10.16 anger against injustice. What do you reckon are people getting angry enough yet?
Tony Benn | People Before Profit | the Budget | Nov 24 2008 - YouTube
old time socialist
old time socialist
I think I like Mr Benn.
The world needs more rational Socialists.
The world needs more rational Socialists.
The home of the soul is the Open Road.
- DH Lawrence
- DH Lawrence
old time socialist
I wish americans would hurry up and get angry at the way big corporations now run your country for their own benefit. I find it something that americans just can't grasp, most of europe have and voted for welfare states because the governments were scared shitless about what would happen if things didn't change for the better. Greece will, I think become more left wing and it looks like the parties of the right with their austerity plans have had it. In France there is iw a socialist president, should be interesting. germany might become ore right wing again. As to us I am not sure we will go for one extreme or the other. An independent scotland will shift the balance of power in england to the tories - a few years of tory rule will piss anybody off. Reform comes from below.
old time socialist
It's far too late for us.
The big corps have us, hook, line and sinker.
The best we seem to be able to organize is who gets to gather the crumbs off the table.
The big corps have us, hook, line and sinker.
The best we seem to be able to organize is who gets to gather the crumbs off the table.
The home of the soul is the Open Road.
- DH Lawrence
- DH Lawrence
old time socialist
The trouble with men such as Mr Benn is that they are marginalised as idealist nutters.
I thought I knew more than this until I opened my mouth
old time socialist
Bruv;1393127 wrote: The trouble with men such as Mr Benn is that they are marginalised as idealist nutters.
By the political establishment perhaps but he always touched a chord with ordinary people.
posted by larsmac
It's far too late for us.
The big corps have us, hook, line and sinker.
The best we seem to be able to organize is who gets to gather the crumbs off the table.
They have had in the past as well each generation fights the same battles over and over, in your case it started after the war of independence when it was decided that all men were equal but only some could actually vote.
Merle Travis - Sixteen Tons (original version) - YouTube
It's a common theme throughout your history and in your literature - can you think if a western where the theme wasn't about the little man standing up to the power mad cattle baron or greedy landgrabber, even john wayne made a few like that rio lobo etc etc.The good guys in the white hats
By the political establishment perhaps but he always touched a chord with ordinary people.
posted by larsmac
It's far too late for us.
The big corps have us, hook, line and sinker.
The best we seem to be able to organize is who gets to gather the crumbs off the table.
They have had in the past as well each generation fights the same battles over and over, in your case it started after the war of independence when it was decided that all men were equal but only some could actually vote.
Merle Travis - Sixteen Tons (original version) - YouTube
It's a common theme throughout your history and in your literature - can you think if a western where the theme wasn't about the little man standing up to the power mad cattle baron or greedy landgrabber, even john wayne made a few like that rio lobo etc etc.The good guys in the white hats
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Clodhopper
- Posts: 5115
- Joined: Mon Feb 25, 2008 5:11 pm
old time socialist
I think the bankers thought that the anger against them would fade from public memory quite fast - a week is a long time in politics and all that. But It hasn't really happened. I don't really have a sense that the anger is increasing, but I do think that bankers are beginning to notice they are regarded by most with contempt. Quite a shock for the sort of pillock who believes that because he gets paid a fortune he must be important and that because he is important he should be paid a fortune. All for an admin job that the average person could do at least as well or better.
I'm going in to see my bank tomorrow. Not happy with them. Will be delivering an earful.
I'm going in to see my bank tomorrow. Not happy with them. Will be delivering an earful.
The crowd: "Yes! We are all individuals!"
Lone voice: "I'm not."
Lone voice: "I'm not."
old time socialist
It's the ordinary bank staff I feel sorry for. There is an intelligent finance call centre near me, now part of Lloyd TSB you just know as soon as the lease is up on the building all their jobs will go, already thousands have been laid off yet it's not their fault the banks failed. The Icelanders have the right idea - they have put their former prime minister on trial.
Trial of former prime minister of Iceland begins | World news | The Guardian
Trial of former prime minister of Iceland begins | World news | The Guardian
old time socialist
The scale of Iceland compared to the rest of the world may have something to do with it.
Iceland is tiny, only 329000 people, so presumably the scale of the debt is small.
Iceland is tiny, only 329000 people, so presumably the scale of the debt is small.
I thought I knew more than this until I opened my mouth
old time socialist
LarsMac;1393105 wrote: I think I like Mr Benn.
The world needs more rational Socialists.
Mr Benn is probably the most charismatic speaker I've ever had the pleasure to see.
I might not agree with much that he says but he certainly says it brilliantly.
The world needs more rational Socialists.
Mr Benn is probably the most charismatic speaker I've ever had the pleasure to see.
I might not agree with much that he says but he certainly says it brilliantly.
old time socialist
Bryn Mawr;1393184 wrote: Mr Benn is probably the most charismatic speaker I've ever had the pleasure to see.
I might not agree with much that he says but he certainly says it brilliantly.
Many people say that but when quizzed about what they actually disagree with cannot come up with answers. I've always thought if you have an opinion but cannot explain why you hold it you don't have an opinion you are merely repeating what you have heard. Not that I would accuse you of such a thing so what, of what he advocates, do you disagree with?
I might not agree with much that he says but he certainly says it brilliantly.
Many people say that but when quizzed about what they actually disagree with cannot come up with answers. I've always thought if you have an opinion but cannot explain why you hold it you don't have an opinion you are merely repeating what you have heard. Not that I would accuse you of such a thing so what, of what he advocates, do you disagree with?
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fuzzywuzzy
- Posts: 6596
- Joined: Mon Feb 02, 2009 5:35 pm
old time socialist
well weve just had our budget ..... it's so sad... apparently the poor ...or the cut backs to the poor will bring a surplus ..ohy isn't that great news...but we're not affected by the world situation?... tax the poor but ..not tax them really ...I'm confused.
old time socialist
gmc;1393287 wrote: Many people say that but when quizzed about what they actually disagree with cannot come up with answers. I've always thought if you have an opinion but cannot explain why you hold it you don't have an opinion you are merely repeating what you have heard. Not that I would accuse you of such a thing so what, of what he advocates, do you disagree with?
As an example, his dealings with Norton and the workers co-operative at Meriden will never be forgiven.
As an example, his dealings with Norton and the workers co-operative at Meriden will never be forgiven.
old time socialist
Bryn Mawr;1393315 wrote: As an example, his dealings with Norton and the workers co-operative at Meriden will never be forgiven.
Why? the alternative was just let them fail which they did anyway. Mind you if he hadn't interfered with the car industry it might still be around. The reality is British cars and motor bikes were crap and you can't just blame the workers. I have a czech made japanese car in my drive. Previously it was one made in sunderland my next one might be another British made one - I quite fancy an avensis.
Why? the alternative was just let them fail which they did anyway. Mind you if he hadn't interfered with the car industry it might still be around. The reality is British cars and motor bikes were crap and you can't just blame the workers. I have a czech made japanese car in my drive. Previously it was one made in sunderland my next one might be another British made one - I quite fancy an avensis.
old time socialist
gmc;1393343 wrote: Why? the alternative was just let them fail which they did anyway. Mind you if he hadn't interfered with the car industry it might still be around. The reality is British cars and motor bikes were crap and you can't just blame the workers. I have a czech made japanese car in my drive. Previously it was one made in sunderland my next one might be another British made one - I quite fancy an avensis.
It was the way he did it - making promises to get the agreement and then reneging on them as soon as they were in place and it was too late to turn back.
Beyond that, I still believe that with the support he poured into the worker's co-operative, Norton on its own could have survived.
It was the way he did it - making promises to get the agreement and then reneging on them as soon as they were in place and it was too late to turn back.
Beyond that, I still believe that with the support he poured into the worker's co-operative, Norton on its own could have survived.
old time socialist
Let's see, socialism means "run by the governemnt" so....Post office? Socialist. Police? Socialist. Military? Socialist. Fire Department? Socialist. Schools? Socialist.
I guess I'm a socialist. Meh.
I guess I'm a socialist. Meh.
old time socialist
gmc;1393112 wrote: I wish americans would hurry up and get angry at the way big corporations now run your country for their own benefit..
I agree, but it's difficult when they are constantly scaring you with some crisis-of-the-day. Fear makes it hard to think or act. (See: Orwell's 1984)
I agree, but it's difficult when they are constantly scaring you with some crisis-of-the-day. Fear makes it hard to think or act. (See: Orwell's 1984)
old time socialist
Bryn Mawr;1393365 wrote: It was the way he did it - making promises to get the agreement and then reneging on them as soon as they were in place and it was too late to turn back.
Beyond that, I still believe that with the support he poured into the worker's co-operative, Norton on its own could have survived.
I find some on the left have an ambivalent attitude to business. On the one hand they like the image of businesses struggling to survive but don't quite approve when they do well, plus the reality that most people in private industry work for small to medium companies seems to escape them. Actually it escapes those on the right as well.
Beyond that, I still believe that with the support he poured into the worker's co-operative, Norton on its own could have survived.
I find some on the left have an ambivalent attitude to business. On the one hand they like the image of businesses struggling to survive but don't quite approve when they do well, plus the reality that most people in private industry work for small to medium companies seems to escape them. Actually it escapes those on the right as well.
old time socialist
Saint_;1393377 wrote: Let's see, socialism means "run by the governemnt"
Not necessarily.
Not necessarily.
I thought I knew more than this until I opened my mouth
old time socialist
gmc;1393148 wrote: By the political establishment perhaps but he always touched a chord with ordinary people.
posted by larsmac
They have had in the past as well each generation fights the same battles over and over, in your case it started after the war of independence when it was decided that all men were equal but only some could actually vote.
Merle Travis - Sixteen Tons (original version) - YouTube
It's a common theme throughout your history and in your literature - can you think if a western where the theme wasn't about the little man standing up to the power mad cattle baron or greedy landgrabber, even john wayne made a few like that rio lobo etc etc.The good guys in the white hats
Of course John Wayne also played John Chisholm, one of those cattle barons.
posted by larsmac
They have had in the past as well each generation fights the same battles over and over, in your case it started after the war of independence when it was decided that all men were equal but only some could actually vote.
Merle Travis - Sixteen Tons (original version) - YouTube
It's a common theme throughout your history and in your literature - can you think if a western where the theme wasn't about the little man standing up to the power mad cattle baron or greedy landgrabber, even john wayne made a few like that rio lobo etc etc.The good guys in the white hats
Of course John Wayne also played John Chisholm, one of those cattle barons.
The home of the soul is the Open Road.
- DH Lawrence
- DH Lawrence
old time socialist
LarsMac;1393413 wrote: Of course John Wayne also played John Chisholm, one of those cattle barons.
Well OK, a lot of his films have that theme with some notable exceptions like Donovan's Reef - but then it centred around a story about prejudice and his protecting a friend who had married a native woman. The irony is that anyone who believes that power should belong with the people and not just a few and that all are entitled to equality before the law and freedom is at heart a left wing revolutionary, it's argument about who controls the state them or us. Personally I don't think there are any simple answers every generation runs the same argument over and over again.
Well OK, a lot of his films have that theme with some notable exceptions like Donovan's Reef - but then it centred around a story about prejudice and his protecting a friend who had married a native woman. The irony is that anyone who believes that power should belong with the people and not just a few and that all are entitled to equality before the law and freedom is at heart a left wing revolutionary, it's argument about who controls the state them or us. Personally I don't think there are any simple answers every generation runs the same argument over and over again.