Hey! Get an Intellectual Hobby

[coberst]

Hey! Get an Intellectual Hobby

My experience leads me to conclude that there is a world of difference in picking up a fragment of knowledge here and there versus seeking knowledge for an answer to a question of significance. There is a world of difference between taking a stroll in the woods on occasion versus climbing a mountain because you wish to understand what climbing a mountain is about or perhaps you want to understand what it means to accomplish a feat of significance only because you want it and not because there is ‘money in it’.

I think that every adult needs to experience the act of intellectual understanding; an act that Carl Sagan describes as “Understanding is a kind of ecstasy.”

This quotation of Carl Rogers might illuminate my meaning:



I want to talk about learning. But not the lifeless, sterile, futile, quickly forgotten stuff that is crammed in to the mind of the poor helpless individual tied into his seat by ironclad bonds of conformity! I am talking about LEARNING - the insatiable curiosity that drives the adolescent boy to absorb everything he can see or hear or read about gasoline engines in order to improve the efficiency and speed of his 'cruiser'. I am talking about the student who says, "I am discovering, drawing in from the outside, and making that which is drawn in a real part of me." I am talking about any learning in which the experience of the learner progresses along this line: "No, no, that's not what I want"; "Wait! This is closer to what I am interested in, what I need"; "Ah, here it is! Now I'm grasping and comprehending what I need and what I want to know!"

When we undertake such a journey of discovery we need reliable sources of information. We need information that we can build a strong foundation for understanding. Where do we find such reliable information? We find it in the library or through Google on the Internet or combinations thereof.

I have a ‘Friends of the Library’ card from a college near me. This card allows me, for a yearly fee of $25, to borrow any book in that gigantic library. Experts in every domain of knowledge have written books just especially for laypersons like you and I.

I often recommend to others that they get an intellectual hobby. The following is the essence of my message.

Hobbies are ways in which many individuals express their individuality. Those matters that excite an individual’s interest and curiosity are those very things that allow the individual to acquire self-understanding and understanding of the world. Interests define individuality and help to provide meaning to life. We all look for some ideology, hobby, philosophy or religion to provide meaning to life.

Not many of us have discovered our full potentialities or have fully explored in depth those we have discovered. Self-development and self-expression are relatively new ideas in human history. The arts are one means for this self-expression. The artist may find drawing or constructing sculptures as a means for self-discovery. The self-learner may find essay writing of equal importance.

I recommend that each person who does not presently have some similar type of hobby develop the hobby of an intellectual life. We could add to our regular routine the development of an invigorating intellectual life wherein we sought disinterested knowledge; knowledge that is not for the purpose of some immediate need but something that stirs our curiosity, which we seek to understand for the simple reason that we feel a need to understand a particular domain of knowledge.

[Rapunzel]

This is for you as you are a fan of Carl Sagan. Enjoy. :-6



Forget rap, forget the news, THIS is what auto-tune was meant for. Carl Sagan sings his lovely prose about our wonderful universe with an appearance by Stephen Hawking.

YouTube - Carl Sagan - 'A Glorious Dawn' ft Stephen Hawking (Cosmos Remixed)

[hoppy]

coberst;1251440 wrote: Hey! Get an Intellectual Hobby

My experience leads me to conclude that there is a world of difference in picking up a fragment of knowledge here and there versus seeking knowledge for an answer to a question of significance. There is a world of difference between taking a stroll in the woods on occasion versus climbing a mountain because you wish to understand what climbing a mountain is about or perhaps you want to understand what it means to accomplish a feat of significance only because you want it and not because there is ‘money in it’.

I think that every adult needs to experience the act of intellectual understanding; an act that Carl Sagan describes as “Understanding is a kind of ecstasy.”

This quotation of Carl Rogers might illuminate my meaning:



I want to talk about learning. But not the lifeless, sterile, futile, quickly forgotten stuff that is crammed in to the mind of the poor helpless individual tied into his seat by ironclad bonds of conformity! I am talking about LEARNING - the insatiable curiosity that drives the adolescent boy to absorb everything he can see or hear or read about gasoline engines in order to improve the efficiency and speed of his 'cruiser'. I am talking about the student who says, "I am discovering, drawing in from the outside, and making that which is drawn in a real part of me." I am talking about any learning in which the experience of the learner progresses along this line: "No, no, that's not what I want"; "Wait! This is closer to what I am interested in, what I need"; "Ah, here it is! Now I'm grasping and comprehending what I need and what I want to know!"

When we undertake such a journey of discovery we need reliable sources of information. We need information that we can build a strong foundation for understanding. Where do we find such reliable information? We find it in the library or through Google on the Internet or combinations thereof.

I have a ‘Friends of the Library’ card from a college near me. This card allows me, for a yearly fee of $25, to borrow any book in that gigantic library. Experts in every domain of knowledge have written books just especially for laypersons like you and I.

I often recommend to others that they get an intellectual hobby. The following is the essence of my message.

Hobbies are ways in which many individuals express their individuality. Those matters that excite an individual’s interest and curiosity are those very things that allow the individual to acquire self-understanding and understanding of the world. Interests define individuality and help to provide meaning to life. We all look for some ideology, hobby, philosophy or religion to provide meaning to life.

Not many of us have discovered our full potentialities or have fully explored in depth those we have discovered. Self-development and self-expression are relatively new ideas in human history. The arts are one means for this self-expression. The artist may find drawing or constructing sculptures as a means for self-discovery. The self-learner may find essay writing of equal importance.

I recommend that each person who does not presently have some similar type of hobby develop the hobby of an intellectual life. We could add to our regular routine the development of an invigorating intellectual life wherein we sought disinterested knowledge; knowledge that is not for the purpose of some immediate need but something that stirs our curiosity, which we seek to understand for the simple reason that we feel a need to understand a particular domain of knowledge.


Does collecting belly button lint count?

[coberst]

hoppy;1251458 wrote: Does collecting belly button lint count?


If that represents a step forward in intellectual sophistication for you then I approve.

[hoppy]

coberst;1251516 wrote: If that represents a step forward in intellectual sophistication for you then I approve.


Well, I used to collect little tufts of pubic hair from girl friends, so I'm moving up.

[Oscar Namechange]

hoppy;1251519 wrote: Well, I used to collect little tufts of pubic hair from girl friends, so I'm moving up.
I collect wild bird feathers

[Chezzie]

hoppy;1251519 wrote: Well, I used to collect little tufts of pubic hair from girl friends, so I'm moving up.


omg you made me wee a little:yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl

[Oscar Namechange]

Chezzie;1251527 wrote: omg you made me wee a little:yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl How is your incontinence these days Chezz? :sneaky::sneaky::yh_rotfl

[Chezzie]

oscar;1251530 wrote: How is your incontinence these days Chezz? :sneaky::sneaky::yh_rotfl


p!ss Poor :yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl

[Kathy Ellen]

coberst;1251516 wrote: If that represents a step forward in intellectual sophistication for you then I approve.


Good one Coberst...That's the funniest thing that I've ever heard you say:-6:yh_rotfl

[AussiePam]

coberst;1251516 wrote: If that represents a step forward in intellectual sophistication for you then I approve.


I agree with Kathy! And not only that - I'd put this simple yet elegant gem forward for post of the week!!

:-6

[sharedfastlane]

Rapunzel;1251447 wrote: This is for you as you are a fan of Carl Sagan. Enjoy. :-6



Forget rap, forget the news, THIS is what auto-tune was meant for. Carl Sagan sings his lovely prose about our wonderful universe with an appearance by Stephen Hawking.

YouTube - Carl Sagan - 'A Glorious Dawn' ft Stephen Hawking (Cosmos Remixed)


You are GOOD at finding things Rapunzel! This is one I will have to listen to a few times. My son of 24 will LOVE this.

Hello Coberst. I like your Friend of the Library idea. I might see if I can do something like this. Unless I invent a reason, I cannot access the Temple that is the British Library. I can remember as a child the satisfied peaceful feeling of exploring something new and unknown and getting to the solution or understanding. And that feeling of absorbtion where you could miss your dinner and not notice.

What are your latest intellectual hobbies personally ; and your hobbies?

[Odie]

oscar;1251521 wrote: I collect wild bird feathers


really?

have any pics?

[coberst]

sharedfastlane;1251624 wrote:

What are your latest intellectual hobbies personally ; and your hobbies?


I am a retired engineer with a good bit of formal education and twenty five years of self-learning. I began the self-learning experience while in my mid-forties. I had no goal in mind; I was just following my intellectual curiosity in whatever direction it led me. This hobby, self-learning, has become very important to me. I have bounced around from one hobby to another but have always been enticed back by the excitement I have discovered in this learning process. Carl Sagan is quoted as having written; “Understanding is a kind of ecstasy.”

I label myself as a September Scholar because I began the process at mid-life and because my quest is disinterested knowledge.

Disinterested knowledge is an intrinsic value. Disinterested knowledge is not a means but an end. It is knowledge I seek because I desire to know it. I mean the term ‘disinterested knowledge’ as similar to ‘pure research’, as compared to ‘applied research’. Pure research seeks to know truth unconnected to any specific application.

I think of the self-learner of disinterested knowledge as driven by curiosity and imagination to understand. The September Scholar seeks to ‘see’ and then to ‘grasp’ through intellection directed at understanding the self as well as the world. The knowledge and understanding that is sought by the September Scholar are determined only by personal motivations. It is noteworthy that disinterested knowledge is knowledge I am driven to acquire because it is of dominating interest to me. Because I have such an interest in this disinterested knowledge my adrenaline level rises in anticipation of my voyage of discovery.

We often use the metaphors of ‘seeing’ for knowing and ‘grasping’ for understanding. I think these metaphors significantly illuminate the difference between these two forms of intellection. We see much but grasp little. It takes great force to impel us to go beyond seeing to the point of grasping. The force driving us is the strong personal involvement we have to the question that guides our quest. I think it is this inclusion of self-fulfillment, as associated with the question, that makes self-learning so important.

The self-learner of disinterested knowledge is engaged in a single-minded search for understanding. The goal, grasping the ‘truth’, is generally of insignificant consequence in comparison to the single-minded search. Others must judge the value of the ‘truth’ discovered by the autodidactic. I suggest that truth, should it be of any universal value, will evolve in a biological fashion when a significant number of pursuers of disinterested knowledge engage in dialogue.

In the United States our culture compels us to have a purpose. Our culture defines that purpose to be ‘maximize production and consumption’. As a result all good children feel compelled to become a successful producer and consumer. All good children both consciously and unconsciously organize their life for this journey.

At mid-life many citizens begin to analyze their life and often discover a need to reconstitute their purpose. Some of the advantageous of this self-learning experience is that it is virtually free, undeterred by age, not a zero sum game, surprising, exciting and makes each discovery a new eureka moment. The self-learning experience I am suggesting is similar to any other hobby one might undertake; interest will ebb and flow. In my case this was a hobby that I continually came back to after other hobbies lost appeal.

I suggest for your consideration that if we “Get a life—Get an intellectual life” we very well might gain substantially in self-worth and, perhaps, community-worth.

As a popular saying goes ‘there is a season for all things’. We might consider that spring and summer are times for gathering knowledge, maximizing production and consumption, and increasing net-worth; while fall and winter are seasons for gathering understanding, creating wisdom and increasing self-worth.

I have been trying to encourage adults, who in general consider education as a matter only for young people, to give this idea of self-learning a try. It seems to be human nature to do a turtle (close the mind) when encountering a new and unorthodox idea. Generally we seem to need for an idea to face us many times before we can consider it seriously. A common method for brushing aside this idea is to think ‘I’ve been there and done that’, i.e. ‘I have read and been a self-learner all my life’.

I am not suggesting a stroll in the park on a Sunday afternoon. I am suggesting a ‘Lewis and Clark Expedition’. I am suggesting the intellectual equivalent of crossing the Mississippi and heading West across unexplored intellectual territory with the intellectual equivalent of the Pacific Ocean as a destination.

[ZAP]

Rapunzel;1251447 wrote: This is for you as you are a fan of Carl Sagan. Enjoy. :-6



Forget rap, forget the news, THIS is what auto-tune was meant for. Carl Sagan sings his lovely prose about our wonderful universe with an appearance by Stephen Hawking.

YouTube - Carl Sagan - 'A Glorious Dawn' ft Stephen Hawking (Cosmos Remixed)


Wonderful! Beautiful! Thanks so much for posting that.

[sharedfastlane]

I am suggesting the intellectual equivalent of crossing the Mississippi and heading West across unexplored intellectual territory with the intellectual equivalent of the Pacific Ocean as a destination.


I have had this swiriling around in my mind for a bit - hence so late posting. Can you elaborate a bit? There is so much " material" especially now we have the Internet. If a person has not had much formal education how can one sift through it all and grow?

[coberst]

sharedfastlane;1258727 wrote: I am suggesting the intellectual equivalent of crossing the Mississippi and heading West across unexplored intellectual territory with the intellectual equivalent of the Pacific Ocean as a destination.


I have had this swiriling around in my mind for a bit - hence so late posting. Can you elaborate a bit? There is so much " material" especially now we have the Internet. If a person has not had much formal education how can one sift through it all and grow?


Books, the answer is that the Internet is useful to look for specific answers to simple questins but is not useful for developing a comprehension of a domain of knowledge that is new to you.

We were born smart enough but we weren’t born intellectually sophisticated enough to handle this high tech world we have invented.

What is the difference between “being smart” and “being sophisticated”? I would say that we can use the handyman and his tool box as a good analogy for comprehending this difference. The number and quality of the instruments in a handyman’s tool box is a measure of his smartness and his experience using those tools is a measure of his sophistication.

If a handyman has only a hammer then every job is a job that will get hammered on. If that handyman has a great tool box but has experience only with a hammer then that handyman will look for things that can be hammered into place.

Our (American) educational system has left us with many learning handicaps. It has damaged our curiosity, our desire to learn, and our self-reliance. If we were to try we could overcome these handicaps. The solution is just around the corner if only we had the courage to challenge our tradition of anti-intellectualism.

The irony here is that self-actualization via self-learning is the greatest play around. Our tradition of anti-intellectualism has so damaged our natural curiosity, desire to learn, and self-reliance that few will ever learn this fact.

I have a "Friends of the Library" card from a local college. For a fee of $25 a year I have access to a great library. Seldom do I seek a book that this library does not have. It is the only way to go for the self-actualizing self-learner. A person needs books to pursue knowledge. One generally gets just fragments from the Internet.

We can comprehend only what we are prepared to comprehend. First we must be aware of a matter. Then we must become conscious of this awareness. Next we can begin to gain knowledge of this matter. We can then begin to create new meaning by organizing our knowledge in new and meaningful ways. This final step is often called understanding.

Bertrand Russell on Critical Thinking

“ABSTRACT: The ideal of critical thinking is a central one in Russell's philosophy, though this is not yet generally recognized in the literature on critical thinking. For Russell, the ideal is embedded in the fabric of philosophy, science, liberalism and rationality, and this paper reconstructs Russell's account, which is scattered throughout numerous papers and books. It appears that he has developed a rich conception, involving a complex set of skills, dispositions and attitudes, which together delineate a virtue which has both intellectual and moral aspects. It is a view which is rooted in Russell's epistemological conviction that knowledge is difficult but not impossible to attain, and in his ethical conviction that freedom and independence in inquiry are vital. Russell's account anticipates many of the insights to be found in the recent critical thinking literature, and his views on critical thinking are of enormous importance in understanding the nature of educational aims. Moreover, it is argued that Russell manages to avoid many of the objections which have been raised against recent accounts. With respect to impartiality, thinking for oneself, the importance of feelings and relational skills, the connection with action, and the problem of generalizability, Russell shows a deep understanding of problems and issues which have been at the forefront of recent debate.” 20th WCP: Bertrand Russell on Critical Thinking

Comprehension is a slow and developing process. We comprehend only what we are prepared to comprehend. We cannot comprehend long division until we have first studied addition and subtraction.

I think that comprehension is a hierarchy and can be usefully thought of as like a pyramid. At the base of the comprehension pyramid is awareness, which is followed by consciousness (awareness plus attention). Knowledge follows consciousness and understanding is at the pinnacle of the comprehension pyramid. We are aware of many more things than we are conscious of and that sort of ratio follows all the way up to understanding at the pinnacle.

Understanding is a far step beyond knowing and is significantly different from knowing. Knowledge seeks truth whereas understanding seeks meaning.



Awareness--faces in a crowd.

Consciousness—smile, a handshake, and curiosity.

Knowledge—long talks sharing desires and ambitions.

Understanding—a best friend bringing constant April.

Until we become conscious of a matter we cannot become knowledgable of that matter. I am giving the reader a first step in the road to comprehension, I am helping that reader to become conscious of certain ideas that are essential for the comprehension of other ideas.

Judge a man by his questions rather than by his answers.

--Voltaire (1694-1778)

I suggest that you start by reading history and biographies and then begin to seek out answers to question that interest you.

[Clodhopper]

I suggest that you start by reading history and biographies and then begin to seek out answers to question that interest you.


Agreed.

sharedfastlane, is there a period of history or a historical figure (not just a celeb) you've ever been interested in? Start there.

warning: you are starting a journey which never ends.:-6

[Clodhopper]

Following the advice on this thread, I have just bought myself a biography of Elizabeth I. We'll see how it goes. First few pages seem promising.

[sharedfastlane]

Coberst there's a lot of truth in what you say. I think there are other factors though. I don't think books alone can fully develop us, perhaps you are not suggesting that anyway. I remember my English teacher telling us the way to develop a good vocabulary was to read, read, read. I am sure it helped and I read plenty but taking a written piece of work into the brain isn't the same as communicating the ideas myself verbally. Although communicating well can also be a double edged sword. I can think of Politicians or " Leaders " ( or should I be thinking speech writers here) who have a silver tongue but nothing behind it - no good-will, just spinning a clever, appealing web - of no substance.

I used to read my childrens' essays when they were at Junior School and found them warm and gently revealing. When they got older and were taught to " write differently" ; although I could see how clever and intelligent their essays were - there was something I missed. Maybe childhood innocence. After University though I would sometimes marvel at a sentence here or there that they would come out with, mentally tip my hat to them. Somewhere along the line a University Education can teach a person how to express themselves well.

I agree with you that "We were born smart enough but we weren’t born intellectually sophisticated enough to handle this high tech world we have invented." I heard someone say that on the Radio a few weeks ago , a Psychologist studying crime possibly. Eek, does this mean those alive now have not much chance - capacity for the Masses will come centuries down the line? (!)

Perhaps I give up too easily when the questions I come up with aren't able to be answered by my research within 1 day. So I WROTE to one Author and didn't get a response, Heigh Ho . Also I guess it is having the mindset that we are on a Journey of Discovery. It can feel we are just earning our crust - that Sunday night feeling of belonging to our job not being able to take a day off just when we feel the need, and battling negativity as displayed in the Media on a daily basis. It would seem pretentious to be sat in the corner with a book , pen in mouth, notepad on knee, when my normal method of having downtime is TV watching or Surfing the Net. T'would be a start though.

What do YOU do when you are stumped? And do you read and then have to sit queitly and think through what you have read? How do you choose books on a subject - as each person writes from a different perspective often. Some books almost cancel each other out.

[sharedfastlane]

Clodhopper;1258767 wrote: Agreed.

sharedfastlane, is there a period of history or a historical figure (not just a celeb) you've ever been interested in? Start there.

warning: you are starting a journey which never ends.:-6


;)

Hi Clodhopper.

Here's my problem - if anybody suggests something I will take against that very thing for a month!! I must be a late developer looking to express herself.

I went down the "Autobiography" route a few years back but found eavesdropping on other peoples lives wasn't satisfying my own. Some of the things I read were inspirational, SOME I could have lived happier without knowing thanks, but clearly not enough to make ME change my corner of the World! If I'm even more honest a lot of the books were about men ( great people though they are!) and it just got a bit tiresome, couldn't fully relate in the end.

No, what intersts me at present is here

VillageForum.com

I have been looking for " Community" for a while I guess. ( Realise " Community " is all around me of course) Not getting far with connection to the UK but I live in Social Housing and wouldn't be able to sign up as a Home Buyer. Will raise the issue with the Forum but want to read much more about them first.

Bookwise I flit about quite a lot and the Local Library, God Bless IT, doesn't have a huuuge selection, all those late Returners who won't return'em(!) but I will join a University Library, or there's a swanky Establishment in London called the London(not Briitish) Library. Gotta be honest my eyesight is a bit hap hazard at times - the ole eyes get hot and tired, especially when I've been at work and late evening is the worst time often for my peepers so it does impact on how much text I am comfortable with. A Kindle might be interesting - those notebook computer books?

[Clodhopper]

sharedfastlane: Hi there! I've just finished a Elizabeth the Queen by Alison Weir, which might fit your requirements more closely. Old Lizzie (the First, not the Second) is a strong candidate for the greatest monarch we've had, certainly since Alfred the Great.

[coberst]

sharedfastlane;1259362 wrote:

What do YOU do when you are stumped? And do you read and then have to sit queitly and think through what you have read? How do you choose books on a subject - as each person writes from a different perspective often. Some books almost cancel each other out.


Studying disinterested knowledge is like taking off a month every year to visit a strange new land. Curiosity is reinvigorated and new meaning is created.

Disinterested knowledge is the energy bunny; studying disinterested knowledge creates more energy than it consumes. It generates the energy for exploration and for overcoming some of our inhibitions.

Disinterested knowledge is an intrinsic value. Disinterested knowledge is not a means but an end. It is knowledge I seek because I desire to know it. I mean the term 'disinterested knowledge' as similar to 'pure research', as compared to 'applied research'. Pure research seeks to know truth unconnected to any specific application.

Knowledge is like a jigsaw puzzle. We have created many puzzles in coping with reality and when we receive a new piece of knowledge that does not fit our present puzzles we forgetaboutit (Italian word for ‘forget about it’). However, if through disinterested knowledge we have created new puzzles within which the new knowledge might fit we might find a whole new meaning in life.

After we leave school if we want to become a self-learner and to become knowledgeable of new domains we will follow this same procedure but with a significant difference. We will have no teacher to supply us with the pieces of the puzzle. Especially difficult will be gathering the appropriate side pieces so that we can frame our domain. After this we might very well have to imagine the image of the puzzle because we will not have a teacher to help us ‘see’ what the domain ‘looks like’.

When we become a self-learner we will often find pieces of knowledge that do not fit our already constructed frames, when this happens we have two choices. We can throw away the new fragment of knowledge or we can start a journey of discovery in an effort to organize the construction of a new domain. The odd piece of knowledge is either trashed or we must begin a big effort to start construction on a new big puzzle.

I think that knowledge is easily acquired when that knowledge fits easily within one’s accepted ideologies. If we have a ready place to put a new fragment of knowledge we can easily find a place to fit it in. When the knowledge does not fit within our already functioning ideas that fact will be discarded unless a great deal of effort is made to find a home for that fragment of knowledge.

We are unable to move beyond our ideologies unless we exert great effort. No one can give us that type of knowledge; we must go out of our way to stalk it, wrestle it to the ground and then find other pieces that will complete a frame. That is why our schools do not try to take us beyond our narrow world because it is too costly in time and effort. Our schools prepare us to be good workers and strong consumers, anything beyond that we must capture on our own.

No one can give us that kind of knowledge. It can only be presented as an awakening of consciousness and then we can, if we have the energy and curiosity go and capture the knowledge of something totally new and start a new puzzle.

Creativity is the synthesis of the known into a model of the unknown. The value of the unknown is yet to be determined. Creativity requires a comfort with the unknown.

[sharedfastlane]

:-3

Thanks C. Guess I'll mull this over for a bit.

[sharedfastlane]

Clodhopper;1259560 wrote: sharedfastlane: Hi there! I've just finished a Elizabeth the Queen by Alison Weir, which might fit your requirements more closely. Old Lizzie (the First, not the Second) is a strong candidate for the greatest monarch we've had, certainly since Alfred the Great.


How thick was the book - you only bought it yesterday didn't you?!

[Clodhopper]

sharedfastlane: Was thinking about your post a bit.

Books are someone's opinion. Yes, they can sort of cancel eachother out, but I find that one argument seems more convincing than another - better researched, more logically expressed, better understanding of human nature, that sort of thing. The more you read the more discriminating (in the best sense of the word) you become.

coberst: Well, you've certainly got me going again! Finished my book on Elizabeth I and now need to read more. The biography I read was very much about Elizabeth as a woman ruling in a male dominated world. Now I want to read modern stuff on the Elizabethan period generally in the light of that recently acquired knowledge. Not to mention that there were many hints that much more about the period has recently been discovered.