries are more stable, it's far easier to preserve human rights and freedom within those whereas multiracial societies always end up
going down the road of tyranny.
Guide for Journalists Reporting the BNP
HERE
Example "Drop them out of a plane somewhere over Africa. I really don’t care."
And a video meeting up with David Duke (Former KKK Wizard....and all round nice guy)
HERE
Mark Collett has not been In the BNP for the past 4 years... he was a casualty of one of Griffin's purges and has no Influence over today's party what so ever....
In fact....
My bad, abandoned another 'Bad boy' have they?
More diversionary tactics......but it doesn't really matter, not in the long term.
It is all part of the plan, (that you are a part of as far as I am concerned) to change the tactics but not the aim of the party.
Transcript of Panorama "UNDER THE SKIN" BBC TV
Read it HERE It's old but he sets out the long term plan.
Griffin's words
There's a difference between selling out your ideas and selling your ideas,
and the British National Party isn't about selling out its ideas, which are your ideas too, but we are determined now to sell them, and that means basically to use the saleable words, as I say, freedom, security, identity, democracy. Nobody can criticise them. Nobody can come at you and attack you on those ideas.
They are saleable.
Griffin again
We haven't given up on our principle that mono racial countries.. mono ethnic countries are more stable, it's far easier to preserve human rights and freedom within those whereas multiracial societies always end up
going down the road of tyranny.
Guide for Journalists Reporting the BNP
HERE
Example "Drop them out of a plane somewhere over Africa. I really don’t care."
And a video meeting up with David Duke (Former KKK Wizard....and all round nice guy)
HERE
I thought I knew more than this until I opened my mouth
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Oscar Namechange
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- Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:26 am
Baroness Warsi quits
Bruv;1462473 wrote: My bad, abandoned another 'Bad boy' have they?
More diversionary tactics......but it doesn't really matter, not in the long term.
It is all part of the plan, (that you are a part of as far as I am concerned) to change the tactics but not the aim of the party.
Transcript of Panorama "UNDER THE SKIN" BBC TV
Read it HERE It's old but he sets out the long term plan.
Griffin's words
Griffin again
Guide for Journalists Reporting the BNP
HERE
Example "Drop them out of a plane somewhere over Africa. I really don’t care."
And a video meeting up with David Duke (Former KKK Wizard....and all round nice guy)
HERE
Did you read the extremely long list of Labour and Tories, convicted of child abuse or sex crimes?
Do you read about UKIP stating all poofters should be shot? Ot women are not Important ?
You will get people with extreme opinions In any Party. The Labour Party and the Tory Party obviously have some who's opinion Is that children should be sexually abused.
How many times have I posted on this forum that Griffin Is capable of being a Grade 1 pillock ?
But the difference Is, what you are highlighting here, Is Griffin's opinion.
It does not go hand In hand that every member of the BNP agree's with his opinion.
In fact, the sheer viciousness of the leadership challenge to bring Griffin down two years ago was nothing short of an attempted coup to oust him... I should know... I was caught up In the middle of It. Talk about Party Politics, It was ruthless. When Brons lost by just four votes and numerous recounts, he formed a new Party which catered for those far more extreme than Griffin who did firmly have their roots In the NF and would be a far more sinister force than Griffin for this country.
The Party was decimated when Brons took a large amount of the membership with him and that alone should tell you that a Party, any Party does not always lap up every word the leader says.
Having said that, and I am not going to write tactics here, but being privvy to a heated arguement one night between Brons and Griffin over press manipulation, as Griffin pointed out... negative press Is better than no press at all.
It's like Fourparts geezer In Southampton... you have to distinguish what Is Party line and what Is just the geezer's opinion... very often, the two are worlds apart exactly the same as the majority of Labour and Tory members being reviled at child abuse.
More diversionary tactics......but it doesn't really matter, not in the long term.
It is all part of the plan, (that you are a part of as far as I am concerned) to change the tactics but not the aim of the party.
Transcript of Panorama "UNDER THE SKIN" BBC TV
Read it HERE It's old but he sets out the long term plan.
Griffin's words
Griffin again
Guide for Journalists Reporting the BNP
HERE
Example "Drop them out of a plane somewhere over Africa. I really don’t care."
And a video meeting up with David Duke (Former KKK Wizard....and all round nice guy)
HERE
Did you read the extremely long list of Labour and Tories, convicted of child abuse or sex crimes?
Do you read about UKIP stating all poofters should be shot? Ot women are not Important ?
You will get people with extreme opinions In any Party. The Labour Party and the Tory Party obviously have some who's opinion Is that children should be sexually abused.
How many times have I posted on this forum that Griffin Is capable of being a Grade 1 pillock ?
But the difference Is, what you are highlighting here, Is Griffin's opinion.
It does not go hand In hand that every member of the BNP agree's with his opinion.
In fact, the sheer viciousness of the leadership challenge to bring Griffin down two years ago was nothing short of an attempted coup to oust him... I should know... I was caught up In the middle of It. Talk about Party Politics, It was ruthless. When Brons lost by just four votes and numerous recounts, he formed a new Party which catered for those far more extreme than Griffin who did firmly have their roots In the NF and would be a far more sinister force than Griffin for this country.
The Party was decimated when Brons took a large amount of the membership with him and that alone should tell you that a Party, any Party does not always lap up every word the leader says.
Having said that, and I am not going to write tactics here, but being privvy to a heated arguement one night between Brons and Griffin over press manipulation, as Griffin pointed out... negative press Is better than no press at all.
It's like Fourparts geezer In Southampton... you have to distinguish what Is Party line and what Is just the geezer's opinion... very often, the two are worlds apart exactly the same as the majority of Labour and Tory members being reviled at child abuse.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
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Oscar Namechange
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- Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:26 am
Baroness Warsi quits
Here you go Bruv... a typical example of nutters In Westminster
Watch: Birmingham MP Shabana Mahmood hauled in by Labour bosses after this video of Sainsbury's Gaza protest - Birmingham Mail
Watch: Birmingham MP Shabana Mahmood hauled in by Labour bosses after this video of Sainsbury's Gaza protest - Birmingham Mail
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Baroness Warsi quits
Please don't keep defending the private lives of 'People' political parties are made up of people with vices and lives outside politics.
Loosely speaking the Tory party attracts a person that considers free enterprise, low tax, big business, with a leanings towards the right.
Labour attracts socialist minded people, that believe the working man need protection from the excesses of the establishment.
Greens draw toward them people concerned with the enviroment and what mankind is doing to damage the earth.
Liberals consider themselves to be left of the Tories, but not as 'right on' bolshie as Labour, they draw support from the middle ground.
What are the attractions that draw people to the British Nationalist Party ?
(There.......you got your political party broadcast out of the Baroness Warsi thread......well done)
Loosely speaking the Tory party attracts a person that considers free enterprise, low tax, big business, with a leanings towards the right.
Labour attracts socialist minded people, that believe the working man need protection from the excesses of the establishment.
Greens draw toward them people concerned with the enviroment and what mankind is doing to damage the earth.
Liberals consider themselves to be left of the Tories, but not as 'right on' bolshie as Labour, they draw support from the middle ground.
What are the attractions that draw people to the British Nationalist Party ?
(There.......you got your political party broadcast out of the Baroness Warsi thread......well done)
I thought I knew more than this until I opened my mouth
Baroness Warsi quits
Regarding the list of M.P. who have been found guilty of Child Molestation / Sex Crimes, Fraud, etc., I agree that they should be barred from even standing. I also believe that anyone with a criminal record (perhaps on a rated basis, depending on the severity & type of crime) should be barred from standing - indeed, I thought that this was already the case, but apparently not. If this were the case, there wouldn't be many members of the BNP left.
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Oscar Namechange
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Baroness Warsi quits
Bruv;1462481 wrote: Please don't keep defending the private lives of 'People' political parties are made up of people with vices and lives outside politics.
What are the attractions that draw people to the British Nationalist Party ?
(There.......you got your political party broadcast out of the Baroness Warsi thread......well done) That's the whole point though Isn't It ?
You use every word Griffin says as ' political' yet excuse those vices and lives of other parties as ' outside politics'.
You can't have It both ways can you ?
So If I choose to refrain from supporting any mainstream party given weighing up the options of child molesters, homophobes, ant-semetics and crooks, preferring to support someone who's capable of being a pillock while knowing I will never ever see headlines as some of the others have seen, that's my right.
What are the attractions that draw people to the British Nationalist Party ?
(There.......you got your political party broadcast out of the Baroness Warsi thread......well done) That's the whole point though Isn't It ?
You use every word Griffin says as ' political' yet excuse those vices and lives of other parties as ' outside politics'.
You can't have It both ways can you ?
So If I choose to refrain from supporting any mainstream party given weighing up the options of child molesters, homophobes, ant-semetics and crooks, preferring to support someone who's capable of being a pillock while knowing I will never ever see headlines as some of the others have seen, that's my right.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
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Oscar Namechange
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FourPart;1462482 wrote: indeed, I thought that this was already the case, but apparently not. If this were the case, there wouldn't be many members of the BNP left.
Really ?
In 2009 the membership list peaked at one million... do you have documented evidence that every member or Indeed every member standing In elections had a criminal record as. I've proved It with a list, do you have one for the BNP ?
Really ?
In 2009 the membership list peaked at one million... do you have documented evidence that every member or Indeed every member standing In elections had a criminal record as. I've proved It with a list, do you have one for the BNP ?
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Baroness Warsi quits
Oscar Namechange;1462485 wrote: Really ?
In 2009 the membership list peaked at one million... do you have documented evidence that every member or Indeed every member standing In elections had a criminal record as. I've proved It with a list, do you have one for the BNP ?
All right, I'll rephrase - There won't many BNP member willing to stand as candidates. There are millions of members of the other parties, but what proportion of them would be actually willing to stand as candidates?
In 2009 the membership list peaked at one million... do you have documented evidence that every member or Indeed every member standing In elections had a criminal record as. I've proved It with a list, do you have one for the BNP ?
All right, I'll rephrase - There won't many BNP member willing to stand as candidates. There are millions of members of the other parties, but what proportion of them would be actually willing to stand as candidates?
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Oscar Namechange
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FourPart;1462489 wrote: All right, I'll rephrase - There won't many BNP member willing to stand as candidates. There are millions of members of the other parties, but what proportion of them would be actually willing to stand as candidates? How do you know there are not many BNP members willing to stand as candidates?
How do you know that unless you've ever been Inside HQ and seen the nominations come In from every region for the Chairman's endorsement?
Or Is this just a case of preconceived assumption without actually knowing?
How do you know that unless you've ever been Inside HQ and seen the nominations come In from every region for the Chairman's endorsement?
Or Is this just a case of preconceived assumption without actually knowing?
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Baroness Warsi quits
I see it as proportionate matching with all the other parties.
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Peter Lake
- Posts: 1031
- Joined: Mon Jul 21, 2008 2:02 pm
Baroness Warsi quits
FourPart;1462489 wrote: All right, I'll rephrase - There won't many BNP member willing to stand as candidates. There are millions of members of the other parties, but what proportion of them would be actually willing to stand as candidates?
I am not a member of the B.N.P simply because i'm not political enough to have such an interest. Yet, i did attend a meeting one night as a renowned author was to give a speech and i was interested in him. Like you, i went along to my very first and only meeting with preconceived notions of what i'd see and hear. Rather than posters of Hitler and knuckle dragging thugs reciting racial rhetoric, i was at first surprised at the amount of members of the Royal British Legion in attendance, the formality of the meeting in the most professional manner and most of all, not one racist word from anyone. The guest speaker, had me enthralled for rather than the rhetoric expected, he talked about British colonialism of South Africa among other subjects. Chatting to him later, i offered the idea that should his speech ever be broadcasted, the myth surrounding the B.N.P may be dismantled. Quite rightly he pointed out that no media outlet would do that as it would indeed dispel too many myths and rather, let the electorate continue to believe the worst. That being, the assumptions that you have been led to.
Last week, i attend only my second involvement with the party when i was roped in to take the minutes at a meeting in order for my wife to appoint committee members. It was a one off now she has appointed that committee. It was a rather small meeting that consisted of people with no criminal records, one was a school exam invigilator, another a road haulage contractor and another, an elected councillor for the B.N.P, 87 years old and a pillar of the community to highlight a few. The preconceived notions of the party are based on a negative media who have been driven to hone in on one or two morons who have brought shame on the party, exactly as Oscar pointed out, other parties suffer the same. At least now with the libelous news of the world exposed for criminal tactics defunct, the left media struggles to find little to report on. I agree, that no more than i would assume every member of the Labour party or the Conservative party is a child molester, it is hypocritical in every sense to assume every member of the B.N.P is a thug.
That is endorsed by the fact that if anyone knows my wife, then it is me and i know should she ever be met with people such as you imply, she would still be with the Labour party.
Naturally, Griffin says stupid things, so does Nigel Farage, so does Alex Salmond but what you're doing is labelling every member with assumption based on libel from a left driven media hell bent on keeping the far right from getting into Westminster.
One example was the story of B.N.P members burning a golliwog over a fire published by the news of the world claiming Griffin and Brons looked on laughing. Odd that, given the rally it was alleged to have taken place at showed in photographs of a field where the farmer had just cut the grass for the rally. In fact, the grass was scorched given the mid summer heat. Yet the photograph published by the news of the world showed lush green grass at least three inches high without Griffin or Brons in sight. What's criminal is the explotation of people like you who they believed would lap up every word.
I am not a member of the B.N.P simply because i'm not political enough to have such an interest. Yet, i did attend a meeting one night as a renowned author was to give a speech and i was interested in him. Like you, i went along to my very first and only meeting with preconceived notions of what i'd see and hear. Rather than posters of Hitler and knuckle dragging thugs reciting racial rhetoric, i was at first surprised at the amount of members of the Royal British Legion in attendance, the formality of the meeting in the most professional manner and most of all, not one racist word from anyone. The guest speaker, had me enthralled for rather than the rhetoric expected, he talked about British colonialism of South Africa among other subjects. Chatting to him later, i offered the idea that should his speech ever be broadcasted, the myth surrounding the B.N.P may be dismantled. Quite rightly he pointed out that no media outlet would do that as it would indeed dispel too many myths and rather, let the electorate continue to believe the worst. That being, the assumptions that you have been led to.
Last week, i attend only my second involvement with the party when i was roped in to take the minutes at a meeting in order for my wife to appoint committee members. It was a one off now she has appointed that committee. It was a rather small meeting that consisted of people with no criminal records, one was a school exam invigilator, another a road haulage contractor and another, an elected councillor for the B.N.P, 87 years old and a pillar of the community to highlight a few. The preconceived notions of the party are based on a negative media who have been driven to hone in on one or two morons who have brought shame on the party, exactly as Oscar pointed out, other parties suffer the same. At least now with the libelous news of the world exposed for criminal tactics defunct, the left media struggles to find little to report on. I agree, that no more than i would assume every member of the Labour party or the Conservative party is a child molester, it is hypocritical in every sense to assume every member of the B.N.P is a thug.
That is endorsed by the fact that if anyone knows my wife, then it is me and i know should she ever be met with people such as you imply, she would still be with the Labour party.
Naturally, Griffin says stupid things, so does Nigel Farage, so does Alex Salmond but what you're doing is labelling every member with assumption based on libel from a left driven media hell bent on keeping the far right from getting into Westminster.
One example was the story of B.N.P members burning a golliwog over a fire published by the news of the world claiming Griffin and Brons looked on laughing. Odd that, given the rally it was alleged to have taken place at showed in photographs of a field where the farmer had just cut the grass for the rally. In fact, the grass was scorched given the mid summer heat. Yet the photograph published by the news of the world showed lush green grass at least three inches high without Griffin or Brons in sight. What's criminal is the explotation of people like you who they believed would lap up every word.
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Oscar Namechange
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Baroness Warsi quits
FourPart;1462482 wrote: Regarding the list of M.P. who have been found guilty of Child Molestation / Sex Crimes, Fraud, etc., I agree that they should be barred from even standing. I also believe that anyone with a criminal record (perhaps on a rated basis, depending on the severity & type of crime) should be barred from standing - indeed, I thought that this was already the case, but apparently not. If this were the case, there wouldn't be many members of the BNP left. May I seek your permission to copy this to the official BNP website just to see the response to your words?
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Baroness Warsi quits
Bruv;1462481 wrote: Please don't keep defending the private lives of 'People'......... political parties are made up of people with vices and lives outside politics.
What are the attractions that draw people to the British Nationalist Party ?
Edited for clarity.
Why should I vote for my own local BNP candidate ?
What does the BNP stand for?
What are the attractions that draw people to the British Nationalist Party ?
Edited for clarity.
Why should I vote for my own local BNP candidate ?
What does the BNP stand for?
I thought I knew more than this until I opened my mouth
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Oscar Namechange
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Baroness Warsi quits
Bruv;1462516 wrote: Edited for clarity.
Why should I vote for my own local BNP candidate ?
What does the BNP stand for? It depends on how entirely you view your local candidate.
In a General election, there are differnet kinds of voters. Those who vote purely for the Party they represent and those who wish the local candidate to be returned based on how you feel he or she will represent your community rather than Westminter.
I'd say do some research Into candidates. You may be surprised to find that they have brought about good things In your community before standing. It should be the one you believe will serve your community best as your MP In Issue's that affect you, yourself.
That's the way It should be but of course, we know It's not.... preconception of Party plays an enormous part with our electorate and that Is only gleaned through media, positive or negative.
Why should I vote for my own local BNP candidate ?
What does the BNP stand for? It depends on how entirely you view your local candidate.
In a General election, there are differnet kinds of voters. Those who vote purely for the Party they represent and those who wish the local candidate to be returned based on how you feel he or she will represent your community rather than Westminter.
I'd say do some research Into candidates. You may be surprised to find that they have brought about good things In your community before standing. It should be the one you believe will serve your community best as your MP In Issue's that affect you, yourself.
That's the way It should be but of course, we know It's not.... preconception of Party plays an enormous part with our electorate and that Is only gleaned through media, positive or negative.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Baroness Warsi quits
No answers ?
The BNP have no ideals, no constitution, no aims, no perspective..........may as well go for the Independent then.
The BNP have no ideals, no constitution, no aims, no perspective..........may as well go for the Independent then.
I thought I knew more than this until I opened my mouth
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Oscar Namechange
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- Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:26 am
Baroness Warsi quits
Bruv;1462524 wrote: No answers ?
The BNP have no ideals, no constitution, no aims, no perspective..........may as well go for the Independent then.
You go for one that you believe will serve your local community and represent them In Parliament the best,
You go by what local Issue's they will tackle for those local Issue's will not be on any Party Constitution. What's Important for Welsh farmers Is not Important for someone trying to get housing In Tower Hamlet's, London.... see ?
The BNP have no ideals, no constitution, no aims, no perspective..........may as well go for the Independent then.
You go for one that you believe will serve your local community and represent them In Parliament the best,
You go by what local Issue's they will tackle for those local Issue's will not be on any Party Constitution. What's Important for Welsh farmers Is not Important for someone trying to get housing In Tower Hamlet's, London.... see ?
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Baroness Warsi quits
Bruv walks away mumbling under his exasperated breath.
I thought I knew more than this until I opened my mouth
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Peter Lake
- Posts: 1031
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Baroness Warsi quits
Bruv;1462527 wrote: Bruv walks away mumbling under his exasperated breath. Her tuition has paid off then? :wah:
Baroness Warsi quits
Oscar Namechange;1462503 wrote: May I seek your permission to copy this to the official BNP website just to see the response to your words?
I see that what I post is, as far as I'm concerned, Public Domain. However, I would request that the quote be made in its entirety & not spun out of context.
Even so, I doubt any party members will exactly view it with unbiased attitudes.
As I have said, I do concede that the BNP do make some very good points, as do, on occasion, do the Conservatives [spit]. They also all make some very bad ones (in my opinion, anyway).
Although, as I have previously said, my loyalties are with Labour, that is primarily because they offer the package closest to my views. Basically I am sort of mid-way left of centre, but I know that any vote for a small time Independent candidate with a policy even closer to mine would, in the real world, in effect be a wasted vote.
At the EU Elections I voted UKIP, as I am totally opposed to Central European Government, but in favour of Free Trade (which is what the original Common Market was intended to be). However, both Conservative & Labour have their official stance of being Pro-Europe. This, I believe is going to be harmful to them both. Cameron 'promises' an 'In / Out' referendum IF he gets in again, which is blatant bribery, if ever I heard it. So far, Labour have said that they won't offer one at all. This, too, will be harmful to them. Whether they are officially Pro or Anti Europe I think they should both agree to hold a referendum regardless of who wins the next election. No doubt this is also one of the policies of the BNP.
UKIP, on the other hand have never made any bones about their motives. Their primary agenda is to get out of Europe, yet despite their soaring in popularity at the EU elections & their support all round, I don't think anyone thinks for a minute that they have a hope in hell of getting into Government.
I see the BNP as being the same sort of thing except that if enough people choose to make a protest vote by voting for a no-hoper, this is the only way I see of a BNP candidate gaining a seat.
Yes, I see the BNP as having a primary agenda of Anti-Ethnic, where I believe I am in the vast majority of the public in general, and I have seen nothing to convince me otherwise. How many ethnic candidates does the BNP have, for instance? Come to that, how many ethnic members does it have? Not many, I'll bet.
Nick Griffin is right on one thing inasmuch as Islam is not a racial issue - it's a Religious faith. True, but what proportion of Whites are there who are Islam? As it happens I do happen to know one - she 'converted' in order to marry someone she met while on holiday in Turkey - and before you think otherwise, it wasn't merely a marriage of convenience to get an easy pass through Immigration, followed by a quick divorce - they are still very happily married for the past 15 years or so now. However, she isn't a follower of the faith - nor, for that matter is he. They just had to go through the motions of conversion to satisfy family honour before they would allow the wedding.
I ask you outright though - Putting aside what the Media might claim, rightly or wrongly, just what ARE the Top 5 OFFICIAL BNP Policies, in order of priority, and why? No ducking & diving - just an outright statement of fact.
Think of it as training for your campaign, as these are the sort of things you're going to be faced with - and in far less civil ways than myself. I'll tell you for now, there's no way you're going to convert me, but perhaps (albeit highly unlikely) you might convince me to have slightly less contempt for them. I don't think I can say fairer than that.
I see that what I post is, as far as I'm concerned, Public Domain. However, I would request that the quote be made in its entirety & not spun out of context.
Even so, I doubt any party members will exactly view it with unbiased attitudes.
As I have said, I do concede that the BNP do make some very good points, as do, on occasion, do the Conservatives [spit]. They also all make some very bad ones (in my opinion, anyway).
Although, as I have previously said, my loyalties are with Labour, that is primarily because they offer the package closest to my views. Basically I am sort of mid-way left of centre, but I know that any vote for a small time Independent candidate with a policy even closer to mine would, in the real world, in effect be a wasted vote.
At the EU Elections I voted UKIP, as I am totally opposed to Central European Government, but in favour of Free Trade (which is what the original Common Market was intended to be). However, both Conservative & Labour have their official stance of being Pro-Europe. This, I believe is going to be harmful to them both. Cameron 'promises' an 'In / Out' referendum IF he gets in again, which is blatant bribery, if ever I heard it. So far, Labour have said that they won't offer one at all. This, too, will be harmful to them. Whether they are officially Pro or Anti Europe I think they should both agree to hold a referendum regardless of who wins the next election. No doubt this is also one of the policies of the BNP.
UKIP, on the other hand have never made any bones about their motives. Their primary agenda is to get out of Europe, yet despite their soaring in popularity at the EU elections & their support all round, I don't think anyone thinks for a minute that they have a hope in hell of getting into Government.
I see the BNP as being the same sort of thing except that if enough people choose to make a protest vote by voting for a no-hoper, this is the only way I see of a BNP candidate gaining a seat.
Yes, I see the BNP as having a primary agenda of Anti-Ethnic, where I believe I am in the vast majority of the public in general, and I have seen nothing to convince me otherwise. How many ethnic candidates does the BNP have, for instance? Come to that, how many ethnic members does it have? Not many, I'll bet.
Nick Griffin is right on one thing inasmuch as Islam is not a racial issue - it's a Religious faith. True, but what proportion of Whites are there who are Islam? As it happens I do happen to know one - she 'converted' in order to marry someone she met while on holiday in Turkey - and before you think otherwise, it wasn't merely a marriage of convenience to get an easy pass through Immigration, followed by a quick divorce - they are still very happily married for the past 15 years or so now. However, she isn't a follower of the faith - nor, for that matter is he. They just had to go through the motions of conversion to satisfy family honour before they would allow the wedding.
I ask you outright though - Putting aside what the Media might claim, rightly or wrongly, just what ARE the Top 5 OFFICIAL BNP Policies, in order of priority, and why? No ducking & diving - just an outright statement of fact.
Think of it as training for your campaign, as these are the sort of things you're going to be faced with - and in far less civil ways than myself. I'll tell you for now, there's no way you're going to convert me, but perhaps (albeit highly unlikely) you might convince me to have slightly less contempt for them. I don't think I can say fairer than that.
Baroness Warsi quits
Peter Lake;1462528 wrote: Her tuition has paid off then? :wah:
Towing the party line?
Evasive replies, avoiding the question, while getting across your own agenda?
Brainwashing?
Triple AAA student.....studied sincerity bloody marvelous.
Oscar is the weakest link..................goodbye.
Towing the party line?
Evasive replies, avoiding the question, while getting across your own agenda?
Brainwashing?
Triple AAA student.....studied sincerity bloody marvelous.
Oscar is the weakest link..................goodbye.
I thought I knew more than this until I opened my mouth
Baroness Warsi quits
FourPart;1462529 wrote:
I ask you outright though - Putting aside what the Media might claim, rightly or wrongly, just what ARE the Top 5 OFFICIAL BNP Policies, in order of priority, and why? No ducking & diving - just an outright statement of fact.
No ducking and diving ?
You have been keeping up with the thread haven't you ?
Oscar is standing for the local council not as MP, she may as be standing as Labour or Independent........local politics at grass roots is almost non political.....at grass roots I repeat. Constituents vote for the person they know, regardless of party. It all changes in the council chamber of course........its all the power......(maniacal laughter)
I ask you outright though - Putting aside what the Media might claim, rightly or wrongly, just what ARE the Top 5 OFFICIAL BNP Policies, in order of priority, and why? No ducking & diving - just an outright statement of fact.
No ducking and diving ?
You have been keeping up with the thread haven't you ?
Oscar is standing for the local council not as MP, she may as be standing as Labour or Independent........local politics at grass roots is almost non political.....at grass roots I repeat. Constituents vote for the person they know, regardless of party. It all changes in the council chamber of course........its all the power......(maniacal laughter)
I thought I knew more than this until I opened my mouth
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Oscar Namechange
- Posts: 31842
- Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:26 am
Baroness Warsi quits
First of all UKIP Is a farce. Most are ex Tory public school boys who know they don't stand a hope In hell of getting returned under Conservative. The rest are ex BNP.
There's no point In my listing the policies of the BNP, they are easy enough to find on the net. There's no point because some I don't agree with and I have my own policies that do not appear on the list.
Listing policies will simply attach them to myself and unless you know me, then that's the typical preconception classed solely by Party that we object to.
Besides which, we have a new Chairman and leader now and there may be changes to those policies and even the constitution... I doubt It but we'll see.
Yes we have had ethnics stand for election, off the top of my head, Carlos Cortiglia for London Mayor and Pat Richardon a Jewish Councilor.
Rajinder Singh Is an example of Sikh members.
I don't have to defend myself, Griffin nor anyone else. If you want the low down on them, then do some research. But If you are going to quote him then at least quote him correctly.
For Instance
" There's the indigenous Brits, people like you and me; there's settled ethnic minorities populations who are here legally and legitimately and they are civically British and we have no problem with them at all; and then we have the third block, the colonists, people wanting to change our country into something completely different,' Mr Griffin said."
That Fourpart Is a world away from your ' ethnic cleansing' preconception.
Read more: BNP leader Nick Griffin: Lots of Hindus, Sikhs and ethnic minority Britons support my anti-immigrant views | Mail Online
Now look at events In Sheffield... there's just been a stabbing In a street brawl, Muslims vs Roma... not a far right org In the mix anywhere.
There's no point In my listing the policies of the BNP, they are easy enough to find on the net. There's no point because some I don't agree with and I have my own policies that do not appear on the list.
Listing policies will simply attach them to myself and unless you know me, then that's the typical preconception classed solely by Party that we object to.
Besides which, we have a new Chairman and leader now and there may be changes to those policies and even the constitution... I doubt It but we'll see.
Yes we have had ethnics stand for election, off the top of my head, Carlos Cortiglia for London Mayor and Pat Richardon a Jewish Councilor.
Rajinder Singh Is an example of Sikh members.
I don't have to defend myself, Griffin nor anyone else. If you want the low down on them, then do some research. But If you are going to quote him then at least quote him correctly.
For Instance
" There's the indigenous Brits, people like you and me; there's settled ethnic minorities populations who are here legally and legitimately and they are civically British and we have no problem with them at all; and then we have the third block, the colonists, people wanting to change our country into something completely different,' Mr Griffin said."
That Fourpart Is a world away from your ' ethnic cleansing' preconception.
Read more: BNP leader Nick Griffin: Lots of Hindus, Sikhs and ethnic minority Britons support my anti-immigrant views | Mail Online
Now look at events In Sheffield... there's just been a stabbing In a street brawl, Muslims vs Roma... not a far right org In the mix anywhere.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
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Oscar Namechange
- Posts: 31842
- Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 9:26 am
Baroness Warsi quits
Ok Fourpart, let's start with one of the polcies... to pay Immigrants to leave the country.
Repulsive ? Vile ? Unlawful even ?
Then dig further...
Griffin and Straw have both made headlines with their hostility to immigrants, Muslims and Travellers. The BNP demands the deportation of illegal immigrants and ‘foreign criminals’, financial incentives for immigrants to return to their countries of origin, an end to new immigration except in exceptional circumstances and the rejection of the applications of asylum seekers who have passed through safe countries to get to Britain. But most of these demands have already become law during the Labour administration in which Jack Straw has played a leading role. The latest round of restrictions on economic migration was announced by Prime Minister Gordon Brown on 12 November.
While Griffin was grilled by the Question Time panel and audience, Jack Straw sat unchallenged. Yet Straw was Foreign Secretary when Britain invaded Afghanistan and Iraq, and Home Secretary when 58 Chinese immigrants died in the back of a lorry trying to get past punitive immigration laws he was responsible for introducing. He allowed murderous Chilean dictator General Pinochet to escape extradition, vetoed publication of documents that could have proved the illegality of the Iraq war, refused to call for the US torture camp in illegally occupied Guantanamo, Cuba, to be closed and covered up British government collusion in torture. As Minister of Justice, he presides over a massively overcrowded prison system and an immigration service which boasts of deporting one person every eight minutes.
Griffin the only one ? Think again
Spain to pay immigrants to leave | World news | The Guardian
Who is more dangerous – the BNP or the Labour Party? / FRFI 212 Dec 2009 / Jan 2010
Now... do you have any Idea of how many Immigrants want to go home but are stuck here? In jobs paying £1 an hour without the hope In hell of buying a plane ticket ?
Illegal immigrants DO want to leave Britain, Sikh community leader insists as row over poster campaign continues | Mail Online
But hey, let's do It the Tory way.... threaten them Instead !!!
Tories defend 'stupid and offensive' poster campaign telling illegal immigrants to 'go home' - UK Politics - UK - The Independent
Dear God :-5
Repulsive ? Vile ? Unlawful even ?
Then dig further...
Griffin and Straw have both made headlines with their hostility to immigrants, Muslims and Travellers. The BNP demands the deportation of illegal immigrants and ‘foreign criminals’, financial incentives for immigrants to return to their countries of origin, an end to new immigration except in exceptional circumstances and the rejection of the applications of asylum seekers who have passed through safe countries to get to Britain. But most of these demands have already become law during the Labour administration in which Jack Straw has played a leading role. The latest round of restrictions on economic migration was announced by Prime Minister Gordon Brown on 12 November.
While Griffin was grilled by the Question Time panel and audience, Jack Straw sat unchallenged. Yet Straw was Foreign Secretary when Britain invaded Afghanistan and Iraq, and Home Secretary when 58 Chinese immigrants died in the back of a lorry trying to get past punitive immigration laws he was responsible for introducing. He allowed murderous Chilean dictator General Pinochet to escape extradition, vetoed publication of documents that could have proved the illegality of the Iraq war, refused to call for the US torture camp in illegally occupied Guantanamo, Cuba, to be closed and covered up British government collusion in torture. As Minister of Justice, he presides over a massively overcrowded prison system and an immigration service which boasts of deporting one person every eight minutes.
Griffin the only one ? Think again
Spain to pay immigrants to leave | World news | The Guardian
Who is more dangerous – the BNP or the Labour Party? / FRFI 212 Dec 2009 / Jan 2010
Now... do you have any Idea of how many Immigrants want to go home but are stuck here? In jobs paying £1 an hour without the hope In hell of buying a plane ticket ?
Illegal immigrants DO want to leave Britain, Sikh community leader insists as row over poster campaign continues | Mail Online
But hey, let's do It the Tory way.... threaten them Instead !!!
Tories defend 'stupid and offensive' poster campaign telling illegal immigrants to 'go home' - UK Politics - UK - The Independent
Dear God :-5
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon